Congrats DWR!!!

slickrock · Nov 1, 2011

Southern unit just got hammered!! Brilliant idea going to a 9 day hunt. Just when we were getting a few nice bucks. Oh well! BumbleBee all over again. Wonder how many years it will take to recover this time? Idiots!

Slick

"The Road goes on forever & the Party never Ends"

BigMedicine · Nov 1, 2011

What did they kill? You have photos or accounts? Lots of big bucks bite the dust? Let's see some pics and hear more about it.

dillon · Nov 1, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Nov-01-11 AT 11:08PM (MST)[p]My family saw a lot of deer on the southern this year, including two really big bucks that got away. There were better bucks than when they hunted two years ago there. I was not there so I can't judge harshly. I bet a lot of young bucks got harvested statewide though with the cold front that came through.

I blame hunters more than the DNR. We need to stop taking long shots even though rifles are getting much better as are optics, shots at running animals need to stop, and we need to let the little guys grow up if we want to see good bucks. I just get frustrated when you pass up a young buck and 10 minutes later a person shoots it.

Muley_73 · Nov 1, 2011

dillion,
Really???????? Long range and running shots???????? Really???????? WOW!!!!! Of all the factors that are hammering our deer right now, I am not sure that one even makes the front page list...even in small print. For a person that is vocally looking for a career in game managment that comment scares the heck out of me!!!!!

Gator · Nov 2, 2011

+10 Muley_73

"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
>[Font][Font color = "green"]Life member of
>the MM green signature club.[font/]

dillon · Nov 2, 2011

Sorry Muley_73 those are just the things that bother me more than some other things that are happening. I also have things I don't like about DNR management of our deer, however I try not to publish them so they don't come up when I am interviewing for jobs. I do think we should shorten seasons. I did like the 5 days hunt for rifle hunters. I felt that it was enough time to get a nice buck.

Honestly there are a lot things on the "bad for the deer" list, some of them are easier to fix than others.

Muley_73 did you get a nice buck this year? It was you I met last year at the wildlife board meeting right?

Deerlove · Nov 2, 2011

I was waiting for the post only for it to be about Northern Ut. They went from a 3 day hunt to 9 days. The effects?

woodruffhunter · Nov 2, 2011

Too many tags in N.Utah; period! Large winter kill!

It was a terrible season in the areas we hunted. Very few deer compared to years past.

BigMedicine · Nov 2, 2011

Nobody killed big bucks...it's the DWR's fault.

Everybody killed big bucks...it's the DWR's fault.

My uncle touched me when I was a kid...it's the DWR's fault.

My hell, those guys can't win.

The only way some whiners will be happy is if they are the only ones that kill big bucks. They don't want to have to work too hard to do it, but also don't want anybody else to be able to kill them either.

Once or twice every 10 years you have conditions that come together perfectly and guys do well on bigger bucks. We had it after the huge storm in 2004, sounds like maybe 2011 was the same story again? Although, most opening weekend warriors didn't do much in the shirtsleeve weather. The handful of guys that stuck it out and hunted the last 4 days of the season probably had some luck. Years like this don't happen very often, I say stop bitchin and just enjoy it when it happens.

Packout · Nov 2, 2011

Wait!!!! Last year we heard there were no bucks left. I recall one guy saying there wasn't even a 2 point to breed the doe herd. This year we hear the hunt killed all the mature bucks. How could there have been any mature bucks this year if there were no bucks last year? You guys crack me up.

slickrock · Nov 2, 2011

"Nobody killed big bucks...it's the DWR's fault.
Everybody killed big bucks...it's the DWR's fault.

My uncle touched me when I was a kid...it's the DWR's fault.

"My hell, those guys can't win.

The only way some whiners will be happy is if they are the only ones that kill big bucks. They don't want to have to work too hard to do it, but also don't want anybody else to be able to kill them either.

Once or twice every 10 years you have conditions that come together perfectly and guys do well on bigger bucks. We had it after the huge storm in 2004, sounds like maybe 2011 was the same story again? Although, most opening weekend warriors didn't do much in the shirtsleeve weather. The handful of guys that stuck it out and hunted the last 4 days of the season probably had some luck. Years like this don't happen very often, I say stop bitchin and just enjoy it when it happens."

Officer.. Let me just say I have no problem with the individual's at the DWR. I know you are trained professionals that do a great job in your respective areas. My reference to idiots is directed at the policy of the Division not the good people that work there.

Now! Having said that. One of the smartest decisions that was ever made was the 5 day general hunt. Over a period of years we have seen the quality of bucks improve in the Southern unit. Suddenly and I'm sure under pressure we have a 9 day hunt. Well.. guess what? all that improvement was wiped out the last 4 days of the 9 day hunt.

As far as documentation goes... I guarentee coffee shop bullshit is more reliable than all the million dollar surveys and studies you guy's do.

Once again.. no offense to the people at the the DWR but you damn well need to focus on wildlife management rather than politics

Slick

"The Road goes on forever & the Party never Ends"

hossblur · Nov 3, 2011

Why did we go to 30 units?? I am pretty sure it was for more localized control. THEN HOW THE HELL DO WE GET A 9 DAY HUNT ACROSS THE STATE?? If your doing localized control there is NO FREAKING WAY that at least one unit shouldn't have shorter seasons. Manti(the new manti unit) had massive winter kill, total deer numbers are down and buck to doe ratios have got to be in the single digits. The new 30 unit idea is just more of the same. Until the DWR gets serious about ACTUAL management, and not just doing something to do something, UTAH IS SCREWED!!! YOU CANNOT DO MICROMANAGEMENT FROM SLC, OR THE CAPITOL. DWR DO YOUR DAMN JOB!!!!!! ACROSS THE STATE REGULATIONS, GET FREAKING REAL YOU LAZY TURDS!!!

When they came for the road hunters I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for the oppurtunists I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for the public land hunters I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for me there was no one left to say anything!

Deerlove · Nov 3, 2011

Hoss the DWR will say the kill rate is the same with a 9 day to a five day hunt? Your thoughts?? How about everyone else??

slickrock · Nov 3, 2011

DL, it's simply not the same. This year the 1st 5 days were hot & dry. The last 4 days days the weather turned and it was a slaughter. Now having said that the real question is why did we go to a 9 day hunt in the 1st place? The 5 day hunt was working well. Politics.... pure & simple. The opportunity groups got to the DWR and pooof!! End of story.

Slick

"The Road goes on forever & the Party never Ends"

hossblur · Nov 3, 2011

The oppurtunists(I am one) have no legislative clout. There is a ton of money generated in the deer hunts. The state can't loose the tax money, and merchants don't want to loose it either by loosing a weekend. The nine day hunt might be acceptable if it was by a unit by unit reg., but this oh, state wide anything when it comes to mule deer managment is no longer acceptable. We have 30 units(I think we could double that, how are the deer units in Fairview similar to Salina?), so we can MANAGE smaller areas. If we are going to do across the board anything, then lets just have ONE FREAKING UNIT!!!

When they came for the road hunters I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for the oppurtunists I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for the public land hunters I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for me there was no one left to say anything!

Muley_73 · Nov 3, 2011

Dillon,
I hope that if you get a job that you will manage with an open eye as to what will help our herds and not what will make the bosses happy.

I spent most of my summer/fall scouting for my dads moose and brothers Mnt Goat. Had a great time scouting and hunting on those hunts. Both were a very big success. My 13 yr old shot a decent little buck up above Hardware opening morning, there is a pic in the Mule Deer section. I spent the rest of the hunt with a friend on the Paunsy. Hands down my favorite place to be in the entire world the last week of Oct. We had a great hunt down in the desert. I am heading to CO for a 3rd season deer hunt with my dad in the morning. I am hoping it turns out as good as the rest of the year has.

And yes it was me that you talked to at the WB meeting.

I hope you have a very successful and meaningful career in wildlife management.

huntinfanatic · Nov 5, 2011

hoss,

It is still very possible to better manage the herds with every unit being a nine day hunt. Some units (struggling units) would simply just have alot less tags allocated.

woodruffhunter · Nov 5, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Nov-05-11 AT 02:04PM (MST)[p]I will go out on a limb here and say I am looking forward to the new changes next year. Who knows if they will work or not; time will tell. I don't like how things are now managed. If thats whining so be it.

Actually, I took my biggest buck to date this year. However, it was on a LE Unit. I'll give the DWR props for the deer I seen on the LE unit.

Its hard to argue with the fact deer numbers are in trouble on the "General" Northern Unit. Winter Kill is a big part of it. And although winter kill was a big factor, it is ultimately the DWR's problem. Issues should be indentified and resolved. When I mean resolved, I am saying if that tags need to be lowered, so be it. I'll be the first to congratulate the DWR if their new program works.

slickrock · Nov 5, 2011

With you on that Woody... been a advocate of smaller units for years. I'll give it a chance & ##### later if it don't work.

Slick

"The Road goes on forever & the Party never Ends"

hossblur · Nov 7, 2011

Across the board, statewide regs are lazy management by a lazy DWR. If you are going to micromanage units, you need to micromanage, whether it be tags or season lenghts. I personally think you could have 50+ units, and if you really want to improve the herds you can micromanage each unit with all the tools in the box, season length, season shutdowns, tags, etc.. HOWEVER this would take actual effort, something the DWR has no interest in. The DWR justs wants to "do something" so they can say they "did something"

When they came for the road hunters I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for the oppurtunists I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for the public land hunters I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for me there was no one left to say anything!

Muley_73 · Nov 7, 2011

hoss,

That comment is about as spot on as they get!!!!! FACT!!!!

w2u · Nov 9, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Nov-09-11 AT 10:32AM (MST)[p]Well, this thread receives the most idiotic comments award! I can't say I haven't laughed out loud so hard for so long in quite awhile...are Utah hunters really this stupid? Or, is the "Utard" moniker really true? Wow....by the looks of the comments in this thread, Utah hunters really are "tards".

We are talking about GENERAL SEASON hunts people....these are NOT trophy hunts. People should shoot lots of bucks...and quality should be low. They are not LE trophy units.

w2u · Nov 9, 2011

> You guys
>crack me up.

Me too...classic scapegoat thread!

w2u · Nov 9, 2011

>Nobody killed big bucks...it's the DWR's
>fault.
>
>Everybody killed big bucks...it's the DWR's
>fault.
>
>My uncle touched me when I
>was a kid...it's the DWR's
>fault.
>
>

Funny....but, then again, sad because some think it's true.

Muley_73 · Nov 9, 2011

w2u,
It's ok bud, we understand you were raised from a different bible. You are correct that past management has managed our deer herds with only maximum opportunity in mind. This process has proven to be flawed as we have seen our herds plummet. Time for a change!!! I'm sure the fight won't be pretty its worth it in the end if my kids can still have something to hunt down the road.

The DWR deer management group would be considered an epic failure in any business setting over the past 30 years! That is a simple fact!

hossblur · Nov 9, 2011

Your right, they are not trophy areas. What does that have to do with anything? If you think the units should be managed for oppurtunists, then why do we have 30 units and only a 9 day hunt? Why not 1 statewide unit and a 14 day hunt, like in the "good old days"? Why if you are for better and more controlable deer managment are you setting statewide rules? If you want trophy areas, how does making season lengths, one year before the season, before any data from the hunts, or winter kill, or fawn mortality, increase this? Deer management is science. How does the DWR know that we won't have a 95% winter kill state wide? YOU CANNOT DO ANYTHING a year in advance, based on no numbers, no data, or no input per region and call it managment. I love the idea of micromanagement, just not by the UDWR. If your going to have small units, why not try finding out how that unit is doing, next spring, THEN decide season lengths, tag numbers, etc. This is just another example of the DWR doing what it always does, talk about improving things, spending a lot of time and money talking about it, getting all of us to support it, then next year changing their minds and "throwing something new at the board". Micromanagment is just that, micro and statewide regs or rules are the polar opposite of that. THE DWR IS LAZY!!! FLAT OUT LAZY!!! THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU REPLACE BIOLOGISTS WITH POST GRADS AND POLITICIANS!!! There isn't a scientist in the world who decides how his experiment will work(9 day seasons), then doing no research, reading no data, and saying that he was right all along. Thats not science(deer mangagement), its just GUESSING!!

When they came for the road hunters I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for the oppurtunists I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for the public land hunters I was not one so I said nothing. When they came for me there was no one left to say anything!

1911 · Nov 9, 2011

"My uncle touched me when I was a kid...it's the DWR's fault."

Did this uncle work in the athletic dept. at Penn State?

http://www.monstermuleys.info/dcforum/User_files/4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg

ridgetops · Nov 12, 2011

I hunt one of the struggling units and am very happy to see it go back to 9 days and so are most the people I talk to. The 3 day hunt was getting old and because the pressure has been increasing for the past ten years that I've been hunting it. I have seen the buck to doe ratio only get worse.The number of days doesn't really detour people from hunting the area. I would rather hunt every 3-5 years with reduced tags and a 9 day hunt than every year with a 3 day hunt and unlimited tags.

There's always next year