600 billion more?

REDDOG

Long Time Member
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4,437
Why the hell not..Kinda surprised no one here has been talking about it.. http://economictimes.indiatimes.com...-markets-say-analysts/articleshow/6879747.cms

I bet soros has a hard on over this, devaluing the dollar i sa must do for him, since cap-N-trade is too hard to sell, I guess this is the next best thing...

I cant wait for global governance, a utopia where we are all equal..We have been holding the Mexico's of the world back for far too long, its great that we are taking steps to level the playing field, dont you agree?
 
Mexico is a rightwingers utopia. I didn't hear you complain when Bush and company spent hundred of billions to stimulate the economy during the last recession, and it wasn't like this one, lets see, didn't they give everyone with a pulse some money? You must hate America.
 
We decided some time back we wanted to be in a world economy. if that's the game then our currency can't be over valued or it stifles trade. I'm in the ag biz, the lower the dollar goes the more competetive my products are and the more money I make. bring it on.

I'm not saying a world economy is whats best for us, in fact I'll argue it isn't but it's not an Obama thing.
 
QE1 didn't work very well at roughly 4 times the size so I doubt that this will have much effect. Just another sign of desperation from our government that they are "out of bullets".

Can you all say together, better and much more business friendly envoirment please. Thank you

Cabuck
 
What kind of new age american business environment will be as inticing as 50 cent an hour wages in China? don't tell me a tax cut that would be too classic.
 
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/matt-taibbi/blogs/TaibbiData_May2010/217520/83512

http://online.barrons.com/article/S...140224527342.html#articleTabs_panel_article=1

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2010/nov/07/g20-quantitative-easing-showdown

It's my understanding that the Fed really wants a trillion, but is simply stating 600 billion for now. While QE1 did provide for added financial stability for Wall St., it did illustrate one important factor. All banking executives should be publicly drawn and quarter or imprisoned AND their personal wealth should be seized. Perhaps that sounds a little harsh, but I think it's reasonable.

Having no faith in the Fed to act with proper timing, especially Bernanke, I believe the banks have no interest in lending to U.S. small businesses let alone other U.S. banks. Instead, much like the first round from QE1, the banks will use their improved balance sheet to bolster off-shore investments, grease the "In"-club palms, kiss the arse off stockholders, maintain huge bonuses, while using future taxpayer money for free, but not lending the bulk of it as intended back to actual U.S. business or U.S. taxpayers.

Quantitative Easing within itself is effective, unfortunately it relies on the banks to do the right thing.....good luck with that.
 
FTW,

Read the last sentence of your post, it makes my point exactly. The risk dosen't justify the reward. IT WILL NOT WORK!!

Cabuck
 
piper you poor dumb bastard, you still haven't learned to not take the lead...In fairness I did leave plenty of slack in the rope, and you predictably wrapped it around your neck.
 
LAST EDITED ON Nov-07-10 AT 11:24PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Nov-07-10 AT 10:15?PM (MST)

Reddog,

There is a reason I have not brought it up and that reason is rather simple. The markets and market watchers know that this has been in the works for awhile. The biggest questions about it are how much, how it will executed and will it become a bone of contention at the G-20? Brazil, Germany, India, and China are all beneficiaries and victims as we play Weimar roulette.

Now without sidetracking too much you happened to mention Cap n Trade which I find interesting. Whenever I see a side note about Cap n Trade or the Health Care Bill I wonder if the author believes that either is the brain child of the left? The HCB certainly wasn't, that baby belongs to Dole and Cap n Trade originated out Bush Sr.'s administration.

Cabuck I wrote it so I really don't need to re-read it(hehehe). The real issue here is that QE1 lacked 2 things...enough money and bank mandates that should have been negotiated by the Paulson/Bush team during the Wall St. bailout. One only needs to look at the amount injected vs. the amount U.S. total credit market debt outstanding.

http://www.elliottwave.com/freeupda...We-Need-QE-2-If-QE-1-Worked-So-Darn-Well.aspx

It's a tight rope act for the banks, do you lend money when traditional assets are losing value for securitized loans? Ask yourself cabuck, would you loan money in the secondary market against a borrowers home if they were 60/40 in equity with great credit knowing that more than likely in a year or so their home might decline in value another 20%? Excluding a predicted 20% decline, 10 years ago the answer would be, "Hell Yes", but now, in today's economy the answer is not so easy.

On the other hand long standing companies with outstanding line of credit histories stood by and watched their lines cut in half or simply disappear seemingly overnight. The fact that they have survived the last 2 years with no additional capital resources shows their resilience, so why haven't their lines been reinstated to 2005 levels?

No doubt it is all a sordid mess and we have had all the wrong people in place to fix it. That is not an indictment directly aimed solely at the current administration, but an indictment of those currently and formerly on the right which gave Paulson free reign and have recently watered down financial or any other type of reform to the point that they become more of slap on the hand instead of a knockout punch to the jaw.

One thing to keep in mind, today we are feeling the affects of a global recession spurred by the global greed and politics from years ago. Kind of like all those experiencing loan adjustments from their teaser rates from 5 years ago.

I'm not saying QE2 will not work, I just don"t have a lot of faith in Bernanke or the U.S. political climate/citizens to allow it to work. After all if QE1 had allocated 3 trillion as was initially noted as the amount needed, with certain mandates in place, we might have already righted the ship so-to-speak and not needed a QE2.

Who knows? On the flip-side the duck hunting has been pretty good this year.
 
ftw,

Get back to me in 6 months and ask the same question, if QE-3 will work? The government tries to fix every problem by throwing money at it, not good. Do you really think the fed will tighten credit to prevent inflation when it comes? It is coming it's only a matter of when. Can't wait to see what the fed has in mind for all the states whose budgets are going bust in the next two years. QE-4?

Cabuck
 
There was a hint of conspiracy theory in my OP. Does anyone but me think QE-3 is means to the end...of the Dollar?

As you may have gathered I have 0 faith in this succeeding.
 
LAST EDITED ON Nov-08-10 AT 02:05AM (MST)[p]"Get back to me in 6 months and ask the same question" The only question I asked of you was a hypothetical about lending....and it went unanswered.

QE-this, QE-that, Quantitative Easing is simply a new way of saying printing money so the Fed can pump-up the economy. On that note this is really more like QE-23 or something.

We basically are in agreement although perhaps we are viewing the issue from different angles.

I was extremely disappointed that Obama kept Bernanke on as Chairman because I can't think of a single instance where this guy has ever been correct......about anything.

Unfortunately, though, what's the alternative response to a credit crisis like this? Continue limited liquidity, cut-off what little credit is available to struggling small businesses by strengthening the dollar and making our exports less competitive?

Why can't there be agreements on the purchases of MBS, like, "Hey, we'll buy your crap to clean up your books and continue to give you money at 0% interest however you'll need to increase your lending by x% within the next 90 days after purchase. Or you can keep your toxic junk and we will start charging you 1.5 points on any funds received from us. Basically you better start playing ball or we'll find somebody who will and you'll go out of business from all toxic loans on your books.

Now many might say pushing the banks to make loans will take time. However, there are countless companies that would just love to have their bank tell them, "Hey you know we cut you off and closed your 100K line of credit, well, we're reinstating it again" that's a pretty quick process and strengthens those that have survived the last couple of years. Keeping them strong will at a minimum provide a stable platform to build off of.

As for the states you may only have to wait a couple of months instead of 2 years. At the end of the year the states will have to start paying interest on monies borrowed to cover their unemployment funds.

http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2010/05/32-states-have-borrowed-from-treasury.html

I'm sure somebody will think up some flowery name for a vehicle to create zero interest 100 year Fed-State bonds which government number crunchers will somehow tally as being real so the books look like their accounted for.

If it all fails and the house of cards tumble down it will happen quickly...like in a 48-72 hour period. But there is a bright side, we are all experienced outdoorsmen, plenty of gear, plenty of bullets, so all is not lost....non-hunters that live in major metros might have a problem by day 7. Never know, like anything it could happen, best to have a plan and a place should that day come if you know what I mean.
 
This type of easing is just the same as the Obama stimulus. No strings attached funding of whatever the government thinks needs money and it doesn't create jobs or assist small business. Just another spending vehicle that endangers our recovery. The TARP funds have almost totally been repaid so Bush was right to do that.
 
FTW, I read where Glenn Beck is telling people to stockpile food. Are you essentially agreeing with him?





Piper, how's your period?

Zigga, don't forget the knee pads!

440Sixpack wants to measure your boners!
 
beck-9.jpg
 
As you know Forkie I lived a lifetime in the Bay Area just minutes from the Hayward fault. So I have always been of the mindset to break camp and head to hills in cases of natural disaster, pandemic, etc. so a collapse of government could easily fall into that category....Beck pathetically sells it as only the latter.

Perhaps Cabuck will share my view that if the big one hits the Hayward fault it will make the chaos and mayhem of Katrina look like a Sunday Brunch. So whether it's earthquakes in the Bay Area or say the Yellowstone Caldera you won't find me with a Beck Survival Back Pack waiting for help to arrive.

Your probably like me Forkie so we both know when you have the gear and the know-how to live for extended periods of time without needing a grocery store the only food you'll need is something to snack on, on the way out of town.

Boxes of shells will keep you fed, safe, and mobile, boxes of food will slow you down and make you a target. If you are in a big city when the food and water run out (including your bs Beck Kit), you will have to un-barricade that door and go out at some point. The longer you wait, the more desperate those outside of that door will be.

Where I live now I don't worry about it as much, but that doesn't mean I'm not ready for it.
 
That is one nice thing about living in a rural area. Most will have 1 or two freezers full, stocked pantry in the house, and wild game for resupply and a generator to keep the freezer going in a power outage.

FTW, bet I have more ammo stocked piled then you and the means to make more to fight off those prowling city hoodlums.

RELH
 
FTW, one of my most favorite movies is Red Dawn. You better believe if shyt goes to pot, I'll be in the hills in survival mode.

I just had to laugh a little because Glenn Beck is pretty over the top and for a minute you sounded a little like him. Just playin' with ya. Good luck with the ducks!






Piper, how's your period?

Zigga, don't forget the knee pads!

440Sixpack wants to measure your boners!
 
Better get some seeds and a good water filter system because this ain't the 1800's any longer. With the population we have even the rats will be gone in a month.
 
LAST EDITED ON Nov-09-10 AT 09:45AM (MST)[p]One thing about it if your freezer is full of ducks and geese nobody will steal your meat supply no matter how tough it gets.
 

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