Lets Get the Trail Camera's Outlawed

cannonball

Very Active Member
Messages
1,092
I have several friends who use trail cameras. They are tired of being invaded with trail cameras and use them because they are legal, but would really like to see them gone. You can't even pick your nose without have a picture taken of you around a waterhole in the mountains. Contact your State Representative and tell him of your displeasure of this issue. Looks as if Arizona and Nevada may have seen the light and may outlaw them.
 

elkassassin

Long Time Member
Messages
26,237
Here's the Deal grizzly!

Many Years ago I Mentioned the "HIGH COUNTRY TUNE-UP" & People BAWLED!

Who Lost By Letting Un-Policed JACK-ASSES on Wheelers do as they Please Building Illegal Trails Everywhere on Public Land?

(The Game Herds & The Law Abiding Sportsmen,That's Who!)

When the Shed Hunting Season was put in place Who Lost?

(The Law Abiding Sportsmen Once again Lost,That's Who!)

If & When Trail-Cams are Outlawed/Banned Who's gonna Lose?

(The Law Abiding Sportsmen will Lose once again,that's Who!)

The Only Enforcement there will be is other Sportsmen Knocking them off the Tree's when they See/Find them!

(Now Remember,Nobody Liked My Illegal ATV TUNE-UPS!)

WTF is the Difference between an ATV TUNE-UP or a TRAIL-CAM TUNE?

There's Guys on Here Telling You they Will take em Down but I Don't see anybody getting their ASS Ripped for threatening to do it?

Here's what'll Happen if they get the Trail Cams Banned:

Some People will Still set them up!

They won't have them Right on Top of the Weep/Water!

They'll Start Running Mini-Cams You Can't see as easy!

There Won't be one Person on the Mountain that Won't Take one Down/Destroy it if they get the Chance,even if it's another Person Running Illegal Trail Cams!

If Somebody does Get Caught,here's the Attitude:

Just Give Me the F'N Ticket,I'll Just Pay the SOB!

If Somebody does Catch Somebody Breaking the Law with the Trail Cams & Does what He Thinks is the Right Thing by Calling Law Officials, well Good Luck with that!

The Fine Will Be some kind of PISSCUTTER Fine that Most Won't Pay any attention to!

I'm not Against some of the Laws & Rules!

But By GAWD I Think if they make them they should be Enforced a little better than what We've seen in recent years!

There Were Big Game Tags Auctioned Off for as High as 90,000.00-315,000.00 recently!

What'd be the Fine compared to Money Spent on a Tag like that?

TAKE NOTE:

You Get the Trail Cams off the Mountain & Prepare Yourself for More DRONES than You've Ever F'N Seen!

Ya,I Know,There's Laws already..........................!

The Biggest Thing To Think about is: This Change Alone Fixes Absolutely F'N Nothing!

Everybody Thought All This New Technology Happening at a Record Pace was COOL for Many Years!

Well!

Here We are & How F'N Cool is it Now?
 

heywouldya

Active Member
Messages
782
Here's my take on the deal. I use trail cams all year. It's fun seeing the animals and knowing what's out there. I've got mountain lions, bears, pigs, elk and some deer on our property. It's a lot like pre-hunting before season starts. What I've learned is, I never find most of those animals while I'm hunting. Ban camera's if you want, then will you ban scouting next? Where does it end?
 

wstrntines

Very Active Member
Messages
1,334
I bet they get banned. I don’t care either way. I don’t need them I’ll have a great time on my southern utah elk hunt on a unit with tons of cams. I bet some good bucks and bulls slip through the cracks and turn into great bucks and bulls if banned. I really hope apples get banned.
 

backinthegame

Active Member
Messages
720
Several threads on this subject...copying and pasting...

The biggest issue with HB295 is that it has been brought by a single state legislator based only on his opinion on the matters. Zero data, zero research...in fact, no mention of what goal is trying to be accomplished (harvest reduction? wildlife harassment? we literally have no idea) with the bill and impending law. Not only that, but the bill purposefully sidestepped the normal process for wildlife regulations in this state, the RAC committees, meaning no public input was allowed.

I am not at all automatically opposed to trail cam regulations and/or baiting bans, but all of us as hunters should demand better...even if you agree with this particular issue and would like to see cameras and/or baiting gone, that's just fine, but the process should not work this way. A single legislator should not be able to bring and push a bill based solely on his own personal agenda. What happens when the next legislator doesn't like trapping, or doesn't like the idea of hounds for lions or bears, or any other number of "controversial" outdoor-related issues? Slippery slope.

Do a little reading on Casey Snider's "reasoning" for bringing the bill and you will see nothing but one man's opinion. Zero data. Do cameras, cell or otherwise, increase harvest statistics? I don't know. Possible they do, but having that info available (among other data points) as part of this would be a nice start, no?

This SL Tribune article has zero fact, only opinion, hearsay, and hyperbole at best (outright lies at worst). To say there is not a single water source in the state without "dozens" (Casey has used "a half-dozen" at times as well) is not true at all. Implying that hunters are getting a text message that a deer is at the apple pile and killing it 5 mins later is a pretty damn broad brush to paint with, but any non-hunter that reads that article will likely agree (as many of us would) that a scenario such as that is wrong. Problem is, again, there if very little (more like any) proof this is actually happening outside of an isolated incidence here and there, someone's brother-in-law's buddy did it type of thing.

Read the article. Read some of Casey's posts online about the bill.

 

hossblur

Long Time Member
Messages
5,127
Several threads on this subject...copying and pasting...

The biggest issue with HB295 is that it has been brought by a single state legislator based only on his opinion on the matters. Zero data, zero research...in fact, no mention of what goal is trying to be accomplished (harvest reduction? wildlife harassment? we literally have no idea) with the bill and impending law. Not only that, but the bill purposefully sidestepped the normal process for wildlife regulations in this state, the RAC committees, meaning no public input was allowed.

I am not at all automatically opposed to trail cam regulations and/or baiting bans, but all of us as hunters should demand better...even if you agree with this particular issue and would like to see cameras and/or baiting gone, that's just fine, but the process should not work this way. A single legislator should not be able to bring and push a bill based solely on his own personal agenda. What happens when the next legislator doesn't like trapping, or doesn't like the idea of hounds for lions or bears, or any other number of "controversial" outdoor-related issues? Slippery slope.

Do a little reading on Casey Snider's "reasoning" for bringing the bill and you will see nothing but one man's opinion. Zero data. Do cameras, cell or otherwise, increase harvest statistics? I don't know. Possible they do, but having that info available (among other data points) as part of this would be a nice start, no?

This SL Tribune article has zero fact, only opinion, hearsay, and hyperbole at best (outright lies at worst). To say there is not a single water source in the state without "dozens" (Casey has used "a half-dozen" at times as well) is not true at all. Implying that hunters are getting a text message that a deer is at the apple pile and killing it 5 mins later is a pretty damn broad brush to paint with, but any non-hunter that reads that article will likely agree (as many of us would) that a scenario such as that is wrong. Problem is, again, there if very little (more like any) proof this is actually happening outside of an isolated incidence here and there, someone's brother-in-law's buddy did it type of thing.

Read the article. Read some of Casey's posts online about the bill.



Casey is the leader of the sportsman caucus in the legislature. He brought the cam bill because its outside DWR powers. The DWR approached him about baiting.

So your opinion, is flat wrong.

About 4 articles after the one you googled is the same SL tribune, quoting a DWR biologist about the harm of baiting.

Its ok to not like the LIMITING(they can be used 8 months a year), but at least be honest and do minimal research
 

notdonhunting

Very Active Member
Messages
1,081
Hoss
Post up the links to the articles I can't find four since the one that was referred to by backinthegame.
And hoss the point is no data or facts was giving by Casey to the other law makers.
 

hossblur

Long Time Member
Messages
5,127
Hoss
Post up the links to the articles I can't find four since the one that was referred to by backinthegame.
And hoss the point is no data or facts was giving by Casey to the other law makers.


On which? Baiting? Google mule deer and apples. There are a bunch of PDF studies





We have CWD (chronic wasting disease) in the state,” said hunter Steve Sorensen, a member of the wildlife division’s mule deer committee. “It’s spread by saliva and nose-to-nose contact. A deer is going to leave saliva on an apple.”

Baiting also congregates deer in unnatural ways, increasing the chance of disease spreading, said wildlife biologist Brock McMillan, who also serves on the state committee.

“The way mule deer roam, their home range is 150 miles (241 kilometers),” McMillan said. “When you manipulate that with baiting, it changes the natural way they use the landscape.”
-SL TRIBUNE


On cams? If you listen to HUSH Casey admits there isn't studies. But follows that with the obvious, its a newer technology.

But look around. Nevada, Arizona, Idaho, Montana. Its not like he just pulled something out of mid air, it seems to be a problem in public land states.

Screenshot_20210215-181837.png
 

Elkslayer2015

Active Member
Messages
330
Hoss nailed it the other thing that pissed me off about Hush is they sat there and told everyone they don't bait very little in A lot of their videos they are putting out critter lick and setting cameras yeah it's legal to do so but don't sit here and tell us you do it very little.
Also Remember they said cameras don't kill and their right but they are a very helpful tool to target a certain animal and this lets say for instance the fire bull if they didn't have cam pics of him I bet the outcome would be totally different or maybe not by all means I'm not taken anything away from Eric he shot a big bull with a bow and it's a cool video but let's tell the truth here...
Go threw and watch hunting videos on you tube especially guide videos and there are a lot of videos that show this animal growing over the course of 3 to 4 years then it shows them harvested it takes a ton of cameras to get that kind of footage.
 

hossblur

Long Time Member
Messages
5,127
Maybe if Eric Chesser would untuck his ears from his hat he would hear most DIY hunters in the state want them banned.


They are You tubers first. IG follows second. Flat brimmer/bro third. Hunters fourth. Conservationist/sportsmen fifth.

Casey taking shots at Don Peay and $FW at the end of the podcast/video showed their colors. On a normal year they would have spent last week from open to close at the expo, pimping like champions. Bro hugging all the $fw guys. Talking about how great the show is. How the tags do great work for conservation.

They are what they are. Not to mention, Casey lives in Idaho. Not sure why Utah should spend a second on what he thinks.
 

roadrunner

Very Active Member
Messages
2,492
If trail cams get banned, or outlawed, there go our chances of finally getting a good photo of Bigfoot in the Cache, or Bigfoot on the Wasatch :(

Good luck getting Matt Moneymaker and Bobo back in town...
 

SureShot

Very Active Member
Messages
1,013
The substitute bill (punting on the trail cam part by giving the wildlife board the authority to make regulations) passed the House today with overwhelming support.

As passed (assuming it makes it through the Senate as well), baiting will be illegal on public and private lands and any regulations related to trail cams will be established through the RAC/wildlife board process.
 

elkantlers

Very Active Member
Messages
2,538
If this Actually makes it to the WB, there better be at least 2 board members that recuse themselves from the baiting vote. And, they better not allow baiting on private and ban it on Public.
 

roadrunner

Very Active Member
Messages
2,492
If this Actually makes it to the WB, there better be at least 2 board members that recuse themselves from the baiting vote. And, they better not allow baiting on private and ban it on Public.
Slippery slope when you begin to regulate what you can and cannot do on private property. Even if it is a "public resource"...
 

Elkslayer2015

Active Member
Messages
330
This isn't anywhere near the slippery slope. On private property, you already can't spotlight, hunt out of season or hunt without a license. The same rules of fair chase apply on both public and private property.
Sureshot Have they changed something?
Just wondering how they can hunt out of season and with out a license this isn't big game or is it?
 

elkantlers

Very Active Member
Messages
2,538
Slippery slope when you begin to regulate what you can and cannot do on private property. Even if it is a "public resource"...
You need to think before you type. There are all kinds of regulations on private land when it comes to hunting. And, in regards to wildlife if there is a regulation on public land there should be the same regulation on private.

I just know that Heaton and Selmon should not be allowed to vote on anything regarding CWMU's. Conflict of interest. especially when it effects their bottom line.
 

cannonball

Very Active Member
Messages
1,092
The substitute bill (punting on the trail cam part by giving the wildlife board the authority to make regulations) passed the House today with overwhelming support.

As passed (assuming it makes it through the Senate as well), baiting will be illegal on public and private lands and any regulations related to trail cams will be established through the RAC/wildlife board process.
Getting rid of baiting is good, but the Wildlife Board is to engrained with land owners and guide services to be objective.
 

SureShot

Very Active Member
Messages
1,013
I'm glad the bill is taking baiting out of the hands of the board and making the decision for them. With trail cams being handed off to the board, I hope they make a good decision as well.
 

roadrunner

Very Active Member
Messages
2,492
You need to think before you type. There are all kinds of regulations on private land when it comes to hunting. And, in regards to wildlife if there is a regulation on public land there should be the same regulation on private.

I just know that Heaton and Selmon should not be allowed to vote on anything regarding CWMU's. Conflict of interest. especially when it effects their bottom line.
I did think before I typed, hand.

Still a slippery slope...
 

wstrntines

Very Active Member
Messages
1,334
They are You tubers first. IG follows second. Flat brimmer/bro third. Hunters fourth. Conservationist/sportsmen fifth.

Casey taking shots at Don Peay and $FW at the end of the podcast/video showed their colors. On a normal year they would have spent last week from open to close at the expo, pimping like champions. Bro hugging all the $fw guys. Talking about how great the show is. How the tags do great work for conservation.

They are what they are. Not to mention, Casey lives in Idaho. Not sure why Utah should spend a second on what he thinks.
It’s very easy to take the nba knee when the fans are sitting home. I bet not one of these companies that buys a booth pulls out of next yrs. show. They claim to hate SFW but always buy a booth.
 

hossblur

Long Time Member
Messages
5,127
It’s very easy to take the nba knee when the fans are sitting home. I bet not one of these companies that buys a booth pulls out of next yrs. show. They claim to hate SFW but always buy a booth.


I actually challenged Newberg and Rinella/Callahan on that .

Newberg response was that he has great sponsors who do a lot of great conservation work. That work requires !$$ and the expo e as a good marketplace. So he goes to help them. said. hes never put in for drawing.

Callahan kind of echoed that, he was with first lite then. Didnt answer if hed applied.

To be fair I like both. Both do great work. HOWEVER. It is fairly hypocritical to be in the niche they are in, yet be at $fw ethery year.

Randy was pretty conflicted. Did point out THE DON makes wide circles away from him.

HUSH on the other hand would pimp anything.

Personally, there are contractors that I would never work for because they are hacks. I guess we all make choices?
 

travishunter3006

Very Active Member
Messages
1,865
Hooray! The trail cam ban language was struck from the bill! Hooray hooray! People can still take pictures! Hunters' rights weren't further restricted and that is something we can all be proud of!
 

cannonball

Very Active Member
Messages
1,092
I was hoping for more, but as written they are expected to make some rules regarding trail cameras. I just hope they are not so ingrained with special interest groups they they don't do something. State legislature could have stood up to the plate and made a home run here, but they caved to the powerful few. I guess this is life with the powerful. That is the way it is in the world also. Eight of the richest men in the world have more money than the remainder lower income of 1/2 of the remaining world population. politics - - - POO.
 

Hawkeye

Very Active Member
Messages
2,684
I hope the Wildlife Board foes through the process and imposes some serior restrictions on trail cams. BUT, I'm not holding my breath. If that does not occur, then I hope the legislature take this up again after having given the Wildlife Board the opportunity to address the issue.

Hawkeye
 

Giddyup

Member
Messages
99
Ban all of both.a lot of the big bucks and bulls would never even be seen if not for the trail cams. Nothing wrong with some of them surviving. Also we should do away with the late hunts
 

Clownpuncher

Active Member
Messages
200
I don't use baiting, understand why it's illegal. But what is wrong with game cameras? Seriously asking.

I use them all the time and the only time I have taken anyones picture is when they stole my other camera that another one was pointed at because they were poaching and I caught them red handed.
 

buckhorn

Very Active Member
Messages
2,151
Another issue with trail cameras during hunting season is a potential conflict between hunters sitting the water or game trail and then other guys coming in to check the cameras. I have heard of multiple times when this has happened and that usually ends up in a conflict.
I personally don’t sit water but I have gone up to check my cameras while other guys were nearby in a blind and it is an uncomfortable situation for both parties.
I do like running cameras for preseason scouting but I have no problem with having to pull them out before hunting season starts.
I support restrictions but not a total ban.
 

texbowhunter

Member
Messages
11
Another issue with trail cameras during hunting season is a potential conflict between hunters sitting the water or game trail and then other guys coming in to check the cameras. I have heard of multiple times when this has happened and that usually ends up in a conflict.
I personally don’t sit water but I have gone up to check my cameras while other guys were nearby in a blind and it is an uncomfortable situation for both parties.
I do like running cameras for preseason scouting but I have no problem with having to pull them out before hunting season starts.
I support restrictions but not a total ban.
I had an issue where I was trying to pattern some deer I had found during the archery hunt. The bucks would bed in this deep ravine with PJ and feed out on this big chained flat that was hard to stalk them in because I would lose sight of them as soon as I dropped down on their level.

So I was watching the bucks and planning on ambushing them the next day. A guy comes up with binos and a camo shirt on, no weapon. He buggers the deer and checks a trail cam, turns around and hikes out. It took a few days before I relocated the big buck in the group.

Definitely not ideal. Wish more hunters were courteous and used common sense.
 

MuleyKiller

Member
Messages
75
Trail Cameras are just one of the things leading to and causing the decline of our deer and elk herds. My success has definitely improved by using them. It does not matter what they decide to do, it wont change the way anybody operates. They will still put them up and use them, because our Wardens will not be out enforcing it. Other Sportsman will Bash a few of them or put a bullet in a few but mostly nothing will change. You will still be able to drive your ATV in a restricted area to put up and check your camera. The only people you will need to watch out for are other hunters. Laws don't matter in Utah because they are not enforced, I learned that a long time ago. So Carry on.
 

hawkbill

Very Active Member
Messages
1,362
Trash in the forest, keep the plastic crap from China out of the forest. I really like the guys that pack in a T-post with the plastic crap.
 

cannonball

Very Active Member
Messages
1,092
The Wildlife Board is now in charge of making change of the cameras. Contact them.
Gov. Cox signed the bill outlawing baiting, but you need to contact the WB on the cameras. According to the representative they are expected to do something.
 

elkassassin

Long Time Member
Messages
26,237
Ya!

You've Heard Me Bittching about the Same Things!

And What Really Amazes Me Is A Whole Bunch of People Think One Change is Gonna Fix It!

JFP!


Trail Cameras are just one of the things leading to and causing the decline of our deer and elk herds. My success has definitely improved by using them. It does not matter what they decide to do, it wont change the way anybody operates. They will still put them up and use them, because our Wardens will not be out enforcing it. Other Sportsman will Bash a few of them or put a bullet in a few but mostly nothing will change. You will still be able to drive your ATV in a restricted area to put up and check your camera. The only people you will need to watch out for are other hunters. Laws don't matter in Utah because they are not enforced, I learned that a long time ago. So Carry on.
 

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