What Happened with U.S. Outfitters??

ICMDEER · May 10, 2004

It seems like it was over a year ago that we all heard that USO was in hot water for flying and giving info to hunters on the ground. What ever happend about that? Did they get in trouble and were there consequences? If anyone knows, I'd appreciate a post.

Thanks.

NMRaptor · May 10, 2004

I'm not exactly certain, but I thought I heard that the case was dismissed.
-Raptor

RLH · May 10, 2004

never heard it was dismissed. hope not. hope they hang em. anyway, that's just my narrow minded point of view. from what i'd heard is that it was just grinding it's way slowly through the federal court system. anybody out there know? enquiring minds wanna know.

gordhunter · May 10, 2004

they are trying to get all big game tags in all western states to be as one draw or equal to residents and nonresidents alike,which is wrong.I just receive last week papers he submitted in nevada,but he is still in court District 8, he is trying to pad his pocket with this idea,all hunters should not book with this outfit as he is trying to override the system.I can fax anyone who ask about the papers he is trying to submit to the state of nevada thanks Gord

Bura Nut · May 10, 2004

I would like to have the papers faxed to me. Thanks............602-454-2148.......... Allen Taylor......

zia · May 10, 2004

yes, the charges have all been dropped. I was by the uso office the other day, say what you want but it is an impressive operation.

txhunter58 · May 10, 2004

I did just read that either the charges were dropped or he was found not guilty, I forget which, but anyway the charges did not stick. Of course he claims is it retaliation for his lawsuit to open up more tags for nonresidents. He has now filed a money suit against the state for harassment.

According to the article I read, what he did in the airplane was legal at the time, but the law has now been changed since then to make what he did illegal now.

txhunter58

venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)

ICMDEER · May 11, 2004

All of this amazes me. Seems like it is always about the money or the fame. Too bad egos and dollars get in the way. I sure feel like we would be better served if folks just respected the resource and had fair chase at the top of their priority list.

Make me wonder where we are headed in the long run.

RLH · May 11, 2004

mark my words, uso is the worst thing to happen to hunting in the west. they'll have more to do with ruining hunting for the common man than all the huggers, usfw, epa, usfs, blm, etc. combined, before it's over with. what gets me, is they don't offer a good product unless you're a celebrity. absolutely do not care if you ever come back. and guys keep forkin' over their hard earned cash to em. and their hunter pool? what a joke. nothing you can't do for yourself in about an hour. boy george is gonna ruin it for all of us.

nmtaxi · May 11, 2004

I don't quite get this. Why would he want non-residents on equal ground with residents in the drawing? I can't draw a tag in my own state to save my life. I know here in NM, non-residents have a far better chance of drawing than a resident. And from what I've heard, it works that way in most states.
I believe NM holds 20% of it's tags for non-residents. I'm sure that in the overall picture, non-residents don't even come close to being 20% of the applicants.
And I agree with you 100% RLH.

OnTarget · May 11, 2004

Who is this jackass and where can I find more about what he is trying to do
Justin
www.huntinco.com

txhunter58 · May 11, 2004

He wants more tags for nonresidents because they are the big majority of his clients. I suspect that nonresident hunters that use a guide probably make up over 90% of all people who use a guide. Few people who live in a state use a guide.

txhunter58

venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)

ICMDEER · May 11, 2004

Boy George wlll play hell getting any more nonresident licenses in Wyoming. For some species, it is already 40% and sometimes higher if there are leftover licenses from the resident drawing. That is far more than you can justify in the eastern half of the state, where the vast majority of the habitat and wildlife are on private/deeded land.

If I understand the argument right, it is that the wildlife is on federal lands, so every U.S. citizen should have the same opportunity to hunt them (or get a license). I can't see how that is the case on most of those big Newe Mexico ranches either, but I could be wrong. I just know it won't work in Wyoming - others have tired it.

elk4you · May 11, 2004

The wildlife is on every piece of land, both public and private. The wildlife, however, does not belong to the given landowner just because that is where it lives. The wildlife belongs to the state, and the people therein. That is why we have public comment portions of state game commission meetings. The state, with an few exceptions, is also held responsible for the management of the wildlife, not the federal agencies. That is why what Texas does with their deer herd stays there, and not in say Nebraska. So go to the meetings and give them your opinion. If enough people are heard, it will make a difference.

Josh

NVBighorn · May 11, 2004

>Boy George wlll play hell getting
>any more nonresident licenses in
>Wyoming.

>I just know it won't work
>in Wyoming - others have
>tired it.

You think? I think the guy is scary. I think you should be scared too. So should everyone else. He didn't have to win in New Mexico. It was won a long time ago. He's already winning in Arizona as far as he's conrcened. He's on to Nevada now and has vowed that Montana is next. Then...

I want to know where he gets his backing. There's a lot of money to be made if/when he wins but he's planning/hoping on going to the Ninth Circuit court of Appeals. Trust me, it takes CASH to get to the Ninth circuit, and a ton of it. No kiss and a promise is gonna hold an attorney's attention long when you talk about fighting that hard.

I'm told the guy has had threats made on his life, it's that serious. I think he needs to be stopped, but I don't know what will stop him. And like I said on another post elsewhere, he doesn't give a hair on a ratsa$$ about you or me as resdients OR nonresidents. It's about money bigger than any I'll ever have.

ICMDEER · May 12, 2004

You guys are both right. The wildlife in Wyoming does belong to the people of the state. We do not have licenses that landowners can sell or transfer like other states. That's one of the things that George is really fighting for. Without transferable licenses or some other means of getting preferential licenses for outfitters, Wyoming will be way low on his list of places to try. Both of those issues have already lost in court for Wyoming.

I do go to all of the public meetings and express my opinions. I've never seen Wyoming Game and Fish change a big game season based upon public input (in 20 plus years of trying), but that's yet another issue...........

Thanks for the facts and good thoughts.

remsal · Jun 23, 2004

elk4you:
I don't quite understand your argument. You argue that the elk belong to the state and it's citizens not the landowner. Given that argument, it would seem that elk on FEDERAL land belong to the citizens of the entire nation that pay for the purchase and management of federally owned lands. I think the federal government should manage all fish and game on federal land and that all citizens should have equal opportunity for the resources that are available within those lands. Could you imagine driving up to the gates of Yellowstone Park and having the park ranger say that 8 cars from Wyoming must enter before 2 from tha other 49 states can enter. In is not only obsurd, but, completely and totally unacceptable for our western friends to benefit unfairly from a NATIONAL resource. On the other hand, if I was from a western state I would fight to the death to maintain the status quo.

elk_horn · Jun 23, 2004

>yes, the charges have all been
>dropped. I was by the
>uso office the other day,
>say what you want but
>it is an impressive operation.
>

Yes impressive for the rich ... but not the common hunter!

zia · Jun 24, 2004

I think "rich" is a relative term like "fat" or "ugly". I'm not sure what "the common hunter" means. The guy I heard them talking to about a hunt was a plumber from Pennsylvania, seemed like a pretty regular guy coming out west for his first elk hunt. I'm just saying it appeared to be an well run, organized office.

cohntr6 · Jun 25, 2004

I believe wildlife (excluding migratory birds) are managed by the state even though they reside on fed. land like the national forest.
It is interesting that the Primos and realtree teams use USO for their hunts, applicatons, etc. Money talks unfortunatley. I do not like the fact that they can or even have the desire to change license allocation to favor themselves. That is not excusable and i will oppose it!
Jeff