WWYD? Wrong animal from taxi?

muleyhunter413

Active Member
Messages
417
If you went to pick up a bear rug from your taxidermist and he presented a bear rug that was obviously not your bear, what would you do? If you told him that wasn’t your bear and showed him pictures and he agreed it was not the same bear, but also stated that he had no idea what happened, what do you do? He states that no one could have gone home with your bear and you have their bear. What can you do or what would you expect him to do? I’m at a bit of a loss. Anyone ever experienced anything like this and how did it go?
 

Slightlysober

Active Member
Messages
966
Damn that sucks! I had a friend kill a once in a lifetime mule deer and took it to a pretty well known taxidermist. The buck had a double throat patch. When he picked it up it was obvious he got the capes mixed up. Taxidermists are like anyone else, they make mistakes too. He might not know how to handle it as it’s never happened before. I feel like the least he can do is contact everyone he’s mounted a bear for recently to try to find it? Could of been a mix up at the tannery though?

I wouldn’t want someone else’s bear. So I would tell him to keep it and get your deposit back. Use it for motivation to get out there and get another bear. Probably not what you want to hear but free advice is free advice! 😬
 

Hunna_wunna

Member
Messages
16
My grandpa killed an absolute giant (I’m talking Yellowstone bull) Buffalo in Wyoming like, 15 years ago. Picked up the skull and the head from the taxidermist, and the taxidermist “lost” the entire cape. He was heart broken. Heard through the grape vine that the taxidermist sold his hide out from under him and claimed he lost it. My grandpa died and never got the hide. If I could kick that taxidermists ass and not go to jail, I would every day until the lord comes down again.
 

Muleman

Active Member
Messages
209
Refund all your money the very least. The taxidermist knows who else they did bears for he should work to find your bear. Not much else you can do except spread the word about their business if they don’t try to make it right.
 

txhunter58

Long Time Member
Messages
6,982
Many Taxis send out the hides to be tanned to "tanneries". If he did that, you probably have no chance. If not, there should be a way to find it using good detective work. Tell him you are going to put an add in the local paper about it in an effort to find it. He won't want you to do that and might work harder to find it. record any conversations with him if it is legal to do so.
 

Deepcolor

Active Member
Messages
548
I had this same thing happen with my full body mtn. goat, went to pick it up and obviously had the wrong cape mounted. Still pisses me off every time I look at that mount. I had waited until the second half of the season waiting for the goats to hair up and got screwed.
 

Tristate

Long Time Member
Messages
5,946
Howdy MuleyHunter 413. My name is Ben and I am a taxidermist. Your story is interesting. There must be some very obvious differences and you specifically stated that the taxidermist agreed it is not your bear. You also stated that he specifically stated someone else could not have "your" bear. I would want him to elaborate and give details on how he knows that. Is this the only bear he had come in that year? Was your bear such a unique color that he would have noticed if anyone else picked it up??? Etc...

Based on those answers I would decide how to progress. If you believe his logic is flawed and there is a chance someone else has your bear then you need to have a discussion with him about contacting his other bear clients. If at no point the mystery is solved or your bear recovered then he needs to refund %100 of your money. Be careful not to believe rumors to be the truth in these cases. It is okay to investigate a rumor but don't let rumors convince you that you need a pound of flesh with your money back.
 

muleyhunter413

Active Member
Messages
417
The first thing I noticed was the size. I took him a large bear and the rug he presented was a small bear. I’m not talking about a small difference. The next thing was that the rug he had the bear had rubbed the hair on both sides of its face. The bear I dropped off was not rubbed at all anywhere. Color was similar but that was the only thing similar.
Tri, what do you mean when you say a pound of flesh? To be clear, I don’t believe I had put any money down. I need to look it up for sure but from what I remember he said he would let me know when he needed money. That hadn’t happened to my recollection so I was planning on paying the full price when I picked it up. Obviously that didn’t happen. This was actually my sons bear. This taxi did a bear rug for me and I think it looks great. He also does on average 25-30 bears a year. We dropped this bear off the day I picked my rug up in May of 2018.
 

DBLung

Active Member
Messages
215
Not surprised. I was told the hair around the bullet hole had slid on a pronghorn cape. Problem was I harvested it with a bow. I had it to the taxidermist within 3 hours of the kill. (He forgot about that apparently) Found out a few years later from his partner, they used mine on his buddies rifle pronghorn.
 

elkantlers

Very Active Member
Messages
2,364
I would press him to do the right thing, and that is to find your bear. If he balks, get the law involved.
 

HIcountryman

Active Member
Messages
725
yuck. bad stories of taxi's lying and there is no recourse for client. i had a bad experience with meat processor and will never use any processor again. not possible with taxidermy. sorry for your situation.
 

Chesterwyo

Active Member
Messages
810
Pretty easy to tell how it's going to go. Insist on getting your money back. And put a lot of distance between you and that guy.
 

Tristate

Long Time Member
Messages
5,946
"Tri, what do you mean when you say a pound of flesh?"

To clarify it is common for people who have had a business deal go down the toilet to try and exact a certain measure of vengeance. We must remember that this was a business deal that went bad. I do however recognize how there is a very personal variable with the hunting industry. I can't describe it perfectly with words but I, and most hunters agree with me, is a very personal business. Because of that it is not uncommon for people to get vindictive when the business goes bad. Nevertheless we as gentlemen must remember it was business that unfortunately went bad.

If you check your records and you have not paid the taxidermist any money so far then I am sorry to say you will probably receive no money back and all 3 people involved, you your son and the taxidermist, loose on this deal.

Hopefully the taxidermist learns methods of tagging, skin marking, and record keeping which will prevent this from happening in the future. And for sure I hope your son kills an even greater bear next spring.
 

muleyhunter413

Active Member
Messages
417
It was a business deal for sure. Definitely feels far more personal and I think we here on this site understand that aspect. I don’t feel the mistake was personal. I could be wrong but I don’t feel that way. I think I will call and ask him to investigate more and see if he can find it. If not I don’t know what happens. I feel there should be some type of “making it right” but have no idea what that would or should look like. In my mind he was responsible for the bear once we dropped it off and now we have no bear. Seems he should try to figure out a way to make it better. I believe it took 6 years to draw the tag. Multiple trips with guys with dogs to catch a good bear.
I guess I just feel he needs to try harder to fix this.
It’s sad to hear stories of this kind of thing happening.
 

Hunter1

Active Member
Messages
160
Ughh, this dredges up old feelings from when I got chumped by a Taxidermist.
You say you had no deposit, what kind of taxidermist requires no deposit? The kind that wanted to steal your Bear the moment he seen it for a higher paying client.
Quit playing Mr. Nice Guy. Taxidermist are like the Tapeworms that crawled out of the carcasses on their shop floor.
 

JB1975

Member
Messages
51
Ughh, this dredges up old feelings from when I got chumped by a Taxidermist.
You say you had no deposit, what kind of taxidermist requires no deposit? The kind that wanted to steal your Bear the moment he seen it for a higher paying client.
Quit playing Mr. Nice Guy. Taxidermist are like the Tapeworms that crawled out of the carcasses on their shop floor.
I hunt a lot and have used quite a few taxidermists. I have been fortunate and always got my animals back to the best of my knowledge.
To lump all taxidermists together in the manner you just did is wrong. While there may be a few bad apples (This is the case in every industry), I would bet this is far less common than you describe.
Just my .02

I hope the OP gets his kid's bear back.
 

Tristate

Long Time Member
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5,946
" I feel there should be some type of “making it right” but have no idea what that would or should look like. "

This is an interesting statement. I really do wish there was a way to make it right. I have seen different problems similar to these over almost 3 decades of experience within this industry. I have been searching for the great answer of how to make these situations "right" and I haven't found it yet.

Please keep us informed of how it all goes.
 

hawkbill

Active Member
Messages
960
I had the same thing happen with a big bear, and found out another hunter did not get his Bear back either, we confronted the taxidermist, he had a lot of excuses and he finally blamed it on the tannery. The tannery could not help us because each taxidermist has his own way of marking hides. The taxidermist ended up closing shop with a bunch of people pissed off. I agree there are a lot of great taxidermists around this country. When I was younger, I would take my animals to an old school taxidermist he would hole punch a patern in a part of the hide that would not show and show it to you, he would also put that same patern on the deposit receipt. His system seemed to work well. Sorry for your loss, I haven’t thought about that Bear in years, now I’m getting pissed off again.
 

elkantlers

Very Active Member
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2,364
I feel there should be some type of “making it right” but have no idea what that would or should look like. In my mind he was responsible for the bear once we dropped it off and now we have no bear. Seems he should try to figure out a way to make it better.

I believe in this case if you don't get your bear back the taxidermist should pay you the same amount of money as the bear rug was going to cost.
 

Tristate

Long Time Member
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5,946
Interesting outlook elkantlers. Why should he pay the customer the same amount of money as the bear skin would have cost the customer?
 

elkantlers

Very Active Member
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2,364
Interesting outlook elkantlers. Why should he pay the customer the same amount of money as the bear skin would have cost the customer?
Because MH413 owns the bear hide that is now gone. The Taxidermist is the one at fault here. The very least the taxi should do is pay him an equivalent value as what the finished product would have cost.

If the Taxi pays nothing, What justice is there in that?
 

Tristate

Long Time Member
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5,946
"Because MH413 owns the bear hide that is now gone. The Taxidermist is the one at fault here."

I think you misunderstood part of my question. We know the taxidermist is at fault. If the story is true the taxidermist has already admitted fault.

" The very least the taxi should do is pay him an equivalent value as what the finished product would have cost."

This is getting closer to my actual question. I am trying to get to the basis of how to make this right. The Taxidermist has mounted a bear rug for him. The client doesn't want that bear because it isn't his. The taxidermist did the work, and paid for materials. It just isn't the same bear. So the value doesn't have to do with how much a bear rug is worth, the value is how much is this specific raw bear skin worth. That is where it gets really hard to assign a value. The client didn't bring the taxidermist a finished bear rug and the taxidermist lost or damaged a finished product. The client delivered a raw skin.

"If the Taxi pays nothing, What justice is there in that?"

First of all the Taxidermist did pay. He probably has several hundred dollars in material and service costs not including his or any employee's labor. Second are you sure "justice" is defined as one person taking money from another person when they feel they have been wronged?
 

elkantlers

Very Active Member
Messages
2,364
"Because MH413 owns the bear hide that is now gone. The Taxidermist is the one at fault here."

I think you misunderstood part of my question. We know the taxidermist is at fault. If the story is true the taxidermist has already admitted fault.

" The very least the taxi should do is pay him an equivalent value as what the finished product would have cost."

This is getting closer to my actual question. I am trying to get to the basis of how to make this right. The Taxidermist has mounted a bear rug for him. The client doesn't want that bear because it isn't his. The taxidermist did the work, and paid for materials. It just isn't the same bear. So the value doesn't have to do with how much a bear rug is worth, the value is how much is this specific raw bear skin worth. That is where it gets really hard to assign a value. The client didn't bring the taxidermist a finished bear rug and the taxidermist lost or damaged a finished product. The client delivered a raw skin.

"If the Taxi pays nothing, What justice is there in that?"

First of all the Taxidermist did pay. He probably has several hundred dollars in material and service costs not including his or any employee's labor. Second are you sure "justice" is defined as one person taking money from another person when they feel they have been wronged?
1st: I would give him the wrong bear back. Why would anyone want a bear rug that is not theirs? I sure wouldn't

2nd: The Customer should be able to expect a certain level of service. Mainly their own bear done to a reasonable quality. Neither of these things happened.

3rd: What the Taxidermist spent in time and materials is irrelevant. This is of no concern to the wronged customer.

4th: In this case I do believe that a monetary compensation of some sort should be awarded to the wronged customer. This should, at a very minimum, be the price the bear rug was going to cost him. I could also see tag fee, gas, food, lodging, guide fee and any other costs associated with the hunting of the bear.

Is he going to get any of those extra expenses? No, but they are included in the valve of the raw hide to the customer.
 

Bow6x6

Active Member
Messages
143
My grandpa killed an absolute giant (I’m talking Yellowstone bull) Buffalo in Wyoming like, 15 years ago. Picked up the skull and the head from the taxidermist, and the taxidermist “lost” the entire cape. He was heart broken. Heard through the grape vine that the taxidermist sold his hide out from under him and claimed he lost it. My grandpa died and never got the hide. If I could kick that taxidermists ass and not go to jail, I would every day until the lord comes down again.
And I'd help you.
 

Tristate

Long Time Member
Messages
5,946
"1st: I would give him the wrong bear back. Why would anyone want a bear rug that is not theirs? I sure wouldn't"

Seams reasonable.

"2nd: The Customer should be able to expect a certain level of service. Mainly their own bear done to a reasonable quality. Neither of these things happened."

For the most part I agree with you there but imagine if the bear had just slipped and not made it through the tan. Still no bear or quality or service. So what then????

"3rd: What the Taxidermist spent in time and materials is irrelevant. This is of no concern to the wronged customer."

Now that logic sounds greedy and self serving. The taxidermist and the client should always have concerns for all people. Now if you mean the lost money should not effect the value of the raw bear skin that makes sense.

"4th: In this case I do believe that a monetary compensation of some sort should be awarded to the wronged customer."

Okay I am not in disagreement with you there.

"This should, at a very minimum, be the price the bear rug was going to cost him."

Please explain this logic. I want to know how a raw lost bear skin suddenly is worth a finished bear rug???

"I could also see tag fee, gas, food, lodging, guide fee and any other costs associated with the hunting of the bear.

Is he going to get any of those extra expenses? No, but they are included in the valve of the raw hide to the customer."

He's not going to get those other expenses when you can go buy bear skins for a $400 and logical people know that. When your car gets wrecked you don't get the dollars for the amount of gas you had in it, all the times you washed and waxed it, money for all the times you had to get the registration renewed etc..... That's life and life doesn't change the value of the bear skin.
 

muleyhunter413

Active Member
Messages
417
An update for you all. The taxi texted me today that he has contacted the tannery and they are looking into it. He has offered to purchase a bear hide that would match. He said there were 9 bears that were brown in color that he took in that season. He said he has gone over them again and again and doesn’t feel a swap could have taken place. I will hopefully talk with him tomorrow.
 

Ultimag

Active Member
Messages
195
Your taxidermist is. Lying through his teeth to you he knows exactly where your bear is and who has it I'd obtain legal council. And sue him
 

Tristate

Long Time Member
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5,946
Ultimag,

The only way you know that is if you know the taxidermist and where the skin is. So why don't you tell us? Help out a fellow hunter.

Maybe the taxidermist should obtain legal council and sue you.

Or maybe yall will get convicted together for your conspiracy. 🤣
 

Slightlysober

Active Member
Messages
966
Your taxidermist is. Lying through his teeth to you he knows exactly where your bear is and who has it I'd obtain legal council. And sue him
This is why I read hunting forums
1605750091959.png
 

PLK

Active Member
Messages
168
To summarize, you took your son’s bear hide to this taxidermist in May 2018 and you just went to pick it up recently? So 2 years and 6 months later the bear rug was finished? My first reaction is that this is a very long time. Secondly, did you take the finished rug from the taxidermist or did you refuse it because it was the wrong size, wrong bear, etc? has any money changed hands? And thirdly, I highly doubt that the tannery is going to be of much help for a bear hide that they most likely tanned 2 years ago.

Perhaps it is just my nature but I tend to think the best of people and in your case it seems that an honest mistake was made. Nothing the taxidermist offers you is likely going to be satisfactory; sometimes business deals just don’t work out (in this case you haven’t lost any money) and you just have to move on. I really wouldn’t want him to substitute a bear hide that he bought. Just my 2 cents.
 

muleyhunter413

Active Member
Messages
417
PLK, yes it has been 2.5 years. He texted me in August that it was done. It’s a bit of a drive so I didn’t rush. No money had changed hands yet. I did not take the other rug out of his shop. I knew immediately it was the wrong animal. I had called a handful of times to check on the status of the rug. I let him know I wasn’t in a rush but was just curious as to the status of it.
Minus getting my sons bear back, there may be nothing that fixes that sentimental part of this. I like to think I’m a fairly reasonable person though and I think we could come to an agreement that would be reasonable.
It is really hard to not think of all the time and effort of several people that went into getting this bear. I know that isn’t going to be compensated but it still comes to mind.
hopefully he finds my sons bear. I do think the taxi feels bad and is not happy about this situation either. He seemed almost as surprised as I was when I showed him the picture of my sons bear. I give him some credit for admitting it then that it was a different bear and I truly think he was caught off guard and did not know what to do. I hope I’m right in thinking that and not just falling for an act. I’ll let you all know what happens.
 

Deepcolor

Active Member
Messages
548
"1st: I would give him the wrong bear back. Why would anyone want a bear rug that is not theirs? I sure wouldn't"

Seams reasonable.

"2nd: The Customer should be able to expect a certain level of service. Mainly their own bear done to a reasonable quality. Neither of these things happened."

For the most part I agree with you there but imagine if the bear had just slipped and not made it through the tan. Still no bear or quality or service. So what then????

"3rd: What the Taxidermist spent in time and materials is irrelevant. This is of no concern to the wronged customer."

Now that logic sounds greedy and self serving. The taxidermist and the client should always have concerns for all people. Now if you mean the lost money should not effect the value of the raw bear skin that makes sense.

"4th: In this case I do believe that a monetary compensation of some sort should be awarded to the wronged customer."

Okay I am not in disagreement with you there.

"This should, at a very minimum, be the price the bear rug was going to cost him."

Please explain this logic. I want to know how a raw lost bear skin suddenly is worth a finished bear rug???

"I could also see tag fee, gas, food, lodging, guide fee and any other costs associated with the hunting of the bear.

Is he going to get any of those extra expenses? No, but they are included in the valve of the raw hide to the customer."

He's not going to get those other expenses when you can go buy bear skins for a $400 and logical people know that. When your car gets wrecked you don't get the dollars for the amount of gas you had in it, all the times you washed and waxed it, money for all the times you had to get the registration renewed etc..... That's life and life doesn't change the value of the bear skin.
I see this issue from a customer and you see it as a business owner, obviously different views. If a guy takes an animal to a taxi there is an obvious “attachment “ to that animal, you harvested that animal and created memories, etc. Your view of this lost hide is purely from a business/money point of view and the customer views it from a different angle. Some things just can’t be replaced with money or a “similar colored bear” it just doesn’t work like that for me. If it slipped than show me, if it was damaged than show me also it’s just that simple. Liars and cheats don’t stay in business for very long regardless of the industry.
 

PLK

Active Member
Messages
168
Thanks for the reply muleyhunter413. I wish you and your son the best, keep a cool head and work out a peaceful resolution with the taxidermist. Sounds like you are giving him an opportunity to potentially make things right for you and your son, and for that I applaud your character. Good luck.
 

muleyhunter413

Active Member
Messages
417
Taxi called me and he found the bear!! So freakin happy! Another taxi had asked him to ship two hides to the tannery when he sent his own hides. Both taxis had marked the hides number one for that season and they were mixed up. The really lucky part is that the other taxi still had it just sitting tanned and untouched because the two hides he had bought were just spares he purchased from the DWR! What are the odds?
anyway, the taxi seemed as relieved as I was to have solved this one. He was headed out to dinner to celebrate. He said in 25 years this had never happened to him and it was a lesson in hide marking, even though he has done many hides over the years with no issues. He sent me a pic of the hide and it does look like my sons bear. Maybe when this rug is done I will post pics of the two and you can all see how it was easy to tell the two were different. The taxi thanked me for my patience and for not blowing up on him. I’m so excited and can honestly say I did not think that this was going to have a happy ending. I feel very very lucky tonight. I’m on my way to New Mexico with my 13 year old daughter to try and find her a buck to shoot, so I hope the good luck continues. Thanks for all the input. This was really a spot I didn’t know quite what to do. I hope none of you ever have this kind of thing happen but if so I hope you have a happy ending, even you Elkslayer. Ha ha
 

elkassassin

Long Time Member
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24,468
Maybe Your Taxidermist Should of Wrote Down Approximate Size & Color of your Bear So He Doesn't Forget what You Brought in!

Glad You're Getting it Straightened Out!

I Lost a 13 lb Brown Trout to a THIEF Taxidermist when I Was Young!

That Sshhiittt Won't Happen again!
 

roadrunner

Very Active Member
Messages
2,025
Because MH413 owns the bear hide that is now gone. The Taxidermist is the one at fault here. The very least the taxi should do is pay him an equivalent value as what the finished product would have cost.

If the Taxi pays nothing, What justice is there in that?
Umm, no. The value of the bear hide is the price of the tag. The courts would see it the same way. What you spend above that is up to you and in no way anyone else's responsibility. If no money changed hands between you and the taxidermist, the taxidermist loses out as well from his out of pocket expense to the tannery. The taxidermist is not liable to pay in full the valued price of the finished product because you did not pay that out. There is no reimbursement to be had. If money changed hands, that is a different matter.

The burden of proof will be on you that the taxidermist is the one at fault. As Tristate mentioned, there is a reason taxidermists use hide marking techniques to keep this from happening, one is to put a punch code into the hide itself so there is no way a removable tag can get mixed up. The next thing is to use a hard plastic form of tagging to accompany the punch code. You can get those from any ranch and farm supplier (ear tags) or Uline. When the tanned product comes back from the tannery, you can easily match up the punch code.

But, it turned out OK so some good lessons learned it sounds like.
 

NECALI

Active Member
Messages
717
Glad it turned out on a good note. I went to pick up a deer head from a taxi. a few years ago and when he showed it to me I didn’t recognize it. I asked him if that was mine and he said yes, why? I told him something didn’t look right as the antler width was to narrow. He finally admitted he had dropped and broken the skull plate. So he just put it back together what he thought was right. Well it was a few inches to narrow so I told him the original width and brought him a picture and he made it right. It turned out to be the best out of three deer I have had mounted.
 

PLK

Active Member
Messages
168
With your good luck, perhaps you should go buy a few lottery tickets. Congratulations on finding your sons bear.
 

deerslayer88

Active Member
Messages
978
Tri tip the taxidermist is negligent here and you he can be sued for the value of the finished product. Brush up on business law.
 

Tristate

Long Time Member
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5,946
We aren't talking about what people can be sued for. Touch up on reading comprehension.
 

desperatehills

Active Member
Messages
799
This was a interesting thread to read and I have a question.

Has anyone ever lost mounts due to home theft or fire and what did the insurance company pay?

If a natural fire burned my home down I would expect my insurance to pay me the cost of the taxidermy. If my neighbor did something negligent and my house burned down I would expect more than the cost of the mounts. There is certainly a emotional element with mounts and the memories they help preserve.

If you have dealt with a insurance company for lost mounts what was the outcome?
 

PLK

Active Member
Messages
168
Insurance companies don’t reimburse based upon emotions or sentimental value. Your generic “boiler plate” homeowners policy will have limits for artwork, jewelry, firearms and other items. You would probably have to have an extra rider on your homeowners policy for specific artwork and have all of your taxidermy appraised and specifically listed with details on the rider. Once you determine the cost of the appraisal coupled with the annual cost of the rider you most likely will not want to pay the additional premium as it will be costly.

As for your neighbor being negligent, you could potentially sue for property damage but once again you will need authentic appraisals for each item. The appraiser would put a value on each piece of taxidermy. That being said, I don’t think a 190” mule deer buck that you spent $10K to harvest is worth more than a 190” mule deer buck that you harvested on a general tag that cost $400. The insurance adjuster will not include emotional or sentimental value. Similar to your auto insurance; the adjuster will look at the Kelly Blue Book or similar to determine the value of your totaled car; regardless if you really liked the car or not.

Sorry for the wordy response.
 

RELH

Long Time Member
Messages
16,455
PLK is right about if you want full value you will have to place a value on them and pay the added cost for a insurance rider to pay full value they are insured for.
I did that with my firearms as I have several custom rifles and I have a rider that will pay full replacement value. The wife still bit###S over the added cost of the insurance rider.

RELH
 

DanMan

Member
Messages
87
This was a interesting thread to read and I have a question.

Has anyone ever lost mounts due to home theft or fire and what did the insurance company pay?

If a natural fire burned my home down I would expect my insurance to pay me the cost of the taxidermy. If my neighbor did something negligent and my house burned down I would expect more than the cost of the mounts. There is certainly a emotional element with mounts and the memories they help preserve.

If you have dealt with a insurance company for lost mounts what was the outcome?
I lost some mounts in a house fire 15 years ago. Nothing special trophy wise but I had memories with each one. Anyway all that I could wrestle out of the insurance company was normal taxi cost. I did not have any special riders.
 

cbeard

Very Active Member
Messages
1,482
A taxidermist had one job. He totally botches it. In the process, a memento of a son’s hunt is lost never to be recovered.
And Tri’s response is basically “Get over it.”
Why am I not surprised?
 

PLK

Active Member
Messages
168
Did you read the entire thread? Taxidermist located his son’s bear. Honest mistake. Problem solved.
 

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