Horse Problems

[dirtygrass]

I am new to horse ownership, I have had my horses for a year now. I ride almost every weekend and have never had a problem with either horse. The last two weekends my 11 year old horse stopped on the trail and would not go any where. I got off and with about 20 minutes of work I got him to move by leading him. I led him for about a half hour and got back on with no problems. I feel this may become a bigger problem if I don't fix it. I talked to some of my cowboy friends and they told me spurs should work, but being new to horses I am a little worried about how he will react.

Any suggestions would be great.

 

[Zeke]

I'm NOT a horse guy and have been on just a few over the years but I remember when I was on a Stone sheep hunt and my horse did the exact same thing. The guide said "let him know who's boss. Kick him and make him move where you want him to go".
The horses name was Soldier and we got along perfectly for the balance of the hunt. He ended up hauling me over some nasty passes.

The replies will be interesting when the real horse guys chime in.

Good luck to you,
Zeke

 

[NVBighorn]

When properly mounted in the saddle if you reach forward between his ears and using a downward angle pointing toward his muzzle a single .40 S&W slug should do the trick. Just make sure you can step off quickly so as to not get pinned under his weight. The problem is usually solved rather quickly.



Sorry, just kidding... mostly...

 

[coolspringoutfitters]

Make it uncomfortable for him to stand there. I had a horse that did the same thing when we were crossing water. He wasn't scared of it but he would just stop and not move. Horses learn what they are suppose to do when you release pressure... So stay in the saddle and just bug him till he moves... I like a switch... A small branch or the end of the lead rope... just keep smacking him with it till he goes... And as soon as he starts moving, stop with the pressure. Soon he will figure out that if he stops when you don't want him to he will get pressured... I don't like spurs and I never use them so this is an alternative. It may take a while, but stick with it... It will work...

CSO

It's all about the good times...

 

[deadibob]

>When properly mounted in the saddle
>if you reach forward between
>his ears and using a
>downward angle pointing toward his
>muzzle a single .40 S&W
>slug should do the trick.
>Just make sure you can
>step off quickly so as
>to not get pinned under
>his weight. The problem is
>usually solved rather quickly.
>
>
>
>Sorry, just kidding... mostly...

+1, and if a 40 don't do it try a 45. Just kidding...a little bit...

 

[Phantom Hunter]

Making him uncomfortable to stand there is good advice. I do wear spurs but that does not mean you have to gig him as hard as you can. Most times just gentle taps with your heel/spurs will get him moving as coolspringoutfitters suggested. Be sure there is not anything dangerous to him on the trail if front of him. Worst thing you can do is ask him to move and then let him get hurt. If the coast is clear work him til he moves.

 

[dirtygrass]

Thanks for the suggestions! Go figure I start having problems a month before I go hunting. I have packed with them several times, shot close to them, hobbled them, big river crossings, packed meat with them, you name it we have done it and now this! Ha!

 

[BearCat]

Dirtygrass

I am not an expert by any means, but have had hunting horses for about 5+ years.

I have found that if they stop then something is not right to THEM. As mentioned this can be crossing water, a ditch, a rattlesnake, something in the wind, saddle issues or anything. One time it has rained real hard and we were coming through some dead pine timber and we had done this a dozen times, but this time my horse was locking every 20-30 yards. It took some time, but it turned out that the dead stumps had turned a black color from the heavy rain and the horse did not trust the color (I am guessing they looked more like bears). But that shows you that something "spooked" that horse---find out what it is and work with the horse and you should not have any problems. Once I realized what it was for mine, I lead the horse up to the dark trees and let her know it was not a threat and never had that problem again. I also had a saw on my saddle come loose and was hitting my horse in the belly. She would stop off and on and just was uneasy---turned out that once I fixed the saw---she was fine.

I would guess it was something on the trail or surrounding areas.

Hope this helps
BearCat

 

[dirtygrass]

Bearcat,

I was thinking the same thing until this weekend when he wouldn't move right after I saddled him, so I led him a while got on and he still wouldn't move. I will be working with him all weekend long. We have to ride both horses every time we ride because I cant separate them or they go crazy. My younger horse which I have no problems with is the horse I always ride and I always lead. I am thinking that because he always follows he my have a problem leading. But my younger horse does not like the older horse behind him too close because the older horse is very dominant and sometimes bites him in the ass. I found this out packing in to do some fishing by myself, I switched saddles and rode my older horse with no problems. The good thing is I know they will be fine if I lead them and I can walk along way with no weight on me.

Thanks again,

Dirty

 

[dirtygrass]

The only thing I have really learned about horses in the last year is that they are more moody than women!

 

[elkassassin]

I have seen some BULL Headed Bastards in my day that'd just lock up after they thought their Shift was done!

Outside of that somethings up/wrong!

One Year I headed back in to the High Country with a Guy on Horses!

We each had one Pack Horse to Lead!

Back in a few Miles & the Pack Horse I was leading Locked Up Tighter than Hell & you couldn't move him for nothing!

Even my Shiny 3-5-7 didn't Scare/move him!

Got Checkin things out a bit & the Guy I went with decided the Safest Place for His Fishin Pole was between the Pad & the Saddle and it finally wore through & was Rubbing the Horses Back!

We Saddled up 3 hours before Daylight & I never knew what He'd Done!

Another Time My Horse Locked Tighter than a NUNS #$%^ & didn't wanna move!

But I made him go forward!

What a Mistake that was!

Danced right into a GANG BANG of Rattle Snakes!

All I could think of was landing in that Pile of Snakes!

Somehow We made it through that one,Not Perty!

I'd make sure The Saddle/Cinch/etc Ain't rubbing/Bothering him!

You mighta just realized why the last Guy Sold him!










Founder just Banned My Signature!
Hang in there!
I'm working on another one!

 

[Ropinfool]

ride them apart sometimes. sounds like they are getting a little spoiled. don't beat them either, that generally makes things much worse. horses need a lot of attention to keep them working good......kinda like a woman.

 

[nickman]

Probably why spurs were invented, don't ya think?

 

[dominguez]

Make sure his kidneys aren't sore, that will make a horse hurt when going.

Like mentioned before check pads and cinches.

 

[HorseCreek]

You don't feed a horses all year so you can lead them. You also shouldn't beat them. Like Bess said. Check the saddle if they aren't comfortable they won't so what you ask of them. If everything checks out then get back on and show em who's boss. It takes patience not brute force.


Traditional >>>------->

 

[mtmuley]

I grew up with horses, but haven't owned one in years. I do know though, if that horse gets away with behaving that way, it's gonna be a tough problem to correct. I see some trainers and horse people these days are of the kinder-gentler way of training and discipline. The way my father would have dealt with it would probably be considered as abuse now. And if it couldn't be corrected, down the road the nag would go. He had no patience nor use for an animal that wouldn't serve it's purpose, and the mountains are no place to figure that out. mtmuley

 

[riflescope]

I agree with mtmuley.

I grew up riding horses and have used them many times to carry out my elk.

One thing I learned was that the horses that were disciplined, behaved the best and were the best to ride. The ones that got the gentle care treatment were a pain in the a$$ and were not worth the hassle.

 

[LongRangeBangin]

LAST EDITED ON Aug-20-13 AT 07:45PM (MST)[p]You said you have horse problems, but then say you have had your horses for over a year. If your riding with another rider, have them pass an continue on. Bet he won't stand there long.

 

[southslope82]

Watch your horse a little closer it might not be just an attitude adjustment, he might be hurting. When he walks make sure he isn't pawing or kicking towards his guts or stomach, that could be a sign of collicking or another form or stomach issues. I have a 6 year old percheron that does this similar type thing "stopping" I have to watch him close because he ties up, he has like full body muscle spasms and he will lock up tighter than hell and just stop. It has something to do with getting to many or not enough carbohydrates I have to give him only certain types of supplement/Grains. A vet could explain this a lot better than I could. Watch his urine too if it comes out a really dark color almost purple/brown looking it can be a sure sign of the spasms.
One more thing I know that is not good on a horse is after or really even before riding them hard. Cold water in large quantities is not good for them either than could hurt him too.. Watch him close and see if you notice any of these things if it is just an attitude adjustment I would recommend spurs and always let him no who is boss. Horses are a lot of pressure ,release to get what ya want. good luck

 

[dirtygrass]

Awesome suggestions, I have a month to get him going. He does great when he follows the younger horse just cant get to close. My vet comes next week for his health certification so I will have her check him out. I don't think he is hurting based on when he plays in his pasture.

My plan for this weekend is to:

Get on and ride if he locks up I will use some of the Parelli techniques I read about.
If that doesn't work I will use a riding crop and tap him on the ass continuously getting harder until he moves.
If that doesn't work I will start tapping him with spurs continuously getting harder until he moves.
If that doesn't work I will try to lead him and ride my other horse.

The good thing we will have 4 horses, if my friend leads up the trail he may follow. We are going on a scouting trip so we can try this before our hunt.

I can't separate my horses they have been together for five years and go $hit crazy when I tried to ride one and leave the other in the pasture.

Funny thing is he is a retired race horse turned trail horse used on a dude ranch for 5 years. The big bastard can really move and go places I really don't want too, we will get things worked out.

Thanks again for everyones help!

 

[nfh]

How far were you in on the trail when the horse stopped?
Was he worn out and out of shape or overworked on a steep trail?

Spurs will work but don't ram has hard as you can. Remember that horse wont forget if you jab him hard. Also try a stronger bit. If your using a hackmore bit then I suggest not using that. Its always a learning process. Every horse reacts diffferntly and may take time.

 

[dirtygrass]

The first time he stopped we were 1/2 mile up a trail, the second time we had went 150 yards. He is in way better shape than when I bought him. I have a friend that is a horse guy that is coming up with me this weekend to help.

Thanks again,

 

[dreaminbouthuntin]

if this is a sudden thing, I'm going to say you've got an underlying issue with the horse.
what I mean by that is something is wrong. Hooves, body, ect.. one of those is bothering him.

Spuring a horse like a bronc, IMO is done by people that dont have horsemanship skills and dont know how to handle a horse without laying into him with spurs or dont recognize a potential health issue.

I cant say without watching and looking the horse over to say for sure that is his problem, but after 30 years of training, showing, and breeding QH's.. it sounds like something with the horse isnt right rather than just him being stubborn.

Personally, I'd work him in an arena on a lounge line and get a good look at his movment in every gate. saddled and unsaddled.

check his hooves, back, hocks, teeth, girth area for sores, ect. also check his belly for sound.

how is his stool? and what kind of feed do you have him on? Alfalfa, or what type of grass? how is his water intake?

i'm also curious how old the horse is.. has he had his wolf teeth pulled, folated?

what type of saddle are you riding? bit? what type of cinch? have you changed your saddle pad or is there any stickers that could be pinching him.

i'm just going through all the things I would look at if one of my horses started doing something out of character.

also, how is he carrying his ears? pinned back, forward, droopy?

 

[Ropinfool]

"I can't separate my horses they have been together for five years and go $hit crazy when I tried to ride one and leave the other in the pasture.

Funny thing is he is a retired race horse turned trail horse used on a dude ranch for 5 years. The big bastard can really move and go places I really don't want too, we will get things worked out."

so they're really spoiled!! best thing is find somebody who's pretty handy with horses to help you. most spoiled horses can be fixed. get some help before you start using spurs, etc. before you end up getting hurt.

 

[we_B_huntin]

a lot of good advice here. could be cinch bound. Stop, loosen the saddle, move the saddle around, tighten cinch then lift both front legs up toward his chin as far as you can comfortably. because it could be so many different things if all else fails have a knowledgeable horseman go with you and help you figure out whats wrong.

 

[BDR]

I work with and train horses in the mountain and in the arena one thing you can try is breaking his front feet to the right and then to the left like your turning them once you get those feet moving use the end of a switch, lead rope to keep them moving once they get going keep it going. As far as the one horse leading and the other not wanting to that's an issue of what called " pecking Order" or who's the boss and it some times never changes. just remember to pick your battles and deal with them in a safe place spurs are a last resort don't use them much they end up getting you in a place that can get you hurt or end up you lookin for your horse instead of hunting. Good luck PM me if you need any other help.
"GONE FISHIN WILL BE BACK FOR HUNTIN
SEASON"

 

[nickman]

Some "kindly, gentle, cutesy" responses on here.

OPINIONS: Everybody is entitled to their own.

You need to have a horse vet look your horse over and if all is well, get your spurs and a quirt and re-index the animals thinking.

There are few things on the planet more "wrong" than an unruly horse in the back country.........or ANYWHERE, for that matter, but a back country hunting trip is filled with unpredictables.......your horse should not contribute to that.

"Been there, done that, and bled all over the T-shirt!"

While very entertaining, they can present a serious danger to you and the other people and animals in your trail crew. Under the best of circumstances, even a trail-wise, well behaved horse is a ton of responsibility.

To begin a trip with a mount, that you are not 100% confident can be controlled, is foolish and irresponsible.

The horse is either dependable or he is dog food. You should probably listen to your cowboy friends advice on this.......it's how they make a living.

"Being an idiot is NOT an art form. Give it up!"

 

[destroyer350]

People don't have horse problems, Horses have people problems!

Meaning, if you take your horse to a more knowledgable horseman take some lessons with your horse, it will take more than one ride to fix any problems and if you don't learn or are not willing to learn how to keep them fixed, you may want to move on. Adding spurs or a club with little knowledge may give you a lesson you don't want to learn the hard way.

But I will admit it would be fun to watch!!

 

[hilltophunter]

At 11 years of age or so if the horse has been used pretty hard he may be having early signs of navicular. It may not be a mental issue or anything like that if he has always rode out on trails for you and then just decided this one day to stop. Sometimes the first signs of legs/foot issues in horses is in the mountains if your riding uphill and they start to bauch(spelling?) on you. If he has always been a good minded horse and always been good to deal with I would bet he is having some issues in his legs, pasterns, navicular bone, stifle, or even higher in his back end. You may want to at least run him to the vet and have him x-rayed to check for early signs of navicular.

If he checks out ok with the vet then the problem may be that you are new to horses its you not the horse. Sometimes it takes a little pressure to push them through something and not let him know that he can shut down on you any time he feels like it. The problem only gets worse if you let it happen and don't correct it quick. Try riding with spurs and if he locks up on you lay them to him and over and under his ass with your riens until he moves out. He may crow hop forward a little if he is an awnery horse but he will get the idea pretty quick. Also, if you are riding the horse to hard in the hills without a chance to blow every once in a while any horse will lock up if they are spent. (just thought I'd mention that since your new to horses).

If he is a stubborn and misserable to be around SOB I would suggest with you being new to horses that you should sell him and go buy a good one. There are too many good horses out there on the market to be feeding and dealing with a knot head.

 

[hilltophunter]

Oh and I forgot to mention that I didn't mean kick his ribs in with the spurs when I said lay the spurs to him. But you do need to apply gentle pressure first and then increase the pressure if you don't get a satisfactory response. Also, you need to ride him with spurs at home if your loping circles or whatevery you do to ride him in town so that you know he has been exposed to spurs. if the spurs don't move him forward then the reins across the ass are a pretty good reinforcement.

Don't let some of the people on here fool you. Horses aren't dogs. Never hit or beat a horse, but sometimes you need to be firm and show them you are in charge. The more you grope them and spoil them the worse they act. Honestly I've only seen a few decent minded saddle horses that were x-race horses. Usually their early life racing experience added to being bred for speed instead of their mind and trainablility is a bad overall combination. Hopefully you ended up with a decent one. Be carefull those race horses are tall and can run like hell if they decide to bolt. The ground is usually a further fall with them too.

 

[2_Point]

Was the horse shod between the good rides and the stall ride? Seen them tender after shoeing and it can take a couple weeks to get over it.

Why did the ranch sell a reliable dude horse in its prime? My guess is there is a reason and you might be finding it.

Bute him up before the next ride. If he rides out well then you can take him to the vet. If he stalls then it isn't early navicular or another health issue. Vets are too expensive to visit on a whim.

Some guys believe in training horses and some believe in breaking horses. Just depends on the horse which works best. I'd use a switch before I used spurs. Harassing their hip is less likely to cause problems in the saddle.

 

[nickman]

LAST EDITED ON Aug-24-13 AT 08:52AM (MST)[p]>
>
>
>SMH at this post.. I may
>change your name to 'Jerk
>and Spur'. Nothing more pathetic
>than a wanna be horseman
>that can't get his horse
>to do what he wants
>due to lack of horsemanship
>skills, just lay the spurs
>to him. huh cowboy..
>
>that's a damn good way to
>get your butt thrown and
>further injured.
>
>With that said, the spurs purpose
>is to be an extention
>of your heal to gently
>communicate, not to jam him
>with.


Thats nice......Name calling and adding words to my post that I never even eluded to. Brilliant!

I am 66 years old and up until the last 13 years, I have always kept from 1 to 15 horses/mules. Most of my family still keeps them.
My family operated a working ranch on the day I was born, and I don't remember my first horseback ride, or pack trip into the Sierra with livestock.
We held Forrest Service contracts for trail crews, packed hunters, fishermen and nature fakers for years......many of my relatives are still involved, although I don't know why, with all the BS regs today.

Back in the 60's, we actually captured young mustangs in Nevada and broke them to pack stock.......or sold them to "feeders".
I probably learned to cold shoe horses, long before I had a drivers license and was maybe 16 when I was first turned loose with the responsibility of a back country trip with a dozen animals and trail ride dudes.

I have NEVER made a horse bleed from abuse.....although they have made me bleed MANY times. I have doctored, dentist, birthed, buried, branded and put down WAY more horses and mules than I care to remember.

I am willing to bet that my family has spent enough on vet bills and farrier fees, to put a couple of the vets kids thru med school.

I have lost one or two due to the inherent dangers of packing in general, but not from any situation that I had control of.

Now, I readily admit that I am "old school" and have used some heavy handed methods to break and train these animals. They are NOT house pets. They are big, powerful and dangerous, and can get "stupid" in a hurry.....and until they learn and remember who is the boss, you better not ever trust one.

Spurs and a switch are simply reminders that YOU are paying attention, some horses need them, some don't. I have spurs that fit my tennis shoes.

You can "horse whisper" them if you want. I don't care.

The problem with that school of thought, is that the horse NEVER learns the down side to non compliance. So when the time comes....and it will... that you desperately need him to instantly obey your command, he may decide to do what HE wants........"horse wreck!". They are NOT great thinkers in an emergency situation.

My whole point in my replies was that the horse needs to know who is in charge, that testing that authority is not going to be an option and if that level of understanding is not reached, get a different horse......or get a doctor.

 

[Gator]

Get a riding mule.

"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
>[Font][Font color = "green"]Life member of
>the MM green signature club.[font/]

 

[dirtygrass]

Weekend went pretty well. Stayed on him for a long time squeezing my legs and lightly tapping him on the ass with a lead rope. After a few hours he got the idea and just squeezing got him to move.

I miss-spoke earlier when I said I was new to horses. I have been riding horses for a long time but they have always been other peoples horses. I am new to horse ownership and the training aspect. I did pick up a set of blunt spurs if I need them.

He does great while following, my sister rode my other horse in the lead just to get him to move and everything went well. We stopped and switched me to the lead and he would not move so I sat on him and squeezed and smacked until he moved. I also broke his feet left and right to get him to move which worked. I have three days to work with him this weekend, I think we will be good.

Thanks again for all the help.

 

[pookiebar]

The worst thing you could have ever done was get off and lead him. Now he thinks it is a game. "If I stop in the middle of the trail this heavy POS on my back will get off and I will get a break" that is what he is thinking now.

So you have to break that habit in a bad way. Spurs are a good idea. Once he starts moving you gotta ride him hard, I mean wear his a$$ out. Then he will begin to associate "If I stop in the middle of the trail for no reason, I will get my AZZ worked off. So I better not stop and be a stuborn jerk."

Best of luck to you.

Oh and once he is broken of the bad habit you shouldn't need the spurs anymore.

 

[dirtygrass]

Update, went to spurs, didn't kick him just a squeeze with my thighs if he didn't go squeeze with thighs and spurs and he went. Touched him twice with the spurs no another problem all day yesterday or today.

Thanks again for the advice.