Remington 700ml time to upgrade?

[DonVathome]

I got my Remington 700ml when it first came out almost 30 years ago. I am happy with the gun. What is the best new muzzleloader out there that is legal in most Rocky Mountain States for elk? Is it that much better then my 700ml? This is primarily for elk. I limit my range to 150 yards. Is there a gun that is good at 200 without dropping like crazy because of a heavy bullet.

I currently shoot TC shockwave for elk.

 

[Blank]

All of the new rifles out there are much improved over the old Rem 700ML of yours. I personally use White Whitetails for the majority of my hunting, and have a CVA Accura for Blackhorn and 209 ignition in states which allow it. Heck, watch any of the TV shows and they have muzzleloaders with guaranteed MOA accuracy to 500 yards!!

Many of the states are realizing this, and adjusting seasons, restrictions, and harvest numbers accordingly. When it gets to the point that you are basically hunting with the equivalent of a single shot 30-30, you are no longer muzzleloading! As long as you are restricted to loose powder, percussion ignition, lead bullets like Idaho there are no differences in performance. When you start talking Blackhorn or smokeless powders, 209 or cartridge ignition systems, and custom designed bullets the world of long-range performance opens up considerably.

Probably the biggest thing is that most muzzleloading bullets haven't changed for 40 years. If you still launch them between 1400-2000 fps, they drift like crazy and drop like a rock!!

Muzzleloading Bullets and Ballistic Coefficients

 

[DonVathome]

Thanks! Accurcy is not an issue with my gun - energy is what limits my range.

 

[buckhorn]

Thanks! Accurcy is not an issue with my gun - energy is what limits my range.

I shoot the same gun you do. I primarily hunt Nevada,Idaho and Colorado where scopes are not legal. You can get a conversion bolt from Badger Ridge to shoot 209 primers. Do a search for badger ridge Remington 700 muzzleloader conversion and you will find it. Keep your original bolt for states that don’t allow 209.
I load 80 grains by weight of Blackhorn powder and Barnes Sabot Bullets.
Very accurate and lots of energy!

 

[DonVathome]

I have the 209 conversion it is great.

 

[DonVathome]

Also when you saw better why? I am mostly looking for something more powerful. My gun is accurate and dependable - but for bull elk I would like to reach out to 200 yards. Not sure if my current 700ml can.

 

[goforbroke]

Remington ultimate muzzleloader has treated me well. I shoot 105 grains blackhorn and parker bullets. One shot 340 yards on my cow elk this year. I am sighted in at 150 and 0-185 yards I am within 4" of aim point so I don't have to dial/adjust till 200 plus yards. Be tough to do if scopes aren't allowed.

I would agree that technology changes weapons and harvest ability. I wouldn't shoot my rifle at 300 yards 20 years ago, Now I feel confident with a muzzleloader to 400 yards. I am more accurate with my bow at 90 yards than I was at 40 yards in 1990.

 

[DonVathome]

WOW! I limit myself to 150, under IDEAL circumstances on a cow elk 175. I sent you a PM

 

[BIGJOHNT]

Is this Don Martin from Arizona? Arrowhead rifles moved to Arizona and puts together some great muzzleloader rifles. You don’t have to buy one of his. But you can see what these new muzzleloaders can do. He builds of the Remington ultimate and the Thompson. I have a Thompson set up. It is pretty amazing. Shoots great groups out to 600 yards and groups better then most of my center fire rifles at 100 yards.

 

[DonVathome]

Nope not Don Martin. That is amazing. My gun is accurate and I have never attempted to really test that - I was happy with 150 yards - going to do some research.

Bottom line is my gun inferior energy wise to newer guns? Basically I guess that means can never guns shoot enough more powder to matter? Other then that I can use all the same bullets it is jsut a matter of if they shoot accurate enough. Am I missing anything?

 

[liecabucks]

Nope not Don Martin. That is amazing. My gun is accurate and I have never attempted to really test that - I was happy with 150 yards - going to do some research.

Bottom line is my gun inferior energy wise to newer guns? Basically I guess that means can never guns shoot enough more powder to matter? Other then that I can use all the same bullets it is jsut a matter of if they shoot accurate enough. Am I missing anything?

The powder capacity in many new loaders have been increased conciderably but to allow for the increase most will be using the new ignition systems. I still run older White rifles and havnt joined the crowd on the new technology yet though. My guess is you would be able to load your remy enough to get what you need to do.

 

[elkassassin]

But Remember lieca!

Your White was Top of the Line at one time!

The powder capacity in many new loaders have been increased conciderably but to allow for the increase most will be using the new ignition systems. I still run older White rifles and havnt joined the crowd on the new technology yet though. My guess is you would be able to load your remy enough to get what you need to do.

 

[hntbambi]

Don,
In factory original state your gun is a ways behind the current technology for muzzleloading. You can have your 700ML built to handle loads that are in excess of the current 700 Ultimate ML for sure. I have a few of them myself. I limit 400 yards on bull elk shooting BH209 with my old custom 700ML. Accuracy is fine but energy drops off with the black powder subs. Now shooting smokeless I can shoot a whole lot farther than that. But I can't use it in New Mexico during ML season with smokeless powder.

 

[DonVathome]

hntbambi thanks! I had no idea I could do that. How much does it cost to have it custom built? PM me if you do not want to post that here. That seems like great idea. I have been very happy with the gun so far and have confidence in it - which goes a looooong ways (pun intended).

 

[buckhorn]

Don,
In factory original state your gun is a ways behind the current technology for muzzleloading. You can have your 700ML built to handle loads that are in excess of the current 700 Ultimate ML for sure. I have a few of them myself. I limit 400 yards on bull elk shooting BH209 with my old custom 700ML. Accuracy is fine but energy drops off with the black powder subs. Now shooting smokeless I can shoot a whole lot farther than that. But I can't use it in New Mexico during ML season with smokeless powder.

All this sounds great but are your custom jobs legal for hunting in Nevada Colorado and Idaho?
Muzzleloader only seasons.

 

[DonVathome]

I only plan to hunt with it in Wyoming, NM & Utah. I believe it is legal in those states????