Is Utah Monster Elk Over?

K

ktc

Guest
I have not heard anything about any bull over 400 this year. I have seen one 390+ and a couple of 380+. Most of what I am hearning is 280-320 with a few better. Have we shot too many cows? Too many bulls? On one hand it can be argued the best bulls are gone? It can also be argued the weather and moon are to blame.

I have talked to a lot or archery and rifle guys and this year is nothing like the past 10. what do you guys make of it all? Has opportunity taken its toll or just bad conditions?

I am interested to hear your take on this? This is not an opportunity versus quality thread. I just want to hear your reasoning why the big Utah bulls are not showing up. Kind of spooky.
 
LAST EDITED ON Sep-19-08 AT 07:46PM (MST)[p]It's all down hill from here!!! :) I honestly think the conditions have had a lot to do with it. It's been hot a dry and that is not conducive to finding elk and deer. I think some good bulls have been killed and I'm sure we haven't heard of a lot of them. We know there are some monster out there. Look and Spidey....and he's disappeared. I think the current conditions coupled with the fact that there seems to be A LOT of water up in the hills has a lot to do with it. Maybe the elk are just getting smarter. :) Also, if I'm not mistaken...The age class has been lowered on some units.
 
I believe the conditions have played a part. I also believe the late rifle hunts have been much more successful than the DWR believed they would be. I think there are still some monster bulls out there however the numbers are less.
 
You may be onto something, Ty. But now hunters are spoiled....380 is the new 320 and most guys I know with LE tags are gunning for 380 or higher...until the last couple of days on the hunt, that is. Then they won't take anything lower than 340.

SlamDunk has 2 hunters who've put down a 375 and a 370 bull. My neighbor killed a pretty nice one. I'm guessing 360ish.
 
I saw some jumbo bulls while spotting and hunting with Birdbuster on the archery hunt but they were really mobile. They didn't seem to have any pattern. Heard the same from guides who had put a lot of time in spotting. I think they are there, just being sneaky and moving alot. This might be the year that the smokepole and late rifle guys hit the jackpot...or there will be a bumper crop next year.
 
I don't know! But we are seeing a bunch of monster muleys going down in Utah this year. Maybe it's cycles or something.

I really think the giant bulls are still out there but maybe getting smarter each year.

WooHoo! horn hunters. Gotta get my wheeler tuned up for spring 2009!

RUS
 
THEY KEEP KILLING MORE COWS!!!

THEY OFFER MORE OPPORTUNITY WITH WAY MORE BULL TAGS!!!

NUNYA IS PISSED!!!

HOW BOUT IT Pro???

CAN YOU SPLAIN IT TO US???

I'VE SAID IT WAS GONNA HAPPEN FOR YEARS!!!

THIS IS THE BEGINNING!!!

ONE OF THESE ####ING DAYS SOMEBODY IS GONNA LISTEN TO ME!!!


THIS IS MY NEW GUN,YOU MAY NOT LIKE IT,YOU'LL LIKE IT A HELL OF A LOT LESS WHEN IT HITS ITS DESTINATION!!!
47654abd5a8fd79a.jpg


469ff2b8110d7f4e.jpg


THE ONLY bobcat THAT KNOWS ALOT OF YOU HAVE HAD THIS IMAGE IN YOUR PEA BRAIN BUT DUE TO POOR SHOOTING TACTICS I'M STILL KICKIN!!!
 
I think slamdunk just got lucky. I don't think he could find his butt with both hands. Noones killing big bulls and utah is finally showing its true colors. death doom and destruction. Guess this means those freakin high dollar jerks won't be payin a lota $$$$ for conservation tags this year. darn! I'll give em $5 for the san juan and another $4 for Dutton.
 
ONE OF THESE ####ING DAYS SOMEBODY IS GONNA LISTEN TO ME!!!



You gotta be shi%Ting me bess. After 10,000 posts everybody is now paying attention?

Ease up on PRO. I think you was outta town.

RUS
 
Hey bobcat, seriously though. I hunted arizona last year as well as the gila and unit 34 in NM. It wasn't too hard to spot 350 in arizona, and the gila kicked you know what. I was hunting a 380 bull when I came across a 400+++ bull and was passing up 350 bulls like they were 300 class bulls. Unit 34 had an awesome rut and 330 bulls were everywhere. This year is totally different. It was a crap shoot in 34 this year and arizona and the gila are a total bust. Read through the other posts and you will find out that this goofy season is hitting all the states not just Utah. We left lots of big bulls in the gila that I know made it through the year and now nothing is showing up. I really am totally clueless. I however am gearing up to have a serious hunt next year in Utah though. I've based my hunting on the el nino/ la nina effect. This year was suppose to be the dry one and next year is suppose to be the wet one. ????? I know water everywhere, I don't know but I just have a hunch that next year is gonna rock. Who knows I could be wrong. Lets hope I'm not. All I'm saying is utah is the same as NM is the same as arizona is the same as nevada, etc...
 
Thanks for the replies. Seems most think the conditions are bad. Sounds like stinky is seeing the same down south. I would hate to see anything bad happen. Just wondering what people thought since the top end bulls have just not showed up. I am sure lots have hit dirt not on here, but still we usually see a bunch.

Maybe the muzz guys have a treat in store? I hope so. Sounds like slampunk downed a couple of nice ones.
 
Ty,

I think the bulls are still there! I ahave seen a few! The rut is really late and with all the forage and water, the elk seem to be all spread out. Makes for a tough hunt. Also, the smaller bulls are still running cows. Maybe, just Maybe, I am hoping it is the year of the smokepole as mentioned earlier! We leave tuesday AM. Will let you know how it goes by Sunday PM. Good luck to you all still hunting!

Actually, forget all that, Utah sucks, don't put in anymore everyone!!! HaHAHa!!

Chad
 
I say it i sthe weather, and I know of at least 3 400+ bulls down so far. Amazing how Utah having 'only' 3 bulls over 400 on September 19th is considered a 'down year'.

The big boys are out there, it's just harder to find them when they aren't screaming much.

I heard about one of the bulls slammy put on the ground, sounds like things out west are looking good.

I agree with Silentstalker, all the quality is gone, save your money and don't apply for the next 6 years.

Stinky, I hope you kill a monster in Utah next fall. I did my best to keep the quality high for you.

PRO

Define, develop, and sustain BOTH trophy and opportunity hunts throughout the state of Utah.
 
Ha!!!

Don't make me laugh...by the end of this rifle season, cwmu, and muzzleloader, this is bound to be an above average season. Anyone who's hiked around has seen how lush the grasses are pretty much state-wide...lots O' protein for sure and for goodness sake there's certainly no shortage of minerals in this state.
 
#1) Warm weather + full moon + good feed and water everywhere = tough hunt!

#2) UT better be careful with tag allotments or 400 class bulls will be a thing of the past!
 
I think it's Bush's fault...no economy = no big bulls...LOL... It's all about the moon and weather. Horn growth is better than ever. The big boys don't come out until it's time to put the hammer down deep. Next year should be a good year because of this weird year. I bet some monster muzzy bulls show up. Just give it a little more time.
 
Seriously, even with the studs we have seen, this year seems to be down. I have not been on any premium units this year so that is why I asked. I have not seen for myself (I got Colorado mule deer on the brain!) TripleK is right, pretty funny how loosely the term 380 is used any more. I still say 350 is a stud any where anytime! Even on a good year 380 is not easy and there are not as many as some people think.

I also think peak is on target. This muzz season or even next year should be sweet!

Next year stinkystomper just may be the ticket!?!?!!?

Good luck to those still hunting and those with muzz tags. Even though I am done, I still love seeing the big stinkies and those with tags get the same chance I had.
 
I think that we have all see the forbidden fruit of the 400 bull been taken way to many times in this state and we have been spoiled. A 350 bull is huge and props to all that get a bull. There is no greater experience than being with the family and walking up to a dead bull(of any size)! Yes we like to see the 400 bulls but they aren't behind every tree like some think. Good luck to all the elk tag holders I'M JELOUS!

---------------------------------------
"you can't fix stupid"
 
It is a weird year season wise. How long did winter last? We got snowed on for the muzz hunt last year and the mtns got slammmed and that continued until late into May. Seems like all the seasons are off, what was it 85 today? But I do think we are killing to many cows and could cut down a few tags but overall the bulls I've seen this year seem pretty good. We all read CAelks post( perhaps the best thing I've read in a long time) about the monroe, how many big bulls did he pass on? I think that with our LE tags becoming twice in a lifetime, guys are really holding out for huge bulls which runs them the risk of not gettin anything. Having said this, I have a late rifle tag so you all leaving me a hog is greatly appreciated, sure hope winter doesn't start again next week!
 
I know who/what is to blame:

1. Global Warming
2. George Bush
3. The DWR

There isn't a problem on the planet that you can't blame on one of those 3.

Seriously though, I think it is a combination of warm dry weather, full moon, and lots of feed and water spread over lots of country. I think there will still be a handfull of 400" bulls taken, and I bet the average harvest age of bulls is still probably at or above the objectives for most units. Good luck to those with tags.
 
Spidey is still out there somewhere!

I'm not from UT and don't know much about UT but I've said all along IF spidey gets taken it will be on winter range somewhere!
 
I'M TELLING YOU AGAIN!!!

NUNYA IS PISSED!!!

AND HAS WROTE A LETTER TO THE UDWR!!!

THIS IS MY NEW GUN,YOU MAY NOT LIKE IT,YOU'LL LIKE IT A HELL OF A LOT LESS WHEN IT HITS ITS DESTINATION!!!
47654abd5a8fd79a.jpg


469ff2b8110d7f4e.jpg


THE ONLY bobcat THAT KNOWS ALOT OF YOU HAVE HAD THIS IMAGE IN YOUR PEA BRAIN BUT DUE TO POOR SHOOTING TACTICS I'M STILL KICKIN!!!
 
I think there are still some monster bulls out there, but there are a lot of factors keeping them hidden this year. The timing of the rut, the warmer weather, the abundance of feed and water, and the full moon just to name a few.
I've noticed in areas where I always sit and glass, that there is so much more foilage on the trees and the grass is so much deeper, that it is sometimes impossible to see into some of this area. The smaller bulls are the "herd" bulls right now, but I bet things will change in the next week or so. I think the muzzleloader tag is the "prime" tag this year.
And here we sit with a late spidey Monroe permit...What to do?
 
I wouldn't get too worried until all the hunts are over, including the late season. We may see all the monsters taken late in the year if/when the conditions are right.
 
It is great seeing lush browse and water. Hopefully this will mean the elk, deer, and other critters will go into this winter in great shape! It has been a nice break after so many droughty years! KTC, I am just like you and am really looking forward to just watching and filming those mondo bulls even though I already punched a tag! They are something else...Utah ought to be proud!
 
It definately seems like a strange year, but there HAVE been some giants taken that are being kept OUT of the spotlight.
I personly know of 3 over 400". I think we are just expecting 400" bulls to be dropping like flies because Utah had a few great years....exceptions to the rule??
Maybe people are just wising up with all the controversy and the 400" do or die craze that they are keeping things more "secret"??
I have two super great friends hunting LE units as i am typing this, one on Dutton, one on San Juan.....stories pending. ;-)







48288e6577d023b6.jpg
 
Ok, reality check time..... First, the hills are in great shape foragewise, plenty of water, and from what I've been reading on this and other sites, plenty of great bulls have been spotted preseason and watched up to this point (has everyone forgot about Spidey?) in many of the Utah units to this point.
It is now Sept. 20, and historically this is about mid-rut time, so just because 5-10 400"ers haven't shown up on the ground yet this year, I think it is a bit premature tho think there is a problem. I mean, really, how many 400" bulls have been recorded ever? Utah has done a great job of providing many of the ones that have been taken to date, and there will most likely be a couple of more contributed this year. That said, I do kinda worry what mid-long term effect having rifle hunters out there in the peak of the rut will do to overall giant bull quality/quantity as the rifle hunters should be way more effective at harvesting the higher quality bulls than "primitive" weapons and have the chance to dramatically affect the big bull ratios.
Anyhow, I was fortunate enough to draw one of the Beaver LE bowhunts this year and had a blast. Had to work our tails off from dark to dark glassing from high ridges and then diving into deep holes, but ended up seeing lots of great bulls. Tough but totally enjoyable hunt and I lost 10 lbs to boot! But since the season was scheduled so early this year, they were quiet until towards the end of the hunt and even then, did not do much more than yak it up; they would not come in to any type of calling and in fact skulked away when you got too close. Typical of pre- and early rut from my experience and hence necessitated being kinda aggressive on my part. Bottom line, stayed with it and finally had one make the mistake of circling back silently to hunt for that "lost" cow (heh heh heh!); he paid a heck of a price and I couldn't be happier.
Sooooo......... let's wait and see what starts showing up as the rifle hunt continues and the muzz hunt begins. For what its worth, heard yesterday that a rifle hunter got one of the two really big ones we chased all week; he was a real toad and I hear he tapes just under the magic mark.
 
Here is my take on the whole situation. I noticed a decrease in BIG bulls this year. I did see a few that would be considered HOGS early on in the scouting season but they seamed to disappear come hunt time. I came to this conclusion after experiencing a couple of days of tough hunting. I think the BIG bulls are still there but a number of factors have made them less visible.

#1 - Every unit experienced an increase in tags. Some units a pretty big increase. There was a lot of activity in the hills during scouting season and I really think the BIG bulls wisened up. We are used to going out and seeing these monsters on a regular basis. I think they started to feel the pressure and are doing what big old bulls do......hide out. There was a big bull we had been watching in a certain draw and opening day came. The hunter and guide came really close to killing this bull but he got blown out by other hunters in the area. When it got light enough to look around there was orange on every ridge. This was a drastic change from last year. These bulls are definately getting smarter.

#2 - The full moon during the first week. A lot of the rutting and fighting took place while you and I were dreaming about them. The majority of the elk seamed to be well on their way to bed when the sun came up. They were vocal going back to their beds but it was over shortly after daylight.

#3 - Unseasonably warm. Highs in the 70's and lows in the 40's (in the mountains)? Come on, what elk would tolerate those temps for long while running off satelite bulls and breeding his cows. Elk DO NOT like heat. That takes us back to the whole nocturnal thing.

#4 - It seamed that the bigger bulls were slow to get into the rut this year. There were a lot of 300-320 class bulls watching the herds. Not sure why that is but the herd bulls were smaller.

Of course this is just my oppinion and I may be full of a whole lotta bull so take it for what it's worth.

It's always an adventure!!!
www.awholelottabull.com
 
Jim,

I appreciate your thoughts. Hell, you have been in the hills non stop. Just some out loud thinking guys. This year is different. I also tend to think it is conditions more than anything, but who knows?

I have heard different takes from different guides who have spent the time looking more than the average guy. I have seen some pretty sweet bulls on here, so who knows. You muzz guys might have punched the right ticket this year?
 
Jim said it about as accurate as could be said.

The only other thing I noticed is a lot more water sources this year. With the exception of a couple bulls we never had the same bull hit the water and wallows we hunted more then once. They would hit it once and move on. It made it impossible to get a pattern on any particular bull.

We seen some good bulls scouting in the 370+ range that we did not see during the hunt so I know there are few out there. But I also think we might be hitting the point where the harvest age will start coming down. I guess time will tell when the muzzle and late hunts are over.
 
Nothing spooky. We should focus on opening up these LE. units so that more people can hunt them. There is no reason why someone should have to wait 14yrs to hunt an Elk. You should be able to hunt quality animals for 14yrs. Open Bull acres VS. LE entry acres is a joke. JMO.
 
AWLB SEE'S THE LIGHT!!!

I'VE SEEN THE "PRE-SCOUTERS" GET THICKER & THICKER THE LAST SEVERAL YEARS!!!

MAYBE THE DWR COULD START SELLING PRE-SEASON SCOUTING PERMITS???

THE ADDED PRESSURE & THEN EVERYBODY WONDERS WHY THE BIG STINKY'S AIN'T STANDING UNDER EVEY TREE WAITING FOR SOMEBODY TO SHOOT THEM!!!

SOUNDS LIKE YOU TOOK SOME NICE BULLS JIM!!!

GREAT JOB!!!

THIS IS MY NEW GUN,YOU MAY NOT LIKE IT,YOU'LL LIKE IT A HELL OF A LOT LESS WHEN IT HITS ITS DESTINATION!!!
47654abd5a8fd79a.jpg


469ff2b8110d7f4e.jpg


THE ONLY bobcat THAT KNOWS ALOT OF YOU HAVE HAD THIS IMAGE IN YOUR PEA BRAIN BUT DUE TO POOR SHOOTING TACTICS I'M STILL KICKIN!!!
 
u guys don't have it so bad. come down to new mexico and try to hunt the gila. you'd be doin good gettin a 370 bull. that's if u can draw a tag. I've been applying for elk since I was 9. the gila, the sacs, the whitemountains etc.. I'm 29 now and have never draw an early bull tag. not once. I finally gave up one year n put in for a late season tag which was the dumbest idea I've ever had. I also have put in for antelope 20 years straight and I've drawn zero tags for a goat. never drew sheep or ibex either. Now I've been rejected for just an ordinary deer tag three years straight. and wouldn't you now it, deer went to a straight draw 3 years ago, all units. I would love to know every fifteenth year I could expect to hunt at least once without braking the bank. you aint got it so bad in utah. Our f***in democratic leadership down here needs to find another tree to hug or at least put in a point system. just my two cents
 
LAST EDITED ON Sep-20-08 AT 09:18PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Sep-20-08 AT 09:17?PM (MST)

KT-

I think we still have those monsters. Actually I know we have, because I know of a monster sitting at a local taxidermist that is unfreakin' believable.

As Jim said, lot more tags equals lot more pressure. However, several years ago there was a slaughterhouse called Fishlake and I'm here to tell you that the herd is not hurting down there at all!!

That being said, my own personal opinion is that this is the first calendar year in which we have had normal to above normal snowpack, normal to above normal rainfall, and normal summer temps. A little warmer this fall, though. But overall a pretty normal year all in all.

We got so used to being in the drought that we think what is happening this year is abnormal; actually it may be more normal than we can recall.

I might have to do a Trophy Search on B&C website to test my theory, but if you think about it-the monster bulls showed up about the time management changed AND we began a drought, about the last 8 years or so.

Food for thought, yes?
 
Mrs Bess, who are you the grand Pubah? or the expert from afar? I can understand why Pro would not stoop so low as to answer you. I would bet my last nickle that you have not hunted elk in the last 5 years. My impression is its just another 12 year old with a computer that wants to stir the pot. I really would like to see the posts constructive rather that the soap opera "As the stomach churns" My 2, cant find cents on the keybord
 
Basically what happens is a reputation gets raped. This is what happened to the gila. I called one landowner and he said, I need another bull tag, these bulls are eating up all my grass for my bovines. Greed causes a increase in tags. I remember when I first moved to NM in the early 90s. There were 10-15 400 class bulls a year coming out ast year I heard of one over 400. It got raped and that is probably what is happening to Utah slowly. Oh well I guess its hard to keep a great thing going. They have cut tags some recently. This will help over the next few years.
 
Lisa,

Sure, that is food for thought! I forgot to mention some of the opinions are not just guides, but some of you I know spent many, many, many hard days archery hunting like you, Letter, and others.

It will be interesting to hear some any weapon guys at the end of that hunt and some of the muzz guys shortly. I kind of enjoy this topic without getting into the bow versus rifle and opportunity versus quality stuff.

By the pictures on MM, does mass seem to be a little better than usual? Seems most bulls are packin some weight on their heads? Does that seem accurate or maybe not so much?
 
Ty,

I have seen some great mass and most of the mature bulls posted so far are massive bulls! I think it is pretty important to realize that this website is but a cross section of all the tag holders. I am SURE that some giant bulls have hit the dirt that we will not see till they hit the magazine racks! Lisa speaks of one that goes WAY OVER 400 inches. It will not get posted on this site. Even the taxi had to sign a document to keep it under wraps I hear. Is it a bad thing to not have 15 400 bulls killed yet? Not sure that is a bad thing. Truly a tough year. I sure hope it is easier for the muzzy hunt! I was feeling pretty confident I could get my better half on a quality bull, now I am not so sure?? Do we pass 320 bulls?? She has never even killed an elk? Don't want to waste the tag on a young 350?(smile) I know a few any weapon guy's who ate tag soup. Hard to beleive but very true. Good luck everyone next week!

Chad

Chad
 
Ty, I am with you on the mass. It does seem that the bulls are packing more, but then again I can only base that on this year, a year in which I spent more time in the woods than I can recall and on a unit I've never set foot in until this year.

Chad, Chad.....*smile* sucks, doesn't it? :)

Just tell her she'll know the bull when she sees it. Especially if you are next to her gasping and reaching for the gun when she hesitates!! LOL
 
Hey Lisa,

I told her she can shoot any bull she wants, If she likes him, let him have it! I don't care what he scores! She is pretty competitive with me though! She wants a bigger bull than I have killed! She beat me on antelope, I shoot a 75", she shoots a 79". I have no doubt she will out do me on this too! It is cool with me though!

Why don't you all finish that Pauns thread! I am dying for more pic's!
 
Boy, then you better keep my cell number handy-yer gonna need help packing out her big ole' stinky!

Turkrazy has to be excused for slacking off on his post.

We spent 7 hours cutting up those two elk today, he was looking a wee bit worn out when I left.

But the steaks he let me bring home sure look nummy!

JIM-You gonna be around Kamas area Sunday (um, today)? Heading that way, wouldn't mind meeting you.....did Kacie enjoy her book?
 
calico - you crack me up. Where have you been the last 9000 POSTS while my "12 year old" little buddy Bessy has been entertaining the masses. I am here to tell you that I bet his dad could whip tail on your dad any day! Get the hell outta here!

You better figure out the past before you open your mouth about the present.

Sorry Bessy, I know you don't need anybody standing up for you but I couldn't resist this one!!




It's always an adventure!!!
www.awholelottabull.com
 
I have been out on the Deep Creeks (Inidan Reservation side) and the rutting activity is really just starting to heat up out there. I saw bulls without cows (not uncommon) and herds of cows without bulls (very uncommon). A big bull (370) we let the air out of friday morning had zero cows and didn't have an ounce of mud on him, not to mention he was not talking very much. Yet there was an old 5x5 just up the hill from him that wouldn't shut up and had 30+ ladies with him....go figure.
I leave again to go back tomorrow morning, hopefully things will be heated up better than last week.
Good luck muzzy hunters, this might be your year to pick up the slack!!






48288e6577d023b6.jpg
 
I think the weather and the moon has alot to do with it. The big bulls are still out there. The question should be is this the last year of good hunting before it starts to go down hill? With the increase in tag numbers this year it is going to start to take its toll especially on the easier to acess units.
 
Yep, I agree the big ones are goin down the drain for sure. No more 400's in Utah. I think everyone would agree. Your elk herd has definitely gone down the drain.... I can't say that enough. Please pass on the bad news to all your friends.
2194_constipation.gif
 
Yeah, Calico. We love the Cat around here. I can assure you he's no 12 year old kid. Like AWLOB said...find out about the past before you come around and start badmouthing the most popular MM members. Get over yourself, embrace that which is Bobcatbess, and enjoy his posts.
 
Triple, 10,000 gomens. Didnt know the cat was so revered, I will watch my conduct in the future.
 
Calico-
If you joined MM to learn, "learn" the people as well and you'll be MUCH better off than coming on here brand new and bad mouthing it's members.
ESPECIALLY the senior members.








48288e6577d023b6.jpg
 
All of you guys saying the quality is gone need to see the pictures of mulepacker's bull! It was taking on a LE unit that has a 3-4 year old bull harvest objective and is one of only 3 that is at objective instead of WAY over objective. If a unit that has the average bull harvested being a 4 year old bull can still produce bulls of this caliber, please explain how the quality can be anywhere near shot out on units that have 7+ year old bulls on AVERAGE harvested? Not to mention this unit borders Idaho where they issue OTC tags.

The hysteria and internet biology is amazing, as in it is amazing that 'hunters' are that clueless. No offense, but how can units that are OVER objectives on harvest ages that are 6+ year old bulls be "shot out"? I hunted a 'quality' LE unit and ate tag soup, but I will NOT say the 'quality' is gone on that unit. I KNOW for a FACT that it is NOT.

Odd how when the 400 bulls aren't falling like flies, and 'hunters' actually have to HUNT, the cries about too many tags starts before the early rifle season is even over. WTH is that all about? I have tried to stay out of threads like this since my hunt, but dang it man, where has the 'logical' thinking gone on here?

PRO

Define, develop, and sustain BOTH trophy and opportunity hunts throughout the state of Utah.
 
numbers of kills down on mondo bulls. hmmm. i hope the 400s go away. so mutch hype is created by them. not to mention all the bs that goes on up in the hills when 1 of these bulls is around. it takes hunters and hunting to new low,s every time. 50 guys 1 elk this yr 35 last yrs mondo. that many eyes on a mountain is a mobile game fence. no better than a canned hunt. i love to see the big guys just as you all do. but i dislike the attitudes and conflicts the start.
 
Hay Pro, good to see your back. I hope you had fun on your hunt. Good luck to you and your family.
 
Thanks dry, I had the best hunt of my life!

PRO

Define, develop, and sustain BOTH trophy and opportunity hunts throughout the state of Utah.
 
Oh quit worryin Chad Im sure that your wife will probably have to show us all how it is done and be standin over one of the big pisscutters grandpa inb just a couple of days. The elk are movin, and callin pretty good. Last weekend I had a bunch answer my callin, but were still not showin themselves. The next couple of days could really be the demise of a feww giants. I hope that is the case. Keep me posted. Best of luck to all the rest of ya who have tags. One day left for rifle but that might be all that you need. We love our big Utah stinkies
Lambo
 
Hey Pro, c'mon man, share your tag stew story. I had a great time eating my tag, you are right about quality of experience. Post up some pics if you took some, take us on your hunt!

Like I said, I don't think my unit is hurting at all, I just think that the elk are acting normal again. No biology there, just a hunch on my part. If we produced 400 inch bulls during a 10-year drought, we all know that there are even bigger this year. Big bulls aren't stupid, we all know that, to 'shoot out' a unit would be an arrogant claim for humanity to make.

My true personal opinion is that the 400's that have been killed are being kept secret for magazine and DVD's sake; we'll see 'em come Christmastime, I'm sure of it.
 
Easy pro you a-hole!:)

The question was about the hunts as far as quality and the conditions. I too would find it very odd that the units would be shot out. I definitely lean toward the bad conditions or possibly good conditions? This has been an off year no doubt about it.

Hopefully the muzz guys can put the hurt on the big stinkies.
 
Who the heck's pro anyways... he's clueless. all those freakin numbers flyin around. Didn't we already all decide that the big ones are gone. How many times do I have to keep sayin this before everyone starts believin me. Trust me I know my SPIDEY senses are tinglin....



Hey, a horse just fell over dead in my back yard. Who wants to come join me in a kickin party.
 
PROBLEM IS!!!

WE NOW HAVE 450" BULLS TREADING IN UTAH!!!

ONCE A FEW OF THESE 450"ERS HIT THE DIRT 400" BULLS WON'T MEAN JACK UNLESS I GET THE CHANCE AT ONE!!!

I'LL EVEN SETTLE FOR A LIL OLE 350" PISSCUTTER!!!

I ALSO BELIEVE THERES QUITE FEW BULLS BEING HELD SECRET!!!

"MAGAZINE MATERIAL"!!!

"LET EM GET AGE,LET EM GET BIG & LET A FEW OF THEM BE HARVESTED"!!!

YOU CAN'T SATISFY EVERY TARD SO WHY EVEN TRY???

THIS IS MY NEW GUN,YOU MAY NOT LIKE IT,YOU'LL LIKE IT A HELL OF A LOT LESS WHEN IT HITS ITS DESTINATION!!!
47654abd5a8fd79a.jpg


469ff2b8110d7f4e.jpg


THE ONLY bobcat THAT KNOWS ALOT OF YOU HAVE HAD THIS IMAGE IN YOUR PEA BRAIN BUT DUE TO POOR SHOOTING TACTICS I'M STILL KICKIN!!!
 
Hate to disagree with jim (awhlb) but i dont think he was hunting the wasatch ;-) lol. I saw more bulls this year over 350 than i have ever before,i also saw more hunters than ever before. Not to mention i saw the biggest bull ive ever seen on here three different times. He just kept gettin bigger haha, the first one was 375-380, then it went to 390, then i found one that was 400+. But come huntin season all these bulls disappeared. We still managed to put two monsters down a 360 class bull and a 370+ bull. As the hunts wore on we got this kind of a count, 1 380 bull no shot 3 370 bulls 1 dead, two got away no shot or inept hunters, 5+ 360 bulls 1 dead again no shot or inept hunters. now compared to last year this was stellar. we saw jack nothin last year till a week before and still managed two bulls well over 350. This was an awesome year, it was an insanely tough hunt tho. all the bulls we killed were unknown to us never seen before in pre season. I have to agree with the muzzy idea think this is the year for them!

ON that note Chad if ya want a little help from me, i think ya have my number. id be glad to help pack out or see another big stinky die. Nothin gets my blood pumpin like that!
littlebeaver.jpg


Wildlife population control specialist
 
Thanks Berry! I will give ya a shout if we get in a pinch. I have to agree with you guy's. Lot's of great bulls and they are being held quietly. I know a 400 bull was shot 2 days ago. Some dandy bulls are being seen. They are actually starting to rut! I am on my way out today! Hope everyone has a great hunt! Talk to ya later!

Chad
 
Kinda makes me sick how many of you are so worried about a number (400)
What ever happened to just enjoying the site of a big majestic bull regardless of his score. Do you really respect the animals we hunt or is it really just the head gear?

Do you realize that the difference between 370-400 is 30 inches? I've caught fish that size!!! Quit whining!
 
Looks like AZ is makin a run the white mountain bull and that 434 bull from somewhere east of 3a/3c are huge!!! and hjb this isnt about hunting or passing a bull its about the state of Utahs elk herd and the year its havin. take it down a notch
littlebeaver.jpg


Wildlife population control specialist
 
I know for me conditions were rough, I cant really compare it to other years since I have never have a LE tag before. Had a great hunt, but it was tough. Saw a TON of bulls, but just young bulls. Water was everywhere which is why I think the elk were scattered. They were moving alot, which made it hard to plan on where they would be. All in all I had a great hunt and cant wait to do it again in 15yrs!

CC
 
370-400 is 30"? Good math lesson. However I shoot pisscutters. If I even THINK the thing will go 350 I am putting him down. Lets see 350-400 would be a whopping 50"! Just thinking aloud again. I learned something new today.

What would you think HJB if I told you a guide I know felt it was going downhill? A guide who does this for a living who spends all his spare time on the premium units? I guess that is what got me thinking and discussing something of interest on a DISCUSSION FORUM? Don't make it sound like people think 400 should be the number for every bull or any good bull. I think anything over 320 is a very good bull and a great one at 350. That is if you even care to measure. I kind of have a pisscutter attitude I guess?

Carry on......
 
KTC you are a pisscuttin fool!! ;-) if it aint at least 500" you dont even look at it! I dunno bout down hill but i do believe the its on an even plane right now the next couple of years will be the crucial ones. Like i said before i saw more and better bulls on the wasatch this year but the conditions just made hunting them impossible. i dont expect a year like this next year not with the increase in tags and cow slaying. But i dont think the state on the whole is on the down hill slide yet. It could happen soon but not this year
littlebeaver.jpg


Wildlife population control specialist
 
Here's my crazy two cents after a couple of glasses of wine this evening :)

I think given ample feed, that high day time tempuratures is what creates the monster bulls we've seen. This year was cooler than the last few years here in Utah, from what I can tell.

I believe that elk use their antlers as radiators during the summer. Given enough feed water and extremely hot conditions, you can get the massive long growth we've seen the last few years.

This year was not as warm from my recollection and thus the slightly lower scoring bulls this year. There are monster bulls this year, but not quite the dandy's we've seen in years past.

Secondly that increased tags, increases the pressure during the scouting season and during the hunts. This makes the animals smarter and more apt to stay out of harms way.

I believe the elk are the same caliber this year, just more heavily hunted, smarter and not quite as much growth this year as years past.

Ty, this is the effect I've been talking about for a number of years now. Add pressure, give them lots of feed and make it hot as all get out and we see more bulls growing to be the mac daddy of all. A big part of it is that the more we add permits the smarter the elk become and the more opportunity there is for all of us. If you add environmental conditions to the equations, you can double down for next year when I might actually draw :)

Cheers,
Pete
 
I think the hunting and scouting pressure these bulls are seeing is making them more wary. Well maybe not the bulls, but the cows they chase. (Utah bulls usually do not get shot at, they just get shot.)

Just some food for thought, but most units are above the set age objectives and quality will fall slightly as they are brought into the set objectives. Many units that are supposed to be managed as 5-6 year old units are really 7-8 year old units in actual age. Big elk in Utah will not go away in the near future, but instead of shooting 20+ 400" bulls a year, I bet is falls to single digits.

-------------------------
www.sagebasin.com
-------------------------
 
I think Packout nailed it! Again.

PRO

Define, develop, and sustain BOTH trophy and opportunity hunts throughout the state of Utah.
 
LAST EDITED ON Sep-25-08 AT 01:18AM (MST)[p]I think it's been pretty well covered but I'll throw in my 2 cents. I just spent the last two weekends down in San Juan and I can tell you the big stinky still lives in Utah. Admittedly I didn't run into any memebers of the 400 club but I did see many bulls that were getting pretty close. Like we've heard over and over the weather and moon just had them treed up and and quiet during day light hours. There seemed to be lots of water around too preventing them from having to leave the dark holes during the day.

Night time was a different story. The bulls were active, even the cows were noisy at night.....all night. The bulls were fighting, chasing cows and screaming thier guts out. The big stinkies are still there.....just living their lives at night and that just makes it "feel" like the biguns are not as plentiful because they are showing themselves much less.
 
Good thread Ty........

Sorry I am catching it at the very end of the interest.

I have bow-hunted three states this September----Wyoming--Arizona and of course Utard.

I personally feel that the lack of true 'inches bulls' in Utah is mainly because of 'Education of Bulls' by the simply stupid ---28 days--28 days---bow elk season---BUT---the week extra coming at the freaking begining August 16th date.

Every single Goofball with a cow call and bugle started Educating the bulls way to early with the bow hunt starting August 16th dates.....in Utardville.

By the time the some-what 'actual rut timeframe' started in early September----the elk had been FULLY educated by the idiots out bow elk hunting and calling because 'the season started' in Mid-August.....so by the time the 'tough rifle rut' hunt dates started/full moon/well educated bulls/HOT WEATHER....nocturnal Rut activity took place and by 0730/0800 mornings....Dark Timber the elk went.......tough hunting for sure...

Personally--------I say get rid of August 16th elk hunting---even if it cuts us bowhunters back to 'normal' hunt dates....and less--very less Education Timeframe of bull elk and the rut timeframe...

But then again----I am just yet--'Another Website Biologist'.....

Robb
 
To add to what Robb said, on the Dutton I ran into more archery deer hunters trying to call in bulls than elk hunters. I only ran into 1 other elk hunter but ran into at least seven different groups of archery deer hunters. Most of these groups were at the tail heads. As I was returning to the vehicle I would find groups of up eight calling from the back of trucks (road hunting). I confronted most of them and they said they just wanted to see some of the big Utah bulls.
 
400,

Like I told you in the PM, I admire the true blue archery guys. I do not bow hunt, but I think it is just a rip off to have to deal with general season guys, hounds, idiots, tards, and the flexible closing dates, on the precious elk tags. To be fair the archery should run from Sept 1-18 or 20th. Cut the time back a little but give it on the end.

I really cannot bugle well. I only use a cow call if locating or to pull something from the timber. I just don't get people going out and messing with another guy's hunt. They think calling is not harmful, but it is. I also just stay off the LE units if I do not have a tag. Why mess it up for someone else? I wish they would stay home when I draw as well. I do not care for sight-seers much.

Just some opinions I have. Good luck going forward 400.
 
Ty,

My dad has a ML Elk tag on your favorite unit and me and my brother had them last year. I have a work issue to deal with first thing Monday morning so I had to leave him and my brother till Monday mid day.

In a nutshell conditions are different and elk are behaving differently from last year. I can affirm that the bulls are hotter than they were last year at this time and there are some exceptional bulls out there and a lot of good ones.

We have come close to sealing the deal but the bigs ones aren't big by accident. With a little luck we will get him the bull he wants.


?Here?s to the hero's that Git-R-Done!!?
 
out4,

Let us know how your dad does? Good to hear your report that the big stinky is alive and well.
 
Is anyone else out there sick and tired of hearing about how it was IMPOSSIBLE to hunt the elk with a rifle and for that matter with a bow this year??? Just because they aren't screaming their heads off and running around stupid, we all cry that we couldn't kill a 400 bull. Do we even understand anymore that it is STILL called HUNTING not KILLING? Get off ur four wheeler, get out of ur truck, put ur damn bugle in the glove box and hunt!!! Here in utah, we have been spoiled into thinking that all we have to do is show up on the mtn, and big stinky will lay at our feet TAPE himself out, then jump on our wall without us lifting a finger! Give me a break, I feel for you guys that ate tag soup this year, I think there is a pretty high number of guys that could have put more time and EFFORT into their hunt. Now for those guys that worked their a$$e$ off, thats why its hunting not killing. We need to adjust our hunting tactics accordinly on-the-fly to the conditions that our unit deals us. I just don't want to hear the word impossible again about this years hunt, if the elk were timbered up, get in the timber...oh yeah, that requires getting off the wheeler trail. A buddy and I called in three great bulls for an uncle this year on the wasatch within 300 yds, he missed all three. Point is, the elk were moving and talking, full moon and heat. No more excuses, the big bulls are still in utah, just cuz you didnt't shoot one from ur pickup doesnt mean they aren't here anymore. One year won't make that big of a dent in the bulls, wait a few more years to use that one. Remember this is utah, we can ruin anything we want really fast!!!
 

Similar threads

Bigbucks
Fillmore Pahvant vs Plateau Boulder Muzzleloader Elk
Replies
16
Views
2k
wstrntines
wstrntines
cantkillathing
utah elk numbers?
Replies
17
Views
1k
middlefork
M
highsierra
The most underrated deer hunt in CA?
Replies
42
Views
2k
Skykarp
Skykarp

Click-a-Pic ... Details & Bigger Photos

Member Gallery Photos and Videos!

IMG-20201006-WA0009.jpg
1591133932148.png
Super Buck!
phonto.jpeg
3F464652-9896-4B2E-8A7F-2BA4ED4DB859.jpeg
7937D7E0-FD21-442C-A47D-C3DDDE853FE3.jpeg
IMG_5456.jpg
1675832463360.jpeg
Huge Buck
41D1A228-1790-4975-843E-EEF53D1A1C81.jpeg
20221022_114325.jpg
Screenshot_20220109-190339.png
Back
Top Bottom