another bad resident preference point bill

[feduptwo]

Because we went another year without making any changes to the crappy random draw (i.e. address actual odds) or at least introducing alternate ideas we get to attempt to kill another resident preference point bill (SF0094). This time they've added verbiage to address some of the biggest concerns raised with last years bill.
Still the same solution that does nothing to address actual odds. One of these times the supporters of this stupid idea are going to win because of our refusal to actually change the status quo.

 

[BuzzH]

I agree, its bad legislation.

Hope you dont want to apply as a party with your friend...thats not going to happen. Has to be immediate family.

As per usual, I hear that the split is going to be 50-50 to preference/random and thats not a fact either.

I also heard it was going to allow youth to apply with the same number of points as their parents...that didnt make the bill either.

I suppose that didnt favor Senator Larry Hicks in the draws...so that was likely thrown out from the get-go.

I tell you what, I'm about to throw in the towel and simply start looking out for myself...to hell with the young hunters, to hell with those just getting into the sport, and to hell with the NR's.

I should support the 10% limitation on NR's and a preference point bill that will assure me another tag or three. With the increase in Resident quota AND a preference point bill, I'm a shoe in to get my tags...and quicker!

I'm in the second half of my hunting career and I fuggin' deserve a few more good tags at the expense of everyone else.

I'm owed that.

 

[TOPGUN]

BuzzH---I should support the 10% limitation on NR's and a preference point bill that will assure me another tag or three. With the increase in Resident quota AND a preference point bill, I'm a shoe in to get my tags...and quicker!
I'm in the second half of my hunting career and I fuggin' deserve a few more good tags at the expense of everyone else.
I'm owed that.

***Unfortunately BuzzH, there are a lot out there with that "Me Me Me" attitude and one who already responded on the other thread will probably be on this one to get his two cents worth in and tell everyone to have their relatives support this one too so he can get all his tags quicker!!! That sort of self-serving attitude is exactly what will eventually bring Wyoming down and make it another DP run Utah with all the problems it now has with 100s of auction tags, saleable landowner tags, etc. that will not help the resident hunter one bit, but the landowners and outfitters will be smiling all the way to the bank!

 

[dwalton]

Buzz H,

I'll try my best again this year to work with my rep. Maybe I''l send a power point showing what tag reductions do for draw odds. The areas south of Rock Springs (one of the big drivers in these pref point bills) have seen up to 50% quota reductions in the past 5 years. See what that does for waiting periods when draw odds go from 3% to 1.5%. Even those in the top pool could wait 20+ years for a tag.

It's simple math people - the demand far outstrips the supply. There is NO mathmatical way to make the draw "fair" without sacrificing someone else's ability to draw a permit.

Like I told our representatives last year: A random draw is the only "fair" way to distribute a public resource. Everyone has the same chance, every year. Kind of like the same principles our country was founded on.

Then again, maybe I should be selfish. I'm nearing 50, and I still have 3 points in my bank from my non-ressy days. I would be assured a tag in the first year of a pref system....

 

[jm77]

>Then again, maybe I should be
>selfish. I'm nearing 50,
>and I still have 3
>points in my bank from
>my non-ressy days. I
>would be assured a tag
>in the first year of
>a pref system....


Sorry this bill and any future PP bills will address NR points and how they can't be used in front resident max points.

The bill does not use the correct language intended for youth hunters and IF it is introduced, (big IF) that will be changed.

 

[jm77]

feduptwo PM sent

 

[alaska_bou]

I think it is ridiculous to suggest anyone favoring a pp system must be selfish.. I personally have had relatively good luck in the random draw and cannot complain but I fully understand the frustration with friends who apply unsuccessfully for seven or eight years in a row for a unit with 45% draw odds, meanwhile others (who naturally oppose a point system) pull good tags two and three years in a row. I think some need to reevaluate who in-fact may be the selfish ones.

What I would like to see introduced is a bill limiting antlered moose and any bighorn sheep permit holders to one harvest per lifetime similar to Idaho's current system. Any word if this will be proposed?

 

[feduptwo]

A random draw being the most fair system is normally touted by people who have had a lot of luck in the draw. Dwalton how many tags have you drawn (or close family) in the last ten years.
Random draw
sucks and pref points sucks their are other solutions.

 

[BuzzH]

Wow, its so complicated...(heaviest of sarcasm here).

I suppose a 3 year waiting period for those "drawing good tags two and three years in a row"...is just an outlandish solution to a solve that problem?

 

[piper]

The only thing that seems complicated to some people is how drawings odds work over multi year periods.
Its good to see that some understand the reality behind fairness, not just the theory.

A preference or bonus point system would work great in Wyomings pronghorn draw, as the odds in many public land areas are around 40% for a buck tag
Most hunters could draw every two years or so with a point system, he way it is now many hunters go for 5 years or more without ever drawing and some draw 5 years in a row.


Im surprised DWalton doesn't understand the idea behind point systems since he moved from Nevada recently, Imagine how upset many hunters would be in that state if they had a pure random draw system?

 

[TOPGUN]

Piper: "Most hunters could draw every two years or so with a point system, the way it is now many hunters go for 5 years or more without ever drawing and some draw 5 years in a row."

***Some people are obviously dumber than a stump if they think drawing a tag with their PPs once every few years is better than having the same chance as everyone else at getting the same tag every year the way a random draw works! Piper, you have got to be kidding me when you make any kind of a statement about DWalton concerning draws with your absolutely screwed up theory on random draws, LOL!

 

[grosventrehunter]

I personally like the random draw. Is that selfish?

 

[piper]

I give up topgun, you can't comprehend what Im saying, thank goodness other do.

 

[TOPGUN]

>I give up topgun, you can't
>comprehend what Im saying, thank
>goodness other do.


***You don't have enough people in your corner comprehending your twisted logic and goofed up draw mentality to count to five, so it probably is "other", meaning one, LOL! Sorry, but you had that coming when you said I'm thick-headed! Anyone that keeps coming up with completely incorrect statements like you do that a random draw is not fair to some when it's the most fair way of doing things, bar none, is absolutely hopeless. How you came up with these other erroneous statements about how and why PP draws are done is really hopeless. It sounds like you should run for the Legislature with your complete lack of knowledge of how things actually work, as you'd fit right in!

 

[dwalton]

Piper,

I understand Nevada's bonus point system completely. It is vastly different that the one being proposed here in Wyo. Stop comparing apples and oranges.

I have agreed many times that a point system for antelope would work great because:
1. There is no general, over the counter antelope hunt.
2. Draw odds on antelope are such that people could cycle through every two to three years.

 

[piper]

I mentioned Nevada because Topgun repeats over and over again that a random draw is the most fair way to distribute tags, and I disagree.

I know Nevada's is different, but it is a point system that rewards those that consistently apply with better odds.

 

[TOPGUN]

>I mentioned Nevada because Topgun repeats
>over and over again that
>a random draw is the
>most fair way to distribute
>tags, and I disagree.
>
>I know Nevada's is different, but
>it is a point system
>that rewards those that consistently
>apply with better odds.


***If I were to have a system other than random, it would probably be exactly like NV has and it is nothing like you guys are proposing. A majority of people, when discussing various state systems, almost always put NV at or near the top of systems they prefer. My Sheridan, WY hunting buddy drew a great archery bull tag last year out there that I went on with him and he had only put in for tags out there for about 5 or 6 years. The problem is now he has to wait quite a few years to apply again after he drew that tag. I think it's 5 years because he didn't fill it and would have been 10 if he had tagged out, but I'm not positive.

 

[piper]

Topgun-I would prefer to see a well thought out point system of some kind, but not that 75%-25% thing they have now.

You right about the wait, I had to wait 5, and my successful brother had to wait ten.