21 NR elk points. Where to put in?

[ChubbyTuna]

At 66, dad has decided he's ready to cash in. If you could get any tag next year, which one and why? We've chatted with a few of the outfitters here on MM and get a sense that they are looking at 23 over 10 early rifle. Wouls love to hear some thoughts and predictions on these hunts and other possibilities.

 

[sagebrush]

23 has better elk IMO, but 10 is has more human friendly terrain if that is an issue. Some of that stuff in 23, especially where the big boys like to hang, can be pretty ugly.

 

[booter96]

LAST EDITED ON Jan-03-13 AT 08:37PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Jan-03-13 AT 06:14?PM (MST)

Sir...I have hunted unit 23 on both the early bow and rifle hunts for the last 9 yrs in a row.I have a great deal of info I can offer you and im sure I can answer any questions you might have. Please feel free to call me. Dave 602/228-1719

 

[Greybone]

I was reading Matt Shimberg's blog on his website and if I had that many points and the money to hire an outfitter I would highly consider going with AZStripbucks and unit 10. Check it out:
http://arizonastripbucks.blogspot.com/

 

[canon]

Pm sent

 

[msolocam]

would also advise you to look into hunting with ArizonaStripbucks. they aquired an awesome piece of property in unit 10 as well as 9. i was lucky enough to spend some time on the 10 side last year and WOW is all i can say.

 

[azhuntin]

If you are going to go guided, I would definately look into the private land hunt with Arizona Strip Bucks, I have hunted with them the last 2 years and you wont be disappointed. I hunted public land diy in unit 9 archery last year and when you wait that long for a tag and every big bull in the unit has several guys hunting them it gets pretty frustrating (this will probably be the case with most of the better units). After fighting over blinds, etc with other guides, I decided it wasnt worth it and went and hunted another part of the unit and killed a good bull. Good luck with whatever you decide

 

[DonMartin]

Unit 23 has a heck of a lot less people in it compared to Unit 10 when it comes to early rifle hunts! Last year for some reason, many who had Unit 10 early tags were very disappointed at what they got--or in many cases what they didn't get.

You don't have to spend a fortune to get a good bull. We pride ourselves in being the "working man's guide".

Here are bulls we got in 2011 in Unit 23n and in Unit 10.

Randy Hopp, Oregon

Dr. Roy Jones, Arizona

Good luck, you are in the "Game".

Don Martin
Arizona Wildlife Outfitters

 

[CAelknuts]

Unless I mis-read the regulations last night, there is also an early bull hunt in Unit 9 this year, but it may have been a muzzleloader tag. That would be a dream hunt as far as I'm concerned. Whatever you and your dad decide, he has an elk tag this coming fall with that many points.

 

[ChubbyTuna]

Never even knew the Strip guys did elk as well...I'll pass that along for sure. Many of the guides highly suggested the muzzy hunt.

 

[billythekid]

How many points?

 

[billythekid]

oops, saw the title. you're good for any hunt you want. good luck!

 

[BUTCH]

put in for 23 EARLY, the antler growth in 10 wont be acceptable this year.

 

[msolocam]

why wont the antler growth be acceptable in 10 this year?



check out arizonastripbucks.blogspot.com or message me for some more info on the private land in units 10 and 9.

there is a story and picture of a bull harvested from 10 last year on the blog

 

[azhuntin]

Might be because Butch is turning in for 10. We have got a good start with moisture hopefully it continues and we get it when it counts

 

[CAelknuts]

CT,given that your dad can draw any AZ hunt he wants to apply for, perhaps these thoughts will help the two of you decide where to apply?

Which unit and HUNT will give him the best EXPERIENCE? Does it even matter to your dad whether he has a chance at a 380-400" bull, or would he be perfectly happy with a nice big bull of 250-370 if he killed it on a memorable hunt? Will he be happier with a 360 class bull in a unit where the terrain is easy for him to enjoy the hunt, rather than feel beat up from a tougher physical unit where he killed, say, a 380 bull? Would he rather experience hunting a unit with a high number of big bulls, but maybe not the very top end, size-wise, or would he prefer to hunt a unit with fewer bulls, but an outside chance at a true monster?

At 66 years old, his priorities likely have changed from what they were when he began accumulating points at 47 years old. The overal experience may now be more important than simply the size of the bull he has an opportunity to shoot.

 

[Anaconda]

The post above by Caelknuts is some solid wisdom to consider.

Another point is, what type of terrain does he prefer ?

Of the top, big bull/great hunt unites, I would describe them like this;

9 & 10 are desert like, cedar flats. Yes there are some tall pines and canyons but mostly hot dry PJ flats.

23 is along the Mogollon rim. Heavy timber and brush, lots of thick country, with steep rim rock canyons.

1 has a lot of alpine mountain country. High mountain meadows, tall pines.

 

[elkmojo]

pm sent

 

[DonMartin]

Besides the moisture issue, which in fact is less than average in Unit 10 right now, better be aware of the access issues in Unit 10, which I absolutely like!

If you want to see what is being proposed send me an e-mail and I'll send you the pgf file with all the rules and fees that are being proposed.

No it is not a signed deal yet, but for those wanting to go in and do a lot of scouting--which is something we like to do, the access may be limited to 10 days before the hunt starts! No cameras, no blinds, no hunting within 100 yards of water, are just a few of the rules in that document.

You got way too much invested to make a mistake now.

Think of all the plus and minuses of each unit before your decide.

Don Martin
Arizona Wildlife Outfitters

 

[ChubbyTuna]

Thanks for all the great info. Dad will be hunting with Steve Chappell this fall and we plan on killing a big one. Pics to follow in late September.

 

[BigTom]

Are you sure he has 21 points.?
According to the AZ game and fish BP Data there are only 4 that have 20 going into this draw. 20 points is listed at the top of Genus points for elk. But even with 20 he should draw.

 

[ChubbyTuna]

Yup 21, right from the AZ website. That includes loyalty and hunters ed points too. I think there is only 1 other NR in the country with more points.

 

[BigTom]

cool! Good luck to your dad. I hope he kills a toad and has the hunt of lifetime. Camped next to Chappell guides last year. Never met a better bunch of guys.

 

[couesmagnet]

I def would not put in for 23 north. I've had the honor of being in 23 north in the month of september almost every year for the last decade or so, and several more years in addition to that for the last 20 years. While other opinions might vary from mine, 23 north has gone down in quality fir the last 5 years. I know its probably coincidence but right about the time they started the archery hunt in sept. in there and a few years after the fire. There are a few really good bulls in 23 north every year, and almost every year there is a 400 inch bull in the unit, but to find a bull over 370 there are better units with far more density of 370 plus bulls. On the other hand if your looking for 340-350 bulls and crazy amounts of bugling 23 north is your choice. To many late rifle tags in 23 north lately and the archers whacking some of the biggest bulls every year, although way less than when they first started the early archery hunt. Good luck regardless.

 

[WapitiBob]

Good luck to your dad. I hope he has the time of his life.

 

[jodog]

Hope your dad kills a great bull. Make sure you come back here and tell us the story next fall. Good luck.

 

[Cutbow]

Good luck...can't wait to find out how it goes.

 

[logslinger]

I don't know where your Dad should put in with 21 points but I do know with whom (Me). With our combined points of 29 we should have a real nice hunt. LOL.

 

[huntazido]

Chubby Tuna,
Now that the application deadline has come and gone, what hunt and unit did you end up putting your father in for? Did you go for a BIG bull unit or maybe another type of hunt/unit? What weapon type?

For what it is worth. My wife had a unit 10 early rifle elk tag back in 2003. It was one of the worse hunts I ever was involved in. Way too much pressure to kill big. I can't tell you how many people told her that if she didn't kill a certain size bull it was a wasted tag. The only reason why we applied for the early rifle hunts was because my wife did not want to hunt in cold weather or steep mountain type terrain. She drew with 7 points.

Good luck on whatever hunt you and your father go on and I hope you have a great experience. I look forward to the pictures and story.

 

[model700]

Huntazido,
Did your wife have any luck?

 

[huntazido]

Yes, she did kill an elk. It was a bull that you could easily find in any AZ unit.

 

[DonMartin]

Not to hijack this thread, but last year I had two friends who drew an early rifle tag in Unit 10. Both were extremely disappointed at the end of the hunt, and for about the same reasons as Huntazido listed.

One hunter was in his 70's, lives in Kingman and had 17 points. He wanted a "Big Bull or nothing". Physically he had some issues as all men in their 70's do. He hunted with a mutual friend of ours from Nevada who is a guide and they saw lots of bulls; but none he felt were better than the one he had at home. So he brought his tag home empty. Unfortunately he will probably never get another early elk tag in AZ, even though he is a resident. I'm going to use his tag in my hunter ed classes to show kids that you don't have to kill something on every hunt to have a successful hunting experience.

He was and is still adamant that he had a good hunt!

Second friend is a real DIY guy, also from Kingman who drew with 10 points I think. He too wanted a big bull. He hunted with one of my friends who is a former guide, and other volunteers who agreed to help him out on his hunt.

He too has some serious medical issues.

They also saw lots of bulls on that early Unit 10 hunt, and he finally pulled the trigger on a 320's kind of bull.

But he too was not happy with the quality of bulls they saw.

One interesting fact of that hunt was that one of his helpers had found a 350+ bull and offered his long range rifle to him. Bull was at something like over 700 yards, and with time running out, no way to get closer.

The hunter passed on using the rifle, saying he felt that HIM taking the shot was in his opinion, not ethical. I say good for him!

Anyway, each year I see hunters who put tremendous pressure on themselves to bag "THE BIG ONE" and the true meaning of the hunt, which is to have a safe and wonderful hunting EXPERIENCE is secondary to bagging a giant bull!

Of course we all try and get our hunters on huge bulls. That is what outfitters/guides do.

But sometimes, for various and assorted reasons, it doesn't always happen. Missed shots, illness, unable to walk deep into the back country due to medical reasons, are just a couple I've personally dealt with in the past.

Bottom line, enjoy the hunt, and know the hunter and his guide will do their best.

Guys, "Size doesn't always matter when it comes to a successful hunt"

Good luck to the hunter here and no matter what he ends up with, it will be a "trophy."

Don Martin
Arizona Wildlife Outfitters

 

[ChubbyTuna]

Dad will be hunting unit 23 with Steve Chappell. We interviewed 4 guides and all were outstanding. Although Dad has always wanted to hunt unit 10, everyone we talked to and some of the stories we read confirmed that 10 was a circus. We are headed to the Pheonix show tomorrow night to meet Steve and check out the rest of the show. Cant wait for October!!!

 

[couesmagnet]

Excellent choice on your guide!!! You will have the time of your life in 23 north with all the action and the chance of seeing something very special. Good luck

 

[vmcfadden]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-21-13 AT 08:55AM (MST)[p]Hopefully we will get to see the hunt on Extreme Bulls 8 or 9.