Points System

[freebird63]

So who has the ultimate say in if Idaho gets a points system?? There is a new candidate running for Idaho Governor. She said on her TikTok account page if appointed she would look into a points system. Is it solely the Governor or the Fish and Game or would it go before the voters??

 

[Weiserbucks]

It'll be whatever the farmers, ranchers and landowners want, just like everything else.

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

I think the authority may already be vested in the commissioners.

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

Fish and Game to Consider Bonus Point System

The Idaho Fish and Game Commission, during a meeting Thursday, May 20, gave the go-ahead to the Fish and Game Department to develop a controlled hunt bonus point system and a number of other rule changes. A bonus point system would give an advantage to hunters, unsuccessful in a controlled hunt...

idfg.idaho.gov

 

[otcbowhunter]

Article is a little old, don't you think?

Monday, May 24, 2010 - 12:00 AM MDT

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

It is old. But it's reflective of the notion that the Commission believes a point system is within it's power, not the legislatures.

 

[JPickett]

I’ll pay 3 times tag and application fees to not have a points system.

 

[wweaver79]

Idaho does not need to a point system but they to do need a waiting period for the limited non resident OTC elk tags ( yes I am a non resident). Every three years or something, same with deer. Go somewhere else the other two years take your pick, your already a non resident. But at least after you waited you can get you and your buddy or family tags without the Dec 1 draw( lets face that is what it has been last couple years)

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

That's getting to be a problem that needs addressed. It's only come up the last two years I think. Prior years NR tags didn't sell out until fall(some did not all).

 

[JPickett]

blown away to see a non resident actually suggest something other then "IDAHO OWES ME A TAG EVERY YEAR"

no we don't. weaver, you seem like a very logical guy. wish more of the tourist that came here in the fall were

 

[freebird63]

It always seems that the biggest share of non resident hunters refer to Idaho as their fall back state. But am not sure how that is now that the non resident tags sell out so soon.
All I know from what I've heard from all the hunters in states with points systems, they hate them and complain about the point creep.

 

[Weiserbucks]

Point systems are for greedy, entitled people who don't understand math and who hate their kids and grandchildren and never want any of them to get a good tag in their lifetime.

 

[SS!]

Point systems are for greedy, entitled people who don't understand math and who hate their kids and grandchildren and never want any of them to get a good tag in their lifetime.

Soooo you like point systems?

 

[Weiserbucks]

Soooo you like point systems?

I like point systems about as much as I like having a camel flea infested vagina.

 

[SS!]

I like point systems about as much as I like having a camel flea infested vagina.

 

[JPickett]

I like point systems about as much as I like having a camel flea infested vagina.

I still can’t tell if he does or doesn’t like point systems

 

[Weiserbucks]

I still can’t tell if he does or doesn’t like point systems

I'd rather sandblast a tiger's ass while wearing nothing but a pork chop loin cloth than go to a point system in ID.

 

[JPickett]

You have some troublingly specific scenarios you’re throwing out there…

 

[Weiserbucks]

You have some troublingly specific scenarios you’re throwing out there…

The only troubling scenario is the possibility of a point system.

 

[JPickett]

I’ll give ya that

 

[andrew12gauge]

Thankfully the majority of Idaho residents have spoken on this issue numerous times and hopefully IDFG will continue to listen and honor the wishes of that majority

 

[Idahoron]

Thankfully the majority of Idaho residents have spoken on this issue numerous times and hopefully IDFG will continue to listen and honor the wishes of that majority

The majority doesn't matter. What ever the legislature, and landowners want is what will happen.

 

[treedagain]

I like point systems about as much as I like having a camel flea infested vagina.

Itchy?

 

[El Gringo]

Preference points for residents…. Random Draw with 5 choices for us Non Res….. There….I’ve solved the “problem”

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

The majority doesn't matter. What ever the legislature, and landowners want is what will happen.

It's not the legislature, it's already in the hands of the F&G commissioners. And by extension the governor.

The legislature will, IMO, eventually squeeze them into doing it in a round about way by refusing funding. Essentially telling the commission if you want more money sell governors tags(this is already law) and points.

 

[huntindad4]

Point systems suck balls. Go to random draw for all NR and keep the residents system the same.

Only reason I even say NR random draw is it seems to be an issue for some with the first come first served mid day on a weekday wait on the computer till your random number comes up and you get to pick from the remaining tags system existing now.

Point systems are not your friend. I used to support them, it was convenient knowing where you stood in line for each state you applied for so you could map out your season and know you would t have 2 tags that overlapped by season etc...but then....point creep happened.

If NR crowd wants them and for whatever ridiculous reason the Idaho commission wants to appease them then at least go to a bonus point system like NV or similar, but still NR ONLY.

I am a NR by the way, to those that didn't know and want to.

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

The best thing about Idaho's system and the thing that makes it best is you can't put in for everything every year. I wish every state would do that, though I hold no hope. Idaho should decouple elk and mule deer too.

 

[Mooretitan]

I wish they would go to draw and let families put in together for tags. The way it is now sucks

 

[Weiserbucks]

Itchy?

It's really itchy, but if you scratch it, it feels like you dumped gas on it and set it on fire.

 

[customweld]

It's not the legislature, it's already in the hands of the F&G commissioners. And by extension the governor.

The legislature will, IMO, eventually squeeze them into doing it in a round about way by refusing funding. Essentially telling the commission if you want more money sell governors tags(this is already law) and points.

That is absolutely correct. The commissioners serve at the pleasure of the Governor. If he/she isn't getting what they want, they'll replace the commissioners. An easier way to read the future is to read IFB's play book. They spell out what they want.

 

[Arrowelk]

I can't stand the thought of a points system in ID.

I can see how it would be frustrating for the Non's the way its set up now, and prolly ought to just go full on random draw for them.

 

[JPickett]

I can't stand the thought of a points system in ID.

I can see how it would be frustrating for the Non's the way its set up now, and prolly ought to just go full on random draw for them.

waiting for someone to tell me why a resident should care at all about a non residents problem. don't like it, hunt elsewhere. i see no reason or incentive to change a single thing about our system to benefit any one that doesn't live here. now you want to make something better for a states residents (Wyoming gets this) i say go for it. the tourist can suck it up

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

waiting for someone to tell me why a resident should care at all about a non residents problem. don't like it, hunt elsewhere. i see no reason or incentive to change a single thing about our system to benefit any one that doesn't live here. now you want to make something better for a states residents (Wyoming gets this) i say go for it. the tourist can suck it up

I'm a resident and I think it's ridiculous that OTC tags are distributed this way. Was going to hunt with a NR buddy this year but he wasn't high enough up the que. Which is complete BS since it depends on your internet connection. A drawing wouldn't affect residents at all.

 

[JPickett]

you just need to be like me and have no friends. life's much simpler that way

 

[huntindad4]

you just need to be like me and have no friends. life's much simpler that way

Wait...what? This is absolutely shocking to me.....what with your charm and grace?

Haha.

 

[JPickett]

Wait...what? This is absolutely shocking to me.....what with your charm and grace?

Haha.

lots a suitors but none good enough for me

 

[OLDHORNHUNTER]

I will chime in here on the people that are so infatuated with point systems !! I have 7 friends all between the ages of 45 & 60 that have been gathering points in UT WY CO MT NV AZ NM for the past 20 plus years !!! Only 2 of them have drawn tags

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

I'd like to meet your friends gathering points in NM.

 

[huntindad4]

Drawing tags under point systems is, logistically speaking, no more difficult than random or any other draw. The hangup is drawing the specific tag you want for a specific unit.

That said the only reason I would say Idaho should go the point route or any other than the current one for NR is not to appease the NR, but to capitalize on the resource.

A drawing for those NR tags would of course require you buy a license first (nonrefundable) and then an app fee. Money could help the Department for habitat and or enforcement.

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

Problem with Idaho is the law doesn't allow for anything that can meaningfully improve habitat. It's just a big depredation slush fund. So more money to distribute to farmers doesn't really help hunters.

 

[wweaver79]

I will chime in here on the people that are so infatuated with point systems !! I have 7 friends all between the ages of 45 & 60 that have been gathering points in UT WY CO MT NV AZ NM for the past 20 plus years !!! Only 2 of them have drawn tags

Iam sure they have only been applying for the top couple tags that the HF and Epic, Eastmans promote or doing points only. Only way that is possible.

 

[Blindnonresident]

Points system for residents only.

 

[fullcry]

Eventually everyone will have to go to points.
Not enough tags for everyone and it’s getting worse.
OTC is not sustainable either.
Only a matter of time everywhere.

 

[JPickett]

One minute hunting is dying because younger generations aren’t getting into it and the old are dying off, next you need points because there won’t be enough tags blah, blah, blah

Keep your filthy points scheme hands off my Idaho

 

[boise]

Lot’s people banging drum on how point systems are all broke. States have to keep modifying them to keep people in them. idaho’s first come over the counter internet draw is embarrassing. needs to be fixed so friends and family members can apply/hunt together or all just hunt somewhere else . I love being able to get price locked 2nd tags, but most of those leftover tags in outfitter pool would go to nonresidents if they released them before August 1st and they were first come first served. 10-15 years ago there was a lot of pressure for points looking back Idaho did the right thing and based that decision on hunter feed back, just like the zone and unit restrictions for nonresidents. Give F&G a little credit for following thru on hunter surveys. Those states are saddled with broken systems that they will probably never be able to walk away from no matter how ridiculous they become.

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

What a lot of people forget about the point systems(and I'm against them) is their impact on pitman robertson money(pushing close to a billion a year). Arizona for example harvests half the elk that Idaho does but collects more PR money. In part because the land area is bigger but in part because they sell more licenses. Why does a state that harvests half the animals sell more licenses? Probably because you need one to be in the point scheme, whether you hunt or not. But I wouldn't advocate IDFG get more money for anything, I don't think they'd use it well.

 

[OLDHORNHUNTER]

I'd like to meet your friends gathering points in NM.

Sorry that was a miss print MY BAD

 

[OLDHORNHUNTER]

Iam sure they have only been applying for the top couple tags that the HF and Epic, Eastmans promote or doing points only. Only way that is possible.

And who in Idaho is putting in for tags in CRAP areas !! Probably not many, Idaho's top 4 premium deer units have 3 to 5% odds .

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

And who in Idaho is putting in for tags in CRAP areas !! Probably not many, Idaho's top 4 premium deer units have 3 to 5% odds .

Does any other states' top areas have better odds? Good evidence for not switching the system.

 

[JPickett]

Does any other states' top areas have better odds? Good evidence for not switching the system.

agreed. ill take 3-5% odds every year over 0% for 20 years

 

[boise]

What a lot of people forget about the point systems(and I'm against them) is their impact on pitman robertson money(pushing close to a billion a year). Arizona for example harvests half the elk that Idaho does but collects more PR money. In part because the land area is bigger but in part because they sell more licenses. Why does a state that harvests half the animals sell more licenses? Probably because you need one to be in the point scheme, whether you hunt or not. But I wouldn't advocate IDFG get more money for anything, I don't think they'd use it well.

Absolutely the Ponzi schemes generate $$ for game and fish depts. But P&M comes from guns, ammo,etc…. Not hunting Licenses AZ has 7.2 million people they sell a hell of a lot more 9mm and shotgun shell than Idahos 1.7 million

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

Absolutely the Ponzi schemes generate $$ for game and fish depts. But P&M comes from guns, ammo,etc…. Not hunting Licenses AZ has 7.2 million people they sell a hell of a lot more 9mm and shotgun shell than Idahos 1.7 million

The money comes from surtaxes. It gets distributed based on land area and licenses sold. Incentivizing people to buy a license and not hunt is easy money.

 

[boise]

I stand corrected I thought it was in state revenue not federal pie split 50 ways. How does that formula work is it more size or license based?

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

There are a few fixed carve out for hunters ed, and conservation grants. Then the rest is state_land_area/total_land_area for 50% and state_licensed_hunters/total_licensed_hunters for the other 50%. 0.5% minimum and 5% max.

 

[5K]

This Commissioner will never advocate for a point system in Idaho. I'll die on that hill.
The legislature is another matter. Makes you rethink the end around the commission for a chintzy piece of lighted plastic?

 

[HUNTNNW]

I'm a resident and I think it's ridiculous that OTC tags are distributed this way. Was going to hunt with a NR buddy this year but he wasn't high enough up the que. Which is complete BS since it depends on your internet connection. A drawing wouldn't affect residents at all.

yup the Non res OTC deal is messed up and they should make it a drawing. Leftovers available afterward as first come first serve.

 

[HUNTNNW]

I will chime in here on the people that are so infatuated with point systems !! I have 7 friends all between the ages of 45 & 60 that have been gathering points in UT WY CO MT NV AZ NM for the past 20 plus years !!! Only 2 of them have drawn tags

what units are they applying for? I dont put in that many states and in the last 11 years drawn have drawn 11 tags from WA,ID,UT and NV

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

yup the Non res OTC deal is messed up and they should make it a drawing. Leftovers available afterward as first come first serve.

Apparently 5K has a say on that. Maybe he can chime in? for now I'll chalk it up to being a recent problem.

 

[OLDHORNHUNTER]

agreed. ill take 3-5% odds every year over 0% for 20 years

Damn Straight Point systems SUCK !! But Maybe your lucky like HUNTNW who should be buying lottery tickets if he has been 100% successful drawing NR tags 11 out of 11 years !!

 

[OLDHORNHUNTER]

agreed. ill take 3-5% odds every year over 0% for 20 years

Yes sir some of those point states if you dont draw you dont hunt

 

[huntindad4]

Damn Straight Point systems SUCK !! But Maybe your lucky like HUNTNW who should be buying lottery tickets if he has been 100% successful drawing NR tags 11 out of 11 years !!

I think his point was it depends on which unit you apply to in states with points. CO for example has units you can draw every year with 0 points, then there are slightly better units you can draw with 1 or 2 points. Many folks say those hunts are as good as ID general units, I won't say that as I don't have experience in CO low to zero point units.

There is also hunts on the leftover draw that you can hunt while you wait to draw a better hunt because you keep your points when you get leftover tags. Similar to hunting a general tag in ID waiting to draw one of the high end low odds of drawing tags.

Other states have a similar setup.

Point is your friend could draw those tags but is waiting for a better hunt, I don't blame him. But he can hunt many of the states he puts in for often and be hunting out of state EVERY YEAR and probably more than one every year if he's not being picky about the hunt he gets.

It would be like you saying you won't hunt deer again until you draw the Owyhees or Bennetts and then complaining you never get to hunt deer.

Again I don't want ID to go to points and with what point creep and other problems have done to the states that have point systems I think those systems can be considered a failure. But you anecdotal analogy is off base a bit.

 

[Iddogguy]

yup the Non res OTC deal is messed up and they should make it a drawing. Leftovers available afterward as first come first serve.

I don’t think you’ll have to worry about it much longer. Idaho will be a draw for all nonresident tags soon. Idaho’s days of implementing a point system have long past. What State would start a point system with all the problems that are starting to arise for states with existing systems in place! The days of hunting deer & elk ever year in Idaho for nonresidents will soon be a thing of the past. Most nonresidents can’t do that in the State they call home. I’m with Wyoming leftovers should go to residents first.

 

[JPickett]

I don’t think you’ll have to worry about it much longer. Idaho will be a draw for all nonresident tags soon. Idaho’s days of implementing a point system have long past. What State would start a point system with all the problems that are starting to arise for states with existing systems in place! The days of hunting deer & elk ever year in Idaho for nonresidents will soon be a thing of the past. Most nonresidents can’t do that in the State they call home. I’m with Wyoming leftovers should go to residents first.

Amen

 

[Blindnonresident]

Idaho hunting is saved only by the massive amount of public ground it's made up of.

The funny thing is while most hunting residents are totally anti government they benefit from the government being the single largest landowner in the state.

They want America to fund the acres but only them to reap the rewards.

Hypocrites?
Probably.

 

[boise]

15 million hunters in U.S. they can’t all hunt Idaho, although the Boise national forest has been trying for years! Is there a better system not yet.

 

[JPickett]

Idaho hunting is saved only by the massive amount of public ground it's made up of.

The funny thing is while most hunting residents are totally anti government they benefit from the government being the single largest landowner in the state.

They want America to fund the acres but only them to reap the rewards.

Hypocrites?
Probably.

that's unique to Idaho huh?

 

[BGnight]

One minute hunting is dying because younger generations aren’t getting into it and the old are dying off, next you need points because there won’t be enough tags blah, blah, blah

Keep your filthy points scheme hands off my Idaho

The vaccine hasn't even kicked in. In two years it'll be 25% easier to draw in every state. Just a guess. A morbid guess yes, but still just a guess.

 

[idahomuleyhunter]

Idaho hunting is saved only by the massive amount of public ground it's made up of.

The funny thing is while most hunting residents are totally anti government they benefit from the government being the single largest landowner in the state.

They want America to fund the acres but only them to reap the rewards.

Hypocrites?
Probably.

What is there to fund? Do you know how much better hunting would be if they cut the forest service and their fire policies out of the loop?

 

[elkocd]

No point system, but fix the NR general tag disaster. It is by FAR the worst way of dispensing tags of any western state. Even without the discussion about not being able to get tags with family members, the whole idea of having to sit in a queue online for hours on a weekday for a chance to get a tag? Are you kidding me? I actually can do that, but what about a guy that is out working a job that can't? He's just F#$%ed because he has to work? What an embarrassing system!

 

[wildfin]

Idahoes 1.7 mill is increasing more than anywhere and the residents hunting every year is maybe more in jeopardy than nr. does anyone not know someone moving to Idaho. If Idaho goes to a pt system it wont matter if I like or not I will buy.

 

[Blindnonresident]

Idaho is the new California.
Surf's up Dude.

 

[HUNTNNW]

Damn Straight Point systems SUCK !! But Maybe your lucky like HUNTNW who should be buying lottery tickets if he has been 100% successful drawing NR tags 11 out of 11 years !!

its not 11 out of 11. its 1 out 15 apps at best a year.I dont apply for the strip, henrys, san juan etc. I apply for realistic expectations and somewhat of a shot at a tag and get to hunt pretty good units.

 

[Cooper]

Maybe Idaho just needs a good ole Hunting Expo, I bet you could find an organization or two to run it, make a ton of money for restoring your herd and then you’ll have so damn many deer and elk you’d get tired of counting them

 

[Weiserbucks]

Maybe Idaho just needs a good ole Hunting Expo, I bet you could find an organization or two to run it, make a ton of money for restoring your herd and then you’ll have so damn many deer and elk you’d get tired of counting them

Worked great in Utah didn't it?