Skunk

[202typical]

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Iraq war is 'lost': US Democrat leader Harry Reid
Apr 19 02:45 PM US/Eastern

The war in Iraq "is lost" and a US troop surge is failing to bring peace to the country, the leader of the Democratic majority in the US Congress, Harry Reid, said Thursday.

"I believe ... that this war is lost, and this surge is not accomplishing anything, as is shown by the extreme violence in Iraq this week," Reid told journalists.

Reid said he had delivered the same message to US President George W. Bush on Wednesday, when the US president met with senior lawmakers to discuss how to end a standoff over an emergency war funding bill.

"I know I was the odd guy out at the White House, but I told him at least what he needed to hear ... I believe the war at this stage can only be won diplomatically, politically and economically."

Congress is seeking to tie funding for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan to a timetable to withdraw US troops from Iraq next year, but Bush has vowed to veto any such bill and no breakthrough was reported from the White House talks.

Bush on Thursday was addressing an Ohio town hall meeting and defending the war on terror launched in the wake of the September 11, 2001 attacks.

"It is the most solemn duty of our country, is to protect our country from harm," Bush told the invited audience in Tipp, Ohio.

"A lesson learned was that -- at least in my opinion -- that in order to protect us, we must aggressively pursue the enemy and defeat them elsewhere so that we do not have to face them here."

But Reid drew a parallel with former US president Lyndon Johnson who decided to deploy more troops in Vietnam some 40 years ago when 24,000 US troops had already been killed.

"Johnson did not want a war loss on his watch, so he surged in Vietnam. After the surge was over, we added 34,000 to the 24,000 who died in Vietnam," Reid said.

The comments came a day after bombers killed more than 200 people in a slew of car bombings in Baghdad, dealing a savage blow to the US security plan which aims to deploy an extra 30,000 troops in the country to quell sectarian unrest.

US Defense Secretary Robert Gates fly into Iraq Thursday on an unannounced visit for talks with top US military commanders there.

He met with General David Petraeus, chief of coalition forces in Iraq, his deputy Lieutenant Colonel Ray Odierno and Admiral William Fallon, chief of US forces in the Middle East.

 

[huntindude]

I don't think " lost " was the best choice of words he could have used. I do think it's fair to say we're not going to win it, maybe a " draw " would be the best way to put it. say it however you want things aren't going well and the troop surge doesn't seem to have helped that much, it's not taboo anymore to talk about it expect more blunt comments.

 

[viking421a]

The troop surge hasn't even been completed yet. How can we say a plan hasn't worked when it hasn't been implemented? Only a small percent or the troops slated to be a part of the "surge" are in place and already it is being reported that there has been an overall drop in violence.

The only thing reid is doing by making these defeatest comments is emboldening the enemy. Every time they hear one of our so called leaders say something like this is boosts the terrorists moral. The democrats have invested so much in defeat they don't want anything else but defeat.

Think about it, if we lose in iraq the democrats and the terrorists win.

If we win in iraq our troops, the american people, iraqi people, and the rest of the free world wins.

Which side do you want to be on?

 

[huntindude]

If you check you'll find all registered democrats are Americans, so if they win isn't that Americans winning?. you're right not all the extra troops are in place but we can't hold them there forever so the peak won't last that long, their tours have been extended to 15 months and everything short of pulling WWI vets back to service has been done. if the troop numbers we have there now can't do it then the prospects for success is limited at best. I wouldn't say the fat lady has sung yet but the dems are not out of line calling a spade a spade. it's time for some real results, the power of positive thinking program has worn thin.

 

[202typical]

The shame of it all Dude is if the Dems would get on board with a winning attitude and a winning strategy and let our troops do what they do best we could be out of there in a year. The Dems desperatly do not want a win in Iraq. They are so far vested in defeat now that if our troops with the help of the Republicans pull out a good ending to this war the Dems will go down in flames for years and will forever be seen as the party of losers and quiters and anti American.
Yes Dude we can win, but it takes us all to pull together to do it and the Dems refuse.

 

[huntindude]

As of now what have the dems done to keep the troops or Bush from doing what they want? a funding cut off is a threat but it's not going to happen and that's the first and only action taken. Bush has done a good job of messing this war up he doesn't need the dems help at all. if all winning required was sticking to your guns we should have won by now, nobody's ever won in the middle east and it may stay that way.

 

[202typical]

The Dems embolden our enemy on a daily basis Dude and you know it. Don't act stupid. You know as well as I do that when pieces of garbage like Harry Ried say the things he says it gives our enemy hope. When the Dems call our troops stupid (John Kerry) when they call our President a murderer (John Murtha) when the Dems in congress call our troops murderers (John Murtha) when they say the war is lost (Harry Ried) when the Dem Speaker of the House has private talks with our enemies (Nancy Peloci) and I could go on and on and on. These things are emboldoning our enemy. They are doing everything they can to make sure we lose in Iraq. A loss in Iraq means votes for Dems in 08. It is that simple. The Dems are so scared that this surge might go well they are crying wolf before the surge even gets legs.

 

[jhibbs]

202 is exactly right, and if the polititions and media stayed out of the way and let the military do its job it would likely have been over with absolute victory by now.

If that means blowing up a few mosques where the insurgents are hiding themselves and thier weapons so be it. (You know that they would do it to us in a heart beat)Just the fact that our troops have to fight in a politically correct manner gives the enemy hope. If we had fought WW 2 like this who knows how it would have ended.

At least back then everybody got on board and supported the effort, even if they didn't like the war. Now we have a bunch of meally mouthed spineless idiots (some of which 202 mentioned)who just want to grand stand for political gain after they take thier biased polls to see which way the wind is blowing.

I'd call it a serious lack of commitment and a slap in the face for our troops when these people double talk and back slide the way they do. I think that if they voted for the war, they should back it until it's finished.

Like the previous post said most of the liberals want us to lose. But then I'm sure that most of them never served in the Military. They love the freedoms that we enjoy here, but they would probably throw up the white flag before they would actually fight for them.

Jody

 

[202typical]

"I'd call it a serious lack of commitment and a slap in the face for our troops when these people double talk and back slide the way they do. I think that if they voted for the war, they should back it until it's finished."

Amen brother.

The Dems are squirmin cause they know this troop surge may very well work.

 

[huntindude]

You guys oversimplify everything. first off polititians will always run wars that's the law and for good reason. second if the enemy fought like a conventional army we wouldn't be having this conversation because we'ld have won and come home years ago. this is more like the war on drugs, you can't bomb a whole city block because there's one drug pusher standing on the corner. get real this is not a war anymore as much as very violent police operation, the cops seldom have a clear victory either do they? they just keep plugging away forever, same thing here except we have the option to leave .

 

[TFinalshot]

"If that means blowing up a few mosques where the insurgents are hiding themselves and thier weapons so be it. (You know that they would do it to us in a heart beat)"

The fact that we respect others place of worship is one thing that seprates us from the rest of the world. There is no point in turning into the type of people we are fighting, is there?

 

[huntindude]

202 did you watch 60 Minutes last night? you better get over there and give us the " real " story because it doesn't look that great to me . you shouldn't have a problem finding a place to stay since the Iraqis are leaving.

 

[202typical]

Since when did 60 minutes become a credible source for anything? That is laughable Dude. So you are talking about the same 60 Minutes where they lied about Bush's service record and used false/made up service records to try and change the outcome of the last election? That 60 Minutes? There is no more left leaning news program on network television then 60 minutes. Why would you believe anything these guys say. Hell if they don't have the back up for a story they just go out and make one up. LMAO. Besides every reporter on 60 Minutes is a Dem.

 

[TFinalshot]

"If that means blowing up a few mosques where the insurgents are hiding themselves and thier weapons so be it. (You know that they would do it to us in a heart beat)"

The fact that we respect others place of worship is one thing that seprates us from the rest of the world. There is no point in turning into the type of people we are fighting, is there?

 

[huntindude]

After a while your " evil media " deal gets to wearing thin. we all know Fox and friends is pro Bush and they can't even give you anything to work with . if it looks like a duck and it quacks like a duck it's a chicken, you're good.

 

[viking421a]

Dude did you read his post 202's post? 60 minutes is one of the most liberal inaccurate "news" shows out there. What do you mean evil media wearing thin? It's a proven fact that 60 minutes used falso forged documents to try to support a negative story about Bush. And there is lots of evidence that the producers as well as dan rather knew the documents were forged when they aired the story. In fact they had numerous people tell them the documents weren't legitimate but they went ahead and aired the story anyway.

Now amazingly they air a negative news story about iraq and you want us all to believe they are telling the truth?! You liberals are amazing.

 

[huntindude]

Stop whining and prove them wrong, not " my cousin's sister heard some Iraqi kid got a candy bar " kind of crap but something real and important that shows it's worth it.

Most of what they said about Bush was true it was just the documentation that was questionable, so did Bush turn out to be a war hero ? I think not. what about the" Swift boat moron's for the truth as told by the political opposition" crap put out against Kerry before the election, I suppose that's all the gospel tuth though isn't it? most of what the media reports is true, sure they do a little high grading but if you want many happy stories out of Iraq you'll have to fabricate them like McCain did I'm afraid.

 

[viking421a]

If you want to talk about the fabrication of a story look no further then CBS, perfect example. The documentation wasn't questionable, it was forged. Even CBS finally admitted the documents were forged. Not questionable, not "high grading" they were FORGED. Your whole dan rather approach that the story is true (never mind all our evidence is a lie)doesn't work for most people with any common sense. I don't know of anyone calling Bush a war hero, I'm not.

Why do the swiftees have to be moron's? Because they opposed John Kerry? They did nothing wrong and have evidence and eyewitness accounts to support their statements.

Actualley there are a lot of happy stories in iraq. (Talk to some of the soldiers that come back on leave.) They just aren't reported by the media. No everything isn't great and wonderful over there but yes there are good things happening too.

 

[huntindude]

Kerry got treated worse than Bush and one thing is for sure, he served his country and can prove it. as for the media no doubt they aren't perfect but I find it hard to beleive all of them are anti Iraq war. we know Fox and freinds couldn't be anymore pro Bush if they wanted to so where's their happy Iraq stories? all we hear is the media is anti war and anti Bush but even the republican channel can't make this thing look decent. what's up with that? give us some hard proof things in Baghdad and the major areas are looking up that the media doesn't want us to know about. not just the usual BS but something real that's big enough to offset some of the negative goings on. com'on we're into this over 4 years and the best you can do is cry that the media is doing a bad job, that's weak.