NR cap on OTC archery deer

AZNATIVE98

Active Member
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Looks like beginning in January NR will be capped at 10% for OTC archery deer. 2,890 tags to first come first serve available 12-01-22 at 12AM online only. Yeah
 
Should we start the list of blame game?

AZFG - paying YouTubers like Hushin, Brian Call, ect , ect

Modern technology - hunters being able lob arrows at 100 yards and higher success rates.

YouTube & Internet - overall hunter popularity and ease of access to information.

Climate - winter moisture and fawn recruitment has been been down hill for the better part of a decade.

Population - Both NR and R populations have grown at exponential rates and show no sign of slowing down. Numbers of people moving to AZ that will become Residents will also dilute the pool. This is the same argument Idaho residents tried to mount saying that NRs were ruining their hunts.

Covid - saw increases in every aspect of the outdoors.


It’s a non sustainable hunt. Congratulations to all those got to enjoy it prior to the internet and population boom.
 
I’m happy, but the inevitable is in our future.

Honestly, I think OTC mule deer hunts are a mistake. The resource in the arid SW just can’t sustain the demand.
 
Awesome for residents for sure! I wonder how many nonresidents annually there have been? is this a 10% decrease or 50% decrease from what usually is sold to nonresidents?
 
Not sure about awesome for residents either if the below article is anywhere close to true.

Point pool is going to get a lot more crowded real quick. The upside is those OTC hunts should be considerably nicer .


“Arizona has had over-the-counter archery deer hunting for as long as I can remember. It has always been underrated in my opinion, but it has been picking up more attention in recent years which has spurred discussions to make changes for 2022. Typically, the number of tags sold for OTC archery hunts from the 1980s to 2017 fluctuated between 20,000 and 25,000. Then in 2020, that number shot up to over 30,000 tags sold and units and seasons were dropping from the program.”

 
Sorry but I hope this is a very short-lived solution. We live in a state with a very limited number of deer that is not increasing. At best, some units are stable. Compound that with a human population that has already grown over 6 million people over last 40 years and is predicted to grow by another 1.4 million people this decade. All this and then add on the 20+ year drought we have been experiencing. The last thing we should be offering is OTC opportunities to non-residents when we can't meet the needs/wants of the residents. What other western state offers OTC deer (especially mule deer) opportunities to NR's during the very best times to hunt them during the rut? This is crazy

I have no facts to support this assumption, but I only know what I have observed and read. I believe NR's are more successful per capita than resident hunters. When they travel from out of state to hunt, they tend to hunt harder and longer than most resident OTC archery deer hunters. Because of this they tend to be more successful. A NR is more likely to hire a guide/outfitter as well which adds to their success

Game fish should have just issued NR's a very limited # of tags for each unit and made them apply and draw the tag. I am not anti- NR but I am pro Arizona wildlife and hunters. With the quota system in place now all this new NR's solution is going to do is take opportunity away from residents. The faster quotas fill, the sooner hunts close.

If I'm wrong, I am wrong. Nothing would make me happier.
 
Game fish should have just issued NR's a very limited # of tags for each unit and made them apply and draw the tag. I am not anti- NR but I am pro Arizona wildlife and hunters. With the quota system in place now all this new NR's solution is going to do is take opportunity away from residents. The faster quotas fill, the sooner hunts close.

I agree. They should have just made them draw tags for the NRs and required them to apply in the draw and lose points if drawn. The guys that love these archery hunts that have low number of points would probably burn them, which would help with point creep.
 
I agree. They should have just made them draw tags for the NRs and required them to apply in the draw and lose points if drawn. The guys that love these archery hunts that have low number of points would probably burn them, which would help with point creep.

BW not picking on you specifically just the data. 10% of the tags went to NR as it was. So roughly 3000ish tags.

How does letting 27,000 people run free solve that issue?

The resource is the issue plain and simple. Should residents get more access absolutely but does zero good for the health of the resource we are all bickering over if that’s your main focus.

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I understand managing the resource and increasing hunting opportunities for residents, but the thing that bothers me the is a NR could purchase a tag, then the season closes due to meeting kill quotas. AZ selling a tag and not letting it be used is like robbery!

Yea, I know, the same could happen to a resident. And the buyer knows those are the rules, but a NR is out $460 bucks, plus a lot more in travel, motel, etc. than the R tag.
 
I understand managing the resource and increasing hunting opportunities for residents, but the thing that bothers me the is a NR could purchase a tag, then the season closes due to meeting kill quotas. AZ selling a tag and not letting it be used is like robbery!

Yea, I know, the same could happen to a resident. And the buyer knows those are the rules, but a NR is out $460 bucks, plus a lot more in travel, motel, etc. than the R tag.
There's no way that the quota will be met for every or any unit for whitetail down south so NR will have an opportunity to use their purchased deer tag, it just might not be for mule deer. Also plenty of other hunting opportunities to use that $160 hunting license and I'm guessing that most NR who purchase a hunting license are also putting in for other species. Also lets say that a NR gets a 2023 tag and the quotas all feel up before they were able to use it in January the tag will still be valid for the August hunt and right now I believe every unit down south and some of the Northern units didn't feel the quota for mule deer and will be open for at least the first 6 days of the December hunt and I would be willing to bet the same will hold true for 2023.
 
I understand managing the resource and increasing hunting opportunities for residents, but the thing that bothers me the is a NR could purchase a tag, then the season closes due to meeting kill quotas. AZ selling a tag and not letting it be used is like robbery!

Yea, I know, the same could happen to a resident. And the buyer knows those are the rules, but a NR is out $460 bucks, plus a lot more in travel, motel, etc. than the R tag.
Both R and NR just needs to be there opening day. Even if the quota is met Friday(opening day), the unit won’t close until the following Wednesday at sundown. So you still have 6 days to hunt, regardless if the quota is met.

Pick an open unit and be there opening day. Hunt hard for 6 days!
 
I doubt it will make much of a difference, they'll barely sell out archery tags to limit NR's. The new quotas will limit archery harvest and then they'll realize the problem is the thousands of rifle tags, multiple rifle seasons and people popping deer at 500+ has a more profound effect on the deer population....

That said it may help mule deer slightly as tag numbers and quotas are lower, but the coues get punished by the rifle hunters..
 
Prolly withing 3 years all archery tags will be a draw for everyone. There may still be some OTC in the southern units for coues only. I'm good with less NR tags, late archery hunting may become more enjoyable without film crews all over the place.
 
Thanks for the info AZ-N and AZ-8. With the Arizona tags good for the calendar year, it's not as bad as I thought. Also good to hear many units don't typically fill quotas.

Thanks again.
 
I’m just salty about no land owner tags in Az… I understand the limiting NR tags. It isn’t sustainable at all. I wonder about the increase in residents in the west at the rate we are going we won’t have any water left for people. CO’s population has doubled in 10ish years AZ is booming… I guess we will find out?
 
The last thing we should be offering is OTC opportunities to non-residents when we can't meet the needs/wants of the residents. What other western state offers OTC deer (especially mule deer) opportunities to NR's during the very best times to hunt them during the rut? This is crazy
What I'm interested in is how many of those "residents" are actually non-residents with a lifetime license, AZ likes to exempt this group from the NR cap for some reason. I'm expecting this carve-out to go away in the future considering the limited resources as you mentioned, but it's amazing that they're still applying this rule, now towards OTC archery deer.
 
Looks like beginning in January NR will be capped at 10% for OTC archery deer. 2,890 tags to first come first serve available 12-01-22 at 12AM online only. Yeah
Where did you find this information? I have heard about the units closing after meeting quota but I haven't read anything about tag caps and online purchasing
 
I’m super happy about this. This needed to happen years ago. I can’t just buy a tag in the prime rut for other states I don’t live in and go hunt. I’d like the to see it capped at even less.
 
I’m super happy about this. This needed to happen years ago. I can’t just buy a tag in the prime rut for other states I don’t live in and go hunt. I’d like the to see it capped at even less.
Sure you can. Colorado you can bowhunt elk in the rut every year, they sell tens of thousands of tags to NR. Also OTC rifle hunts post rut also tens of thousands. Also Idaho has OTC rut deer and elk hunts with a quota much higher than Arizona. Nebraska archery deer is the same. I'm sure there's more....
 
Sure you can. Colorado you can bowhunt elk in the rut every year, they sell tens of thousands of tags to NR. Also OTC rifle hunts post rut also tens of thousands. Also Idaho has OTC rut deer and elk hunts with a quota much higher than Arizona. Nebraska archery deer is the same. I'm sure there's more....
I’m referring to archery deer hunts in the rut not elk.
 
Sure you can. Colorado you can bowhunt elk in the rut every year, they sell tens of thousands of tags to NR. Also OTC rifle hunts post rut also tens of thousands. Also Idaho has OTC rut deer and elk hunts with a quota much higher than Arizona. Nebraska archery deer is the same. I'm sure there's more....
You can’t compare those States to Arizona. Our dry, arid climate limits the resource greatly. We just don’t have the numbers our Western neighbors hold. We can’t sustain unchecked demand.
 
You can’t compare those States to Arizona. Our dry, arid climate limits the resource greatly. We just don’t have the numbers our Western neighbors hold. We can’t sustain unchecked demand.
Mule deer I would agree.... Coues on the other hand is a totally different story. I doubt that many units will reach the archery harvest limits on coues with the exception of a few, the success rates are so low.

The roughly 35,000 gun tags handed out does more damage to the deer than 2,800 NR bowhunters averaging 10% sucess. Realistically NR bowhunters likely equate to about 2% of the overall deer harvest in AZ.
 
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I’m just salty about no land owner tags in Az… I understand the limiting NR tags. It isn’t sustainable at all. I wonder about the increase in residents in the west at the rate we are going we won’t have any water left for people. CO’s population has doubled in 10ish years AZ is booming… I guess we will find out?
Huh? Unless you own a ranch on the strip, I don’t follow you on the landowner tags. Not that private is a real issue down there, but I don’t see how taking licenses out of the public pool helps anything.

They say cities use less water than ag does. Not sure I believe that.

30 years ago that otc archery tag was the best thing going. I seem to recall hunting season being like 4 months long back then :cool:
 
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Huh? Unless you own a ranch on the strip, I don’t follow you on the landowner tags. Not that private is a real issue down there, but I don’t see how taking licenses out of the public pool helps anything.

They say cities use less water than ag does. Not sure I believe that.

30 years ago that otc archery tag was the best thing going. I seem to recall hunting season being like 4 months long back then :cool:
Blue I am a colorado kid, and lucked out into marrying into a pioneering ranch family in the Kirkland area, so when I looked into hunting AZ I was a little disappointed in the no land owner option, but I get it. Everyone has to go through the draw more equitable for sure, just was looking to cash in on finally having some private to hunt, aren’t many big deer on the ranch though… tons of javelina though

4 months is awesome, yeah my in laws are pretty connected with some outfitters and they are not happy with the new deer archery season, sounds like most of the units will meet quota the first week and then close up
 
Blue I am a colorado kid, and lucked out into marrying into a pioneering ranch family in the Kirkland area, so when I looked into hunting AZ I was a little disappointed in the no land owner option, but I get it. Everyone has to go through the draw more equitable for sure, just was looking to cash in on finally having some private to hunt, aren’t many big deer on the ranch though… tons of javelina though

4 months is awesome, yeah my in laws are pretty connected with some outfitters and they are not happy with the new deer archery season, sounds like most of the units will meet quota the first week and then close up
Totally get it. My grandma is what they called a “territorial daughter” and I was borned and raised in the Verde Valley. Which may make me an illegal?

I knew a lot of those old pioneer families. Most of those big holdings have been turned into a house on the beach somewhere. The ones that are still in the family usually have a pile of gnarly racks in a barn somewhere. :)
 
Totally get it. My grandma is what they called a “territorial daughter” and I was borned and raised in the Verde Valley. Which may make me an illegal?

I knew a lot of those old pioneer families. Most of those big holdings have been turned into a house on the beach somewhere. The ones that are still in the family usually have a pile of gnarly racks in a barn somewhere. :)
The family is still holding 800 or so acres along Kirkland creek, but a fraction of the 6500 that it once was. Grandpa has killed a few nice ones when he was little, but he is far more into raising and eating cattle than hunting
 

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