Karpowitz retirement

wileywapati

Very Active Member
Messages
1,808
I swear I heard the other day that Jim was getting
close to retiring. I'm not 100% but if this is true it may be a good time to try and get away from what many perceive to be a "Good Old Boy's Club"

Can anybody confirm that Jim is indeed retiring??






2010 TOTALS
P.E.T.A. = 0 HUNTERS GONE
UTAH WILDLIFE BOARD = 13,000 HUNTERS GONE
 
Did you not read the letter he wrote to RMEF? I think he just submitted a letter of retirement or resignation. One of the two.

AFTER THAT LETTER, I WANT HIM OUT!!!
 
i bet ol don peay is gonna be applying! get the worst man for the ailing wildlife. just like we got the worst man in office for the ailing economy.
 
+1 robinland hes a peach

avatar_2528.jpg
 
Now go on the other thread and read the rebuttal letter Mr. Allen sent back dated today. It makes him look real bad to the point that if he can retire he better put in his paperwork, LOL!
 
He's got to be getting close ..
I first met him 20 years ago , 1992 , when he was in Price .
He had well over a dozen years in the DWR then ..

4aec49a65c565954.jpg
 
Are you kidding me?

Slam SFW, Slam the Expo, Slam the Utah Model, and now slam Jim Karpowitz???

Since Jim has been involved in Managing Utah's Big Game and other rolls including Director we have seen Elk Herds grow from 20,000 to over 70,000. Thanks Jim. We have seen a 500% increase in Big Horn Sheep. We have abundant Moose, Goat, and Bison. We have over 1 million acres of habitat rehabilitation. We have a predator management plan that will along with habitat allow the Mule Deer Herds the needed relief to grow and thrive in the habitat.

Jim has received a number of awards from Conservation Groups and other State's Agencies for his outstanding wildlife management.

Jim, please ignore these ridiculous attacks and accept my apology on their behalf. They are obviously swayed by other issues and have no idea what a blessing you have been to Utah's wildlife and sportsmen.

You guys want a fight? Well now you have one! I encourage every sportsman or woman who has received benefit to at least stand up for a great man who has done a great job. It doesn't matter if you agree with Conservation Tags or Expo Tags or whatever but you would be wrong for not supporting Jim Karpowitz for all he has done for you and your quality of life in the outdoors.

One more thank you to Jim Karpowitz!


R. Todd Abelhouzen
SFW Executive Advisory Board
 
ABE,

You need to understand a few points.

My 1st, elk can grow like a weed. I dont think that any one person or group has made that happen. Elk can adapt to almost any and every environment. But what has happened to the deer under his belt. Look at the cyote problem under his belt. All of this not ones owne fault or praise for what has happened with the animals.

2nd point. When an organization post a letter asking to do what is right with the rest of the organizations, by making your taxes available to all to see and not hide them, and then for Jim to write a letter to RMEF asking them to appologize to that organization (sfw) that is taking the heat, IT DOES NOT LOOK GOOD! RMEF did not name states or organizations, if I remember right. They jsut asked for all to do what is right. Then you get jim and SFW getting on here and blasting him for it, that to me sounds like a smoking gun like a..a...a we didnt do anything wrong.

Come on ABE, You cant pick sides like that when you are serving the public. It make him (jim) look like he has been spooning in bed with SFW. It wouldnt blow my mind that something comes out that he has been recieving "gifts" under the table from SFW. NOT SAYING HE IS. But I would not be suprised. Maybe he is recieving more of a gift in bed spooning than we really know. All joking aside, I know he has done good, a lot of good. Same as SFW, but there is a shady side I dont like.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-22-12 AT 11:44AM (MST)[p]ABUNDANT MOOSE???? no cow tags, Ogden river bull down to 4 tags for the public??? maybe if the DWR did not trade them away for turkeys in COLORADO, THEY HAVE ABUNDANT MOOSE NOW.. deer herds at a level that is SHOCKING for most hunters.... the general public has seen there chance of obtaining a tag diminish every year, except the CWMU's and landowner tags never take a hit...if i was a operator of a CWMU, a landowner who receives permits or a guy like you who relies on the state to give them tags to auction off to provide the capital to keep them in business i would agree....but for you to apologize for us common people is BS...

you belong to a NON-PROFIT agency that ALLOWS NO ACCESS TO YOUR BOOKS...give me a break...between the Alaska "issue", Don Peay backing out of the debate, the wolf "issue" and the lack of transperity within SFW.....and lastly Jim suggesting the RMEF apologize to the SFW for asking for what is right, to have OPEN BOOKS to account for the money.....give me a break

R. Todd Abelhouzen SFW Executive Advisory Board, please dont apologize for me to anyone....


How to start an argument online:
1. Express an opinion
2. Wait
 
Treedagain, I was wondering if you know why the moose are going down hill. Have you checked. They are suffering from lack of psylliun. They also have a parasite. These are new things that just being known. Now the DWR is working on a way to fix that. They get the psyllium from plants and we do not have the plants that they need. The deer hurt was doing good till 1080 was banned. That is when the coyotes and other preditors became bigger in numbers. Then they were overhunted. Now the division is trying to fix it. Cut hunters or what ever. Now maybe the Nevada DWR has a better way. No income so they are doubling the deer tags. I am sure there way will increase their deer herd that has been going down hill also. Lets see in a few years which method works the best. When was the last time you checked SFW's web page. Transparity info there. Everyone keeps talking and no one bothers to look.
 
ABE you lost all credibility when you called Sportsmen, "terrorists" You also didn't do any favors for SFW either. Sportsmen have the right to know where the money from public tags are going.

SFW wouldn't be very successful without public tags. You can't make a lot of money cooking hamburgers at Costco for a fundraiser.

Maybe since were terrorists then we should take away the public tags that SFW receives and send SFW packing.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-22-12 AT 12:03PM (MST)[p]Tweety bird, are you from Springville?
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-22-12 AT 12:32PM (MST)[p]Birdman, you need to stop drinking the purple KOOL-AID....your saying that the transplanting of moose did not have an adverse effect on the moose herd in the OGDEN unit???

Birdie i would encourage you to go back to your handlers at SFW and have them open their books to Randy Newberg and put to rest all the allegations of mis-doing in the SFW house

BTW, Nevadas increase in tag #s was in responce to biological data not money issues. your just pissed that you cant get your hands on a few of those tags to auction off to increase the payroll.


How to start an argument online:
1. Express an opinion
2. Wait
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-22-12 AT 01:03PM (MST)[p]What a bunch of BS! Apologizing for a State of Utah employee who shouldn't have written the letter to the RMEF under the State of Utah letterhead in the first place when the RMEF letter was addressed to organizations and not State agencies, tells me one big thing. The DWR Director, no matter what he's done or how good you say he's been over the years, needs to retire or resign. That letter, when read by anybody with a little common sense, shows he is in deep with the SFW and their tag scheme and agrees with what is going on at the present time. He needs to go when that philosophy is so against the NAM and now he wants the RMEF to apologize for asking that all organizations be transparent so the public knows where all the money made from the sale of public tags they're given is used. Screw him and the whole DWR if there are more tied to SFW at the umbilical cord like it appears in that letter. Abe shot his wad in those first couple posts calling us terrorists, etc., so screw him too as far as I'm concerned. And if Birdman comes back with one more stupid post screw him too. I'm way over here in MI and this whole GD thing now has me more than a little pissed. If all the Utah guys who don't like what is going on aren't feeling just as mad as I am, then they should be and should do something about it! Sign that UWC petition and take it out on every friggin street corner and get thousands of signatures because it sounds like that is what it will take to rid UTAH of this plague.
 
Abe is right, jim is one of the good guys. he has devoted his entire life to the program and the wildlife of utah. after reading some of the threads on here and on the rmef letter cearly some of these folks know more about his job and and what he has done than he does. I personaly have pulled all support of the RMEF as they are just a "habitat group". Yellowstone national park is some of the best elk habitat on the planet, anyone taken a drive through there recently not many elk. You can have the greatest habitat in the world but if the ungulates are being eaten faster than they can repopulate what exactly have you accomplished? The northern herd is down from 21,000 to under 4,000. This is exactly why the anti hunting groups keep advancing their cause because we as sportsman just cant get along. wow i think i'll go back to work now as it will be a better use of my time.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-22-12 AT 01:29PM (MST)[p]I really hope you SFW boys/gals, whatever...realize everytime you open your mouths or type on these threads....the more you sound like idiots. Really!!!! Please pull your blinders off and look outside the box. Use some common sense.

I know it's hard for some to admit when they're wrong but I've been told and I'm sure most of you have heard the saying.

If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck....it's probably a duck.

Just sayin.

ABE your comments make you sound retarded. Birdman....Everytime you type on your computer you sound retarded.

You need to except that the Utah public hunters are SICK AND TIRED OF THE BS. We're not gunna sick back and let this crap happen anymore. Your boat is sinking....Fast!
 
I don't care who you are. SFW,RMEF, The director of the DWR....If your in bed with some group getting cut backs, bonuses, cash under the table....then you gotta go. It's that simple.

It's time to clean house of all this crap.
It's sucks that there is so many people/groups fighting each other but somebody needs to stand up for whats right. If any group/organization is directly related to having a negative or positive impact on the herds based on their decisions is not looking out for the interests and common welfare of the herds and the public, then you gotta go. It doesn't matter who you are or what your position is.

How can these herds get better when there is some who are too busy thinking about themselves and how they can benefit instead of doing the right thing for the animals? It's simple, they can't get better.

Any of you would be a fool to think that some high position people are not concerned about their paycheck, buying there next boat, etc. by going to bed with some group and selling some tags that they shouldn't be selling or doing things that they shouldn't.

There have already been evidence of crooked people in high positions getting caught in other states. Look at Corey Rossi in Alaska... You honestly think Corey is the only one? Or has been the only one? All it takes is one leech to get a position and they'll open the door for all the other leeches. They open the political door to all their leeching,greedy,power hungry friends to milk on the systems that were put in place to help the herds.. Not themselves. It's sad. It really is.
It's gotta stop if these herds are going to get better.
 
He should get FIRED with NO retirement package offered after he OPENLY admitted he works for the freaking Con org.$ and does not represent the tax paying public in Utah that pays his freaking salary and benefit package.

You $FW appoligist simply do not get it--do ya?

Every freaking state around us has had HUGE increases of all species/sans a disease issue on Big Horn Sheep....in a few states.

Look at our Utah dink elk now...

Look at our Utah dink deer....

Look at our Utah dink Desert Rams.....

Oh yeh---take your commi$$ion you $FW---workforce type guys....

And go to church on Sunday--right?

Robb
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-22-12 AT 02:10PM (MST)[p]I met with Jim Karpowitz today and we had a lengthy discussion. The meeting occurred at his invitation and I accepted. We had a good conversation about convention permits and accountability. We also discussed the recent correspondence between him and David Allen of RMEF. I told him that I was dissapointed in the position he took in response to RMEF's statement, and he explained his reasoning for issuing his letter. As with most of these types of meetings, we agreed on some things and agreed to disagree on others. We did not resolve the core underlying issue of accountabilty and transparency with regard to the convention permits but the meeting was still productive. I appreciate Jim for inviting me to his office.

I know may people on both sides have strong feelings on this issue. However, please keep your comments limited to the facts. I strongly disagree with the position Jim took in his letter to David Allen but let's not confuse that with unsupported allegations of kickbacks and bribes. Unsupported allegations and personal attacks distract the attention from the real issue and frankly are not helpful to the debate.

That being said, I remain convinced as ever that the only way we will fix this problem and obtain tranparency with regard to the accounting of funds generated from the convention permits is to push forward UWC's proposed amendment to the rule. Please take the time to sign the petition in favor of the amendment and send your comments to members of the Wildlife Board and RACs.

Hawkeye

Browning A-Bolt 300 Win Mag
Winchester Apex .50 Cal
Mathews Drenalin LD
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-22-12 AT 02:29PM (MST)[p]>LAST EDITED ON Jun-22-12
>AT 02:10?PM (MST)

>
>I met with Jim Karpowitz today
>and we had a lengthy
>discussion. The meeting occurred
>at his invitation and I
>accepted. We had a
>good conversation about convention permits
>and accountability. We also
>discussed the recent correspondence between
>him and David Allen of
>RMEF. I told him
>that I was dissapointed in
>the position he took in
>response to RMEF's statement, and
>he explained his reasoning for
>issuing his letter. As
>with most of these types
>of meetings, we agreed on
>some things and agreed to
>disagree on others. We
>did not resolve the core
>underlying issue of accountabilty and
>transparency with regard to the
>convention permits but the meeting
>was still productive. I
>appreciate Jim for inviting me
>to his office.
>
>I know may people on both
>sides have strong feelings on
>this issue. However, please
>keep your comments limited to
>the facts. I strongly
>disagree with the position Jim
>took in his letter to
>David Allen but let's not
>confuse that with unsupported allegations
>of kickbacks and bribes.
>Unsupported allegations and personal attacks
>distract the attention from the
>real issue and frankly are
>not helpful to the debate.
>
>
>That being said, I remain convinced
>as ever that the only
>way we will fix this
>problem and obtain tranparency with
>regard to the accounting of
>funds generated from the convention
>permits is to push forward
>UWC's proposed amendment to the
>rule. Please take the
>time to sign the petition
>in favor of the amendment
>and send your comments to
>members of the Wildlife Board
>and RACs.
>
>Hawkeye
>


+1
Again, a level head. Thanks Hawkeye

I understand the passion of everyone but the false accusations make some of you guys look like total idiots! If the shoe fits....

THANKS FOR YOUR SERVICE Mr Karpowitz!
Zeke
 
Jim Karpowitz has been a very very good Director and is a great person. Anyone in any public appointed position gets unfair criticism. Jim has pressure from many many people that only represent the minority of how Utah sportsmen really believe. But the squeaky wheel usual gets the grease

JIM has great integrity and overall wants wildlife to flourish under his watch. Jim and I have had MANY meetings on Utahs wildlife and Mule deer in general. We have not always agreed on things but I have NEVER thought Jim was bought off to push an agenda.

Whether Jim is retiring or not does not matter, what needs to happen is Jim and the DWR need to fully endorse and support the UWC proposal on the convention permits. This must happen as the convention permit revenue is not being used as was promised or expected.

Jim we have been friends a long long time. Please fix the problem of the convention permits. You know I was the ONLY person not with the division to travel to EVERY RAC meeting and push the convention rule through as the General Manager of the MDF. The rule is flawed and it is giving a black eye to the division, the wildlife board and Utah in general.


Jim as one of the 3 people to create the convention and its permits I am asking you to right the wrong that has come of it.

This is a public resource that has ZERO accountability and is being ABUSED under your watch. You can fix it if you choose.

Thanks for all you have done and will continue to do as the DWR director.

Tony Abbott
The next buck to have a fawn will be the
1st.
 
Great post Tony! Having retired after 30+ years working for the State of Michigan, I know where you're coming from and it's great to hear your comments about Jim. However, after reading his letter and most of us not knowing him at all, it did not give a positive reflection on his character IMHO. As you stated in your post, he should be able to correct this situation or at least use his position to press for a positive change as to how the tag revenues are handled so as to lay this issue to rest. Let's hope that is forthcoming ASAP!
 
"I understand the passion of everyone but the false accusations make some of you guys look like total idiots! If the shoe fits...."


Plus ya need to add....

"You $FW appoligist simply do not get it--do ya?"

Robb
 
Right on TOPGUN.

After reading the letter, I would think that there is a little back door going on. But I hope not and hope that Tony is 100 % right with his comments about Jim. I bet he is a good honest guy. But the letter left me thinking twice.
 
Here's the letter:

19 June 2012
Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation.
Dear Mr. Allen

I read with interest your recent news release entitled "RMEF calls for Transparency on State Special Big Game Permits." I am concerned with your statement in the news release that "questions have surface about how funds generated from these permits are allocated and spent." This statement could be interpreted by some readers that Utah has not been transparent. With RMEF having been a major participant in Utah's Conservation Permit Program, I am sure you know that neither implication is true. I believe you owe the public and the other conservation organizations in the program an explanation of your statements.

As you are aware, Utah has two types of "Special big game permits." Conservation permits are
auctioned at banquets, fundraisers and other special events sponsored by various conservation groups including the RMEF. More than 90 percent of all the proceeds go towards projects such as habitat enhancement, transplants, aerial surveys, radio telemetry studies, education efforts and research projects that directly benefit the species for which the permit was issued. The conservation group that auctions the permits may retain 10 percent of the proceeds to cover administrative costs. We do not question how the 10 percent is specifically used and I can see nothing in your financial report that explains how the RMEF uses these funds.

Convention permits are the second type of "special big game permit." They are not auctioned, Rather, they are a block of permits made available for a public drawing that is held in connection with a "wildlife convention" within the state that is sponsored by multiple conservation organizations. The conservation groups that host this annual event and conduct the drawing are allowed to collect a $5 fee for each application to pay for expenses associated with the drawing. If any additional funds remain, the groups use the money to support and promote wildlife at their discretion. In the past, the convention groups have provided information to the public showing projects they have funded with proceeds from the drawing, even though they are not required to do so. I think it is important to point out that the RMEF was instrumental in promoting and supporting the Conservation Permit Program when it was originally proposed.

You also need to know that both the Conservation and the Convention Permit Programs undergo an internal Audit each year, These audits are made available to the public in an open public meeting of our Wildlife Board. In addition to this annual audit, the Conservation Permit Program has been audited by the State Auditor, the Legislative Auditors Office and the Attorney General's office since I have been the Director. There is no other program in this agency that has been more thoroughly audited and scrutinized than the Conservation Permit Program.

Finally, let me say just how important the Conservation and Convention Permit Programs are to wildlife in Utah. In the case of conservation permits, the program has proven invaluable in enhancing and expanding our big game populations throughout the state. Since the advent of the Conservation Permit Program every big game species in Utah with the exception of mule deer has increased dramatically, and it is conservation permit dollars that are now funding large scale research projects designed to identify and correct the problems associated with our deer herd.

Conservation permit dollars have also funded our massive Watershed Restoration Initiative which has now resulted in the restoration of over 700,000 acres of big game habitat at a cost of over $76 million dollars in the past seven years. Most of the conservation permit dollars are now being directed to this huge conservation initiative.

The Convention Permit Program has also resulted in additional revenue to the state of Utah and to the Division of Wildlife Resources. In February 2011, the Western Hunting & Conservation Expo---and the opportunity to apply for up to 200 permits-- brought more than 30,000 people to downtown Salt lake City. Nonresident attendees paid for 24,567 hotel nights and spent $10,841,205 while visiting the expo. Conventions permits are a large part of the expo's popularity and tangibly benefit Utah's economy. We believe that the convention has the also greatly elevated the notoriety of Utah's
big game program and dramatically increased interest and participation in our regular big game drawing.

In conclusion, I would just like to say that I am concerned that a major conservation group such as the RMEF would issue a news release critical of the transparency of these important programs without first contacting the states and getting the correct information. We were especially surprised that your state representative did not provide you with the facts before the news release. If you or your staff would like to discuss this issue further, I would be glad to talk to you.

Sincerely,
Director of Utah Division of Wildlife Resources.
 
Jim Karpowitz has bettered Utah wildlife and Utah hunters have benefited from his involvement in our wildlife's management.

I may not agree with his entire letter to RMEF, but lets not confuse this letter and the integrity of the man. He is one of the GREAT guys. He has fought for the opportunity for hunters to hunt. He also implemented the very strategy which produces the elk opportunities of today (and don't associate the rut-hunts/age objectives to that-- those come from lobbying). He has done so much good it would take too long to list. And of course, he has made some mistakes-- which he will readily admit!

Jim-- or any biologist-- should not have to put up with the social BS of the moment. I fear the future will be much more bleak with a different man at the wheel. You guys who think he is "bought off" by SFW have no clue to the situation. I have sat in numerous meetings with the Director and watched him stand against the special interests so many claim he is part of.

Tony and Hawkeye both make good posts which I can agree with.

Jim-- Thanks for your overall performance in being a steward of Utah's wildlife.

Mike C.
 
The guy may be as you say. However, reading his letter as a Government executive of the highest level defending the Utah system when the RMEF letter wasn't even speaking of government agencies does not shed a positive image of the person penning the letter. I am not saying there are bribes or anything else going on, but when he is working for all of the people of Utah he should not be writing letters defending special interest organizations, regardless of which ones they are!
 
Even "GEAT" guys, can end up ruing their own legacy, if they let ego's, or arrogance get in the way.



I wanted to take a scalp,but the kill was not mine.
 
I just got off the phone with our SLC TV media types--almost 15/45 minutes of talking divided/to each of them.

I shared links and 'Letters' from both our Con Org DWR Director and our highly respected RMEF letter.

To a --News Room Person-- on each channel----Public Salaried employee said What??

'As The World Turns' M&M soap box......

Robb

PS--raise your advertising fees Brian!! It is all about the Moment!
 
I think it's important that this doesn't turn into character defamation. This is about fiduciary responsibility. Though recent Statements are contrary to many of our philosophical views, putting bus tracks on people who are in a position to assist with righting things is not a prudent thing to do. Again, attack the results and the actions all you want, but we are all human beings and deserve a certain level of respect and compassion.

We will all sleep better at night and maintain our personal decency if we all remain respectful on a personal level.

.

http://unitedwildlifecooperative.org
 
Once again , here we are.
It all boils down to ' politics, politics, politics' ..
Too many fingers in the pie ..

Hell YA Jim's a good guy!

He's devoted his life to wildlife!

No matter what changes are made , There's NO WAY to make
even a slight majority satisfied with management practices ..

That's just how it is .. Unfortunately!

4aec49a65c565954.jpg
 
Quit Stirrin it wiley!



[font color=red size=redsize=18"face"]SHOW THEM TO ME![/font]
If You Love Your Country,SHOW THEM TO ME!


I've got Wild Honey Tree's and Crazy Little Weeds growin around my Shack!
These Dusty Roads ain't streets of gold but I'm happy right where I'm at!
All these Perty little Western Belles are a Country Boys Dream!
They ain't got Wings or MM Halo's but they sure look good to me!
 
The few times I've met Jim I would say he does have a strong desire to better Utah's wildlife.
With the set up of the Wildlife Board and how the UDWR has to get approval from the state legislators for almost anything they and how Don/SFW has an in or sway with many of those members I would not be the least surprised if Jim was leaned on to send this letter.
Not saying I agree with the letter but he may not have been the sole author of the letter...
 
+1 mtnrunner260

That is what I thought when I first read his letter....

Pressured into writing it and sending it.

Robb
 
Exactly what I thought as well since it sounded more like it came off the desk of DP than a State of Utah DWR Executive!
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-23-12 AT 01:38PM (MST)[p]Wow. I get my own thread on MM - pretty good for a dumb wildlife biologist! Thanks to all who don't think I am the devil himself. As for retirement, I can go at any time. I have worked 34 years and it gets a little harder every year to work in the public arena. Since, I have my own named string I thought I would take this opportunity to say a few things.

You know it's pretty discouraging to get bashed by sportsmen for whom I have worked tirelessly to expand hunting opportunities for over 34 years. I went to work for DWR because I am a hunter and fisherman myself and because I wanted to see better hunting opportunities in Utah. So despite the bashing I have carried on.

Let me just take a minute and tell you about a few of the changes I have seen during my career. When I first went to work for the Division as a trainee in 1976 there were 12,000 elk in Utah there are now 72,000; there were less than 1,000 bighorn sheep by 1984 and now there are more than 5,000; there were very few moose in 1976 and now there are over 4,000; there were no mountains goats in 1976 and now there are more than 3,000; there very few wild turkeys and now there are more than 20,000; and there are also many more bison and pronghorn than were in 1976. However, there are fewer mule deer than there were in 1976 and that is a huge disappointment to me. I guess that is why I insisted we make mule deer recovery a top priority. Since becoming director seven years ago, more than 100 million dollars have been spent on that effort.

So how did this all happen? I can tell you it didn't just happen by itself. And it didn't happen because of Jim Karpowitz - that not my point. It happened because of two things -because we have great employees at DWR and because we have had strong partnerships with conservation organizations. Without either one of those it would not have happened.

During my carrier I have been with wildlife biologists as we have hung out of helicopters capturing bighorns, moose, bison, elk and mountain goats to transplant them to new areas. For the first part of my career I spent so much time trapping and transplanting elk that I thought I was a truck driver rather than a biologist! But the results have been amazing and many people have had fantastic hunting opportunities they never thought they would have as a result of these efforts.

It also happened because of strong partnerships with conservation organizations such as SFW, UFNAWS, MDF, RMEF, NWTF and others. I appreciate the efforts of all of these groups who helped make this great success story happen. These groups have not only raised huge amounts of funding for wildlife, but they have helped fight the political battles that were so important to the expansion of big game in Utah.

There have been many great sportsmen in these groups who have helped wildlife over the years, but I want to take a minute and recognize one sportsman who has taken a lot of heat on MM, but has been very instrumental in the expansion of wildlife in Utah over the years. I know I will get bashed for this, but it is high time somebody stood up and recognized all the good Don Peay has done for wildlife over the years.

I want to give you just a few examples of the contribution Don has made to wildlife over the years. Some 25 ago, I was young biologist trying desperately to preserve the last of the bighorn sheep that were dwindling fast in Utah. Money for sheep work was non-existent. That is when I first met Don Peay at the first organizational meeting of the Utah Chapter of FNAWS. Don helped get that organization started and then proceeded to raise large amounts of funding for bighorn sheep work. With that funding and with the support of Don and his group, we moved several hundred bighorns over the next two decades planting the seeds of bighorn expansion across their native range in Utah. I will always be grateful that that Don and UFNAWS came along when help was needed. We now have 5,000 bighorns and hundreds of sportsmen have had the opportunity to hunt bighorns in Utah including me and my son.

Throughout the 80s and 90s Utah was also involved in a massive elk herd expansion effort. We have 6 times as many elk in Utah now because of an aggressive transplant effort and because of a lot of hard work. One person I could always count on when I needed help fight the political battles was Don Peay. He was always there at the old Board of Big Game Control meetings and now the RAC and Wildlife Board meetings to speak for more elk in Utah. There are many sportsmen groups who helped with this effort, but none more than SFW. Don has also been a big proponent of high quality elk and deer hunting and so have I. I did not think I would ever have the opportunity to kill a 380 bull or a 30 inch buck in Utah ? but I have.

Fast forward to 2008 when DWR desperately needed a hunting and fishing license increase ? many people helped with that effort, but at the eleventh hour when it appeared the increase was going down in flames, Don went to the capitol and convinced a key legislator that the fee increase and its accompanying bill had to pass. Had the bill not passed the DWR would be financially crippled right now following the collapse of the economy later that year.

Now a couple of recent examples ? in 2010 and 2011 two important bills worked their way through the legislature concerning the delisting of wolves in Utah. These bills sent a strong message to Washington that we are not going to stand idly by in Utah and watch wolves devastate our elk herds. The only sportsmen to come to the legislature to voice support for these bills were Don Peay and Clark Aposhian of the Utah Shooting Sports Council.

More recently, two important bills made their way through the 2012 legislature to increase funding by more than a million dollars for predator control in Utah. Three sportsmen groups were there to support these bills - SFW,BGF and MD. But, it is safe to say these bills would not have passed without Don.

My final example occured at the the last Wildlife Board meeting. On the agenda was the revision of the Statewide Elk Management Plan that called for an increase of elk on several units in the state. The only sportsman to stand and testify for this elk herd expansion was Troy Justeson of SFW.

So you can see from my perspective who is always there when I need help. There are many more examples of how Don has worked with the Division to do good things for wildlife. I have been accused of ?carrying the water for SFW? which is not true. They carry their own water very well. But, I can tell you who ?carries the water" for wildlife in Utah time and time again ? Don Peay. There are also many other sportsmen in Utah who have done great things for wildlife in Utah, but none more than Don.

Many people have the opinion that Don controls the Division of Wildlife Resources. Nothing could be further from the truth. Don and I have many disagreements and we often engage in heated discussions. But we have one thing in common, we want to expand and protect this great wildlife heritage in Utah for future generations.

Yes, Don is a great businessman and he has been successful in building several wildlife related businesses. But, I can tell you this - I have stood with Don Peay in the Book Cliffs and I have stood with Don on the steps of the Utah State Capitol. I know his heart and I now of his concern and love for wildlife.

So, there you have it ? I am sure the bashing of DWR and Don Peay will resume on MM. But you all have a choice ? you can roll up your sleeves and do something positive for wildlife or you can bash those who do. I know which will do the most for wildlife. I encourage you all to join the conservation organization of your choice and go to work for wildlife. There is nothing to be gained from tearing down other organizations. There are huge challenges facing wildlife in Utah and wildlife desperately needs your help and support. And, yes I will retire someday, but I will never quite working for wildlife.
 
Good info Jim...... Would you care to educate us regarding your position on the need for financial transparency and accounting for organizations obtaining funds from a public trust i.e. big game tags? Or do you feel this is already in place? If so I would honestly appreciate you providing us a better understanding of this issue......Terry
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-23-12 AT 01:50PM (MST)[p]I think there are very few that have any argument with the fact that Don and SFW have had a positive impact on wildlife in the State of Utah. It's the negative impact that is occurring that tends to diminish, if not totally eliminate that, in many people's minds and I would submit that that is just human nature at work. How much I don't know because I'm way over in the midwest in MI. The thing that most sportspersons are distressed about is the huge number of tags that are given to SFW/MDF with no accountability whatsover for the application/handling fees raised that goes to them. Your previous correspondence intimated that there was and it just needs to be tweeked a little, if I might use that word. It needs more than a little tweeking! It needs to be completey changed and I would hope you and the rest of the DWR and Board get behind and support the UWC initiative that is now in the petition stage to insure money goes where it should. I, myself, think that taking 200 tags out of the common man's pool offered at the EXPO is truly obscene because it lessens the chance in the draws for people who have invested many years and a lot of money, especially when a nonprofit organization pockets close to one million dollars a year from "handling fees" alone and can do whatever they want with it with no oversight whatsoever. IMHO, that needs to change, but if the tags remain at 200, at least the money raised from the sale needs to go back onto the ground to benefit all of Utah. Thanks for coming on here and sticking your neck out on the chopping block and good luck in your future, whether it be with the DWR or many years of a happy, healthy retirement!
 
THANK YOU JIM !
Once again,, I'm sorry to see "politics" so involved ..

I've said it before, I'll say it again ..
NO MATTER what changes are made in wildlife management ..
The majority will NEVER be satisfied !!



4aec49a65c565954.jpg
 
goofyelk stated: "NO MATTER what changes are made in wildlife management ..
The majority will NEVER be satisfied !!"

I really don't feel that it's the majority, but a certain minority that would never be happy even if they drew every difficult to draw tag in the same year!
 
Jim, don could open the books and it would shut alot of pie holes especially if there is nothing to hide. The tags are public tags and i personally feel the need to see where the funds went because unlike you i have never drawn a le deer or elk tag. I have 12 points for archery deer now and will probably never draw a le elk tag in my life, let alone shoot a 380 bull.

Like i said it could put an end to all the fighting unless they havent been on the up and up.

One thing ive learnd in my life is, nothing is more corrupt then politics.

Sorry for callin you a peach. I just felt your letter was on unappropriate for a public employee and further makes me feel there is some back door back slapping going on after reading it.

avatar_2528.jpg
 
It's on the other thread under RMEF wants transparency. It's out of place so just look for jimk about half way down.
 
Jim-

For somebody who never reads these forums, we have now received two posts from you in the last 24 hours. We apparently have your attention. Thank you for joining the discussion.

I tried to clarify this point during our meeting on Friday but given your last post I apparently did a very poor job. The vast majority of us understand and appreciate that you, Don, the DWR, SFW and MDF have done some wonderful things that benefit Utah sportsmen. For this we say thank you. However, that does not give you all a free pass on the issue of accountability and transparency with respect to the Conservation Permits. My comments and concerns regarding the Convention Permits are not a personal attack on you and Don. Most of the sportsmen I have spoken with feel the same way. We are simply pointing out a glaring problem that you, Don, the DWR, SFW and MDF have the ability to address. Please do not make our comments and concerns into something that they are not.

Your last post spent 17 paragraphs expounding on the achievements and successes that have taken place as a result of the efforts of both you and Don. You said nothing about the convention permits and the public?s request for transparency and accountability. You did not mention the proposal from the UWC to amend the Convention Permit rule. You have yet to say that you understand the frustrations and concerns of the average sportsmen on this issue. Those are the issues that are germane to the discussion. Everyone on both sides needs to focus their attention on the issue at hand. What we would really like to hear is your personal opinion and the DWR?s official position on the proposal circulated by the UWC to impose transparency and accountability requirements into the Convention Permit rule. So what is it? Where do you and the DWR stand on this issue? When we spoke on Friday, you stated that you had not yet formed an opinion on the UWC proposal. Please let us know when you have.

Thank you again for your service and feel free to stick around and chime in on some of the other threads regarding lighter issues.


Hawkeye

Browning A-Bolt 300 Win Mag
Winchester Apex .50 Cal
Mathews Drenalin LD
 
Forget the elk herd increase or sheep or bison. What about the cougar increase over the last 35 yrs?

Isn't that something to be proud of? Because Karpo has been instrumental in that also.

Just want to give credit where credit is due.
 
Jim let me first apologize for my unfair, unproven
Inference to an " old boys club" I have no proof
Only perception. In that case I probably should
Have kept my mouth shut. Let me also thank you
For 30+ years of service. Fact is that Jim K has
Made hunting better in Utah over his tenure.

That being said I feel there is a huge disconnect
Between the Division, The Wildlife Board and Utah's
Hunting public. I can also speak from my own opinion
That defending Don is only reinforcing the current
Perception. Would you be on this forum right now
If there wasn't a major issue to deal with??

This can all be handled very easily. Set up a meeting with
MDF and SFW a group of sportsmen will be present as well
As Randy, a certified CPA and we'll take the time needed
And do a thorough review of the financials pertaining only to the WHCE.
No non disclosure B. S. what comes out is for
The world to see. That's all anyone is asking for. We want
To know where roughly one million dollars of
Money generated from these tags is going. That's all.

When this whole concept was going through the
RAC process years ago we were told to " trust them"
Well for several years we have. Now it's time to
Verify.






2010 TOTALS
P.E.T.A. = 0 HUNTERS GONE
UTAH WILDLIFE BOARD = 13,000 HUNTERS GONE
 
Seems Director Karpowitz has done a good job of showing how things have happened in Utah during his career. A pattern very similar to what has happened in other states during the years he mentions, with all states having one or two species suffering as are the mule deer in Utah.

I struggle to see the difficulty the Director has in addressing calls from the masses for transparency. I struggle to see why he is so defensive when reasonable requests are made to non-profit groups benefiting from public resources - groups and individuals he feels compelled to defend in his letters, and now in his posts.

Continued dismissal of requests for transparency and accountability turns this post into a parade of praise. Nothing wrong with praising those doing good, just seems strange to have a continued pattern of showers for SFW and their paid agents, and no discussion about the topics at hand, or any praise for others who have done way more than SFW.

Rather than shower so much praise on a few individuals or groups, I would like to raise a toast to the larger group who has made a bigger difference than any single Director, any single non-profit leader, any hunting personality, or any auction tag buyer.

That would be the rank and file hunters, whose license fees and excise taxes provide such huge amounts to conservation and state agencies, as to make auction and raffle tag revenues look like chump change. It would be these non-paid volunteers who spend a huge portion of their spare time and limited money to improve the cause for all of us.

These people teach hunter ed courses; they are scout leaders; volunteers to fund raising committees; the labor that helps complete habitat projects; they attend legislative hearings or write letters to government leaders - The thankless stuff so necessary for wildlife conservation.

Collectively, these people, their licenses fees, excise taxes, volunteerism, and activism, have provided the platforms that allow Director Karpowitz and similar wildlife agency employees in all states to do the work that Director Karpowitz describes happening in Utah over the time of his career.

Yet, for some reason, that average person is often left out of the discussion. Their opinions are seldom solicited. They seldom receive much recognition. This recent post by the Director being a similar pattern, where a few people are painted as saviors, when the common guy is forgotten.

Though Director Karpowitz focuses his praise on Mr. Peay and SFW, deserving as any for positive work they might be responsible for, I suspect he would agree the greatest value is provided by the rank and file hunter.

As much as praise should be given to positive efforts mentioned by the Director, so should criticism follow when those same groups do damage to hunting and conservation. With that, I provide some examples that Mr. Karpowitz might be inclined to overlook.

Many have had encounters with Mr. Peay and his organizations, SFW and BGF. Such encounters do not allow for a long list of praise as Director Karpowitz posted.

Rather, the list of others who have encountered SFW is mostly negative, and unfortunately so. I wish my list was littered with items of praise, as more is accomplished when we are all on the same side, rather than opposing sides.

Director Karpowitz talks about the work of SFW in the national wolf delisting issue. His understanding reflects a version as told by SFW, a version not held by the majority involved in the process.

My version, as just one of many people deeply involved both regionally and nationally, for a much longer period than Mr. Peay, would show the efforts of SFW to be detrimental to the cause of state control over wolf management. No sense in re-hashing the gory details herein, other than to say SFW did more to hurt wolf delisting and more to fracture the hunting community than any group involved.

Another encounter would be from those Alaska hunters and those Alaska Game and Fish employees. Mr. Peay wrote in his column of Sportsmen's Voice, where he was proud to get the founder of Alaska SFW, and his close personal friend, Corey Rossi, appointed as the Director of Alaska Game and Fish.

The Director at that time, who held the same position Mr. Karpowitz holds in Utah, with an equally stellar career in wildlife and advocacy on behalf of Alaska hunters, was relegated to some far corner of the state, removed of his position, for no apparent reason. Unless, you consider being outside the SFW circle grounds for demotion and being inside the SFW circle as being grounds of promotion. Mr. Karpowitz's peer was replaced with a person having no single credential in wildlife management, biology, or administration of a state agency, and SFW publicly took credit for that event.

Most of you know, Mr. Rossi, the person Mr. Peay boasted as helping get appointed, resigned earlier this year in the face of double-digit charges of illegal hunting and illegal outfitting. Before doing so, Mr. Rossi dismantled many of the important wildlife programs in Alaska. And, as one final favor, he sent 4 of the 11 Alaska Governor's auction permits to SFW in Utah for their annual expo in February.

Another encounter with the work of Mr. Peay and SFW would be the effort of his Utah-funded franchise, Montana SFW. They have been on the wrong side of all the hunting and fishing legislation since forming two years ago, some of which would have cost tens of millions in hunter/angler dollars to our FWP agency. They lobbied for a bill that would have resulted in Federal control of wolves only weeks after MT and ID were granted control. SFW supports and funds politicians who do the most damage to access, conservation, and resident hunter/angler opportunity.

In Utah, you know well the strange position SFW took to change your stream access rules. Extremely peculiar that an organization receiving so much public inurement would lobby against the cause of the public angler.

We all know of the most recent Arizona franchise attempts, where Arizona SFW tried to take 300 of the best AZ permits and raffle them off in a manner identical to the Utah model, where not a single penny of the proceeds would go to AZ Game and Fish. Though Mr. Peay and his SFW friends claim they had/have nothing to do with AZ SFW, while on a phone call with me and Jason Hawkins, Mr. Peay stated that if the AZ SFW guys had listed to him, the bill would have passed. So, I have a hard time believing Utah-funded SFW had nothing to do with the AZ attempt.

Or the SFW involvement in .......

The points is to show that a completely different story exists of how the Utah state funding mechanism provided to SFW is used in ways different than what the Director sees from his desk. Thus the calls for complete transparency, for reeling in this process, and more accountability for how the fund are used.

Hopefully this curious stream of accolades from the Director is somewhat countered to show a wider scope of how Utah tag revenues are used. To show there are other sides to the story that the Director may not be inclined to see in his position with a close working partner of SFW in Utah. To show a few examples of the SFW activities that are now growing outside of Utah.

To show that as much as the Director and SFW make calls for hunters to unite, SFW spends significant time and energy attacking other organizations, making the Director's unsolicited defenses of SFW seem strange to those on the outside looking in. It is hard to take seriously calls for unity, when the group making the call is behind the scenes hammering others who are doing way more for the sake of hunting and conservation. And, when the Director makes the same call for unity, while overlooking the reasons for such turmoil and almost blindly defending the biggest violator of our united front, his calls for unity ring rather hollow.

I do agree with the Director that SFW and Mr. Peay should be given credit where deserved. As should the millions of others doing all they can for our cause.

We should hold SFW and Mr. Peay accountable when they work against the benefit of hunters and anglers. The same as we would hold any group or person accountable, and how we would expect to be held accountable for our own actions.

None of the good deeds mentioned by the Director relieves any organization from the responsibilities of transparency and accountability with members' money, or the even higher responsibility when benefiting from state assets. None of that exempts any group from staying financially independent of public resources. And none of that makes any person, group, or state policy beyond question by those to whom they are accountable, the hunters and anglers who are their members or the citizens of their state.

Thanks to the Director for his comments and service. He has served during a period where the entire west has experienced great expansion of wildlife, all using different methods and funding sources. I agree with his tribute to great employees of agencies and good relationships with conservation organizations.

I hope none of us forget who is the real hero in all of this. It is you, the average hunter who is funding the model with license fees and excise taxes, and with the sweat on your brow. You who give graciously of your time and labor, as volunteers, not as paid agents.

The Director did a good job of thanking a few among the millions who deserve credit, as does he.

I will end this by thanking the many millions more who make it all possible. Thanks to all of you!

"Hunt when you can - You're gonna' run out of health before you run out of money!"
 
The last two posts by WW and BigFin pretty well says it all. I have stated on another thread, and I will state it here, that IMHO it was more than a big boner for the Director to send that letter such as he did as a public employee basically defending a private organization. To do so appears to be a huge conflict of interest and with 30+ years of public service and in his position Mr. Karpowitz surely should see that. Now to complicate matters, he has come on this website and lavished praise on a man and his organizations that have created all this turmoil simply by not being transparent and showing where public money has been spent. Mr. Karpowitz may be a great guy like a number of people have stated, but IMHO the only way he is going to come out of this with anything positive is to get behind the UWC petition and endorse the transparency it calls for and get it passed.
 
Jimk I think you are misunderstanding what everyone is having issues about. We all know SFW has done a lot of good work for wildlife. NO one and i mean no one is denying that.

THe problem we have is the refusal to have transparency of funds. If SFW would open the books up and show us where our expo money, conservation tag money , etc is going so we could see for sure its not been used inappropriately , I think everyone would shut up and many would likely join SFW if everything is legit.

THe problem is they refuse to open books(sfw), and you see no problem with that? SFW could do alot of good with just a fraction of the money they generate,( giving the illusion that they are using the money responsibly) while pocketing alot of it or spending it irresponsibly and not having to show where the money went. I dont get why if there is nothing to hide they dont open the books. It seems very fishy that they wont prove they have put the 90% of funds into wildlife!

Once again in short, we dont deny sfw has done good, but show us where the money is going! QUit dodging the audit!
 
>Are you kidding me?
>
>Slam SFW, Slam the Expo, Slam
>the Utah Model, and now
>slam Jim Karpowitz???
>
>Since Jim has been involved in
>Managing Utah's Big Game and
>other rolls including Director we
>have seen Elk Herds grow
>from 20,000 to over 70,000.
> Thanks Jim. We
>have seen a 500% increase
>in Big Horn Sheep.
>We have abundant Moose, Goat,
>and Bison. We have
>over 1 million acres of
>habitat rehabilitation. We have
>a predator management plan that
>will along with habitat allow
>the Mule Deer Herds the
>needed relief to grow and
>thrive in the habitat.
>
>Jim has received a number of
>awards from Conservation Groups and
>other State's Agencies for his
>outstanding wildlife management.
>
>Jim, please ignore these ridiculous attacks
>and accept my apology on
>their behalf. They are
>obviously swayed by other issues
>and have no idea what
>a blessing you have been
>to Utah's wildlife and sportsmen.
>
>
>You guys want a fight?
>Well now you have one!
> I encourage every sportsman
>or woman who has received
>benefit to at least stand
>up for a great man
>who has done a great
>job. It doesn't matter
>if you agree with Conservation
>Tags or Expo Tags or
>whatever but you would be
>wrong for not supporting Jim
>Karpowitz for all he has
>done for you and your
>quality of life in the
>outdoors.
>
>One more thank you to Jim
>Karpowitz!
>
>
>R. Todd Abelhouzen
>SFW Executive Advisory Board


Who would have guessed it... Todd popping his mouth off again... Are you going to call and threaten their wives too?


4b1db2ac644136c4.jpg
 
Hi Jim, I'm from IL just outside St Louis, MO. so I hope u all don't mind me
chiming in?
I'm glad you came on here to chat. I think you saw that the people on here r mainly good people,with the couple of aplogies u received.

I have to say though that what u wrote about all the good Don has done is great but is seems your trying to justify some other actions he may or maynot have done (as many think miss using funds) that may or may not come to light. As to say yes he/they did this but look at all the good he/they did. He/they are the lesser of two evils. It's not just u but the other thread about this . They were saying before the debate can go on all have to go on the infamous three hour tour.

If the main problem is the convention tags take them away from them let the unemployed sell them, divide the $5 fees up between them to help keep their homes, feed their families, etc. I realize that's impossible but just saying.

Look forward to see how things pan out!

Good luck to u in the future.

Respectfully Joe E Sikora


Sometimes you do things wrong for so long you think their right"

-Joe E Sikora
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-24-12 AT 04:28PM (MST)[p]

The selling of our public wildlife resources for the financial gain of a few select individuals and their business ventures (Expo), in the name of "better hunting for all", is wrong. I don't care how many millions they give the Dept.

A thief that gives some of his take to the local homeless shelter is still a thief, and what he does is still wrong.

Somebody always loses in those "it's better for all in the long term" scenarios.
 
I get so tired of hearing the same old success stories in response to the real issue. It is the standard smoke screen Don has deployed for years!

I think people are starting to finally see through it.

Thanks again to BigFin for all of the time and effort he is putting into this.


"The problem with quotes on Internet Forums is that it is often difficult to verify their authenticity." - Abraham Lincoln
 
Just a little observation on my part...

I have seen more than a few posts on MM about the incompetence of Anis Aoude, Utah Division of Wildlife biologist and the Utah Division of Wildlife. During all those negative posts I never saw Karpowitz defend any of them. Not once! Did I miss something? Now I see RMEF ask for more openness and accountability in regards to conservation and convention tags and Karpowitz jumps onto MM to defend Don Peay? RMEF never once mentioned Don Peay or SFW but Karpowitz decides he needs to tell us all what a great guy Don is and how lucky we are to have him. Again, just a simple observation but it says volumes to me. Anybody else see this as a bit weird?
 
Irony to me is that Mr. Karpowitz is the one being attacked and he choses to defend Don Peay/SFW. I would think that as vocal as Don Peay and SFW seem to be they might defend Mr. Karpowitz. That is what is weird to me.

Maybe SFW learned from the Alaska fiasco.
I really don't know!!
Maybe us children are just being taught a lesson and that is Don doesn't have to play in our sandbox as he has been missing during this volatile time.
 
I guess I'll chime in on a few comments.
Wapiti Bob,
You are not stealing from the poor and food bank with conservation or expo tags. You are creating more food banks to feed more people.

Jim Karpowitiz said it plainly. Without the conservation tags Utah would not be able to have near the quality and opportunity of hunting tags.

I agree, we should have better accountability for these tags.

The reason why Jim said the positive things about Don Peay and SFW is because they are willing to fight the hard fights for hunting and wildlife, and they have generated a lot of money to improved hunting, habitat,transplants,highway underpasses,funds for predator control,fought for sportsmen access on School trust lands, National momuments,change state law in passing Prop 5. Got funding for fish hatchery repairs, wolf delisting work, set up Utah full curl and sheep foundation,etc,etc,etc.

In the early 80's we didn't even have a pro big game DWR dirrector. Some of our license money were even used for non game animals.

Thanks for all your hard work over the years Jim. You have made a great impact for the better. And thanks also for telling others what you have observed over the years. Don Peay and SFW have done a great deal over the years. I don't agree with everything they have done. They have done a great deal for sportsmen.

Good luck in your future plans.


Greg
 
Give me all the conservation tags and expo tags, I will market them and return 95% to the dwr to use for Utahs wildlife. I will keep 5% for my expenses and time. I will generate more money then the current conservation groups do and my track record moving permits backs that up.

Then the current groups will shrivel up like a dying weed and go away because their welfare checks have stopped showing up. But we will have more money for Utahs wildlife, 100% transparency and all but the current welfare recipients and kool aid drinkers will be happy.

That will mean 95%+ of Utahs hunters will be satisfied with the program and there will really be more OPPORTUNITY for ALL.....





Tony Abbott
The next buck to have a fawn will be the
1st.
 

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