Was Claude Dallas Forced to Shoot?

Wiszard

Wiszard

Long Time Member
Messages
10,955
"Claude Dallas was charged with two counts of first degree murder, but the trial quickly shifted focus to the alleged aggressiveness of one of the victims, Officer Pogue. The issue did sway the jury to convict Dallas of lesser charges of voluntary manslaughter and of using a firearm in the commission of a crime. At least one juror cited concern that Dallas was acting in self-defense when he shot Pogue."

Any thoughts? :)

Steve
"Get that corn out of my face"
 
oh god.....not again


JB
497fc2397b939f19.jpg
 
As with any criminal trail the facts can be distorted and twisted , and and a good defense attorney can make a saint look like the devil . Combined with the fact the victim officer / officers in this case were not in the court to defend their actions , the defense was allowed to paint a bad picture of the wardens .

Hard to say why or how the POS , Dallas could say he feared for his life . Based on his past experience he should have known the offense of poaching would be a little jail time or a ticket . His deffense of worrying about his pack animal being left in camp doesn't make much sense to me .

Bad deal for every body involved . Its real easy to arm chair quarterback these things after the fact , and with out all the facts .
 
Geezus Steve, you been takin "stir it up lessons" from JB?

The guy shot a game warden, then popped him in the head to make sure he was dead. I pretty much think he went too far...twice...but hey, that's just me.

Pass the popcorn, as they say. This could get good!
 
I'm just not too sure he's as guilty as everyone seems to think....it was two against one.....

Steve
"Get that corn out of my face"
 
And that matters how? Say I'm speeding down the highway, drunk. An officer gives chase. Calls for back up and another officer shows up. They pull me over. I'm guilty and I know it. I'm pretty sure I know what the penalty is. Cops start acting like d!cks. Am I justified in shooting both officers because I'm out numbered?

Claude Dallas was nothing more than a legend in his own mind. Self proclaimed mountain man. Can live off the land in the Nevada Idaho wilderness and never be found, evading the authorities forever. Until they catch him at a Seven Eleven in California.
 
Relax, relax. You shouldn't be speeding in the first place, NVB....especially drunk. You can get in big, BIG trouble for that.

Steve
"I bet you wish your nose was a d!ck so you could use it to f*ck butts" -MacGruber
 
OH GAWD!

Not again!

God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!
 
Claude Dallas was a murderous thug who respected nothing be it the life of an leo or your rights to the animals he poached. Short of donation of internal organs he is worthless. Those who glamorize his life are misguided fools who would patronize the likes of child rapist Warren Jeffs ect.
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Was Officer Elms unarmed when he was shot?

Compromise, hell! ... If freedom is right and tyranny is wrong, why should those who believe in freedom treat it as if it were a roll of bologna to be bartered a slice at a time?
 
Like said above, a good defense attorney, stale or weak evidence, limited witnesses to the event, and the victum not being there to offer testimony, can sway a jury when you talk about a "beyond reasonable doubt" burden of proof. It worked for O.J. Simpson anyway.
 
wow um I dunno about this one but me thinks Claude was wrong murder is murder
 
LAST EDITED ON Nov-30-10 AT 07:54PM (MST)[p]Any bets that one day he will be picked up again? I would bet a felon in possession of a firearm. A 10 year federal sentence would seem like a fitting end to a poacher and murderer.
 
Claude Dallas will never be convicted of anything agian. The man, a criminal...yes, but is a genius. He's probably one of the smartest men I've ever read about. The way he utilized natures offspring as a tool was extremely impressive.

Steve
"I bet you wish your nose was a d!ck so you could use it to f*ck butts" -MacGruber
 
Wiz,

I generally keep quiet on this stuff but your admiration for a convicted murderer is beyond me. Stop and think for a minute, if your family member, friend or acquaitance was a LE officer and was murdered would it be acceptable for any reason. Really, just because there were two officers present. Would you like your son, daughter, brother killed just because he was the 2nd officer at the scene. Claude Dallas maybe your idol, but they say Hitler was a genius also. Have you ever seen someone that has been murdered in person? No one, and I mean no one deserves that. Maybe if the US was filled with genius' like Claude Dallas this would be a great place to live, give me a break.

Rich
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-05-10 AT 11:59AM (MST)[p]Claude Dallas is no different than you or me. The man was pushed beyond his bounds and he reacted. Was he wrong or was he right will always be the question. However the choice he made to shoot both wardens behind the ear was his mistake. The man claim he acted in self defense and was charged and processed through our justice system. He has made restitution and paid his dues to society. I do not condone what he did, I was not there, therefore it is not for me to judge. Long live Claude Dallas and the justice system of the Untited States.
 
jackrussel: said "Claude Dallas is no different than you or me. The man was pushed beyond his bounds and he reacted? I am not sure about you but most of the MM people are not poachers. Are you? I know you have posted about killing every cat you see regardless of the season but I won't label you as a poacher. That is for a judge and jury. Don?t try and compare me with Dallas. The facts are that he was poaching (not disputed). Law enforcement was there to deal with his poaching (not disputed). They were trying to arrest him and he killed the conservation officers (not disputed). He was afraid of being held accountable for his actions (pushed beyond his bounds) and killed two men. Not disputed. Dallas is not the only person that lived through that. The witness said Dallas killed the two officers and he stated he could have taken them earlier when they first ran into them on the bluff. Dallas didn't kill the officers until they discovered the bobcat hides. Not sure what account you are looking at but those are the facts that were presented at his trial. Why the hatred for law enforcement? Not just this post but a lot of yours have shown you don't like police. You also have tried to stick up for poachers in the past. Why? It is a fact the Dallas was caught poaching. If you see law enforcement trying to stop poaching as pushing a man beyond his bounds than so be it. Do you feel the same for Gacy? Following your logic that was simply a "man pushed beyond his bounds and he reacted".

Claude Dallas did go through the judicial system. He is out and a free man. That is not in dispute but to say in one breath you don't condone what he did, and then in the next say ?long live Claude Dallas.? Your logic is as laughable as you.

I am sure you will come back and say that Dallas feared for his live bla bla bla...He went through the judicial system bla bla bla...then end with ?long live Claude Dallas.? I don't need to hear it. You are entitled to your opinion, and I am entitled to mine. Your post's show you as a hypocrite. JMO
 
He was a poacher and a thief who committed 2 murders when he got caught. He is no hero. Some of you guys need to read a book about this guy's escapades. He is a criminal, not a genius.
 
utah400, you need to get a couple things straight. When I say that Claude is just like you and me, I mean that he is the same as in flesh and blood. That is where it ends as it does with any man. He made a mistake as I am sure you have made a mistake somewhere along the road in your life. Granted the consequences of his actions were probably greater in his case than in yours. I am not against law enforcement in any shape or form. There are both good and bad law agents across the board. Claude Dallas was convicted of a very hanus act, and for that he paid a price. Was the price as high as the 2 officers paid? Of course not, but he did pay the price that our judicial system found to be fair. Whether I like there decision or not I do respect it. I do not stand for poaching or support anyone who does. No one else was there on that fateful day when Elm and Pouge lost their lives, I learned a long time ago that life is not always fair. Long live Claude Dallas just as much as long live any man.
 
Howdy jackrussel!

God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!
 
All I need to know is how long is that sicko gonna be locked up, and when will he be allowed back in society, and hope all concerned or near are informed of it.
He's killed LEO's rather than be held accountable for anything.
My condolences to the families and friends of the Deceased.
What a shame.

Rump
 
What Rump?

He's Back!

God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!
 
I think they turned him loose in 2005?

God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!
 
Jim Stevens was also there when Dallas killed the two officers. Stevens testified that Dallas said he could have killed the two conservation officers on the rim but also stated he would have been killed. Stevens also testified that Elms was unarmed when he was shot. Stevens also testified that Dallas killed the two officers to avoid jail. Plain and simple, Dallas is a killer. If you do not stand for poaching or support anyone that does why does you profile list your name as Claude Dallas? You are glorifying a poacher. Again, were Bundy and Gacy just get pushed beyond their bounds? Did the guy in that shot the two cops on the traffic stop and then kill two SWAT cops get pushed beyond his bound?s (I believe it was in California or Washington)? Dallas is a POS and in every post about Dallas you support him. He was a known and notorious poacher!
 
Sorry, B-BOP--
I'm a little out-of-date here, being isolationist and all..
What's the poop on the critter, if'n you don't mind?

Rump
 
Well!

In 2005 he got out on Parole!

I think he got out a few years early?

I don't know all the details!

Maybe NevadaBadger & jackrussel will chime in?

God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!
 
My last post was not to be taken seriously. Most of the MMers here know that this post was simply to stir the pot....and it worked. I strongly believe that emotions need to be expressed as a cleansing tool. Have you ever been extrememly upset and put done something that you would not do if you were in your right mind? The issue of the deceased doesn't come into play here as I really doubt either of the two slain officers have family or friends on MM. I have dealt with death on a first hand basis and, yet disturbing, it is a part of lifes cycle. Claude Dallas, to me, believed to be on his own level. He wanted to be left alone. Was that his right? Absolutely...if he lived his life by the laws of the United States laws that were in place at that time. He broke the law and was confronted. What he did was uncalled for and he will go to hell for his actions, IMO. Seriously, if the man gets arrested at an LA County 7-11, you think he could be construed as a genius? I wish you all would have just yelled out "Bullshit" and I'd have tapped! My apologies to whom ever has too thin a skin to handle the exercise I laid before them.

Steve
"I bet you wish your nose was a d!ck so you could use it to f*ck butts" -MacGruber
 
"Howdy jackrussel!

God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!"

LMFAO!! Talk about stirin the pot!! :)

~Z~
 
Just about everyone on here know my position about Claude Dallas and his admirers, so I will not go there.

There is a few members that have expressed their concern where wardens in the field have not been as "public relations minded" as they would like them to be when being encountered.

The actions of killers like Claude Dallas and others have done a lot to force this change where a warden has to be on constant guard when encountering armed hunters in the field. That warden does not know if he will be met with resistance or just some friendly hunter.

You can bet that wardens are being taught measures to take in the field in order to protect thems selfs. Just one small example to demostrate what I am saying.

You and several friends are incountered by a warden in the field or even your camp. While he is talking to one of the hunters, another hunter decides to walk over to a position that may place him to the side or rear of the warden so he can hear what is being said.

All of a sudden the warden gives a command for that person to stop and get back to his original position. Now you have a pissed off hunter that feels the warden did not have to demostrate his authority in such a rude way. Yet all that warden is doing is protecting himself from a possible surprise attack that may take his life.

Just about any law abiding citizen will obey that command given in a stern voice. A person that is intent on criminal behavior will still try to push the issue and try to argue while moving to flank the warden. If this happens, the warden now knows it is time to go from condition yellow to red and take what steps is needed to protect himself.

You can bet they are being trained to not allow any hunter to enter their tent to get their license without it being done in a way they can be observed to prevent them from grabbing a firearm that may be in that tent.

Poachers and other criminals like Claude Dallas has done alot to force changes in the field that may irritate the average law abiding hunter who feels he is being treated like a criminal for no good reason. Yes, in a way they are being treated like a possible criminal, until that warden or officer is satisfied he is dealing with a law abiding honest person and not a criminal that is bent on harming him.

You can give thanks to all the Claude Dallas's and other killers for making it that way.

RELH
 
Claude Dallas is a man. Man makes mistakes, man pays for his mistakes. Did the punishment fit the crime? Not my call to make. The ultimate call will be made when Mr. Dallas meets his creator, not on some web site full of monday morning quarterbacks. Long live Claude Dallas and long live the constitution of the united states of america.
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-12-10 AT 04:17PM (MST)[p]A couple of interesting observations regarding that post. First, of all the possible candidates, you choose to champion as your hero a convicted felon. Secondly, you choose to properly insert capitol letters typing the name of said convicted felon, while later failing to insert capitol letters as you besmirch the United States of America with that felonious rat. Birds of a feather flock together I suppose. It speaks volumes that your 'Robin Hood' of sorts is a poacher, and by the least of all accounts, unlawfully contributed to the deaths of two people, convicted by a jury of his peers.

Claude Dallas has no respect for anyone and certainly no respect for the United States of America, the laws of the land, or the Constitution.

P.S. You seem to have no problem with your Monday morning quarterbacking your perceived failures on the Warden's part. Long live the Wardens slain in cold blood at the hand of a cowardly, despicable, criminal. As for the ultimate judgment when Claude Dallas meets his maker, may God show him the mercy he denied those who perished at his hand.

And so we never forget, here are the names and faces of those who died as a result of criminal actions perpetrated by Claude Dallas.

Game Warden Wilson Conley Elms
Idaho Department of Fish and Game
Idaho
End of Watch: Monday, January 5, 1981

Biographical Info
Age: 34
Tour of Duty: 3 years
Badge Number: Not available

Incident Details
Cause of Death: Gunfire
Date of Incident: Monday, January 5, 1981
Weapon Used: Handgun; .357 caliber
Suspect Info: Released in February 2005

Game Warden Elms and Game Warden William Pogue were shot and killed while attempting to arrest a poacher in Owyhee County.

The suspect was released from prison in February 2005.

Warden Elms had served with the agency for three years.

8801elms.jpg


Game Warden William Harlan Pogue
Idaho Department of Fish and Game
Idaho
End of Watch: Monday, January 5, 1981

Biographical Info
Age: 50
Tour of Duty: 25 years
Badge Number: Not available

Incident Details
Cause of Death: Gunfire
Date of Incident: Monday, January 5, 1981
Weapon Used: Rifle; .22 caliber
Suspect Info: Released in February 2005

Game Warden Pogue and Game Warden Wilson Elms were shot and killed while attempting to arrest a poacher in Owyhee County.

The suspect was released from prison in February 2005.

Warden Pogue had served with the agency for 25 years.

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4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
>Claude Dallas is a man. Man
>makes mistakes, man pays for
>his mistakes. Did the punishment
>fit the crime? Not my
>call to make. The ultimate
>call will be made when
>Mr. Dallas meets his creator,
>not on some web site
>full of monday morning quarterbacks.
>Long live Claude Dallas and
>long live the constitution of
>the united states of america.
>


Your right jackrussel , men make mistakes like forgetting to take out the trash and leaving the toilet lid up . I can't think of any thing that the POS Dallas did that was simple mistake . Plain and simple he was a criminal that was trying to get away with any thing he could . I have zero respect for theifs and that is what a poacher is .

I'm with ya on the long live the constitution of the United States of America , but I think it is more deserving of good , honest , hard working people .
 
I have never proclaimed that claude dallas was a hero, let alone mine. The man was convicted and served his time, period. Long live all man, including claude dallas and the united states of america.
 
1911! Great posts in response to this issue.

As a retired cop I couldn't have said it any better. Claude Dallas is wasting good air. He concocted an excuse for his criminal acts and got off way too easy.
 
The bottom line is that claude dallas committed a crime, he had his day in court and was convicted by a jury of his peers. He did his time that the judge ordered, and was released from captivity. Whether you, me or the man in the moon agree with what punishment he recieved. That is the justice system in this great country.
 

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