Hey Zigga

Factor in the inflation rate and gas is almost a bargin today compared to $4.00 in the year 2000.



Ransom
 
LAST EDITED ON Jul-10-08 AT 11:23PM (MST)[p]I'll gladly pay taxes if the money is going where we need it. Where was it going to go with Gore compared to where it's going now with w? What was the defecit then compared to now? w got us in a hole and he just keeps on digging. Where is my $4/gallon going right now? Don't make me list all the things wrong with this country right now. We'll be here all day.

Overton,

$4/gallon never happened in 2000 so it's impossible to compare the two. Like I said, don't make me list all the things wrong with this country. I knew it would be bad with w in the driver's seat but he really outdid himself. Full speed reverse.
 
That wasn't my question.

My question was if you would gladly pay more under a Democrat why can't you afford it under a Republican?

I don't understand the logic that you would rather throw money into a government program participate in capitalism, even with all it's warts. Transfers of wealth occur in either scenario and there is little or no return once on funds once government gets it's hands on the money.

You said in an earlier thread that you could afford to live under Gore, even though his position is that gas should be $4, but cannot afford to live under Bush with gas at $4. I am curious about the difference.

Whether or not gas went that high or not isn't the question. Al Gore wants higher gas prices through taxation, show me a government program that wasn't over budget and delivered even 10% of what it promised. The only one I know that truly works is the GI Bill.

Anyway, you don't have to answer because whenever I hear someone say that one side has all the answers I also know they are just another partisan who has swallowed the Kool-ade.

Nemont
 
"whenever I hear someone say that one side has all the answers I also know they are just another partisan who has swallowed the Kool-ade."

Tell me who said that and I'll put my foot in their arse. The difference about the $4.00 gas is that w's actions have caused us to pay it and we have nothing to show for it except a huge deficit and I could continue with the list...blah blah blah. Maybe....and I said "Maybe" if Gore would have forced us to pay $4.00 a gallon we would actually have something to show for it. It's like paying really high rent because there are no houses for sale. Would you rather pay a lot of money every month for a dumpy trailer next to a nuclear waste site or live on 20 acres by the lake in a 3,000 square foot hunting cabin with all the fixins? If it's the same price then I'll take the cabin. I'm not crazy or proud of the dems but look what the republicans have done. It's a frickin disaster. A sex scandal is looking pretty good for w right now.
 
"I also know they are just another partisan who has swallowed the Kool-ade". "Tell me who said that and I'll put my foot in their arse".
Zigga the first time I heard that expression was on this forum. If I recall correctly it was your old liberal pard, Dude, that used it first.
How long do we wait until you put your foot in his arse, or are you just blowing hot air again like you did with Nemont's challege.

RELH
 
I took the challenge, didn't you read that part? Huntindude cuts through the right wing smoke, mirrors, koolaide etc. and gives you guys a dose of reality. We all aren't living in Make-believe, Alabama. The rightwingers are all finger-pointers and what-iffers. w likes to borrow and spend and the dems like to tax and spend. Neither is good but w had plenty of time to get the ball rolling and it just didn't happen. DISASTER!

NEXT!!!
 
You have a good point on the spending of both parties. The best way to get out of that cycle is to get rid of lifelong politicians and let the replacements know that it is not always about bringing home the bacon.

DC
 
lets see I think milk was a couple bucks a gallon cheaper 8 years ago, those 1 acre lots down the road in bargerville were 1200$ to 1500$ now they are 40000$ to 45000$, what has health care gone up about 75% in 8 years? I probably make twenty to twenty five percent more money than 8 years ago, so yea I think 4$ a gallon gas would have been easier 8 years ago
 
Remember during w's first campaign, his main scare tactic was, "the dems will tax you."? Then during the second campaign it was something like, "the dems will tax you." Don't you think we would have been better off with higher taxes instead of higher EVERYTHING. Oh yeah, and we're deeper in debt. When we borrow and spend, doesn't someone have to pay that back? Maybe that's why the dems are forced to tax us? hmmmmmm.
 
Zigga,

We will disagree on all the reasons but......at the end of Clintons term the federal budget was 1.7 trillion....and gwb's last budget was over 3 trillion.......I don't have any representation.

JB
 
The real estate prices are a terrible example. The others are fine, but just who do you think drove up realestate prices? Dang sure not the President. Maybe I'm missing your point on that one.

DC
 
200 years ago the price of land was a dollar or two per acre. Seems like you should be mad at the last 5 generations of people who came before us.
 
A few years ago the I was talking to the local radio station owner, said he came on to some money and bought some lots above town said he could keep them for 1 year and 1 day and only pay 20% capital gains because the new laws, 5 lots paid 400.000$ sold 575.000$ 175,000$ minus 20% taxes=140.$000 profit, of course 6% realestate fee on top, I know he took a chance and all that and thats the way it is, but you asked why, and thats just a small example, thats why trickle down economics is hard on so many while it can really help a few, before you start screaming bloody murder and calling me a commie, Im only saying the truth about the why of some of the inflated property prices recently
 
I think the easy money available to people, you know the ones that are now in foreclosures has had more to do with driving up the price of real estate then any other force.

Again I really have never liked the easy money policy of this administration but I don't like the give everybody money policy of the democrats either. We would all be better off if the government stopped borrowing and spending and we would be further better off if it stopped taxing and spending as well.

None of that was the question. Unless you believe that gasoline at $4 would be price neutral to all other items then it doesn't matter why fuel is high, either through a distorted market place or through taxation, it still would have the same impact.

Those who worship at the gobal warming alter should be estatic as fuel consumption has decreased as people, god forbid, had to react to the market place.

I would gladly have paid more taxes if it meant anything more then our government spending that additional revenue and then borrowing even more. Go look at what the tax reciepts have been under GWB, they have been at record highs and we are still going backwards. Tell me how further taxation will pull us up out of this mess?

Zigga, you have intimated that everything will be better once the democrats are sworn into office. Just wait it will get worse, much worse before it get's better. You cannot tax your way to prosperity. Like Winston Churchill said, "A country trying to tax itself to prosperity is like a man trying lift a bucket while he is standing in it".

Here is the other thing, Obama will not get a honey moon period due to the current political climate. By blaminng GWB for everything from athlete's foot to Iranian missles the Democrats have contributed to the political discourse that says the President is in control of everything in this country. Granted the Republicans are experts in this as well but watch and listen.

Nemont
 
"Go look at what the tax reciepts have been under GWB, they have been at record highs and we are still going backwards. Tell me how further taxation will pull us up out of this mess?"

I don't want further taxation. Never did. But when you run up the debt so frickin high, HOW IS IT GOING TO GET PAID???!

"Zigga, you have intimated that everything will be better once the democrats are sworn into office."

Everything would get better if a monkey (we may be getting one....WHO SAID THAT?) got sworn into office. This country can't cash the checks that w is writing. Thank God a term is only 4 years or we'd be answering to Cuba, Venezuela, etc. I'm not for the dems but anything different is better in time. No one will fix this trainwreck overnight. I don't doubt for a second things will get worse. You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

Is the president responsible for anything anymore? You guys wanted Clinton's head on a stick but the fiasco we are in is ok???
 
No, nothing is Bush's fault, he has the highest disapproval rating in the history of the Gallup poll ( 69%) which is even higher than when Nixon left office but it's just a dem smear campaign. all our problems can be traced back to Clinton and Obama will resume blame.

It's almost too bad McBush is going to lose, I'd like to see if blame could be carried for 12 years to the next dem president, probably.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jul-14-08 AT 10:11AM (MST)[p]Back the bus up. I hold GWB responsible for his follies. Mainly fiscal mismanagement and a complete and total failure of foreign policy.

The problem is that those on the left believe that anything that has gone bad in the past 8 years, whether a hurricane or a volcano erupting can be tied back to GWB.

That is the political environment today. It takes two sides to play the blame game and the democrats have refined it to a fine art. Clinton certainly had to deal with the Republicans blaming him for everything but that has continued at an even higher level with GWB.

Talk to a committed democrat, They will make almost no sense. On one hand he is the dumbest man to ever wear pants and on the other hand he is calculating enough to control the world wide oil market. They will use terms like evil, hated, etc. etc. You know the "free thinking" democrats who believe they are superior because they drink bottled spring water and compost their own crap.

Hold the president responsible for what he is responsible for; but that is a long ago and outdated notion. Obama will get zero break from his opposition and will have to be ready to make decision on day one. There are still enough people in this country opposed to democrat policies that he will have to listen to the other side whether committed lefties want to admit it or not. Just as the right wing believes there should be no compromise or meeting in the middle the left wing is even more committed. Watch and listen as Obama has to move more to the center. The left wing is going to grow louder about him "owing" them.

Nemont
 
Bush isn't responsible for everything and I don't think even most from the far left feel he is, it just gets old hearing him held harmless on every mistake he's made and there have been some major ones. as I've said before I don't think Bush is a bad person , just a crappy president .

I feel he can be held responsibe to some degree for the economy , 100% responsible for the misguided war in Iraq and the failure in Afghanistan which is a consequence of Iraq. we could go on all day about what he is and is not responsible for but the bottom line he was president for 8 years and he's going to be held accountable in this falls elections at the expense of his peers. Obama or McCain are stepping into a mess nobody can clean up in short order, I expect our next president to be a one term president, if they do well enough to be re elected we're going to want them for a 3rd term.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jul-14-08 AT 11:27AM (MST)[p]I agree with all of that. That was not my point. The leftist on this board believe the sun will come out and the birds will sing the day a democrat will be sworn in as President. I could pull the quotes.

If you don't believe that Democrats blame everything bad in their world on GWB then you aren't listening to them very well. A very good friend of mine is an Obama campaign staffer and he believes that GWB is responsible if a dog bites a kid in the park. Democrats are not any less to blame for alot of the issues we face then Republicans are. The only guy running who didn't give GWB a blank check in Iraq is Obama yet he will have to face the reality of the situation and will not be able to announce a date certain for leaving, unless the Iraqi's send us home, which is unlikely.

You may not think Bush is a bad person but the leftist hate him on a personal level. The democrats, who consider themselves superior to everyone else, have no capacity to seperate the person from the office, Just like the idiot rightwingers do to stir up the troops. Who has benefitted more from the current political climate? Democrats have that is why I laugh when they spout partisan stuff about regime change etc. Just proves they are no different then those they hate some much.

All of that is not the point of this thread. The point is that Al Gore isn't whining about the cost of gasoline and the congessional Democrats are not doing anything more then holding hearing in congress because: A. Higher fuel costs reduce carbon emissions B. They understand that any action they take will not bring down the price of fuel and C. High Fuel prices don't hurt the democrats politically as much as it hurts the Republicans.

We are going to get a change in leadership regardless because even GWB hasn't suspended the Constitution and appointed himself king, I personally don't look to anyone in the White House to do anything the "helps" the country.

The democrats will not "fix" Social Security, they will not "fix" health care, they will not "fix" terrorism, They will not deal with any politically difficult problem anymore then the Republicans have. They don't have enough political gumption to even give GWB a reduced amount of money to prosecute the war.

Nemont
 
Pretty hard to argue with that, the only thing I'll say is the dems had no choice but to fund the war, politically anyway.

The way Bush was playing the game was he'd cut what ever he had to to keep the war going full bore and do it in a manor to show the troops were paying the price. it would have been suicide for the dems and they knew it, and possibly it would have hurt the troops because I think Bush would have let them pay if that's what it took to get his way. in the past when congress and the majority of the American people demanded a change of direction in a war the president at the very least compromised, not here, and Bush's all time disapproval rating reflects it.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jul-14-08 AT 01:38PM (MST)[p]HD,

Can you explain how a "stupid" GWB, Who BTW is an unpopular lame duck president with less then 200 days left in office can politically out manuever a democrat controlled congress?

If we are looking for someone to "help" us why would be look to them? They cannot not even effectively to battle with almost all the chips on their side. There is not one dollar that is spent by our government that is not authorized and appropriated by congress period.

What political shots could have Democrats taken if they defunded an unpopular war? They could have funded money to redeploy troops to Afghanistan and to return to CONUS but they didn't, they could have forced enough strings attached to the money to make their policies a reality but they didn't.

So tell me what political price would the democrats have had to pay? Only congresses approval ratings are less the GWB's.

Nemont
 
Also if you will remeber the Dems ran on a platform of cut and run from Iraq. They did not then and they do not now have the sack to live up to what they promised and yet the sheeple are ready to elect another Dem as President.





"dude, nothing we can say will make us like as childish/silly as the rants you post. We HAVE posted the parts, you chose to ignore them. We get it, you like soldiers that sell out their fellow soldiers for political gain, and you hate or hold in contempt those that take a stand. We get that you manage to see NOTHING but bad in Republicans, and nothing put pure and honorable intentions from fellow limp wristed libs. We got it already, now move on."
(PRO July 3, 2008)
 

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