Elk Rubs

[Addicted]

This is something ive always wondered and have never been able to find the answer to and now that I have a tag its time to find out.
Correct me if im wrong but elk rub or create rubs twice a year right?
Once in early August to get the velvet off and then again around the rut to show their dominence. If this is true is there anyway to tell the difference when scouting?

 

[flinger]

I think there are some elk that rub their antlers during the late fall/winter as well.

 

[marley]

I look at the small broken off branches that will be laying on the ground around the tree. If they are still green and don't snap easily it is a pretty fresh rub. If it is a sapling pine the sap won't be dried up yet either on a fresh rub. Hope this helps some.

 

[WapitiBob]

LAST EDITED ON Apr-21-10 AT 03:05PM (MST)[p]The cadmium layer will tell you how fresh.

Size of the tree helps to determine which rub.

 

[Addicted]

What I was wondering is early season scouting like in the spring, so looking at last years rubs.
From what I know the areas they are in when they rub off the velvet wont be the same areas they are in when the rut starts and they are playing the tough guy.

 

[Romulus]

Some elk rub right before they shed their antlers. You sometimes find shed antlers right under a fresh rub.

 

[elknut1]

LAST EDITED ON Apr-22-10 AT 08:28PM (MST)[p]http://www.elknut.com
Vortex Optics Dealer

If your tag is for an Oct. or later rifle hunt then rubs are of little value to you.

Rubs are made by bulls for many reasons & not just twice a year for a specific point. True, bulls will shed velvet by rubbing as early as late July into Aug. Most bulls will be completely rubbed & hard horned by Sept 1st, it's possible to have a few still in the process by then as well.

The real question is "Why Do Bulls Rub" As mentioned to remove velvet is but one. They will also rub as you mention for dominance in a challenging situation, bulls will do this towards one another to size one another up at times.

Bulls also will rub or rake when displaying for cows or other bulls while in bachelor groups. At this time they can take place anywhere in the woods. These displaying areas are not hard to find, there will be rubs everywhere & at different heights as well as different sized trees & brush picked on. The Aug type rubs will have velvet left over on the ground as well as on the trunks or branches. The Sept type rubs & elsewhere for the various reasons being mentioned will be void of velvet.

As the rut increases & competition for cows escalate bulls can be near large open type breeding areas/parks if the hunting pressure is not to severe & pushing them around. At these spots you will find rubs everywhere in Sept especially & parts of early to mid Oct. These rubs will be at treeline where they meet the mdw or in the middle of a mdw with a tree here & there in it with rubs made by the herd bulls & satellites alike. In many cases the satellites will rub like crazy in an effort to work themselves up to the point of challenging a herd bull, too they rub/rake trying to impress the ladies & draw them away from the herd bull. Finding areas as this with old & new rubs will show they use this area yearly.

Other areas of interest are around wallows or trails leading to wallows where resident bulls will rub trees here & there on their way to the wallows. Bulls will rub trees or brush at these areas & release a scent from a gland located low on their forehead, in many cases they will also urinate in or very near this active wallow.

There are other reasons bulls rub as well as for no reason at all except the fact they are feeling their oats as their hormones get the best of them preparing for the up coming rut.

Most rubs found will only show that bulls had been there at one time or another & it's completely normal for them not to come back to that rubbed area once they leave it for that time of the year. Hunting around such areas with old rubs is a real crap shoot & very unpredictable of any return. Freshness of sign around can also help as to their last visit.

Depending on the time frame of your hunt I would rely more on calling if appropriate & glassing from vantage points for location than looking for rub areas!

ElkNut1

 

[elk777]

I was just going to comment on elk rubbing right before they shed. I found an antler right under a fresh scraped tree this year.

 

[Addicted]

Thanks for the info.
My hunt is a Utah Archery hunt so its going to be middle of August through the middle of September.
I was just curious if finding rubs during scouting would be a good way to find areas that may hold elk during the hunt.

 

[Hondoarcher]

I think Elknut1 coverd the topic quite well. One additional note. I think their are different types of rubs. When an elk is rubbing off the velvet they spend a lot of time on a tree and realy take the bark and limbs off. Later when the breading season is in high gear they are mostly showing off and getting worked up for the fight. This is like shadow boxing before the fight. These rutting rubs are usually smaller involving trees with more limbs.

What is everyone elses opinion on this idea?

 

[elknut1]

http://www.elknut.com
Vortex Optics Dealer


I personally do not put a lot of stock in "rubs" (unless the bull is still there rubbing) as areas to just sit & call or set a stand from. Sure the elk were there at one time but most likely have since moved on. It wouldn't hurt to thrash a bit & give a few dominate screams of your own to see if a response was received but I would focus much more on topo-maps & places the elk will be living/rutting in at that time such as basins, parks or long running draws with water in the bottoms with various scattered parks throughout them & away from most hunting pressure. I would both Glass & Call from vantage spots that would allow me to see or hear from these areas for location only, I wouldn't be trying to call elk to me!

Midday especially if hot out & I wasn't getting into any action I would position myself either on vantage areas where I could hear well from & listen & watch carefully for midday movement or bugling. This would show me aprox bedding areas the elk were using during my hunt there!

Too, if I could locate a well used wallow or water source near those bedding areas I would be focusing on them heavily during midday & especially evenings or last 3-hrs of daylight!

Calling for location, glassing & finding water sources would be my goto method for your time frame, not putting too much focus on rub areas only.

Bring a trail camera or two to set on water sources/wallows or well used trails while you hunt elsewhere, they're great scouting tools for your hunt!


As far as what time frame bulls remove more bark from trees, well that's a toss up, different occasions can influence different elk differently! (grin) How's that for side stepping the question! (grin)

ElkNut1