UTAH DWR NEEDS A PSYCH EVALUATION

AspenAdventures · Nov 21, 2012

Are they crazy? Stupid? Or Greedy?

There were people EVERYWHERE this year! I hunt an area 17A in Utah and pack in about 5 miles. As you know the country is rugged and most people don't bother to get up there. I usually see some people but this year it was absolutely CRAZY!

I hunt a high alpine bowl and since 1994 the most strangers I have had hunt the same area opening morning is 3. This year it was 17!!!! The bucks were all shot....ALL of them in the basin!

My buddy and his son hunt another high basin across the canyon. The most strangers we have ever seen in there opening morning since 1994 has been 4. This year it was 12!! It was a war zone with shots being fired in all directions. All but two bucks we saw were shot!!!! Two left!

On the pass between the two basins we usually see NO ONE, 0, zip, okay...maybe one guy hunts there on opening day...since 1994. This year....7 guys!

Can you imagine!?! I am five miles packed into the top of a 11,000 foot mountain and I have 36 other hunters to contend with!

It was the same situation on our muzzleloader hunts too but at the time I thought it was a fluke....nope the rifle hunt was just as bad.

Utah gave out 7,500 tags for the unit!!!!!!!!!
That is almost 10% of the tags for the ENTIRE STATE!!??!!
That explains why EVERYONE in our party drew a tag.

YOU FOOLS! YOU HAVE DECIMATED AND ANIHILATED AN ENTIRE AREA!

Thanks for the tag you friggin bozos......

On another note I hunted western Wyoming with a buddy this year. We saw 4 point bucks every day...we took two nice 4 point bucks....and there was very little pressure. Had the same experience in Nevada and Colorado over the last few years.

Not sure if I evern want to waste my time this next year in Utah.

"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." - Plato

jarheadhunter · Nov 21, 2012

You should feel so lucky you have had the mountain to yourself since 1994. What you described is what I hunt every year.

400bull · Nov 21, 2012

This year was a learning year. I know that some of the units I applied for this year I did so because I thought that they would be easier units to draw not because I knew the units better. Over the next couple of years I think that the pressure on some of the more popular units will start to spread out to some of the more not so popular units. Before we start thinking the sky is falling lets give the new system a year or two to see how it plays out.

400bull

Rambo · Nov 21, 2012

Wyoming is raising tag prices. Wouldn't it be great if Wyoming required all non residents to have a guide? Utah is the best place in the world to hunt you can get a general tag almost every other year. Lol Glad I moved.

"Relax and squeeze the trigger, They can't
get away

", quoted from the best hunter I
know

Zeke · Nov 21, 2012

I'm going to go back to road-hunting.
The road-hunters got tired of getting bash by the back-country crowd and all headed to the hills. That's why you're seeing all the people. LOL

Ok, I'm back to reality:
I think that in the unit you referenced the tag numbers were way too high but it's also a mind-set by the hunters. With the switch to smaller units some hunters thought that if they just worked a little harder that they would kill a monster muley. I see more people putting in more effort to get a big buck.

I hope the tags will eventually be spread around a little better. We'll soon figure out which units are better than others.

If your area is so difficult to get into why do you think everyone was there? Usually when additional hunters are in an area they don't get into the tougher place...... unless they already knew about it and have been hunting it other years.

Zeke

gznokes · Nov 21, 2012

Aspen, I just looked at a map. 7500 tags in that area seems like a lot to me too.

I'm somewhat familiar with that area and I'm not entirely suprised you had more company in the back country. That really isn't a road hunting unit in my opinion (Mt Timp Wilderness area, Maple mountain, Provo Peak etc, etc).

Were you experiencing this kind of pressure on the opener or all through out the season? I find a lot of people are willing to get out and hike hard on the opener. After that it usually simmers down.

stillhunterman · Nov 21, 2012

Sorry you had a crowded experience Aspen. This was the first year of option 2, and it will take a bit to work out the bugs if it is going to succeed in managing hunters. Hopefully it won't take too long.

www.unitedwildlifecooperative.org

piper · Nov 22, 2012

LAST EDITED ON Nov-22-12 AT 09:14AM (MST)[p]your upset because you went 5 miles in and there were crowds? welcome to the modern world, where have you been?
Come on up to the Salt River range in Wyoming, virtually all the Alpine basins are 5 miles away and full of gung ho mule deer hunters.

Im over 50 and was born 20 years too late, at least when it comes to good mule deer hunting.

Rambo · Nov 22, 2012

>LAST EDITED ON Nov-22-12
>AT 09:14?AM (MST)
>
>your upset because you went 5
>miles in and there were
>crowds? welcome to the
>modern world, where have you
>been?
>Come on up to the Salt
>River range in Wyoming,
>virtually all the Alpine basins
>are 5 miles away and
>full of gung ho mule
>deer hunters.
>
>Im over 50 and was born
>20 years too late, at
>least when it comes to
>good mule deer hunting.

Every Basin, now that's comical

piper, have you hunted every basin?

"Relax and squeeze the trigger, They can't
get away

", quoted from the best hunter I
know

ktg · Nov 22, 2012

> All but
>two bucks we saw were
>shot!!!! Two left!

(sarcasm on) All the armchair biologist on MM and the 'real' biologist with the DWR know that 2 buck will breed that whole unit. Don't worry. What we really need is more does. Bring on the pumpkin patch! (sarcasm off)

elkfromabove · Nov 22, 2012

>
>> All but
>>two bucks we saw were
>>shot!!!! Two left!
>
>(sarcasm on) All the armchair biologist
>on MM and the 'real'
>biologist with the DWR know
>that 2 buck will breed
>that whole unit. Don't
>worry. What we really
>need is more does. Bring
>on the pumpkin patch! (sarcasm
>off)

But isn't this what we wanted when we got Option #2, lots of bucks to shoot? Looks like we got them already! Don't worry, it'll all get straightened out next year, or the next, or the next, or the next......

AspenAdventures · Nov 24, 2012

Piper, you are right, there are a lot of people in the Salt River range. But that is where I hunted this year and took a nice 4. My buddy shot an even bigger buck that has mass, width, character, long tines, etc. I hunted hard in Wyoming and saw too many bucks to count. Shot at the widest buck of my life and missed.....bottom line. It was a great hunt...and yes there was pressure.

But

Utah was CRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZY with people. I have never even dreamt it would get close to that amount of pressure. It never seemed possible to me that so many guys would go to one spot.

"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." - Plato

AspenAdventures · Nov 24, 2012

400bull
Over the
>next couple of years I
>think that the pressure on
>some of the more popular
>units will start to spread
>out to some of the
>more not so popular units.
>Before we start thinking the
>sky is falling lets give
>the new system a year
>or two to see how
>it plays out.
>
>400bull

No, you are wrong. They gave out 7500 tags in this unit (10% of all the tags in the state). There will not be less pressure until they cut tags for the unit. Can you imagine 7500 hunters hitting one little unit! It was insane! The DWR screwed up big time on the Wasatch this year. This unit will not recover for at least 5 years if they cut down to 4000 tags. And never if they keep selling tags at these numbers.

"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." - Plato

AspenAdventures · Nov 24, 2012

>
>Ok, I'm back to reality:
>I think that in the unit
>you referenced the tag numbers
>were way too high but
>it's also a mind-set by
>the hunters. With the switch
>to smaller units some hunters
>thought that if they just
>worked a little harder that
>they would kill a monster
>muley. I see more people
>putting in more effort to
>get a big buck.
>
>I hope the tags will eventually
>be spread around a little
>better. We'll soon figure out
>which units are better than
>others.
>
>If your area is so difficult
>to get into why do
>you think everyone was there?
>Usually when additional hunters are
>in an area they don't
>get into the tougher place......
>unless they already knew about
>it and have been hunting
>it other years.
>
>Zeke

The parking lot of 4 wheelers was still down in the canyon and was bigger than ever so by going off what I saw there were more 4 wheelers and road hunters as well.

I agree that people are trying harder but many of the guys I saw were up there for their first time. It was funny to see the frustration on their faces as well.

They scouted all summer looking at those bucks thinking they would be alone for the hunt. Then the sun comes up and all you can see is orange vests EVERYWHERE! They were as disappointed as I was.

"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." - Plato

AspenAdventures · Nov 24, 2012

>Aspen, I just looked at a
>map. 7500 tags in that
>area seems like a lot
>to me too.
>
>I'm somewhat familiar with that area
>and I'm not entirely suprised
>you had more company in
>the back country. That really
>isn't a road hunting unit
>in my opinion (Mt Timp
>Wilderness area, Maple mountain, Provo
>Peak etc, etc).
>
>Were you experiencing this kind of
>pressure on the opener or
>all through out the season?
>I find a lot of
>people are willing to get
>out and hike hard on
>the opener. After that it
>usually simmers down.

You are right. The pressure did go away and we shot some bucks. The same was true in Wyoming and Colorado. Opening day is a bit of a mess then we go back and pick up the scraps. The thing is.....we only saw a few bucks after the opener....and we shot them.

So what is next year going to be like....same pressure? And I have never seen this area cleaned out of bucks like it was this year.

"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." - Plato

AspenAdventures · Nov 24, 2012

(sarcasm on as well) The two bucks that got away were 2 points and one was a 24" heavy two. Can't wait to see his offspring!

"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." - Plato

Avsman · Nov 24, 2012

LAST EDITED ON Nov-24-12 AT 01:12PM (MST)[p]

"WHEN INJUSTICE BECOMES LAW" "REVOLUTION
BECOMES DUTY" unknown

Windage and elevation pilgrim windage and elevation

swbuckmaster · Nov 26, 2012

It was a friggen joke. I also saw all the bucks on the hill anialiated.

Also the wasatch extended should have been seperate than the general rifle area.

There should not have been that many tags given out. That general rifle area will be recoveding for years to come.

who farted?

AspenAdventures · Nov 27, 2012

Okay, here is the deal. We need to show up to the RAC in droves and tell them what we think.

So, April is the meeting about tag numbers. We need to make sure we go as a group and tell them about what we saw. I will continue to remind everyone when and where the meeting is so we can all go.

If I go they will listen and forget.
If you go the will listen and forget.
If 50 of us go the will listen and change.

See ya there.

"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." - Plato

piper · Nov 27, 2012

I hope you guys go through with it, show up and make yourself heard.
In addition, you might think about sending some well written letters to the newspapers.