AZ sheep units/ guide questions

S

scottyboy

Guest
Odds are indeed slim, but every year 70-80 lucky individuals are bestowed with a tag that many of us dream of.

With that said, I'd like to get some opinions from some of the sheep nuts/sheep experts/well known sheep guides that frequent this site.

What, in your opinion, are the top 5 sheep units/tags in the state these days? Is the unit a historically known producer each year or is it a "sleeper" that is bypassed by some? By this, I mean a good precentage of class IV rams. Not only a good percentage of class IV rams, but a decent pop. of sheep in total.
Is it a unit in the extreme desert areas of the state or a more "temperate" part of the state? Is it completely devoid of water (almost) or is there plenty available ?
Is it a vertical unit or is it a moderate incline in most places the sheep in the unit frequent?
Does it offer multiple tags or just one?
Is it "easily" hunted or do you have to pack in on horseback or on foot to access the rams?

Any other info you guys would like to indugle would be greatly appreciated.

As for the guides, who is the top guys these days and in what units are these guys getting the job done? If you ARE one of the guys, plese speak up and let it be known! By all means, toot your own horn here. I am all ears. I know there are some really good outfits here that do really well on some great rams. I'd like to see you guys speak up on this thread. Post some pics, share some info about the units, let us know how your hunts run etc.

All it takes is your name getting pulled. We all get that giddy feeling each and every year when sheep tag season rolls around. To me, it is the epitome (DBH and BH) of ALL North American hunting and I am ate up with it. Its just a matter of getting your name on that tag. Each year, I hope that this is the year.

Thanks guys!
 
LAST EDITED ON May-05-11 AT 03:34PM (MST)[p]I am by no means a "sheep guy", but I seem to remember that the Scott brothers (Southwest Hunting Adventures) had a 3 ram average last season of about 175" for their clients down in their neck of the woods. I might be off an inch or 2, but pretty close. Thats pretty good IMO.
 
Wy would any of them come on a public forum and divulge that info? Yes the draw odds are slim to none, but why make them worse for particular units? I'd be surprised if you get specifics!
 
I have serious doubts that one dissussion on one (out of literally thousands) of hunting sites on the WWW is going to hurt the draw odds in any sheep hunt unit in ALL states, much less one.

Thank you for that well thought out and insightful response though. Well done.

------------------
DRSS
 
Well keep doubting then. Same reasons people don't name specific deer and elk units when asked. Ya it happens sometimes, but not likely.

Not trying to get in a pissing match just my thoughts. Guess I should've asked permission first.
 
scottyboy, you won't even answer a pm to tell them how the mearns quail hunting is and you expect sheep info.
 
I'm sure that if you showed enough interest to call the better outfitters and ask, you would get their reccomendations on where to apply based upon what you are looking for.

And there are the application services, fool:)
 
Typical MM dissussion, lol!

The app services are about as useful as the ##### on my male pointers. Garth likes to regurgitate the same stuff in each issue. Guess I will go back and reread over the last 5yrs and see what they have to say. Lord knows its the same each season with "Garth's top 10 list"!

Best of luck in the draws. We all need it for these sheep.





------------------
DRSS
 
It really is sad when it always turns to this! I, for one, would give you give some info, if I was given permission!
 
Best unit in Region III is no doubt Unit 15D. Last year was a phenominal year there, with the two largest rams taken in the past 10 years being harvested on the first day of the hunt. (Yep one of them was ours--Don Oostenink-- who is featured in Carter's Huntin Fool magazine..

Plus two or three more tams taken last year would qualify for the state book.

Unit average not as good as Travis area ( 44BN), but more tags. This year they dropped from 9 to 7 tags, but there are a lot of class 4 rams there, but alas many of them are broomed off and won't score a ton, but none-the-less are darned fine rams.

I think our hunters have taken the number one or number two rams in this unit for the past three years. I think our outfit has guided more sheep hunters in Region III the past three years than any other outfit. Might be a reason for that, especially since we are just 30 miles from Unit 15D....

If you or anyone else wants to talk about this or the other units in Region III, just give me a call.

By the way I have nothing but the highest regards for Travis and his bro and for Pat Feldt. All are stand up guys..

Don Martin
Arizona Wildlife Outfitters
928-681-4867
 
Actually from what I read on Geof Moss's website he did a little report on draw odds for sheep and he reported that Between 2007 and 2010, total applicants decreased from 10,930 to 8,206.

When people contact us for unit recommendations to apply we only hope in the event they draw they'll book a hunt with us to better their odds at scoring one of the larger rams in the unit. We have no way of knowing if these guy's just trolling and don't plan on hiring us or anybody for that matter. So whether or not somebody divulges info on a public forum or simply talks to sheep outfitters or reads Huntinfool, Eastman's is not going to sway the odds any worse than it already is because one way or the other the info is out there. IMO

As far as the better sheep guides go. I don't feel comfortable getting on a public forum and pounding my chest, but I will say there is no other sheep outfitter in the state who can claim they will work any harder and have more passion than us. The trick of hiring the right outfitter is finding out where his geographical location is or where he specializes in.























Gun control is a good aim and a steady rest
 
LAST EDITED ON May-06-11 AT 10:17AM (MST)[p]
In region 4 many of the units have the potential for a cranker ram. But not every unit has 1 in it right now. The best unit in region 4? Who really knows! I like a couple different units for different reasons.

I like 44BN, although the best ram killed in there was "only" 172, it has better sheep. I scouted the unit quite a bit last spring and found 2 rams I strongly believe would go over the 180 mark. But we did not hunt that unit last year. The last year we hunted 44BN was 2008, we killed a B&C 180&3/8 ram out of there, The unit record.

We hunted 44AE and took a 184 ram last year. The common thought of this unit was "Not many sheep, lots of country, and the sheep are small". Most of that is true, but a 184 ram is a monster. That ram beat the unit record by 30"!

I like 43B as well. We hunted Mr. Taylor in 43B last year and took a ram that scored 169 gross, 166 net. We saw lots of sheep. We couldn't really penetrate into the wilderness, Mr. Taylor is 74 years old. He got around great, but.... Well you know.

My personal favorite unit is 44BS. It has access and wilderness in one. We have 3 book rams out of this unit in 3 years. We did not "guide" Ryan Mell. I was just along helping. But I did guide Stan Sanchez last year and Phil McCreary, 2008, to two rams over 170, 171 and 175 to be exact. I do not know if the unit has a 180 within it, but, mid 170"s class 4 rams are good enough for my tag!

If was to consider region 3, I would contact Don Martin and Pat Feldt. I haven't got a clue where to begin there.

If was considering the middle units, 22-37A, I would contact Geoff Moss, or Richie Hogan.

Not one outfitter is "THE BEST" in the entire state. We all have our core areas.

Travis Scott
www.southwesthuntingadventures.com
 
I've been in the Scott brothers camps and they are a first class outfit. IMO there are none better. They can get it done and done right.
 
Don, Travis, and Mesquite

thank you! That kind of info is EXACTLY the type of exchange I was looking for. Past history of kills, general info on the diff units, et cetera.

I was hoping you guys would show up and join in. You guys certainly know your sheep and I enjoy reading your sheep related posts.

Thank you for getting the topic on track. I was never lurking for exact GPS coords where some old 200"er lives or the hunter's social security numbers.. I just wanted to talk AZ hammer rams.

I hope I'll be in contact with you guys this summer with a tag in pocket.


------------------
DRSS
 
Another twist on the same question...

Where would you want a tag if you were bow hunting? In my mind a good bow hunt means lots of sheep. Since you will likely blow several stalks before it all comes together, lots of opportunity is key. I'd rather kill a 150 sheep with my bow than a 170 with my rifle. What say ya'll?
 
Despite contary belief, rams(in region 4) are not as hard to stalk as one may think. In most places, DOWN HERE, people only observe sheep, not predate on them. The snowbirds have done quite well at "taming" them. I know region 3 is quite different, but several of those units have a ton of sheep.
My 7 year old son and I have patiently walked to well within 30 yards of many bachelor groups of rams. Don't move like a predator!
 
LAST EDITED ON May-06-11 AT 02:09PM (MST)[p]Scottyboy- how many points do you have? I would assume you're way up there!

My best advice I can give is especially residents is don't get caught up in unit trends. By the time a unit gets on the map as being a super unit the odds spiral out of control and by the time somebody does draw a tag the quality is on it's way down because of harvest expectations. Now you have people chasing white whales that don't exist.
I know of one unit that is gonna fall flat on it's face here real soon due increased tags numbers, hunter expectations and die offs. Five years ago it only had two tags and most hunters were unaware of trophy potential so they basically shot the first 150-160 ram they saw.

If you have a lot of bonus points start developing a good relationship with some of the reputable guides and plan on hiring one. The better guides are ahead of the pack in knowing what unit should have the best potential for a B&C ram. At least we do. Not only am I looking for big rams but I'm keeping an eye out for some of the younger stock coming up the pipe. Heck I'm waiting on several rams to hunt four years from now in units that have less than 30 people applying for. I hope they live because they're gonna be crankers.















Gun control is a good aim and a steady rest
 
LAST EDITED ON May-06-11 AT 04:06PM (MST)[p]Well, I know Trav and Troy are being modest, and rightfully so...no one should ever be too comfortable honkin' their own horn, its a red flag in my book anyway

So I will say it: them guys and the team they've put together can hunt sheep ANYWHERE at the absolute top level...hell, some of these units were places nobody wanted to touch until SWHA started pullin hammers out of em. T-Rex and 'Glasser put those units on the map! They are also just all around top hunters: in addition to sheep, they annually kill some monster desert mule deer, have killed some super antelope bucks, Trav is one hell of an elk hunter, etc...just life-long experienced outdoorsmen who know well their craft

Anyway, I think the picture is pretty clear as to who it is that could rightfully be considered the Masters of the Desert anyway...ya, there are a lot of pretenders out there with a fancy webpage who do a lot of 'piggybacking', and would lead the gullable to esteem them much more than they're deserving of, and there are obviously some good, honest, decent outfitters as well...but I don't put anyone in the same class as Travis and Troy

And I am proud and fortunate to have such fine and able "Brothers", and happily look forward to EVERY chance we get to hunt together!

**edit---Absolutely agree with 'Glasser about the archery, BigPig...anyone who's seen my crappy sheep pictures here on MM knows that they've pretty much all been taken within archery distances...there's definitely a way to do it
 
Lots of good outfitters already mentioned but you can't leave out Chris Harlow when talking about the states best sheep guides. Top notch outfit and have a very impressive library of rams that they follow yearly.
 
>Typical MM dissussion, lol!
>
> The app services are about
>as useful as the #####
>on my male pointers. Garth
>likes to regurgitate the same
>stuff in each issue. Guess
>I will go back and
>reread over the last 5yrs
>and see what they have
>to say. Lord knows its
>the same each season with
>"Garth's top 10 list"!

I don't know Grath personally and have no dog in this fight other than I enjoy hunting desert sheep and following the annual harvest. Last year Huntin Fool ranked unit 22 1st and unit 24B south 2nd. Guess where the top two rams came from? As far as the top four goes they got right judging by the size of the rams harvested.
This year they changed it up a little but the stellar units are still there. You won't draw them if you don't have max points because the tags go in the max pool draw. Lot's of great rams taken throughout the state last year just proves there are crankers in places other than Garth's top picks.
 
Well ASB the two big ones from last year were piggied out from under the good outfitter who found and documented them sheep...

And as far as Huntin Joke goes...I couldn't care less about their top fool picks, but I do know they've been recommending amateur outfitters with a penchant for grossly overjudging rams who are part of their clique over guys with proven track records

bunch of Huntin Tools...them guys, the novice 'experts', and the Piggies
 
Well I am no expert on sheep, but I know fellow MM member azarcher, has hunted or guided in unit 24b the last 4 years and done very well. He took a 177 ram, guided his 75 year old insulin dependent and heart condition dad in taking a 170+ ram, then in 2010 helped the hunter take a 178+ ram, and this last year his hunter took a 180+ ram. So all in all, if you drew a 24b tag I think azarcher would be the person to contact.

Just my 2 cents on the topic.
 
You forgot to mention that Mark was guided by Geoff Moss on his hunt when he took his 177 ram.
 
Travis, I did not mention that because that fact in no way changes the fact that I believe Mark knows the unit and the sheep in it as good, if not better than anyone else. In addition, I know from personal experience he is an excellent guide and has an uncanny ability to spot, field judge, and successfully assist hunters to taking game, no matter their personal limitations, especially sheep in that unit.

The fact is, the year Mark took his Ram, he was already familiar with the unit and sheep in it before even drawing the tag. In addition, Mark personally spent over 30 days scouting that unit before the hunt. He hired Geoff, who at the time he considered to be a good friend, to help Jeff develop his reputation. In fact Mark was very generous in acknowledging Geoff in the story he had published and made the cover of the Huntin Fool.

In any event, as stated, over the last 4 years Mark has spent many many days learning that unit and the sheep that reside there. He has also helped numerous hunters take book Rams, the last one scoring in excess of 180+. Consequently I stand by my opinion that anyone who is lucky enough to draw that tag should give serious consideration to hiring Mark for that hunt.
 
LAST EDITED ON May-08-11 AT 09:48AM (MST)[p]Quite the plug there CaElk...quite a few holes in it too

I don't remember much mention of Geof at all in Mark's story about his FIRST ram...'helping develop' Geof's reputation? Ha!...that's rich

And as far as this latest "180+" you keep mentioning, which I believe was called 181" in the Huntin Tool story...well, the Childers ram went 176 and small change GREEN

Since when is tacking on 5" inches to a rams measurement acceptable? Or rather, when is doing such NOT just plain DEPLORABLE?

Eh now?
 
Guys

Thanks for adding to this thread. It is quite informative as well as entertaining. I really do just enjoy reading about our sheep. It helps keep the hope alive each time the draw comes around.

As for my number of points, I am merely a neophyte. I am coming into this season with a whopping 11 BP points for AZ. Who knows, in another 20 years, I may be able to break through!
I also put in for Rockys each yr in MT as well as NM though (still a one in a million!)

That was part of me posting this thread. Some of these units only give tags into the max draw. I do not not know ALL of those units. Seems as if there are a couple of insanely lucky folks each year that pull a tag with only a handful of points. And that alone is what drives me to keep my fingers crossed all summer each year! One just has to see the hammer that mesquitehunters pulled with a whopping 3 points. It CAN happen! I am just trying to weigh my miniscule odds in my favor just that tiny bit more and put in for a unit that I could pull a Mexicana tag without max pts.

Who knows, it could be any one of our chances.

Great disscussion, guys. I am thoroughly enjoying the banter.

------------------
DRSS
 
GW,
I just read that HF article and Mark does in fact mention Geoff 8-10 times in the article and thanks him for his assistance and knowledge of the sheep in the last paragraph.

Scotty, the draw stats are available from AZGFD and you can identify the units that it takes max points to draw. Doesn't mean you can't have a fantastic hunt in one of the other units.
 
Just a minor point, but there is no unit that "requires" max points to draw. That said, the units with the most people with max points in relationship to the number of tags for the unit are most likely to fill on the bonus point round. It all depends on the luck of the 200+ people with max points. If the 19 or so with the lowest random number put in for "lesser" units, the "prime" unit tags will be left for the remainder of the draw. It's just that the odds favor the best (most popular) units going to those with max points.

This year for instance, both the 24 units had a tag left after the max point draw as did Arivaipa. Last year 37 had a tag left. Altho the "prime" units are tougher, they are not guaranteed to go in the max point round.
 
Sheep and antelope don't require max points for a nonresident, as the top pools are heavily weighted resident (and for sheep, more resident hunts (1 tag units) available to draw from). Most of the max points tags go residents so the 10% cap is not likely to fill.

Odds are you are going to die before drawing a desert ram tag, especially as a nonresident. I'd be happy to just get a tag and the opportunity to scout and hunt hard for the best ram I could find in any unit I could get a tag in:)
 
Greatwestern, I've also read Mark's article on his ram and he mentions Moss throughout it with plenty of plugs to him. So yes, by Mark getting the story of his Ram published, in fact making the cover of The Huntin Fool, and Mark giving Geoff significant mention throughout the story, in my opinion he went out of his way to help Geoff.

If you are suggesting that Mark should have mentioned Geoff on last year's Ram, well that is nonsense. Geoff had nothing to do with that hunt or hunter.

As for the Childress ram, It was initially scored in the field the day is was shot and thought to be a 181 ram. They failed to deduct the difference on one side. It was measured several days later by the Az G&F @ 178 7/8. After the official drying period Safari Club measured it @178 7/8 no deducts currently #50 And B & C measured it @ 177 gross and 175 6/8 because of the deductions.

Even with this said, he has three rams from the unit over 177 and the fourth one still made it in the B&C book. He has also spent countless days scouting and hunting that unit for sheep over the last 4 years. So getting back to the original post, anyone lucky enough to draw that tag should seriously consider talking to Mark about that hunt.
 
Hey, thanks for counting KTM...now was is 8? or 10? or maybe it was somewheres in between? I can't remember...

What I DO remember (the point I think you must've missed) is that the article seemed to fail to recognize Geof in the appropriate context as an employed professional. It was watered down to come across as two 'friends' hunting together...if that were the case, why would the author have hired Geof at all for his services?

Also, in reference to CaElk's remark about Mark trying to 'help develop' Moss's proven reputation as a sheep outfitter, why then did he start his own, directly "competitive", outfitting business immediately following the hunt? Why does he continue to use GM's landscape photographs (uncredited) in support of his articles in Huntin Fool? If he's so good, why does he....nah, I'll save it for now

It was never my initial intention to specifically identify the 'piggyback' outfitters on this thread, as I have no personally invested interest in the matter...but if one or the other of them is going to send in a 'spokesman' advocating them in some BS manner, then I would be happy to inform the good public here if I happen to know otherwise

Now, if y'all want to get out your picks and shovels and dig a little deeper into it...well, I'm your huckleberry ;)

And I'm glad you're enjoying the 'banter' Scotty...nice job man :)
 
Hey, sorry to have cut in above ya like that CaElk...don't know why this thing is set up to do that?

Anyway, them are a lotta scores you're throwin around...I think the point is that NONE of the more 'official' ones are the 180+ you claimed earlier, nor the the PUBLISHED 181 2/8" in the Huntin Tool article

By the way, the hunter's name is CHILDERS, not Childress
 
LAST EDITED ON May-08-11 AT 08:09PM (MST)[p]Elmer, I am a resident. I've lived in Tucson since 2003. Not that it ups my odds by much!!

Also, I accidently said mequitehunter when I meant couesfever in my previous post. He drew w 3bp & smoked a gagger ram. I love it!!

How's bout some pics, boys? Live or dead. If it makes you feel better, leave the unit name/number out.


------------------
DRSS
 
HUH.....I'll be darned to. I never thought I'd be known as cousefever.. However I can see , how cousefever and mesquitehunter could get mixed up though.....















Gun control is a good aim and a steady rest
 
I don't even know how or why I get myself mix-up with all this! I guess it's the lack of hunting until this fall.
 
I would like to take the time to apologize to you all. I do get too wrapped up in my emotions sometimes. I have made a few rash comments about my fellow outfitters and guides. I do feel very passionate about what we do. I do feel that nobody well out work us. I am not the "maddglasser" so many people think I am. My name is Travis Scott.

I know my words have been taken to heart by some of you, and for that a do apologize for the lack of respect. I am sorry I have lost your respect for me.

Travis Scott
 
Well, my respect for you just went up a notch Travis Scott. Not every man will apologize when he feels he has wronged another.

I follow several hunting boards and it seems like on this one nearly every subject that comes up turns into a pissing match. It's too bad because there are many knowledgeable hunters here. I am a non confrontational type so I try to stay out of it although I do have strong opinions about things. I don't need the BS that comes from expressing an opinion or asking a seemingly innocent question.


There are better things to do. The exchanges that come from behind a keyboard are seldom expressed face to face. I've found that mouthy internet tough guys will seldom say the same things to your face. If they did they wouldn't have a face to speak out of.
 
Travis,

Please explain "where's the beef". I didnt think there was any.
As far as pictures your more than welcome to check my blog out for my ram. I guess I shouldnt be able to draw a tag with just 3 points. I should've had to wait 20 plus years like everyone else. Shame on Az game and fish for just giving me that tag. Im sure you wouldnt have minded if they gave you a tag after just three years.

I would have no problem thanking you for any hunters you have sent our way. But I dont know of any that we have booked that came by way of your referral.

Next: as far as "Honesty" goes Greg didnt tell him it was a 160 "ONLY" unit. He told him that the unit statistics was a 160 plus unit. Were not going to lie to a client and promise a 180 ram when the unit has only produced 160"s the last 20 years. Theres a handful of units that could have a sleeper ram in it.

Last: Do you remember the hunter that told HDO he would book with us and wanted to hunt with a bow for the first ten days. Then someone told him he could kill 180 ram. So then he go's out the first day and shoot's a 164 with a rifle the first day. No sweat off our back we booked another hunter that year anyway. I wouldnt have wanted to hunt with him anyway after all the lies he told.

Your more that welcome to email/call me or Greg a call anytime and we can

Scottboy as far as outfitters. Your smart enough to know the good ones. My personal opinion is that there are some outfitters that can go to any unit and find rams or big rams. Then theres some outfitters that wouldnt step foot in some of the tuffer units. Those are the units we like. I could sit here brag about this ram and that ram, But our track record speaks for itself. Scottyboy you have just as much chance to draw a tag as the next guy.

http://www.highdesertoutfitters.blogspot.com/
 
Jason are you refering to the Ryan guy who killed the 164 ram? If so that was the same year Trav was down in 46a. He didn't have anything to do with Ryans ram.

We do get hunters inquiring about sheep hunts in 46a and we always tell them to get ahold of you guy's. Whether or not they book we don't know. And I do agree with you on the promising 180 rams
we don't do that either. That would be foolish.

But anyhow this crap has gone to far...I'm ashamed I even participated with the whole discussion. As a matter of fact this will be the last MM post I'll ever make..





























Gun control is a good aim and a steady rest
 
LAST EDITED ON May-09-11 AT 02:55PM (MST)[p]Jason check your inbox.

Troy was assisting on that ram, I explained it all to you.
Ryan was not promissed a 180 by us!

We did tell Ken there was a few 170+ rams in his unit, maybe our scouting in there before the draws is what led him to us.

Anyhow guy's, I think I am going to give it all a break for now. Take care and happy hunting this fall to you all!
 
It has long been said that you have to have thick skin to post anything on MM. Even the most well intended post will be attacked.

With the exception of the political forum, where all bets are off, I have made a practice of avoiding taking potshots at fellow hunters. In fact I have made many posts where I have expressed my view that "we", as fellow hunters, become our own worst enemies when we attack each other. These attacks, in my opinion, lead to developing fuel to the anti hunting organizations such as PETA and the like.

It was my understanding that the original point of this thread was a request for fellow hunters to post info about sheep units and potential guides. I did not see it as a request for fellow hunters to bad mouth each other. Unfortunatley, as is often the case here, it seems such threads lead to just that happening.

I made my original post to express my personal and honest opinion aobut someone I have the utmost respect for as a person and hunter. Despite receiving underserved and unwarranted attacks, as is my practice I refrained from responding in kind and did not take any potshots at any other hunter, guide or outfitter. I have simply tried to explain the basis of the personal opinion I expressed.I did not make my post as a "spokesman", but was just giving my 2 cents on the topic.

At the end of the day, it is still my hope that "we" fellow hunters can do a better job of getting along. We do share common interests and our sport is already subject to enough attack from the outside anti-hunting groups.
 
Well said Caelkhunter.

I sure hope Mesquitehunter will continue to post in these threads. His post # 17 is spot on. Words any serious Sheep hunter should consider.

As for Scottyboy, wait your turn son. :) I will be going in this draw with 20 bp.
 
Aaah, this stuff is wearisome...

CaElk, it is not personal at all...I think your recommendation would have not been subject to "attack" if it lacked the embellishment from the beginning. Pretty simple, really

I'm done here as well, and will certainly be sure to steer clear of any baited hook threads like this in the future

Cheers'
 
No intional "bait" was used in the thread. It just regressed into the MM abyss as usual.

I just wanted to BS about AZ sheep. That has proven to be a difficult thing to speak of.

Thanks for the input, guys, and good luck with the draw.


------------------
DRSS
 
LAST EDITED ON May-10-11 AT 10:00PM (MST)[p]I guess I'm done after this... CAELK, I find it VERY funny how you point a finger after you Really poured salt. Now you're the saving grace of decency! I am proud of you son! Way to keep the fire burning! A real net Jedi!

As far as sheep hunting goes? I feel as passionate as I ever was. And I will be here for a LONG, LONG time!

How many REAL sheep hunters here, in AZ, know of Jack Walters? Do they know what the name of the town he built was? Do they even know where his memorial is? Or even what his last ram was? Probably not.
BUT, Jack was known as "The Arizona Desert King." Will anyone ever fill his shoes?
No, but a few will try, and maybe one will succeed!

So long guys!
 
Come on guys lets get back to talking sheep. Trav clearly apologized. Lets move on. Trav and Mesquite keep up the passion and the good huntin' you rock. JS
 
Wow guess I was late to the party, since I was one of the hunters being talked about I might as well clear a few things up. When I was lucky enough to draw my sheep tag I did meet with a few different outfitters who I was told were the best in the state, I sat down and talked with them told them my unit and asked what kind of sheep I could expect to shoot and if killing a B&C ram was a possibility, after talking with them they both said that killing a B&C ram was possible but not likley, after thinking it over I figured spending 5k to possibly kill a booner wasn't worth hiring a guide, besides I think I'm a good hunter and had never hired a guide in my life. A couple weeks later I ran into a game and fish officer who I told what tag I had and he said I should give the scott brothers a call because they live in that area and know what kind of sheep are there. After talking to Travis I decided sto book with him, and after two days of scouting I saw four different rams that would go B&C, the hunt now became which B&C i wanted to kill. Travis and Troy nver promised anything other than killing the biggest ram possible, and not only did I due that but I made some good friends out of it too. Trav and Troy, don't let these guys get to you, just keep killing big rams and making clients have the experience ofa lifetime like you have been.
 
LAST EDITED ON May-18-11 AT 06:41PM (MST)[p]I know I said I was done here on MM, but if I can help somebody I will-hopefully my advice will result in a trophy of a lifetime to a lucky tag holder.

What chompy said is a prime example of what I was saying earlier in this thread before the mud slinging started.

BTW I still find myself going through my pics and just starring at chompy's ram. I guess a good name for that ram is "The Big Ugly" He wasn't no prince charming, thats for sure.




















Gun control is a good aim and a steady rest
 
After all the banter, did anyone draw a sheep tag? Not I.

Doug~RR

You are welcome to visit my Photo Gallery here http://dougkoepsel.smugmug.com/
The-Wave-9-15-10edited_210.jpg
 
Travis:

I just gave your number(s) to a friend. Seems that his friend's 16-year-old son drew a tag in the Mohawks. I think you work that area, so I told him to call you.

I heard the guy that drew the Unit 9-10 tag did so with three bonus points. Good luck to him!

Don Martin
AWO
 

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