Word is getting out on SFW

russ_outdoors

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I am participating on a couple of websites with current threads on SFW. One of the web masters recently posted that one particular SFW thread had over 100,000 unique visits! So word is getting out and folks are educating themselves, which IMHO will be key to solving this issue. SFW is so deeply embedded and connected to the Wildlife Board, UT DWR and governor's office, that it will take a significant public outcry to change things. Please continue to make your voices heard!
 
S.F.W. is making a major push on Idaho this year too. First wanting to auction off land owner tags, witch the F&G commission vetoed,and one last effort before the legislature adjourns in two weeks to have a "private company" run the controlled hunt draws. The wild life Blood suckers in Utah are wanting to do the same thing here!!
 
Perhaps M73 or Birdman can answer this question - is SFW Idaho affiliated with SFW Utah? I know that Birdman took issue with people connecting the dots between SFW Utah and SFW Arizona a few years ago.

-Hawkeye-
 
I haven't found any S.F.W. organizations per say,but since Idaho is so close to the main "TEEPEE", every thing that the special interests groups have been trying to push through is identical to what has been explained about S.F.W. Utah. The saying if it looks like a DUCK, comes to mind!
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-16-16 AT 01:21PM (MST)[p]The main SFW website used to have all of the state Chapters listed under their affiliates and Idaho along with Wyoming were listed there. Now all it shows is their outfitter ownership along with the Full Curl Society and Hunts For The Brave. A paragraph from the main page still mentions both of those states. If they aren't affiliates, why would they tout what they are doing there in those states on the website? Here is the paragraph:

SFW members have raised millions of dollars and volunteered tens of thousands of hours and equipment that is having very real affects on the ground. In Utah, Idaho and Wyoming more than 1,000,000 acres of public land has already been rehabilitated with SFW funds and influence.
 
There is SFW in Utah as the main state. There has been startups in other states and I have no idea what is going on there. Those states now run their own programs. Those states that have been affiliated with Utah are. Idaho, Wyoming, New Mexico, Colorado, Montana and alaska... those are the only states that have had chapters outside of utah. There has been some requests from states in the mid west.
 
Thanks for clarifying. So why does SFW claim this on its website: "SFW members have raised millions of dollars and volunteered tens of thousands of hours and equipment that is having very real affects on the ground. In Utah, Idaho and Wyoming more than 1,000,000 acres of public land has already been rehabilitated with SFW funds and influence."

See http://sfw.net/about/

-Hawkeye-
 
I guess because they have. I am affiliated with utah. I am not a paid employee and do not deal with other states. As you said to me, why don't you call and ask.
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-16-16 AT 03:38PM (MST)[p]>Perhaps M73 or Birdman can answer
>this question - is SFW
>Idaho affiliated with SFW Utah?
> I know that Birdman
>took issue with people connecting
>the dots between SFW Utah
>and SFW Arizona a few
>years ago.
>
>-Hawkeye-

During the 2012 Arizona fiasco, I read the HB2072 legislation and it was virtually word for word same as the Utah bill used to steal the 200 public tags. They had to use the same attorney or something. Also several original AZSFW board members had direct ties to the Utah bunch, and their names appeared on bill sponsor Jerry Weier's campaign contribution list.

I need to do some research on exactly what happened. AZF&G created a "sportsmen's constituent group" specifically intended to watchdog for any further special interest groups from exploiting public big game tags. I'm sure the wildlife board knew full well AZ was a prime target if not #1 on the list to pillage. I think the board's actions laid down the law there.


*****************************************************
Greenhorns educate yourselves. Wherever SFW goes, scandals and corruption follow. Write your legislators:

http://kutv.com/news/local/allegations-of-corruption-surround-utah-hungtin-and-conservation-expo

https://www.cascwild.org/don-peay-the-man-who-would-be-king-baron/

http://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs...ares-north-american-hunting-model-“socialism”

http://www.standard.net/Recreation/...16-Western-Hunting-and-Conservation-Expo.html

http://www.mtbullypulpit.org/2012/06/pox-on-fox.html

http://www.thewildlifenews.com/2013...on-essentially-buy-utah-division-of-wildlife/

http://westernvaluesproject.org/tax...hunting-energy-industry-over-hunters-anglers/

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/02/u...-but-hunters-cry-foul.html?smid=pl-share&_r=2

http://www.themudflats.net/archives/25891
 
I'm not finding any S.F.W. head lined group in Idaho. They are trying to come in as unnamed and use their money to persuade certain politicians!
 
Birdhuntr, Is that a fact or a wild guess. SFW is in Idaho. There is no under the table. Idaho has been looking at Utah for several years with what they have accomplished.
 
>Birdhuntr, Is that a fact
>or a wild guess.
>SFW is in Idaho.
>There is no under the
>table. Idaho has been
>looking at Utah for several
>years with what they have
>accomplished.


SFW Idaho has been active for several years. 7 or 8 years ago SFW Idaho offered to build a new IDF&G building in Idaho Falls at SFW's expense. They've been trying to buy their way into IDF&G ever since.

http://www.sfwidaho.org/
 
So they are trying to come in unnamed? If they offered to build the Idaho fish and game a new building, which I dought, why would they come in unnamed?
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-17-16 AT 09:16AM (MST)[p]>So they are trying to come
>in unnamed? If
>they offered to build the
>Idaho fish and game a
>new building, which I dought,
>why would they come in
>unnamed?


Just one guy theorized that Birdman and another corrected him and put up their website link. The website is essentially inactive since the last activities they show being held is way back in 2012 and 2013. Question for you Birdman---If all the state Chapters operate separately with their own programs, why are they required to send big chunks of money back to the Utah headquarters? You do know that's a part of being affiliated with UTSFW don't you? Are you aware that the Cody, WY Chapter disaffiliated and went out on their own several years ago because they kept asking for transparency within the organization and where the money they were sending back to Utah was being spent? The answer they got from headquarters on down through to the WYSFW Executive Director, Bob Wharff, was to not hold their breath because they wouldn't be getting that answer any time soon! Pretty good when your own members ask the same questions we're asking out here on these MM threads and are told to go pound sand! These, Sir, are facts right from the Chapter that wrote UTSFW their resignation letter and said letter has been out on the net, so please don't come back and tell me I don't know what I'm talking about like is generally the case. PS: My best buddy belonged to that Chapter and he's told me the members worked their butts off just like it sounds a lot of the blue collar guys are doing in Utah and that's what they got back from Utah in return for their efforts!
 
Top. If Idaho sfw is no longer in business, why are they going under the table. I know the big horn chapter left but my understanding was the money went to bob. Though I don't know that much about how all works I do know that when money in the past went to Utah sfw if was for supplies. My guess now is each state is independent. Jon Larsen is president of Utah sfw. As far as I know that is it.
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-17-16 AT 09:36AM (MST)[p]Guy Eastman gives SFW a mention in this blog on public lands. Bolded emphasis was added by me to direct your attention to that mention.

Eastman


This whole mess with people crying out for federal public land to be transferred to the states has me really scratching my head. I will never be one who supports the vast bureaucracy that we currently have at the federal level because I am a firm believer that government should be as small as possible. However, I really think this is one issue where we should be careful what we ask for or we might just get it.

Some state government agencies and practices aren't great for the average middle class hunter who uses public land regularly. State land agencies have far different mandates than what the Forest Service and the BLM have. The mandates that the state agencies operate under for State Trust Land are completely different and designed to prop up state budgets. Those mandates are not for public access and in many cases public access is the low man on the totem pole because there is negligible revenue to be made from public access on these small parcels. With those mandates in mind how much would access or conservation change when the state manages the lands currently under federal management?
In Wyoming our state economy lives and dies by mineral extraction in one form or another. In tough budget years like what we are currently facing it quickly turns into an all hands on deck effort to stop the bleeding. Budget cuts will be made and it won't take long for the recently transferred land to look like a giant slush fund that can pay for immediate state government needs with land sales.
Think I'm crazy? It is already happening in parts of the West. In Oregon the Elliott State Park is on the selling block because the state needs money to fund schooling. This isn't a small parcel, this is 84,000 acres that is currently available for the public to use. The state wants it in writing that the buyer would maintain public access but only if there is a buyer who is able to provide that. The park has generated revenue for local schools through logging but in recent years it hasn't been the cash cow it once was.

The next problem that we have to contend with is a perception that state government agencies are not corruptible because they answer to locals. For instance, the Utah DWR has come under a lot of scrutiny in recent months about the allotment of 200 of the best big game tags the state has to offer for the Western Hunting and Conservation Expo. Based on the reports it sounds like this will be a long fought battle and hunters in the state of Utah aren't likely to give up on their case. No one has been tried for a crime but the real question is how long and how much money will it take to sort this one out? Could land sale deals lead to questionable practices?
Many people from outside of the West have asked how does this really affect me? Well, Wyoming already has rules in place that limit non-residents from hunting in Wilderness Areas. This goes back to mandates, every state will be mandated with their own sets of rules and regulations to benefit the people of their own state. I will let your mind wander on the types of regulations that might come about with land transfer.

So I ask you this, would we simply be trading one set of problems for an even worse set of problems with the state?s managing or selling the land? Leave a comment below with your thoughts on these very complex issues. I'll put in my two cents and respond as warranted.
 
Interesting read. True there has been no illegal doings the battle goes on. The contract has been signed for 5 more years with the clause all money will go on the ground which is what the fight is over. If there is a rule in the contract broken, then there should be consequences but until that time I don't know what the fight is.
Mr Eastman is in titled to his opinion though. It is his opinion.
 
>Top. If Idaho sfw is
>no longer in business, why
>are they going under the
>table. I know the
>big horn chapter left but
>my understanding was the money
>went to bob. Though
>I don't know that much
>about how all works I
>do know that when money
>in the past went to
>Utah sfw if was for
>supplies. My guess now
>is each state is independent.
> Jon Larsen is president
>of Utah sfw.
>As far as I know
>that is it.

Who said they were no longer in business? I said the WEBSITE appears INACTIVE since there have been no updates since 2012 and 2013. I doubt if they didn't exist any longer that there would be a website up and running that costs money now would there? For an SFW guy that always seems to say he's "in the know", it sure doesn't sound like you know much of what went on or are keeping mum! How do you know money sent in from other states to Utah in the past went to supplies? How can you even conjecture that the money I'm talking about went to Bob? Is it because the Don said so and he would never tell a fib? The only fact in your post is that Jon Larson is the UTSFW President and we all knew that! In closing, for you to be someone "in the know", but are now "guessing" that each state is independent leaves me with a big question mark of what you do really know about what is going on throughout your organization!
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-17-16 AT 10:14AM (MST)[p]>Interesting read. True there has
>been no illegal doings the
>battle goes on. The
>contract has been signed for
>5 more years with the
>clause all money will go
>on the ground which is
>what the fight is over.
> If there is a
>rule in the contract broken,
>then there should be consequences
>but until that time I
>don't know what the fight
>is.
> Mr Eastman is
>in titled to his opinion
>though. It is his
>opinion.

His opinion is essentially what thousands of other opinions are on transfer of Federal lands and this whole mess called UTSFW! Guy also did not say that there has been nothing illegal going on when he referred to the 200 Expo tags. He stated what we already know and that is that it is going to take some time to get answers to the big mess. Just maybe some heads will roll down the line at a later date in trying to correct the mess that the DWR has created along with the way SFW has it's tentacles into everything including the Governor! I'm not going to hold my breath for you to give the correct answer to the question Hawkeye asked since you already spoke to it and it was 100% incorrect. That one sentence in the contract is so open ended that all that money could go to one person and nothing would be violated. You see Birdman, "personnel" that it can be used for certainly isn't "going back on the ground"!
 
SFW members were at the F&G meeting I attended last month.
The focus of the meeting was to get input on whether to add
more auction/Governor tags in the state of Idaho.

SFW has been trying to get their hands on the best tags in Idaho for years, they have been shut down so far but they just keep coming back trying different angles each time.

I'll say this for em, they don't give up easy, they must stand to make some serious money off of these tags the way they just keep coming after them.
 
Will top, when I say I don't know, I don't know. I do know things have changed. I also know in the past. I was involved a while back in packaging up supplies for different states. That's how I know. Now days I don't. I guess I compare you to don. You are both as honest as each other. Now I know don. I am just assuming you are honest. I know I should never assume. With Jon Larson now things are different. He does things his way.
I belong to Utah sfw not Idaho. I can speculate just like you do or is is OK for you to speculate and not me. You always want to go back to the past. Always easy to speculate on hindsight. Now we are going in a new direction. Top, you are good at trying to bully. Keep it up Mr know it all.
 
Runamuk, yes they can make serious money off of tags that they can use to improve habitat and wildlife in idaho.
 
>SFW members were at the F&G
>meeting I attended last month.
>
>The focus of the meeting was
>to get input on whether
>to add
>more auction/Governor tags in the state
>of Idaho.
>
>SFW has been trying to get
>their hands on the best
>tags in Idaho for years,
>they have been shut down
>so far but they just
>keep coming back trying different
>angles each time.
>
>I'll say this for em, they
>don't give up easy, they
>must stand to make some
>serious money off of these
>tags the way they just
>keep coming after them.


You only have to look to Utah to see why they want them! They are sort of like a case of herpes, LOL!
 
Hawk, I believe page 4 seems to some up what the money is used for. The interesting part is it can be leveraged with grants to increase the money. That is exactly what will happen as it has in the past. Sorry you don't believe.
 
>Will top, when I say
>I don't know, I don't
>know. I do know
>things have changed. I
>also know in the past.
> I was involved a
>while back in packaging up
>supplies for different states.
>That's how I know.
>Now days I don't.
>I guess I compare you
>to don. You are
>both as honest as each
>other. Now I know
>don. I am just assuming
>you are honest. I know
>I should never assume.
>With Jon Larson now things
>are different. He does
>things his way.
> I belong
>to Utah sfw not Idaho.
>I can speculate just like
>you do or is is
>OK for you to speculate
>and not me. You
>always want to go back
>to the past. Always
>easy to speculate on hindsight.
> Now we are going
>in a new direction.
>Top, you are good
>at trying to bully.
>Keep it up Mr know
>it all.


So stating facts, unlike what you post, is now bullying, LOL! Yep; you're going in a new direction alright, but what it is nobody has figured out yet. If you didn't know any facts of what is being discussed right now, then why did you even bother to post? Do me one big favor please. Don't put me in the same sentence or compare me in any way to that sleezebag of a leader you mentioned! PS: I think the Cody Chapter boys were talking about a little bit more money not going where it should have than what a box or two of supplies that you may have packaged up for them cost, LOL!
 
Top. You are right. You are not knowledgeable about the position. Prove to me what happened in bighorn basin. Not hearsay from you buddy.
By the way, you don't even come close to comparing with don. He is head and shoulders above you in both honestly and character.
Yes top your attitude you have, shall I say your better than everyone's attitude, makes your statement sound bullying. Now I realize no one on mm, or no one in Utah even comes close to topgun. He is the best. Knows it all. Makes statements how dishonest SFW is but of course no proof. But then if topgun says it, it has to be fact. Just ask him
 
Birdman-

You stated in Post #17 that the new contract includes a clause providing that "all money will go on the ground" and that is "what the fight is over." I don't see any contract clause on page 4 that states that all of the Expo Tag proceeds will be used for actual conservation and as you said "go on the ground." What specific provision were you referencing: http://wildlife.utah.gov/pdf/expo_permit_contract.pdf Point me to a specific clause on page 4.

The reason that I am asking is because it appears that the DWR and SFW included the general, undefined reference to "conservation initiatives" in Clause 7.c in an effort to allow the groups to make the claim that "100% of the money is being used for conservation" when in reality it is being spent on whatever they want (payroll, overhead, lobbying, etc.). I have asked for clarification from SFW but have heard nothing.

Can you help us understand what, if anything, has changed under the terms of the new contract? If SFW has made some real, new committment with regard to the Expo Tag revenues, then please let us know. Thanks.

-Hawkeye-
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-17-16 AT 01:00PM (MST)[p]>Top. You are right. You
>are not knowledgeable about the
>position. Prove to me
>what happened in bighorn basin.
> Not hearsay from you
>buddy.
> By the way,
>you don't even come close
>to comparing with don.
>He is head and shoulders
>above you in both honestly
>and character.
> Yes top your attitude
>you have, shall I say
>your better than everyone's attitude,
>makes your statement sound bullying.
> Now I realize
>no one on mm, or
>no one in Utah even
>comes close to topgun.
>He is the best.
>Knows it all. Makes
>statements how dishonest SFW is
>but of course no proof.
> But then if topgun
>says it, it has to
>be fact. Just ask
>him

Man, your IQ must be single digit because the more you post the dumber you prove yourself! I may not be as PC in my delivery as Hawkeye and some others, but I haven't made a single post anywhere that isn't backed up by the same facts that he posts. I DID NOT mention any "hearsay" anywhere in my post regarding the Cody Chapter. I stated my buddy was in that Chapter and that the guys worked their butts off like a lot of the members in Utah apparently are. He thought highly of the organization until what I mentioned happened in Cody and then he started reading everything being brought out on various websites, including this one, about the negative stuff involving the UTSFW. The proof is in this letter the Cody Chapter Board sent to their SFW members. You were correct that their suspicions were that the money was going to pay the Ex Dir., so I apologize for that error on my part because nobody really knows where that money went! Sound familiar? What was even worse, if you read that letter, is that their bylaws were changed and they were then required to send 100% of their fundraiser money profits back to the State Chapter with no assurance that their 30% would ever be returned for their use. Again, sound familiar?

5732sfw.jpg
 
I'm sure that SFW has Idaho's best interest in mind. The habitat that they are most interested in improving lies in the landowners and their own bank accounts.
 
Just Curious, I know people have gotten responses from governors Herbert's office in regards to the Expo tags.

Has anybody reached out to any of the other Governor campaigns to find out where they may stand, being it is an election year?
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-17-16 AT 03:50PM (MST)[p]>Runamuk, yes they can make
>serious money off of tags
>that they can use to
>improve habitat and wildlife in
>idaho.


Idaho had a record harvest of almost 69,000 combined whitetail and mule deer in 2015,and almost a record harvest of elk in 2014, [the 2015 numbers are not out yet.] Then if we are doing so poorly,why do we need a group from Utah telling us that we need more habitat,when in fact it's under the guise of big money!! This will be a fight every year to keep this special interests group from gaining control of our tags. Call it what you want,but the majority of Idaho hunters are on to this tag theft!!!
 
Birdman-

Will you also please point out the specific clause in the new contract that requires that "all money will go on the ground"? I don't think it exists.

See Post #29 above.

-Hawkeye-
 
Brdhunter, The money was sent to Bob and not salt lake. The money raised in a state stays in that state.
I believe top said the money went to salt lake. All money raised in that state stays in that state.
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-17-16 AT 09:30PM (MST)[p]>Brdhunter, The money was sent
>to Bob and not salt
>lake. The money raised
>in a state stays in
>that state.
> I believe top said
>the money went to salt
>lake. All money raised in
>that state stays in that
>state.

Please quit with your "know it all" responses! The people in the Cody, Wyoming Chapter don't know where the money went Birdman. The money was sent to the main headquarters and their conjecture is that it was going to pay Bob. However, the letter specifically states they parted company with SFW because they could not get any answers as to where the money was actually going once it left their Chapter. If they couldn't get any answers and money in the past had been going to UTSFW like you stated that was allegedly for "supplies", there is no way in haydes that you have any fricking idea that all or a part did or didn't go to the UTSFW UNLESS you keep the books. Do you keep the books for UTSFW or is this just one of those things that "you know to be true" and that shouldn't be questioned?
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-18-16 AT 07:54AM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Mar-18-16 AT 07:53?AM (MST)

S.F.W. must not have raised any money since 2012,because it appears they have not been in Idaho since then according to their closed down web page. You still didn't answer my question, why does Idaho need this out of state group under the guise of improving habitat, when our deer and elk harvest numbers,are at all time highs!!
 
Oh they're here alright!!
They are doing a banquet in Twin falls this month and they are running TV comrecials also, looks like a full on attack
trying to gain support.

I'm focused on speading the word about SFW and the circus that follows em around, most folks were clueless about them.. but not near as many now! :)



With all the crap going on in Idaho with tag grabs and land grabs, all we really need to do is send SFW packin' and that would solve most of the problems.
 
>Do you think those commercials are
>paid for by sfw Id?
> Me neither.


They could be. They must be doing something with the money they make at their banquets. They can only give so much to the political campaigns of the state legislators they are buying and they haven't really been involved in any actual wildlife enhancing projects.
 
Perhaps the advertising and seed money in surrounding states is what SFW and the DWR meant by "wildlife conservation initiatives" in the latest contract?

We hereby commit that the remaining 70% of the Expo Tag monies will be spent on "policies, programs, projects and personnel that support wildlife conservation initiatives in Utah." Section 7.c of Expo Tag Contract. Now they just need to figure our how best to get around the "in Utah" requirement.

-Hawkeye-
 

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