Antelope Island Deer Tag!

[Tristate]

"I remember there being a crash now that you mention it, HOWEVER look at the numbers, didn't take long to rebound back."


This is a very irresponsible outlook. Population crashes within an ecosystem can be so drastic that you never recover. Infact with the last crash there may be animals on the island that have not recovered even though the deer herd has. In fact the deer herd may be hurting other species on the island through competition.

As to worrying how challenging hunting the island it is, that is of little importance. For whatever reason you believe you are in some form of competition with Denny and you can't let go of that. Maybe Denny feels the same. However when it comes to wildlife management the challenge of the hunt should not be a factor in proper game management. If you have to drop hand grenades out of helicopters to reach quotas before a deadline to avert disaster then you do it. The ecological balance is more important than peoples sence of challenge and competitiveness.

 

[hossblur]

Tri,
You should read the posts before you "educate". According to Yelum, the count of deer on the island is at 800(I doubt its that high, but whatever). Killing 2 deer will not stop any kind of crash. It doesn't do anything, other than give Denny a tag. Your theories on wildlife biology on the island are completely misguided. The island is a closed system. There is no migration of outside animals into and out of the gene pool. The whole point of this NOT BEING ABOUT MANAGEMENT is the fact that they don't manage it as a big game unit. Its a nursery herd for sheep. Its a storing house for bison. Its Dennys personal deer herd. There are tons of chukars out there that die of old age. There is a thriving antelope herd that dies of old age. There are tons of coyotes that run the island with no competition. In short, that is the HYPOCRACY of this hunt being beneficial to the deer, they were there long before SFW.

The island wasn't going to close because of finances, which was the excuse for SFW to get there claws on the island.

Its not about game management, there is no management of any of the species out there, there is simply sheep killing and deer killing.

Its not about creating new habitat for the benefit of the herds, they aren't making more land out there, nor more water(yeah I know, guzzlers).

IT IS SIMPLY ABOUT LETTING SFW REWARD THERE CONTRIBUTORS, so lets put it where it is and be honest. SFW has rich, lazy guys that want to kill big deer. Short of letting them kill deer out of a helicopter, this was the easiest and closest to the airport.

Lastly, I don't troll around in the Texas forum spouting my half azzed knowledge of Texas game managemnt. Mostly because I have never been to Texas, never hunted it, and have zero plans to do so. It would be stupid of me to comment on a place I have never seen. It would be stupid of me to suppose that hunting Texas mule deer in the "hill" country or desert is anything like the mountain hunts we do in the west. Your just wrong on this hunt. That is why I invite people to come see the island themselves. Until you see it in person, your ideas and thoughts about it are flat out dumb.


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"

 

[Tristate]

"Tri,
You should read the posts before you "educate". According to Yelum, the count of deer on the island is at 800(I doubt its that high, but whatever). Killing 2 deer will not stop any kind of crash."

I never said killing the 2 deer was the answer to management. In fact if you go back and read I stated it certianly looks like they need to be killing more than two deer.

" It doesn't do anything, other than give Denny a tag."

Once again you are bending the truth. It also gives a lucky draw hunter a tag.

" Your theories on wildlife biology on the island are completely misguided."

Anf what theories are those? You don't even know what they are.

" The island is a closed system. There is no migration of outside animals into and out of the gene pool. The whole point of this NOT BEING ABOUT MANAGEMENT is the fact that they don't manage it as a big game unit."

Whether you deem it to be mismanaged or not it is still management.

" Its a nursery herd for sheep. Its a storing house for bison. Its Dennys personal deer herd."

Then why not send him a thank you letter next time you get to visit and photo his deer.

" There are tons of chukars out there that die of old age. There is a thriving antelope herd that dies of old age. There are tons of coyotes that run the island with no competition. In short, that is the HYPOCRACY of this hunt being beneficial to the deer, they were there long before SFW."

Sounds like it is beneficial to a lot of animals and even the people who get to visit the island.

"The island wasn't going to close because of finances, which was the excuse for SFW to get there claws on the island."

Who knows for sure. Looks like it ain't gonna close now.

"Its not about game management, there is no management of any of the species out there, there is simply sheep killing and deer killing."

Again even if you think it is mismanaged that is still management.

"Its not about creating new habitat for the benefit of the herds, they aren't making more land out there, nor more water(yeah I know, guzzlers)."

Maybe thats next years plan. Maybe this year they boought new toilets and a coke machine.

"IT IS SIMPLY ABOUT LETTING SFW REWARD THERE CONTRIBUTORS, so lets put it where it is and be honest. SFW has rich, lazy guys that want to kill big deer. Short of letting them kill deer out of a helicopter, this was the easiest and closest to the airport."

And now we run back to class warfare......

"Lastly, I don't troll around in the Texas forum spouting my half azzed knowledge of Texas game managemnt. Mostly because I have never been to Texas, never hunted it, and have zero plans to do so. It would be stupid of me to comment on a place I have never seen. It would be stupid of me to suppose that hunting Texas mule deer in the "hill" country or desert is anything like the mountain hunts we do in the west. Your just wrong on this hunt. That is why I invite people to come see the island themselves. Until you see it in person, your ideas and thoughts about it are flat out dumb."

Now I want you to answer a question. What am I wrong about on this hunt? What do I not understand about the hunt? I am pretty sure I have agreed with every comment about how the hunt occurs, where it is, and the dificulty of it. The only statement in regards to the hunt that I have stated is I DON'T CARE!

 

[mntman]

Cant believe I just read this.... Except for tristates comments, I skipped them cause he never says anything useful or productive anyway.

1.No one cares about the Denny and his money. End of argument.

2.These two tags do zero for the management of deer and other species on the island. End of argument.

3. It is the easiest hunt EVER in the history of Mule deer on AI. End of argument.

4. There were giant bucks prior to SFW on AI. End of argument.

5. There will be giant bucks when SFW is gone on AI. End of argument.

6. Only thing worth discussing is if a state should be selling tags to the highest bidder and how many?
- America destroyed nearly every, if not all big game populations in the 1800's and early 1900's. Due to hunters paying for their recovery we now have and have had huntable populations in place for decades. The American model of hunting has worked (proven with time). Europe's (SFW) model has NOT worked (proven with time).
Yes, auction tags raise huge sums of money but at what cost to future hunting generations?
I like the idea of having 1 auction tag/species and one draw tag/species that can be used any where in the state during normal hunting seasons/regulations.
If there was only one tag/species, the money received for that one tag would sky-rocket and the Denny's of the world would pay close to a million probably for one tag...

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"


Let me guess, you drive a 1 ton with oak trees for smoke stacks, 12" lift kit and 40" tires to pull a single place lawn mower trailer?

 

[Tristate]

LAST EDITED ON Mar-08-13 AT 01:33PM (MST)[p]"Cant believe I just read this.... Except for tristates comments, I skipped them cause he never says anything useful or productive anyway."


At least I don't type a bunch of opinion junk and end each phrase with "END OF ARGUEMENT" as if my narcissism has gotten out of hand.

"Europe's (SFW) model has NOT worked (proven with time)."

First how have you decided that Europe and SFW have the same wildlife model. Second there are many nations within europe that have different wildlife models. Third, how have you decided their wildlife model has failed? You can still load up on a plane right now and go to almost any nation over there and go hunting. I know its hard to beleive that someone not using the NACM could have huntable wildlife but its actually true. I am not saying that we should have any of the European wildlife models but it is time for people to understand that wildlife models are time, socialy, and biologicaly sensitive. Ther comes times when you have to change your model to evolve with the dynamics of both your social structure and you ecosystems.

 

[mntman]

LMAO!!! You really going to argue any of my first 5 comments? If you do then it proves what everyone on this site is thinking.

_____________________________________________________________
Can any normal law abiding European citizen with a low to average income apply/draw/hunt 2 or 3 times for a multiple of species anywhere in Europe each year?

Oh wait it works for the RICH hunters...

Europe doesn't have large tracts of land open to the public (granted their overall size is a lot smaller, still they don't have crap set aside or public land programs like what the U.S. has in percentage of total acres).

If it works so well, why didn't we adopt it over 100 years ago???

SFW, wants a few rich hunters to have the oppurtunity to hunt leaving everyone else out of the picture.

FYI- I couldn't care if someone has millions, good for them. I actually feel they get the short end of the stick nearly all the time when dealing with the gov't. Yes if I wanted to become rich I could try but I'd rather put my effort and time into spending time with my girls, family and friends getting rich with a life full of memories than spend my time working 12-16 hour days till I am 50 or older to become rich so I can buy these tags so I could create memories alone or with some stranger who charges me $20-$40k to shoot a tame buck...


Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"


Let me guess, you drive a 1 ton with oak trees for smoke stacks, 12" lift kit and 40" tires to pull a single place lawn mower trailer?

 

[Tristate]

"LMAO!!! You really going to argue any of my first 5 comments? If you do then it proves what everyone on this site is thinking."

So now you know what everyone on a website thinks...... Like I said before check your narcissism.

_____________________________________________________________
"Can any normal law abiding European citizen with a low to average income apply/draw/hunt 2 or 3 times for a multiple of species anywhere in Europe each year?"

Once again, Europe is not a country. This is like stating the NACM doesn't work because low income US citizens can't go hunt in Canada anytime they want.

"Oh wait it works for the RICH hunters..."

What income is rich in you most hated country you call Europe? You got those numbers?

"Europe doesn't have large tracts of land open to the public (granted their overall size is a lot smaller, still they don't have crap set aside or public land programs like what the U.S. has in percentage of total acres)."

So you do realize Europe is different than North America. You may now enter the second grade.

"If it works so well, why didn't we adopt it over 100 years ago???"

Because like I said before and you failed to read, wildlife models must vary depending on society, time and ecosystems.

"SFW, wants a few rich hunters to have the oppurtunity to hunt leaving everyone else out of the picture."

Do you have a quote of them saying that or is your brain that assumes knowledge of all posters on this website deciding this also?

"FYI- I couldn't care if someone has millions, good for them. I actually feel they get the short end of the stick nearly all the time when dealing with the gov't. Yes if I wanted to become rich I could try but I'd rather put my effort and time into spending time with my girls, family and friends getting rich with a life full of memories than spend my time working 12-16 hour days till I am 50 or older to become rich so I can buy these tags so I could create memories alone or with some stranger who charges me $20-$40k to shoot a tame buck..."

Ain't America great. You can do what you want with your time and money and someone else can do what they want.

 

[mntman]

Thanks for your time, you haven't said one thing that is worth while reading. You can't say nothing unless you are attacking someone. Why don't you learn how to communicate your point.

FYI-never said Europe was one country... If I did, why don't you quote me...

Who said anything about Canada, they have a very similar type of management style as to the US but to answer your question, yes a person making $40k a year could easily get to Canada and hunt Caribou, Black Bear, Moose, Mule Deer, Whitetail, Mnt Lion, Mnt Goat. The other species are getting up there and you'd have to be wise with your money at $40k/year to hunt grizzly, sheep, mountain caribou but very possible.

When I was making 30k/year I went on a Moose hunt to AK, with out borrowing any money.That was after I took nearly 3 months off after the Navy to do nothing except hang out with my family, no income coming in yet still went to AK.

Sounds like you are real smart compared to me since I am only in 2nd grade.... So what is the average income of a hunter in Europe (the Continent)? You can pick any country you want, since I am likely not going to be able to figure out where Europe is even at, I am only 7 years old. You can use the Euro or USD, convert it if you want or not, since I am only in the 2nd grade all of it is the same to me anyway...

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"


Let me guess, you drive a 1 ton with oak trees for smoke stacks, 12" lift kit and 40" tires to pull a single place lawn mower trailer?

 

[Tristate]

Well you just shot your arguement to hell. If you make 40k in a year, you can go hunt in somewhere in Europe.

 

[mntman]

LAST EDITED ON Mar-09-13 AT 11:13AM (MST)[p]Remember I am only 7 years old, where are your facts?
Also you haven't answered any questions of anyone on this posting.

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"


Let me guess, you drive a 1 ton with oak trees for smoke stacks, 12" lift kit and 40" tires to pull a single place lawn mower trailer?

 

[Tristate]

LAST EDITED ON Mar-09-13 AT 11:18AM (MST)[p]Just call up someone who books hunts in Europe. They can tell you prices for lots of different options.

One downside is you will not be able to keep the meat. US government will not let you enter the country with it.

 

[mntman]

Also, my 2nd grade teacher clarified that the following sentence you just wrote is an improper usage of words.... maybe you should set aside some time and come to class with me, maybe it will help your wrtiting skills.

">If you
>make 40k in a year,
>you can go hunt in
>somewhere in Europe."

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"


Let me guess, you drive a 1 ton with oak trees for smoke stacks, 12" lift kit and 40" tires to pull a single place lawn mower trailer?

 

[mntman]

>Just call up someone who books
>hunts in Europe. They
>can tell you prices for
>lots of different options.

I can't, my parents won't let me call long distance... plus how would you call to Europe, I didn't know there was phone lines long enough to reach across the Atlantic. Do they use pigeons or do you send your message via ship?

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"


Let me guess, you drive a 1 ton with oak trees for smoke stacks, 12" lift kit and 40" tires to pull a single place lawn mower trailer?

 

[Tristate]

You can use a US booking agent and many of them have toll free numbers. If mommy won't let you use the phone but lets you argue on the computer there is nothing I can do to help. Sorry.

 

[mntman]

Still havne't answered one question for anyone on this thread?

You like trying to make fun of other people over the internet but fail to have a sensible conversation? You said I am in 2nd grade so I am just responding the way you expect assuming that is what you understand best...

Forgot you called me a anti-hunting member of PETA on another thread too. Still laughing at that comment!

Cant believe I allowed my self to get suckered into this stupid azz thread with you, even after seeing your other 600+ comments. Completely my fault!


Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"


Let me guess, you drive a 1 ton with oak trees for smoke stacks, 12" lift kit and 40" tires to pull a single place lawn mower trailer?

 

[Tristate]

"Still havne't answered one question for anyone on this thread?"


Didn't you ask if a common person can hunt in Europe? After you finaly defined common as making about 40K a year I answered yes.