BUNDY'S SON IN OREGON!!! (LOOK!)

LAST EDITED ON Jan-10-16 AT 03:18AM (MST)[p]Well dude!

A Few more Black Guns showed up but Bundy's told them they don't need any more Help!

Maybe that little Bunch is gonna kick the Worlds Ass All by theirselves?

So dude?

What makes a Post Office any different than the Building they're in?

Like I said!

I'm Glad to see people with enough Guts to stand up to our Government!

Just don't see this bunch doing it the Right way,if there is a Right way?

I'll agree with you on the QUICK/SWIFT Force!

It should'of already been Handled!

Letting things Drag on & on will only make it worse!

But then again,when I said QUICK/SWIFT Force/3 Fly-Overs You argued with me on the IRAQ War several years ago & we ended up Losing 5-6K American Soldiers Lives for a Lost Cause!

Their Dad is Cliven Bundy,"Look at me"!

Couple of Bundys Participated in the Illegal ATV Ride,"Look at Me"!

Guess by now they Think they are above the Law & go to Oregon!

Amazing How a Select Few can do as they F'N Please!

Anyway!

Gonna be a Surrender?

Or A small Gun Fight?

EDIT:http://www.ksl.com/?sid=38073567&ni...oregon-wildlife-refuge-standoff&s_cid=queue-3







"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
One more thing dude?

You notice Weapons of Choice?

Even Our Military Packs them!

If your Buddy woulda got the Black Guns Taken away maybe there wouldn't be a Threat to anyone,Ya Right!






"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
How do you figure they're standing up to the government? what are they going to accomplish? they're just squatters.


The only point you have is maybe we do need black guns. in this case I could set back at 1000 yards and take these clowns out with my McWhorter and 190 gr Bergers one at a time as they try to move around outside their little love shack.

But not all terrorists are dumb enough to take a stand in the open where they rely on services from their enemy for survival.
















Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
This whole thing is turning into a joke. The "occupation" is more like an "occupation-light". Supporters are bringing them pizzas? Women and children are free to come and go as they please? Press conferences? Visitors? Seriously? It's not an "occupation". It's like scout camp.

I'm not saying there should be a confrontation. That's what they want. But shut down the access. Close the roads. No visitation. No children. Kill the power. WHY are we cooperating with these jokers? If they want to take a stand then take one. This is more like taking a seat... in a lounge chair.

The feds have left this poor Sheriff hanging. He should not have to resolve this alone. The occupiers should be arrested and charged with whatever crime is applicable. I'm sick of them being elevated to celebrity status. Sick of them being in the news. Ammon Bundy will end up as one of People magazine's most interesting people. He's a slug.

This is not about the Hammonds. They are being used.


[font color="blue"]I don't make the soup,I just stir it.[/font]
 
I'm not condoning the lawless actions of the Bundy's, the Hammonds, the Laneys or the many public lands ranchers that took matters into their own hands.

What I am saying is these families have had the heavy hand of the government come down on them due to the many suppression activities of our Government and the radical environmental movement to rid these ranchers from the public land.

For one of the families who pretty much done everything right and eventually the Federal Appeals Court ruled in their favor for a 44 million dollar settlement for which they never received any of, is the Wayne Hage family. Wayne and his wife are now dead but their story is absolutely unbelievable how the government turned on them and the long procession of court battles that took place.

Hank, maybe the map wasn't quite right but the whole gist of those articles are how bad the public lands resource users took it in the shorts especially during the Clinton/Babbitt reign of terror. Hank you are a relative newcomer and haven't witnessed the many transgressions that have been taking place here for the last few decades so don't try and tell me what I do or do not know about public lands. I have and am living it right now. I am seeing first hand the results of Babbitt's wolf releases, and it isn't good. I've seen so much the last 40 years here that it makes me absolutely sick to my stomach. I could write a book on it. A couple of locals have written books on the horrific transgressions of the feds here in rural community.

As far as the health of the wildlife 'on the public lands grazing allotments one only needs to go out on many or these lands and see the tremendous amount of water development put in by the joint efforts of the rancher and the Federal agencies. On USFS lands the permittee's have to keep the waters running not only for their cattle but wildlife also. That is part of the bargain for constructing these water developments.

Take unit 9 in Arizona south of the Grand Canyon and units 13 A & B, the Arizona Strip, you can get a feel for how much the deer and elk depend very heavily on man made waters. Hell every water hole has multiple trail cameras and good share of the trophy animals are taken off of these water holes. This is the same in every western state, so don't try and tell me the wildlife has not benefitted for many, many years starting back in the 20's and 30's, almost a hundred years ago with many of the dirt tanks, stock ponds, water catchment headers in many canyons and on and on that were developed and still to this day benefit a more robust and healthy wildlife population on the public land.

Until you walk in the shoes of those whom were and are being displaced and persecuted, take a step back and see what has and is happening to the way our public lands are being managed. The natural resource consumptive users on the public land are and have been under heavy fire for a long time. For many of you here to not recognize this, is amazing, but yet if you realize that the huge amount of money behind the radical groups have to propagandize with, and then look at how my side hasn't done a very good job of educating the general populace, you might understand.
 
Like I've said many times!

They Walked at the Round-Up!

Nobody said SQUAT to them at the ATV Ride!

I said they'd move on to Bigger Things!

And they did!

They're diggin theirselves a Hole this time I think?

I'm with NVB,The FED's gonna do anything or not?

Guess We'd best get dude over there with his Pea Shooter & Pick em off at a 1,000 Yards!

Dudes GUTLESS Leader should step in if he has too,WTF is his Job?

JFP!!!




"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
I posted this in the general forum too.


Lest there be any mistake what all this is about...

I was looking at a webpage that Ammon Bundy created for the "Safety Committee" he formed in Burns OR here:
http://www.hccommitteeofsafety.org/home.html

On the recent correspondence page was this link.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BzA6vDGp4Z8WSnhJTHk1amtFS3NzdXJNRzZCVVJydXIwclJV/view


Read it. Especially the last section entitled "The Debate"


The debate: The question is whether to sell the lands held by the federal government to private ownership or to grant the title to the individual states? There is little doubt that federally held lands have a great amount of value. Whether their value would equal the debt owed is not for this debate, but only if these lands could or should be disposed of by the federal government. To this, the answer is ?absolutely.?

A prudent-minded person would have to conclude that the founders never envisioned the federal government owning large amounts of lands within the states, or they simply would have mentioned it in the Constitution. Since they did not, then they did not. There is no mention of designating wilderness areas, national forests,<1> or grasslands, or any so-called ?beautiful places? to be locked away forever. All the resources of the states were to be for the benefit of the inhabitants of the states or of the state itself.<2>
Every founding document clearly specifies the intent of land holding of the federal government was to be small, limited and for specific purposes only. All other lands were to be in the ownership of the states or of the individual. Moreover, the intent was for the soils to be for productive uses to create wealth for the states and the nation. That, once again, is where we are today.
Sell these lands to bonafide purchaser,<3> pay off our national debt, allow private ownership to makes these lands productive; and this nation will prosper and have a wonderful future.

<1> Federal laws that created national forestlands, monuments, grasslands, etc. have no standing within the intent of the Constitution or any other founding documents.
<2> In the book entitled History of the Oregon Constitution, the lands within Oregon?s boundaries were not intended for federal ownership, but rather for private ownership and productivity.
<3> Bonafide purchasers of grazing lands would be those producers currently with leases and/or qualified for leases under the Taylor Grazing Act of 1934. Purchase price would be based in connection with current leasing rates and on a 30-year amortization.

[font color="blue"]I don't make the soup,I just stir it.[/font]
 
Elkass, that's just window dressing to make it sound more palatable. Make it sound like it's the right thing to do. Its ALL about getting control of the land to keep you off of it.

[font color="blue"]I don't make the soup,I just stir it.[/font]
 
>Elkass, that's just window dressing to
>make it sound more palatable.
>Make it sound like it's
>the right thing to do.
>Its ALL about getting control
>of the land to keep
>you off of it.
>
>[font color="blue"]I don't make the soup,I
>just stir it.[/font]


don't chit ur pants cause i agree, yup
 
Crock of material coming from the south end of a northbound bull.

Note that Ammon's fighting this fight in Oregon because he knows that these half-baked ideas didn't fly in Nevada, where the state constitution specifically ceded the land back to the Federal government.

These two yahoos can't think past 2 or 3 steps in the future... what do you think will happen if someone say.. bought up the Caribou National Forest up here? Do you think it would still be open for hunters, or do you think that what little would be left for hunting would only be accessible after paying a hefty "entry fee" and then another fee should you actually manage to shoot an animal? What would be left of the forest and grasslands as these resources get quickly exploited?

There's not enough land to offset the national debt. All this is mere smoke and mirrors by a family of anti-government mooches who actually have no quibble about taking government handouts, but don't want to follow the rules like everyone else.
 
They're needin supplies already!

On Saturday, Ammon Bundy's mother, Carol Bundy, sent an email to supporters asking them to send her son's group things like sleeping bags, wool socks, cigarettes, toiletries, food, coffee and "French Vanilla Creamer."



"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
>They're needin supplies already!
>
>On Saturday, Ammon Bundy's mother, Carol
>Bundy, sent an email to
>supporters asking them to send
>her son's group things like
>sleeping bags, wool socks, cigarettes,
>toiletries, food, coffee and "French
>Vanilla Creamer."
>
>
>

Where did you sign up for that email Elk? ;-)

"French Vanilla Creamer"... I rest my case. Its and occupation-lite. Very lite.


[font color="blue"]I don't make the soup,I just stir it.[/font]
 
"Don't worry bro, my mom is coming with snacks"

Funny if these guys get collared, the Feds tack on a smoking in a Federal building charge. Hardcore.
 
Don't see toilet paper on that list. Maybe Ammon's "months of planning" was just to occupy the men's room so nobody else could use it.

All this for a bunch of child abusing arsonist poachers who don't even want him there.
 
I thought Ammon said that he and his merry band of miscreants were prepared to stay in place "for years if necessary".

So how are they expecting the supplies to arrive, by Evil Oppressive Gubbmint USPS?

Anyone have an address to send supplies to? I have a few ideas..
 
>I thought Ammon said that he
>and his merry band of
>miscreants were prepared to stay
>in place "for years if
>necessary".
>
>So how are they expecting the
>supplies to arrive, by Evil
>Oppressive Gubbmint USPS?
>
>Anyone have an address to send
>supplies to? I have a
>few ideas..


HELL SAKES!

You can Hand Deliver them!





"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
It's almost funny when you think of all the great revolutions in history.

Like I have said before, fat people do not stage real revolutions. We got it so good, and we cry for more. Embarrassing.
 
Reports of infighting within Ammon's own group, and with a group of armed "Patriots" whom Ammon has told to f-off... and having to have mommy run snacks down to Y'all Queda...

This is turning to be a highly entertaining situation. They should have asked for popcorn, this is better than the latest Star Wars movie.
 
All the Feds have to do is contain the area to prevent re-supply, even by helicopter, and they will want to give up if the feds allow them to leave.
I would allow them to leave to avoid bloodshed and try to identify the main yahoos and later pick them up on a plan sweep with arrest warrants.

RELH
 
This is dudes kind of Stand Off!

They Don't want any Black Guns around!

#####!!!

Looks like a few of the Militia are Breakin dudes Rules!

Maybe We can have a Good Ole Western Type of Shoot-Out!

GOOD GAWD A MIGHTY!!!






"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
NMPaul,

Try and tell that to the many, many oppressed so called "fat " families whom have lost everything or whom have had their lives uprooted.

This all started many years ago and one of the most onerous and disruptive was when the White Sands Missile Range in southern NM came into being. A handful of the more fortunate or smarter ranchers came out of that alright but several of the smaller ranchers were dislodged and never, ever, received fair compensation.

I think that revolution takes on many forms and I don't agree with Ammon Bundy's tactics but fully understand that this just wasn't something that popped into his mind, but something that has been festering for generations. There is a huge faction of western folks whom are pi**ed of at the Government and are trying to figure out how to make things right.

The Cliven Bundy standoff showed the huge over reaction and show of force by the gov't and yet that standoff ended much better than it looked like it was going to. I think that incident emboldened these folks and now the government has to figure out how to snuff out the burning fuse once again.

Fat cats aren't revolutionists I imagine, just the oppressed.
 
>NMPaul,
>
>Try and tell that to the
>many, many oppressed so called
>"fat " families whom have
>lost everything or whom have
>had their lives uprooted.
>
>This all started many years ago
>and one of the most
>onerous and disruptive was when
>the White Sands Missile Range
>in southern NM came into
>being. A handful of the
>more fortunate or smarter ranchers
>came out of that alright
>but several of the smaller
>ranchers were dislodged and never,
>ever, received fair compensation.
>
>I think that revolution takes on
>many forms and I don't
>agree with Ammon Bundy's tactics
>but fully understand that this
>just wasn't something that popped
>into his mind, but something
>that has been festering for
>generations. There is a huge
>faction of western folks whom
>are pi**ed of at the
>Government and are trying to
>figure out how to make
>things right.
>
>The Cliven Bundy standoff showed the
>huge over reaction and show
>of force by the gov't
>and yet that standoff ended
>much better than it looked
>like it was going to.
>I think that incident emboldened
>these folks and now the
>government has to figure out
>how to snuff out the
>burning fuse once again.
>
>Fat cats aren't revolutionists I imagine,
>just the oppressed.



Stoney, members of my family have very extreme views when it comes to governments influence on Ranching. Like I mentioned,.I paid for a subscription to Range for many many years.
Also, I am well aware of how some ranchers got shafted on the WSMR.

Here is the reality of it. Times change for every business. Ranchers have been told they are the "chosen" ones for years through their heritage. Now when they refuse to adopt, they become bitter.

The following is something that I have felt very strongly about for a long time. Kids raised on a ranch need to go out and live in the real world for at least 5-10 years. I think in some cases the military would be perfect. I have seen it so many times, these kids get out of High School and go right to mending fences, working cows and ranch work. Whether is is good or bad, they need to know a little something about he real world. It seems the only thing they pick up is doing drugs and drinking. Been around the Rodeo crowd much??

I have been in Consumer finance, Automotive repair and being a landlord. All of these businesses are heavily regulated and I have seen guys lose their life savings dozens of times. These guys are hard working and things beyond their control have taken them out.

Can you see a bunch of automotive repair guys pulling this?

Ranchers are not special. They need to adopt and deal with changes. Government Bureaucrats are a bunch of mother fukking bullies in some cases. You dont think almost every business deals with it??

The same qualities and traits that ranchers are supposed to be (hard working, integrity, perverseness, tough) is not what they are showing.

They need to work within the system, and if they are not talented enough to do that they need to change occupations. That damn simple. Lots of people would love to clock in when they want, ride horses all day, spend time outdoors etc... but, If you can't work with in the laws and be successful, you will be a $350 a week cowboy with nothing at age 50.

The clock is not going to be turned back just because they want it to.
 
I've read the entire thread the misinformation and the half truth's and the fake history the best factual point IMO is what NMPaul just posted. Very accurate and to the point I see the same as he does in my part of the ranching world.
 
If Bundy owes more than a million in grazing fees, he isn't oppressed, it's a joke, I know some of these same types in Nevada, they ave no idea haw good they have it, flying around in their airplanes looking for cattle. One now deceased member was a person injury lawyer, among other things.

They hate wildlife too. It competes with the amount of cattle they can graze for buck or two a month. I have seen that side more than you know, they don't advertise this that but keeping elk and other wildlife numbers down on public land in a huge part of the agenda.
 
They hate wildlife too. It competes with the amount of cattle they can graze for buck or two a month.

So, it costs about $25 to run a cow for a year?

So, if you had 1000 head of cows it would cost $25,000/year. If you didn't pay grazing fees for 40 years, you would owe $1,000,000.

If I didn't make a house payment for 4 months I would be foreclosed on.
 
Hey Eel?

How long You Figure Me & You could just go Shack up in that Federal Building while We were Huntin Quackers Before they'd Arrest us?

Let alone Pullin a Stand-Off?

There were a couple Bundy Family Members at the ATV Ride & Nobody Said SQUAT to them!

If I woulda Participated, whatta ya figure the chance they'd done nothing to me & who woulda let me borrow their ATV to participate?:D






"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
elkassassin, let's join them. Let's get a D8 and a 950 and do some logging. All we need is for NVB to bring us some Marlboro Lights and some pizza. And some sand paper. :D
 
Your right Stoney,I am a relative newcomer as in NM landowner. Only 6 yrs.
But my 1st trip to visit MY PUBLIC LANDS IN NM Gila was in 1963.

Been coming here ever since.Been watching what goes on regarding Public Lands ever since.NM & the nation.
Been dealing with the Forest Circus BS since then too.

But in Catron county terms you are a newcomer as well,as everyone here knows only the ranchers from 1920's on count.
Oh wait,it's the Spanish Ranchers,so if you weren't living on the Plaza or named Baca,Chavez&Garcia you are new.

I had a FS lease cabin and was on board of NFHA for many years.But times change and I sold out,saw the writing on the wall for me.Tripled assesments,total control of what I could do with my 60 yr old cabin.
Oh, and I saw cabins & lodges torn down for lack of payment in dispute.

If there was not the Gila & Aldo wilderness areas here you would be out of business and folks could drive all through too....or only private giant ranches.
 
>That's the goal. all private
>ownership for the enjoyment of
>the few.


Doesn't matter if it is Eviro wackos or Elite Trophy Ranch wackos.
 
Actually it does matter. We can attempt to bring enviro whacko's in line with common sense laws. If it is sold and turned to trophy ranches then it is gone forever.

Extremes on both ends is dangerous.

Nemont
 
I am on record as being against sale & or transfer of any and all public lands.
Exception might be conservation easements,like kind swaps.

I see giving in an inch to the enviro wackos in CA is working out real good for wildlife & hunters................NOT!
 
Most public lands ranchers are doing things right and are good stewards of the land. They utilize a vast natural resource of grass to produce food for your table. Most of the ranchers that I know here love wildlife and have had to come to share their grazing allotments with more and more elk all the time. In NM many depending on how much private land they control and the benefits it provides to wildlife, reap some pretty good rewards for fixing all the torn down fences and sharing their water developments and salt grounds with the wildlife.

Like I said in my above post I do not agree with the lawless miscreant so called ranchers, but can sympathize with some of them on how they were treated in the past.

Hank, I love my public lands, Forest Service and the Wilderness areas here. Sportsmen have it good, and me as an outfitter has it good, to enjoy and appreciate the opportunities we have on all of this vast public land. What I am saying is I have been trampled on in the past by an abusive Federal Government but always kept my head up and strived to do things right and have prevailed. The wolves are pinching a little more all the time.

I just hate the negativity towards, it seems like, all ranchers by many on this forum. Most of them are good law abiding folks and most of the kids have gotten out and got educated and tried different things out in the world, but the way of life on the ranch and contentment of working in the wide open spaces and having to be smarter and trying new methods to making sure the range is kept in a healthy state, to produce a beneficial product to the rest of the citizens, has brought them back to the ranch. This is something many have not had a chance to experience.

Hell a lot of ranchers have failed as in any other business.

I am fortunate that I saw a brighter future in recreation on the public land than running cattle. A big share of the public lands ranchers on the Gila/Apache National Forest are not big wealthy ranchers as many in this forum seem to think they all are. Most are not in the business for the money but the way of life. Lords knows many of them barely make ends meet.

We have a few hobby ranchers whom have moved in and the Forest Service loves those guys because they basically have them running less cattle and they spend a lot of their own money in improvements on the public lands and on their private property which in turn helps the wildlife.

This forum is basically bashing all ranchers and I do agree that most everyone here has seen some of the bad and the worst and in this forum they think that those few bad apples have spoiled the whole barrel of apples. I just happen to disagree.
There are more good ones out there that are deserving much better from the sportsmen on this forum.

Another old, died and tired notion is the Public Lands Grazing fee issue. This has been blown out of the water by the Range Improvement Task Force of New Mexico State University after an extensive study by four PHD's, and it shows that considering all of the added costs of running on public land the $1.60 AUM is very close to the $10 lease on private land. Go to RITF, NMSU publication #32 I think it is for this study. I've owned three public lands grazing allotments and know first hand what it costs to run on the public domain.
 
Stoney,

You go the same place for lying as you do for stealing. Nobody is bashing all ranchers, you are just butt hurt by those who say the government doesn't owe ranchers any more or less then it owes everyone else in America.

Tell me what private lands grazing goes for $10 an AUM? Here it can go for up to $45 an AUM.

What gets to be tired old saw is that somehow because you get an allotment that the rules of the game are to never change. Name a business in the United States that has not had to deal with changing regulations out of not only Washington DC but their own states legislatures.

We don't owe anyone a lifestyle if they choose to ranch. Either it is viable ranch or it is not. Don't pi$$ down my back and tell me it is raining. I see what happens here to the guys who have allotments. If it sucks so bad to have to deal with the government why do guys fight tooth and nail to keep their grazing allotments? Why not just go make it easier on yourself and lease private land to graze on?

You may wish to see some updated numbers from the NM RITF you keep citing. Go look at the report and they are using data for 1987, suppose anything has changed since 1987?

Straight from the report #32 from NM RITF:
Results
An estimated 15.4 million AUMs were harvested from BLM and USFS lands in the 11 western states during 1990 (table 6). This represents 19% of the total 80.9 million ,AUMs (6.7 million head) required for beef cows in the 11 western states during 1990. Total AUMs harvested from public lands represents abou 4% of the total forage demand by the 1990 U.S. beef cow herd of 33.7
million head.

Perhaps you can explain why 4% of the total forage demanded by all cattle is such a critical link for our nation to bend over and make ranching lifestyles viable?

It has nothing to do with the guys who are doing it right, being good stewards of the land is a job requirement.

Nemont
 
Stoney I would be the last one to lump all ranchers together.
I learned early on what a real steward of the land is from a 5th generation rancher.
I know very few Catron Co. ranchers who could afford one of these big ranches today. Or anyone.

DB Horton got the GW for 50mil plus? HH was sold for 25mil?
And these are just the bigger private places.I've seen 3 mil for 3 sections & 5 sections of BLM/State lease that was landlocked soon after,they think. I know how to get in legal.

Do you seriously think any of us could afford public lands if they were on the block?

Ask Pearce next time you see him what his stance is? Tripp?
Heinrich & Udall? Our county commissioners?
Do you trust Dunn?

Not one GOP or Dem will say because the bags of bribes have been delivered and no press person will either or they would be gone.

This take over of our public lands is criminal and unexceptable.

And not one media person has stuck a mic in a candidates face IN PUBLIC at a crowded county fair and asked their stance.

The GOP could walk into the WH on this stance alone this week,but not ONE candidate is pro public lands.
Or not a blatant liar.MHO

Shrillery would lie through her teeth about it.
Hell she'd sell her granddaughter for a buck.
Bernie is silent too.

Not one has said taking over a US county,community and a US Wildlife refuge by force is criminal. Not one.

I personally think we as sportsmen/outdoors folks are screwed this year and I don't mean the sweet kind.....
 
I run my cattle on my own land these days and it cost me a hell of a lot more than the allotment I used to run on. end of story.

That said I'm 100% in favor of federal grazing as long as it's done properly. what I don't support are deadbeats like Bundy who don't pay or fags like his sons who think they should be running my public lands to their tune. if the taxpayer is going to subsidize federal grazing, and they sure as hell do, the allotment holders should follow the rules and pay their bills. that's all we ask. and if you don't like it GTF off the land and someone will take your place.

This is not a complicated situation.


















Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
>
>
>I run my cattle on my
>own land these days and
>it cost me a hell
>of a lot more than
>the allotment I used to
>run on. end of story.
>
>
>That said I'm 100% in favor
>of federal grazing as long
>as it's done properly.
> what I don't support
>are deadbeats like Bundy who
>don't pay or fags like
>his sons who think they
>should be running my public
>lands to their tune.
>if the taxpayer is going
>to subsidize federal grazing, and
>they sure as hell do,
>the allotment holders should follow
>the rules and pay their
>bills. that's all we
>ask. and if you
>don't like it GTF off
>the land and someone will
>take your place.
>
>This is not a complicated situation.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Stay Thirsty My Friends

If it Ain't Complicated?

Why Hasn't Cliven Paid His Dues?

Why did the Fed's let it drag on for so long?

The Last Cliven Deal was about as Close to a Shoot-Out as you can get!

Add almost another 1 Million Dollar Debt to the Deal just for the Hired Hands that attempted the Round-Up!

Who'd you say Won?

Sue the Hell wasn't the Tax Payers!








"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
Kind of a different subject but.....the Federal Waterfowl Refuge is a blessing and a curse. They obviously provide ideal habitat and resting areas, but they also pull birds from surrounding public hunting areas. In California, the migrating birds hit Tule Lake NWR and then just refuge hop all the way down to Mexico.

It leaves the hunter with two options. Hunt the Refuges, with all the drawings and sweat lines, and all the assigned blinds, etc. or hunt private land/duck clubs.

The only ones who benefit are the bird watchers who use the refuges but don't pay a dime.
 
Hank,

I am a huge supporter of the public lands and don't see the states' movement to get these lands back as ever happening. What many of us would like to see is better access to some of the isolated and or checkerboarded public lands, while respecting private property rights. Private property made this country great, but the great mix of private and public in the west is good also.

I would like to see a slow down in the removal of multiple use public lands into de facto wilderness areas and or off limits or restrictions to the multiple users.

Also a slow down of productive private ranch lands turned back into Federal ownership.

Many times when these ranches are taken out, the wildlife leave and go to the neighboring ranchers where grazing is taking place.

Case in point: The Buenos Aires National Wildlife Refuge in the Altar Valley SW of Tucson AZ where a big ranch was bought out and turned into a refuge primarily for the Masked Hooded Bobwhite. You can go to there to this day and not find a bobwhite or a mule deer or a Coues deer. All you have to do is go out on the neighboring ranches where grazing is taking place and the waters are kept flowing and you will find the wildlife. What a sad refuge situation. It has been and is nothing but a drain on the US taxpayer.

Or you can look at some of the RMEF ranch purchases of prime private ranch lands, turing them back to the US Forest Service or BLM and see what happens most of the time. Without anyone to take care of this land and the waters, the elk pick up and go to the neighboring ranches to take advantage of the fresh grass and kept up waters.

Again I get a definite vibe of several here on MM that have a deep hatred of ranchers. I am just trying to point out that not all ranchers were created equal and Lord knows many of them have not been treated equal or fairly.

I hate the ranchers that do not follow the rule of law and at the same time can understand how some of them might have come to put themselves in the situations they are in.

I think Ammon is going about his crusade wrong and hope that the situation will be resolved peacefully.

What the sportsmen on this site need to really pay attention to, is the four state rally being held today and tomorrow by Wild Earth Guardians calling for wolves in now Colorado and Utah but more in AZ and NM. Their protest rally will be held in Santa Fe tomorrow at the NM GAme Commission meeting where the seats are expected to be filled with these very dedicated people to greatly expand the wolf program and take us hunters out. Hopefully our NM Game Commission will deny the Turner Endangered Species Fund for permit renewal to bring in and raise the Mexican Gray Wolves at Ted's Ladder ranch in SW NM. You boys have much bigger things to worry about than the public lands ranchers in my estimation.
 
I don't hate ranchers. I oppose what this group of people are doing.
I think they are doing more damage to the ranchers cause than helping it.
I think the smart move by ranchers would be to disassosciate themselves with them or even out right oppose them.
 
Add trespassing to the list of charges.

And destruction of private property if he wishes to pursue.

What did Bundy think? The people around the country would be all up in arms and force the government to change its ways? Americans are too lazy to do anything now days except hold their hand out.
 
Stoney,Paul,Eel,& ass....all good and valid points.
Spot on Stoney & Paul!

Well aware of the double edged eco sword and having enemy close is not without a downside.
NMWF is under close scrutiny by me for just such BS and their hatred of NM ranchers in general.

I have seen the Carriza Plains ranch in SLO,CA that was funded with hunters fees for Tule elk& antelope, turn into a no go place that is "World Heritage Site" now.
Area is also home of half breed recovery dog ranches we are getting some of our so called wolves from.Peta people now.
 
Bundy doesn't think, he's a tard that's the problem.

Why should americans change anything? what's wrong with it too much public ground and too many places to hunt? the Malheur is doing what TR intended it do 100 years ago. the BLM and USFS are doing what he intended they do . our big game herds are probably in much better condition than he ever dreamed they would be.

What we have is a fabulous success story. leave it to a bunch of malcontent losers to wish we could phuk it all up.













Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
They didn't slick it up they bought it. and if they offer me enough money I can be out this week.
















Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
"These Bundy's are throwing mud all over the Bundy name. Ted must be rolling over in his grave. And I can only imagine how embarrassed Al and Peggy are.".....lmmfao
 
>"These Bundy's are throwing mud all
>over the Bundy name. Ted
>must be rolling over in
>his grave. And I can
>only imagine how embarrassed Al
>and Peggy are.".....lmmfao

Al can't be related to these JOKERS!

He's a Funny Sumbitch!






"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
Bobcat the only time the government names the price is in eminent domain. this is not at all the case with the refuge.

Eminent domain is like when a Canadian company wants to force a pipe across landowners land and people like you are in favor of it.

I wonder where the Bundy's were when Nebraska ranchers were getting a pipe shoved up their butts by the Canadians ? go figure, they hate their government but are oblivious to a foreign one.
















Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
...and no one...including wealthy land barons like tog can out bid the government in an open market....that is why the government shouldn't be allowed to participate.
 
So Let's understand this?

Bundy's Ain't the Smartest of People,Right NVB?

If the FBI Had Guts!

They coulda went out to the Refuge Building dressed as Militia And Quickly Took the Bundy Bunch down!

Instead they're running around town dressed up like Militia not doing SQUAT & the Fire Chief didn't like it!

JFP!!!




"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
Well I don't know f they're smart or not. They seem to get away with sh!t you and I couldn't.

My question is who gives a damm about this fire marshall? Why is he news-worthy? He has no more credibility than a Wal-Mart greeter.


[font color="blue"]I don't make the soup,I just stir it.[/font]
 
OK Guys!

Let's say We have a similar Situation only for sure with Terrorists!

(And some have labeled this Bunch Terrorists!)

Would Our Government/FBI/Military handle it in the same way they've handled this Bundy Deal?

GEEZUS!

It's like some kinda JOKE!

LaVoy decides to leave,goes to Utah but BY GAWD He Returns!:D

You Guy's Think I could get away with this kinda BS?

JFP!!!


"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
I think the Feds are trying to wait them out and let them decide to leave on their own. If they had arrested Lavoy, word would have gotten back to the Bundy crowd and that would have the effect of making them more determined to stay and try to bargain for a free pass on any federal charges.

Dude the Feds will always prosecute far faster on disturbing artifacts then they will for other violations. Just go on a federal park and dig up one Indian arrowhead and you will find out.

RELH
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-16-16 AT 08:33AM (MST)[p]Time is on Bundy's side. When America realizes we're out of money, all those coke bottle eyeglass wearing BLM and refuge employees will be just a memory. The refuge headquarters will turn to future artifacts.
 
Hardly.

The refuge as the support of 99% of americans for one reason or another. vanilla ISIS can't even get a little Cowtown to support them.

Both the people and sheriff of Harney county are growing frustrated with the feds for not enforcing the law and ending this. I expect there to be more pressure politically to bring action or at the very least make life less enjoyable for the terrorists so they leave.



















Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
Why is anyone angry, frustrated or surprised at how this "terrorist" situation is being handled by this administration? This is the way they've been handling these situations the past seven and a half years!
 
When the budget cuts come, you'll have one BLM employee per State.

I'm more than sure everyone involved at the refuge will be put on a terrorist watch list. Probably get their guns confiscated too.
 
3148ryanbundyatvrideap.jpg





"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-18-16 AT 07:32PM (MST)[p]>
>
>
>
>
>"I'm Living & Dieing with the
>Choices
>I've made!"
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?
>v=N8i5NLyXZdc
>
>

So is the whole community against em like lennie says or are there several hundred on their side like ammon says?
 
Not everything dude says is Gospel!

We got people on Both sides!

Don't know percentage wise who's on who's side?

One of these Days American's are Hopefully gonna stand up against Our Government on Gun Rights!

The Bad part is we are getting more outnumbered by the day!












"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
The Feds screwed up at Waco by failing to listen to the local Sheriff. He advised them to avoid a standoff, just wait until Steve Koresh came into town, that he did on a regular basis, and take him down then. The Feds decided they wanted the press to see how they surrounded a fortified structure and go in kicking doors. Cost was numerous lives lost including federal agents that got greeted with a hail of gunfire.

RELH
 
"The Bad part is we are getting more outnumbered by the day!"

Yea because of A-holes like the Bundys.

I wish the Feds would go in and kill everyone of those freeloading leeches and end all this stupid Bundy BS once and for all.
 
They Claim there are Warrants for a few/some of these Bundy Boys?

WTH?

You can't tell me they don't know where they are?

Or?

Do they do things like they do around here with Warrants?

They put ZERO Effort/Money in to trying to catch anybody with outstanding Warrants!

The only way they catch any of them around here is when they are pulled over on Traffic Violations!

WAFJ!!!




"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
I was in Burns yesterday picking up a saddle. you have to look hard to find any support for the terrorists at the refuge.

It's costing the county a lot of money and there is a sense it could go on a long time . they say there are armed freaks running around town though I didn't see any. the community is 90% against them but it's causing hard feelings between folks who have been friends for years.

All in all it's a very negative event for Harney county and no good will come of it. it's time the feds take action and show the world we don't tolerate terrorism . not even from bearded white Mormons with drug store cowboy hats and fluffy ear muffs.
















Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>I was in Burns yesterday picking
>up a saddle. you
>have to look hard to
>find any support for the
>terrorists at the refuge.
>
> It's costing the county a
>lot of money and there
>is a sense it could
>go on a long time
>. they say there
>are armed freaks running
>around town though I didn't
>see any. the community
>is 90% against them but
>it's causing hard feelings between
>folks who have been friends
>for years.
>
>All in all it's a very
>negative event for Harney county
>and no good will come
>of it. it's time
>the feds take action
>and show the world we
>don't tolerate terrorism . not
>even from bearded
>white Mormons with drug store
>cowboy hats and fluffy ear
>muffs.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Stay Thirsty My Friends

Bet the local businesses are busy and it is hard to book a motel. Got to look on the bright side.
 
The local businesses are kicking butt. not that there is much business in Burns anyway but this is bigger than deer season.

Looks like dipchit is getting some heat from the FBI, he said he wouldn't talk to them but now he is. the governor finally got of her lezbo butt and told the feds she's tired of them picking their nose she wants action. and she's sending the feds the bill for this.

A good article more people need to read.


http://www.usnews.com/opinion/econo...deral-handouts-ranchers-already-enjoy?ref=yfp


















Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
Who cares what that douche has to say. the Harney county sheriff is the only sheriff involved and he wants these deadbeats out of his county.


This has nothing to do with the Hammonds. never did. it's about an anti government militia looking for an excuse to stir chit up and avoid paying their bills.















Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
>Who cares what that douche has
>to say. the Harney
>county sheriff is the only
>sheriff involved and he wants
>these deadbeats out of his
>county.
>
>
>This has nothing to do with
>the Hammonds. never did. it's
>about an anti government militia
> looking for an excuse
>to stir chit up and
>avoid paying their bills.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Stay Thirsty My Friends

So dude?

Just cuzz Our Government Says/Does something,You Think They're Always 110% Right?








"I'm Living & Dieing with the Choices
I've made!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=N8i5NLyXZdc
 
>>Who cares what that douche has
>>to say. the Harney
>>county sheriff is the only
>>sheriff involved and he wants
>>these deadbeats out of his
>>county.
>>
>>
>>This has nothing to do with
>>the Hammonds. never did. it's
>>about an anti government militia
>> looking for an excuse
>>to stir chit up and
>>avoid paying their bills.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Stay Thirsty My Friends
>
>So dude?
>
>Just cuzz Our Government Says/Does something,You
>Think They're Always 110% Right?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>"I'm Living & Dieing with the
>Choices
>I've made!"
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?
>v=N8i5NLyXZdc
>
>

Follow the money elkassassin.
 
The law says their wrong. are we going to question the law then?

You sound just like Tyrone. he doesn't trust or believe in the law so he fights with them too.

Just because someone is white and wears a drug store hat doesn't make them any better than Tyrone .
















Stay Thirsty My Friends
 

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