What in the world do you do with 10-PP's for elk in CO?!?

crcountry · Mar 13, 2017

Am I in no-man's land or what?!

Myself and 3 others in my elk hunt team all have 10 points going into 2017 draw for elk and Mule deer.

I fear in 5 more years that we will still be in no-man's land with the point creep.

I guess we'll just keep at it and hunt NM until we can get a quality 1st rifle tag in a decent public land spot, go get our 250" bulls and head back to NM.

Is there reasonable ranch hunting for 300" bulls that is under $8k these days?

I can get a 290-300" bull out of NM public land every year for $6000k which includes the landowner tag.

One more elk hunt in CO and I'm done with that point game.

Coloradoboy · Mar 13, 2017

10 points is no mans land for elk in some regards. If you are willing to shell out the money for a guided/tresspass hunt unit 40 would be my top choice. You have plenty of good options with deer tags though.You may not have the points for the the top tier 3rd and 4th season tags but 10 points can get you in on some good hunts.

Coloradoboy

tx_packmule · Mar 14, 2017

Pretty much in the same boat with no unit nailed down and really no urgency to hunt. Plans are when I finally do is basically just cut out the voucher price on a guided private hunt. I usually either have or decline a bull voucher (low quality..though I've seen a few over 300) on deer hunts so it's not like I'm blowing some OIL opportunity to experience a DIY wilderness hunt.

Cohntr62 · Mar 14, 2017

My son and I have 11 pts. so we're in the same boat. We keep hunting an OTC unit for elk and deer, but sometime soon, we will have to go for 1st season elk and use the pts. I'm too old to wait very many years. We're thinking drop camp, maybe unit 49. Another option is ML season. In the flattops, I think, that is about 10 points. I'll be reading this thread to see if anyone has any better ideas.

sjhgraysage · Mar 14, 2017

My suggestion is this.
Look into all of the elk units that have elk licenses available by drawing only. Then figure out what the minimum number of points are required to draw which ever hunt you prefer, whether that is archery, muzzleloader or first rifle, etc.
Then check out the bull to cow ration for those areas. Pick the ones that have decent amount of public land and the habitat type that you think you would like to hunt.

That should narrow the list of areas that you could draw and would want to hunt.
I believe that there are hunts to be had that you can do with the number of points you have and still have a good hunt with the chance to get a decent bull.

nripepi · Mar 14, 2017

49 1st rifle is at 10 now. It has been going up a point or so per year the last few years. I guess everyone in the same boat has seen there just are not many choices out there.

49 muzzle is at 10 as well.

oldmossback · Mar 14, 2017

LAST EDITED ON Mar-14-17 AT 01:07PM (MST)[p]resident or non resident?

crcountry · Mar 14, 2017

Non-resident

Garth Carter/HuntIn fool always offered a unit 40 ranch hunt as one of their raffle hunts...who did they always hunt with?

How much is a "good" private access ranch hunt in Unit 40 with plenty of 290-310" bulls? Recommendations on private land/landowner/trespass fee?

How much is a "great" private access ranch hunt in Unit 40 with plenty of 300-320+" type bulls? I'd gather the better ranches don't allow trespass DIY hunting?

What unit is the Hill Ranch on? The Eastman's hunt there regularly. I'm guessing $10k+?

Thanks
crcountry

crcountry · Mar 14, 2017

Here's my final thought: Is there a private land/DIY/trespass hunt for under $5k in unit 40 that gives a good block of private property to hunt with access to BLM that public land hunters can't get to for around 5k?....when you already have the tag in your pocket?

My #1 priority is not paying significantly more that I would in my New Mexico landowner/elk voucher situation for the same type of bulls.

If there's a place in unit 40 to harvest 300"+ bulls with some regularity, then we would certainly consider a higher dollar hunt....but I have little interest in shelling out $6-7k+ for a 7-day hunt for a 290-310" bull. I'd rather blow my points on a MZ hunt in the White River/Flat Tops for lesser bulls on public land and save my money for an outfitter in AZ and NV when I hit those draws. Not trying to be greedy, just practical with money.

Last question: Are there plenty of ranches in Unit 40 offering outfitting/trespass fees, or is that info as coveted as most other hunting info these days?

Elkduds · Mar 14, 2017

IMO 49 has one of the most inflated point costs in CO. I spend 30+ days there every summer.

Hill is in 851.

85 has a great herd, mostly on private. A trespass there could deliver the goods.

nripepi · Mar 14, 2017

"I can get a 290-300" bull out of NM public land every year for $6000k which includes the landowner tag.

One more elk hunt in CO and I'm done with that point game."

Just going back to your original post, I think you can get a 300" bull out of a public land hunt 1st rifle for 10 points. The cost of those 10 points is only $250-$400? That is way less than $6000, so not sure why you would be done with the point game? The point game is generally pretty cheap in the overall scheme, it just takes time and even with time, you are likely not to shoot a monster bull or buck.

If I were you I would hunt 1st rifle somewhere and shoot a 6x6!

Coloradoboy · Mar 14, 2017

LAST EDITED ON Mar-14-17 AT 02:54PM (MST)[p]>Here's my final thought: Is there
>a private land/DIY/trespass hunt for
>under $5k in unit 40
>that gives a good block
>of private property to hunt
>with access to BLM that
>public land hunters can't get
>to for around 5k?....when you
>already have the tag in
>your pocket?
>
>My #1 priority is not paying
>significantly more that I would
>in my New Mexico landowner/elk
>voucher situation for the same
>type of bulls.
>
>If there's a place in unit
>40 to harvest 300"+ bulls
>with some regularity, then we
>would certainly consider a higher
>dollar hunt....but I have little
>interest in shelling out $6-7k+
>for a 7-day hunt for
>a 290-310" bull. I'd rather
>blow my points on a
>MZ hunt in the White
>River/Flat Tops for lesser bulls
>on public land and save
>my money for an outfitter
>in AZ and NV when
>I hit those draws. Not
>trying to be greedy, just
>practical with money.
>
>Last question: Are there plenty of
>ranches in Unit 40 offering
>outfitting/trespass fees, or is that
>info as coveted as most
>other hunting info these days?
>

Im not the guy to ask as far as land owners are concerned. But being that you are very concerned with score... 350 plus bulls are common. Average bull is around 320. Ive seen multiple come out that are in 380 to 390 class. Check out steve biggerstaffs website.
However you wouldn't have the points to play ball in the muzzy or 1st rifle season.
Coloradoboy

crcountry · Mar 14, 2017

NRIpepi-

I think you just put a valuable spin on some financial facts: 10 years of points, worth $400, and a public land DIY hunt isn't a bad formula.

I guess my concern has always pointed toward the real odds of shooting a 300" 6x6 on public land in Colorado. 300" is a nice bull by my standards, and I've always heard that most limited entry units in Colorado are still a challenge to take a nice 6x6... and smaller (sub-300") are still the norm even after you wait 10+ years for a tag.

I'll research and find a spot with a reasonable amount of tags and likely a trespass hunt.

crcountry · Mar 14, 2017

Great website at Biggerstaff

http://www.biggerstaffguides.com/elk hunts.htm

Looks like they shoot some very nice Colorado bulls...

$8500 for 5 days...wow.

BeanMan · Mar 14, 2017

Buying a bull has never appealed to me.

JWG707 · Mar 14, 2017

Your only 4 points from drawing a first rifle unit 76 tag. I think that is an awesome tag. My group has hunted 2nd choice tags for years and we have killed multiple bulls over 300 inches. All Colorado diy public land.

nripepi · Mar 15, 2017

I would say if you scout some and hunt hard for the 5 day 1st rifle season (and you get normal weather) in a "10-point" unit in CO, you would have the following chances (just my opinion, others are welcome to chime in on their %s):

>350: 5% chance
>325: 20% chance
>300: 40% chance
>270: 60% chance

The question is do you pass on a 270 or not hoping for a bigger bull?

It is what it is, 10 points just gives you a chance to hunt a good unit with a lot of elk without a ton of pressure, DIY public land.

I think the other issue is that a lot of time you hunt in pairs, 2 with the same tag hunt together. I am starting to move away from that as it really reduces your odds in a short 5-day season. I would rather hunt it one year with my buddy when he has a tag and then again the next year when I have a tag. It depends on your hunting style and location (if it is forested and you split up then not a big deal versus if it is open and you are hunting together...)

Maybe the four of you should just get 2 tags and then do it again....you would probably see two 350s standing next to each other!

WVHUNTER · Mar 15, 2017

I would look at Mike Lawson and Trophy Class Outfitters. Unit 40, will take 10 NR points for third season. It's a 300 bull hunt or better, they will take some bigger bulls in the earlier seasons. A fully guided outfitted hunt won't cost much more than the $5,000 you mentioned.

I have done this hunt, PM if you have any questions.

elkkill06 · Mar 15, 2017

Mike Lawson also has a area where he does a trespass fee for around 700.00 and only allows one hunter or group in there at a time.

mntman · Mar 16, 2017

I never been to unit 40, hunting on or around a bunch of private is not for me. I used up 10 points on a 49 mzldr hunt in 2015. I had a great time there and would do it again 100 times if I had the points. Sure you likely have a better chance at a monster in unit 40 than 49. However, will you see moose, bighorn sheep, mnt goat, coyote, mule deer and elk all in the same day at or above tree line?

I seen 2 other hunters while in there. Plus I had the entire summer to camp up there with my kids watching all the species and fishing.
I seen a few bulls in the 300-348 range while scouting, I shot a 292 early in the hunt. Hard to pass up after having seen him scouting while in velvet and again the day before season opened trying to separate some cows from the herd. Plus with my buddy right there, season ended for me early. He ended up being ancient, missing teeth, teeth wore down. Guessing he was at a minimum of 11 years old, likely 12+ due to his teeth compared to other bulls we had aged. Cool to know I had been applying for points for as long as that bull was alive

Also I found a small caliber bullet in his shoulder where someone likely tried to poach him years prior.

Basically the hunt isn't just about inches, to me its about the experience too. 49 gives you that with an ok chance at a 300+ bull.

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"

Magicman · Mar 17, 2017

LAST EDITED ON Mar-17-17 AT 01:41PM (MST)[p]nripepi, If you are saying what I think you are in Reply #16, that is "party hunting" which is illegal in Colorado.

mntman · Mar 17, 2017

>LAST EDITED ON Mar-17-17
>AT 01:41?PM (MST)
>
>nripepi, If you are saying what
>I think you are in
>Reply #16, that is "party
>hunting" which is illegal in
>Colorado.
he isn't referring to party hunting. He is simply saying if you have two or four people, spread the hunts out over multiple years. A lot of people do this on bigger DIY hunts. I do it with hunts my dad and I go on. He gets a tag, we only have to concentrate/worry about his tag. I get to be with him 100% of the time and watch/help on hunt.
Then the next year or whenever he does same for me.
That is not party hunting.

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"

Magicman · Mar 17, 2017

I was just trying to be sure that there was no misunderstanding.

I understand hunting together and only one person has a tag. My son and I have been doing that for many years. I may have enough PP's to draw this year, and he may have enough to draw next year. He accompanied me when I made my bull kill in 2012 and I was beside him when he took his bull in 2013.

I can assure you that one is enough to pack out!

crcountry · Mar 17, 2017

Hello All:

This has been a very helpful thread for me personally. I've learned quite a bit, and I appreciate everyone's help.

Here are a few highlights for me:
1.) There have been multiple/specific ideas given above that I typically don't see in most other threads. Although unit 76 and 49 have been on my radar screen, I never considered the whole unit 40 idea...thank you everyone for the great banter.
2.) I too don't want to "buy a bull" or hunt for a specific score, and my initial post certainly sounded a bit greedy in many ways...I need to scale it back a bit. I drew a premier tag this past fall in WY and took a 330" bull solo DIY....in a unit that dishes up 350" bulls pretty regularly. So score isn't everything
3.) I think the idea MagicMan came up with regarding sharing hunts every other year would take a pile of stress off me while hunting. Instead of taking 3-4 guys and going 50% with 5-day seasons, go with 1 tag and enjoy a trophy hunt with a buddy vs attempting to fill tags. Go as a partner, observer, and just enjoy a hunt without a tag. It is stressful attempting to get everyone filled in 5 days and it never happens although I've gone 2 for 2 a couple times.
4.) Lastly, I think my initial theory that Colorado public land doesn't dish up 300" bulls (regularly) has been sufficiently debunked here. I've hunted OTC Colorado Unit 33 for 6 years so my initial theory was clouded by past OTC experiences...although I've gone 5 for 6 I never saw a 300" bull...but I think OTC vs. limited entry is quite different. I need to cheer up a bit and realize that my 14-16 points will be a fun hunt with way fewer people than any OTC hunt.
5.) I think the Unit 40 thing would be great if the whole trespass fee worked out, Unit 76 may have significant point creep in the next 4-5 years, and so may Unit 49. I'll just have to see what happens.
Great ideas, and thanks
Crcountry

Magicman · Mar 17, 2017

A non-hunting partner can add much to the hunt. There is no competition so both minds are directed toward the same goal. The non-hunting partner can carry both pack frames and also load his daypack a bit heavier and relieve the hunter who is carrying a rifle, etc. He can also carry an extra box of ammo in case the unthinkable happens. This plus we have not even mentioned safety.

Weiserbucks · Mar 17, 2017

Don't mention safety ! Safety 3rd ! Outside of weapons, safety is at the bottom of my list while hunting.

If I die while hunting, thank God

nripepi · Mar 17, 2017

Not party hunting, the one with the tag is the shooter. If you only have five days to hunt and you hunt together, just make 2 hunts out of it.

LIK2HNT · Mar 19, 2017

I know how you feel about no-mans land. I am sitting on 17 NR points and am contemplating on burning or waiting a few more years. At 54 I just had shoulder and wrist surgery, and still need to get the other shoulder done. As you get older your options get limited. Want to hunt as much as possible while I still can.

Bill

2f350s · Mar 20, 2017

IMHO, as a nonresident if you've waited 10 years then its time to use the points cause its not getting any better.

Truth is; there are hunters everywhere in this state so just pick a place make a plan and hunt there!

Good luck, 2f350s: Hunt hard, hunt ethically.