Cannot get a good group

[RenoOffRoad]

Gun was accurate at 50 yards. I put a peep site on so I could be comfortable at 100 yards for next weeks muley hunt.

I cannot get a good group at 100 yards. I can get a couple shots within a 1" group, then a couple or few end up flying all over, up to a foot away.

Weird thing is, one shot will be on target, next will be a flyer, next will be in the group. No consistancy, and my gun is stablized so I know its not the shooter.

I tried the spit patch and dry patch between shots. I am shooting 250gr Hornady with 100 grains of Pyrodex Pellets.

Changed over to 777 Pyrodex Pellets recently, and this might be the issue but I am not sure yet.

Any suggestions would be great. I have one more trip to the range before I head out on my backcountry hunt and now I'm worried.

Jason

 

[Bambistew]

How much powder are you shooting?
What kind of primers?

Did you try any other bullets/powder charge/primer combination?

 

[RenoOffRoad]

2, 50 grain pellets = 100 grains of pyrodex.

I tried a different bullet (knights) with no success. Might have been because they were hollow points, not sure.

209 Primers.

I have not tried more or less powder charge. I am not sure if I should go less for muley at a max 100 yards? I can only use 209 primers, unless I convert, but no time for that now.

 

[grinch]

i have heard that using a .45 cal bullet with a black sabot will sometimes cause eratic patterns.it was explained to me that the sabot is to thin and will peel back.i use 240 gr. .44 xtp and 95 gr. 777 and have no problems.

 

[mevertsen]

I was trying to shoot the HDY SST 250's as well, and getting the same results as you. I had some 295 grain Lead Powerbelt bullets in the box that my other Muzzleloader did not like. I tried them, and I was all of a sudden getting good groups. I went from all over the place to very predictable shooting. I would go down and get some 245 to 348 grain Powerbelts and try them with 80-90 grains of powder. Do not go with too much powder or they will come apart. I use Goex FFG in my Traditions Inline.

Later,

Marcial

 

[APBT]

Yeah a 245gr Powerbelt with 80gr goex will be perfect.


www.GandersPowerbeltForu.Powerguild.net

 

[Frontier]

You may be on to something with the triple 7 pellets. Triple 7 pellets has been known to have issues in the burn consistency, which may be related to shelf life of the powder. If you're not getting a consistant powder burn due to defective or old pellets that probably is your problem. Usually when I get a flyer I found it has been related to not having a good seal, or blow by but rarely happens using sabots unless you're using the mangnum charge which you are not. Here are some suggestions.

1. Go back to using pyrodex pellets. If that doesn't work try number two.
2. Try powerbelts, if they work it says you may not be getting a good seal, so try some different sabots, or stay with the powerbelts.
3.If number two doesn't work try decreasing the charge, if no luck try increasing the charge.
4. Maybe try some triple 7 loose powder, if you want to use triple 7?

Hope some of those ideas may help. Good luck.

 

[Bambistew]

There are probably 5-6 diffrent kinds of 209 primers. Are you using standard primers which are generaly too hot or ones designed for muzzies?

 

[HornyMan]

I have no problems with the SST 250's. Try using loose powder instead of pellets. I've never shot well with them.

My set up is this

777 FFG, Hndy SST 250, 777 209 primers, I shoot 5 shots touching at 50 yards and at 150 yards a 2.5" to 3" group.

 

[DallanC]

777 was hands down the single worst powder I've ever tried. I shot half a bottle trying to wring accuracy out of it before giving up, went back to pyro RS and immediately got a cloverleave group.

I assume you are shooting sabots, the first step in tracking down random flyers is to walk down range 10 yards or so and picking up the spent sabots. Inspect them closely, are the petals torn at all? Tears around the base cup? These are the key and generally with accuracy like you are describing, you will find torn sabots.

If the sabots look good enough to re-use, you can look to other causes for your accuracy woes. Dont re-use the sabots though.

Torn sabots are usually attributed to 1. Fouled barrel, 2. incorrect sabot to bullet diameter matching, 3. Too heavy of a powder charge, 4. A rough barrel (use valve lapping compound to polish), 5. Poor sabot construction / materials

Most Frontstuffers dont realize, you can vary your burn rate in a muzzleloader just as you can in centerfire rifles by changing powder types. Grain size has different burn rates! FF burns slower than FFF. I have had good luck with Pyrodex P loads to tame down an erratic shooting barrel. Be careful though in that switching from FF to FFF, or RS to P requires a 10% reduction in powder amount to get the same chamber pressure.


-DallanC

 

[RenoOffRoad]

Thanks everyone for you great advise.

I have actually got the stuff I need to try different options.

Got a box of the original pyrodex pellets (not 777).
Also got a bottle of loose powder to try.
Picking up some powerbelts today.
I will mess iwth the charge amounts.
I have not picked up the casing to see if it tore but I definately will.

My front sight was a little loose. Screw was completley tight, but it still wiggled, so I put a drop of super glue on the end without the screw, and lock tighted everything else.

Hope today's rounds are better

 

[APBT]

If you bought 245's do not go over your 80gr pyrodex/BP charge.

www.GandersPowerbeltForu.Powerguild.net

 

[HornyMan]

Its funny how different results are.

Pyrodex shoots bad as does Jim Shockeys gold, 777 works best for me.


Speaking of which, I have a bottle of Jim's gold that Id be willing to trade for a bottle of 777.

 

[arrowone4me]

Nothing said about Blackhorn 209. Well worth the money IMO.
Switched last week. 3/4" groups at 100 yds / 90 gr / Shockwave 250's. Best ever with my Omega. Was sold on Shockey Gold but not since the last bench session.

 

[300WBYMAG]

Another Vote for the Balckhorn 209, I get excellent groups out of my 50 Cal. Knight Extreme using 245gr Barnes Spit-Fire MZ bullets and a 100gr volume charge. No more 777 or the Shockey stuff for me.

 

[alp75]

One more for the bh209.

Excellent groups and no swabbing...even after dozens of shots. Have a t/c triumph and barnes 245 spitfires as well. 1.5" groups at 100 yds.

 

[RobK]

>One more for the bh209.
>
>Excellent groups and no swabbing...even after
>dozens of shots. Have
>a t/c triumph and barnes
>245 spitfires as well.
>1.5" groups at 100 yds.
>

DITTO !!!!!!!!!!

AS long as i can keep getting it i will never use anything else , made muzzle loader shooting/hunting even more fun and less hassle .