Roy
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You keep me grounded in reality!
I swear - some of the crap that my friends in Academia say absolutely kill me sometimes! (And you guys thought HomerJ was annoying only posting every once in a while! I have to put up with this crap everyday! BTW - quick update on him: he has been married, divorced, and remarried to the same gal since then, with a 3 month trip to southern Mexico to live in the jungle and learn a native Mayan dialect in between.)
So today, a friend of mine who is a Spanish prof. at a U in the Midwest posts this on Facebook:
"After the release of the Penn State Freeh report, we should also question the toxic influence of sports (especially football) in our universities. Institutions of higher education should not cower to the demands of a coach. With how much money is now involved, it seems to me that the only way to fix the system is to destroy it. Universities exist to advance learning, not to provide space for a tailgating buzz before ESPN College Game Day."
So, of course, being the lover of College football that I am I had to reply, and I came up with a doozy:
"Universities exist to advance learning, not to provide space for a tailgating buzz before ESPN College Game Day.
Or do they? Really.
I know we like to think that U.S. universities are purely purposed as ?institutions of higher education? and that they serve a higher and more altruistic purpose than providing entertainment on Saturday afternoons, but is that really the reality we are living in? It may have been when universities were first created but is that where we are now?
The fact is that it is not. Education is an industry in this country and collegiate athletics are its number one product. There is not a single institution in the U.S. that would not whole-heartedly roll out the red carpet for the ESPN Game Day crew with open arms. The returns are too great and too immediate. The recognition and publicity are priceless and are the reason many research programs and opportunities even exist. Athletics create a culture that allows for universities to become a virtual fabric of society in a way that no other company or institution can.
The major universities in this country have not attained their statuses solely by providing quality education, but have arguably been enabled to do so chiefly because of their athletics programs, and most pointedly football. They have created their own priority, and justifiably so. We are way too far along in this evolution to go back to the point where they are appendages to the university system rather than an integral and vibrant part of it.
I whole-heartedly agree with you that Joe Paterno had way too much power at Penn State, and that the institution allowed him to do so. The power he had is sickening and disgusting and you are right, no coach should ever be able to wield that much power, but you also have to recognize that that power was given to him in that specific situation over a 40 year period. Most coaches now are lucky to have a tenure of 3-5 years. I don't think you will ever see anything of that caliber happen again, not to that magnitude.
But I have to strongly disagree with the characterization you make that collegiate sports, and football in particular, have a purely toxic influence. I recognize that yes, there are cases, like Penn State, where the tail wags the dog, but I would argue that they are by far the exception and not the rule. Most football programs are vital to the success of the university and provide positive contributions on a consistent basis. The problems get magnified, over-publicized, and criticized while these other positive contributions go unnoticed and ignored.
Having worked with numerous student athletes, and having been one myself (a non-scholarship walk-on Offensive Guard/Center at Southern Utah University ? an FCS or DI-AA football program), at SUU, the University of Utah, the University of Texas at Austin, and Huston-Tillotson University, I can honestly say that I have personally seen a multitude more of positive contributions than I have ever seen of problems and negative influences to any given University.
The great majority of student-athletes I have worked with are students first, and many of them would not have the same opportunity they have if not for the athletics programs they are involved in.
For that matter, neither would the majority of the rest of the students there. I don't think you can honestly look at the history of the universities in the U.S. and conclude that they would still not be the elitist institutions for the rich only that they were in the centuries prior to the 20th century without college athletics playing a significant role in that history. Can you really negate their influence and say that we would be where we are now without them?
So, yes, there is something rotten in the state of Denmark, or at least in State College, but the solution is not to burn down the whole country. Cut off the appropriate heads, yes ? which has been done (and many more will roll in State College and at other institutions too), but you can't bite the hand that feeds you. So next time you cash your paycheck, drive by that big empty stadium and tip your cap, you may not have that check in your hand if it weren't filled up those 7 Saturdays in the fall.
To which he replied back:
So, I should thank an overpaid head football coach and his overpaid staff for the fact that my job?as an academic and as a teacher?exists? [Parenthetically: at my institution, Ball State University, the football staff alone earns over one million dollars collectively, which would roughly cover the salaries of seventeen associate professors. While those funds could be used to pay an entire department, that staff coaches a team almost never wins their generally poorly attended games].
And, even though they don't have big time football and basketball, don't universities, some of which are fully funded by the state and tuition-free, not exist in other countries in the world? Don't some people see the university as a public good rather than a team they like to watch?
Surely some reflection will lead you to question exactly how distorted our understanding of institutions of higher learning has become in the United States due at least in part to our tribalist affective connections to sports. I'd also recommend you look into the economics of sports in higher education. Quite simply, it's a losing game for almost every single institution in the US.
TRIBALIST AFFECTIVE CONNECTIONS TO SPORTS!!
Oh man. This guy is so far out of touch with reality! He is locked up in his own little ivory tower and cannot see the forest because he is too busy hugging the freaking trees.
You guys keep me sane. Thanks.
HOOK 'EM!
_______________________________________
Since I am frequently asked about my religion on this site and others, I have created a profile that explains my beliefs. If you are interested in finding out more about my faith, please visit the link below:
http://mormon.org/me/6RNQ/
I swear - some of the crap that my friends in Academia say absolutely kill me sometimes! (And you guys thought HomerJ was annoying only posting every once in a while! I have to put up with this crap everyday! BTW - quick update on him: he has been married, divorced, and remarried to the same gal since then, with a 3 month trip to southern Mexico to live in the jungle and learn a native Mayan dialect in between.)
So today, a friend of mine who is a Spanish prof. at a U in the Midwest posts this on Facebook:
"After the release of the Penn State Freeh report, we should also question the toxic influence of sports (especially football) in our universities. Institutions of higher education should not cower to the demands of a coach. With how much money is now involved, it seems to me that the only way to fix the system is to destroy it. Universities exist to advance learning, not to provide space for a tailgating buzz before ESPN College Game Day."
So, of course, being the lover of College football that I am I had to reply, and I came up with a doozy:
"Universities exist to advance learning, not to provide space for a tailgating buzz before ESPN College Game Day.
Or do they? Really.
I know we like to think that U.S. universities are purely purposed as ?institutions of higher education? and that they serve a higher and more altruistic purpose than providing entertainment on Saturday afternoons, but is that really the reality we are living in? It may have been when universities were first created but is that where we are now?
The fact is that it is not. Education is an industry in this country and collegiate athletics are its number one product. There is not a single institution in the U.S. that would not whole-heartedly roll out the red carpet for the ESPN Game Day crew with open arms. The returns are too great and too immediate. The recognition and publicity are priceless and are the reason many research programs and opportunities even exist. Athletics create a culture that allows for universities to become a virtual fabric of society in a way that no other company or institution can.
The major universities in this country have not attained their statuses solely by providing quality education, but have arguably been enabled to do so chiefly because of their athletics programs, and most pointedly football. They have created their own priority, and justifiably so. We are way too far along in this evolution to go back to the point where they are appendages to the university system rather than an integral and vibrant part of it.
I whole-heartedly agree with you that Joe Paterno had way too much power at Penn State, and that the institution allowed him to do so. The power he had is sickening and disgusting and you are right, no coach should ever be able to wield that much power, but you also have to recognize that that power was given to him in that specific situation over a 40 year period. Most coaches now are lucky to have a tenure of 3-5 years. I don't think you will ever see anything of that caliber happen again, not to that magnitude.
But I have to strongly disagree with the characterization you make that collegiate sports, and football in particular, have a purely toxic influence. I recognize that yes, there are cases, like Penn State, where the tail wags the dog, but I would argue that they are by far the exception and not the rule. Most football programs are vital to the success of the university and provide positive contributions on a consistent basis. The problems get magnified, over-publicized, and criticized while these other positive contributions go unnoticed and ignored.
Having worked with numerous student athletes, and having been one myself (a non-scholarship walk-on Offensive Guard/Center at Southern Utah University ? an FCS or DI-AA football program), at SUU, the University of Utah, the University of Texas at Austin, and Huston-Tillotson University, I can honestly say that I have personally seen a multitude more of positive contributions than I have ever seen of problems and negative influences to any given University.
The great majority of student-athletes I have worked with are students first, and many of them would not have the same opportunity they have if not for the athletics programs they are involved in.
For that matter, neither would the majority of the rest of the students there. I don't think you can honestly look at the history of the universities in the U.S. and conclude that they would still not be the elitist institutions for the rich only that they were in the centuries prior to the 20th century without college athletics playing a significant role in that history. Can you really negate their influence and say that we would be where we are now without them?
So, yes, there is something rotten in the state of Denmark, or at least in State College, but the solution is not to burn down the whole country. Cut off the appropriate heads, yes ? which has been done (and many more will roll in State College and at other institutions too), but you can't bite the hand that feeds you. So next time you cash your paycheck, drive by that big empty stadium and tip your cap, you may not have that check in your hand if it weren't filled up those 7 Saturdays in the fall.
To which he replied back:
So, I should thank an overpaid head football coach and his overpaid staff for the fact that my job?as an academic and as a teacher?exists? [Parenthetically: at my institution, Ball State University, the football staff alone earns over one million dollars collectively, which would roughly cover the salaries of seventeen associate professors. While those funds could be used to pay an entire department, that staff coaches a team almost never wins their generally poorly attended games].
And, even though they don't have big time football and basketball, don't universities, some of which are fully funded by the state and tuition-free, not exist in other countries in the world? Don't some people see the university as a public good rather than a team they like to watch?
Surely some reflection will lead you to question exactly how distorted our understanding of institutions of higher learning has become in the United States due at least in part to our tribalist affective connections to sports. I'd also recommend you look into the economics of sports in higher education. Quite simply, it's a losing game for almost every single institution in the US.
TRIBALIST AFFECTIVE CONNECTIONS TO SPORTS!!
Oh man. This guy is so far out of touch with reality! He is locked up in his own little ivory tower and cannot see the forest because he is too busy hugging the freaking trees.
You guys keep me sane. Thanks.
HOOK 'EM!
_______________________________________
Since I am frequently asked about my religion on this site and others, I have created a profile that explains my beliefs. If you are interested in finding out more about my faith, please visit the link below:
http://mormon.org/me/6RNQ/
