I knew wolves were bad news but after reading alot of these posts I did not know they were that bad.I was thinking maybe we better build a foundation to fight this.Maybe a lawyer on this sight could help us start our own.Just a thought but it sounds like we may need to pool together and have one large voice!!!!
nm wolf federation
- Thread starter JACOB2006
- Start date
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,102
I have not given up on NMWF or SFW.
NMWF brought up the awareness of some major inequities in the current LO tag programs in this last slugfest. I do believe they are very sincere about their mission of Habitat, opportunity and youth.
That being said, they need to post their position on Wolves. I still want to know why there is a link back from NWF (A pro wolf organization) to NMWF.
This and the fact that Jeramey's comments on here gave me the impression that they were handling the wolf issue with kid gloves.
Very non committal.
Until they can side strongly against wolf reintroduction I cannot send them any more money or be outspoken in my support of them.
SFW has a very weak presence in NM. Maybe that is good. Maybe this is an organization that can be shaped to what is important in NM and not UT or WY.
SFW has a tarnished image in UT and other states when it comes to the average Joe hunter. Whether it is deserved or not, I do not know.
What SFW does have is the political horsepower to make things happen and a solid anti wolf reintroduction position.
Locally (Alamogordo chapter), SFW has done some things behind the scenes for the average Joe hunter and have been instrumental fighting for our local elk herd against Landowners that would either remove the herds or try to take ALL the tags.
In the past I have supported both organizations, but, until NMWF takes a strong anti wolf reintroduction position I will give my support to the LOCAL SFW chapter in Alamogordo.
NMWF brought up the awareness of some major inequities in the current LO tag programs in this last slugfest. I do believe they are very sincere about their mission of Habitat, opportunity and youth.
That being said, they need to post their position on Wolves. I still want to know why there is a link back from NWF (A pro wolf organization) to NMWF.
This and the fact that Jeramey's comments on here gave me the impression that they were handling the wolf issue with kid gloves.
Very non committal.
Until they can side strongly against wolf reintroduction I cannot send them any more money or be outspoken in my support of them.
SFW has a very weak presence in NM. Maybe that is good. Maybe this is an organization that can be shaped to what is important in NM and not UT or WY.
SFW has a tarnished image in UT and other states when it comes to the average Joe hunter. Whether it is deserved or not, I do not know.
What SFW does have is the political horsepower to make things happen and a solid anti wolf reintroduction position.
Locally (Alamogordo chapter), SFW has done some things behind the scenes for the average Joe hunter and have been instrumental fighting for our local elk herd against Landowners that would either remove the herds or try to take ALL the tags.
In the past I have supported both organizations, but, until NMWF takes a strong anti wolf reintroduction position I will give my support to the LOCAL SFW chapter in Alamogordo.
S
stinkystomper
Guest
I second your support of sfw alamogordo. Please let me know when they hold banquets and I will definitely attend and support them with you.
I do like the ring of NM wolf federation and I totally agree. The link from nwf back to NMWF is definitely there and cannot be denied. I think the proof is in the writing and that's all I need to know.
ego participate in Monasteriense muleys proinde ego sum bardus (I participate on monstermuleys therefore I am stupid)
I do like the ring of NM wolf federation and I totally agree. The link from nwf back to NMWF is definitely there and cannot be denied. I think the proof is in the writing and that's all I need to know.
ego participate in Monasteriense muleys proinde ego sum bardus (I participate on monstermuleys therefore I am stupid)
G
GregMc
Guest
LAST EDITED ON Aug-31-10 AT 08:30PM (MST)[p]It's the day before grouse season, with elk season on the horizon and all some of you guys can think to post about is is the 20 wolves we have in NM.
Seriously, 20. The wolf numbers here haven't really increased in the 12 years they have been here. We are not talking about Idaho or Wyoming or Montana. We are talking about NM, where we have limited wolf habitat and very few wolves.
They are a non-issue. I repeat, 20 wolves are less important than about 100 other issues impacting wildlife on public lands.
Think fire suppression, development and habitat reduction, roads, drought and lots of other factors that contribute to significant loss of elk and elk reproduction yearly.
See RMEF on elk issues
The persistence seems illogical and it leads me to the only conclusion left: irrational and individual fear.
Wolves are wild and scary and maybe for some people they are too much to contemplate.
Not everyone is cut out for wild places and wild things. For those people maybe a nice internet cafe with lattes and comfy couches would be a better fit.
I suggest finding a place like New York or Pittsburg where there are no bears, no coyotes, no cougars and no mean old wolves.
Best of all, they leave the lights on so you won't have to worry about the dark.
Seriously, 20. The wolf numbers here haven't really increased in the 12 years they have been here. We are not talking about Idaho or Wyoming or Montana. We are talking about NM, where we have limited wolf habitat and very few wolves.
They are a non-issue. I repeat, 20 wolves are less important than about 100 other issues impacting wildlife on public lands.
Think fire suppression, development and habitat reduction, roads, drought and lots of other factors that contribute to significant loss of elk and elk reproduction yearly.
See RMEF on elk issues
The persistence seems illogical and it leads me to the only conclusion left: irrational and individual fear.
Wolves are wild and scary and maybe for some people they are too much to contemplate.
Not everyone is cut out for wild places and wild things. For those people maybe a nice internet cafe with lattes and comfy couches would be a better fit.
I suggest finding a place like New York or Pittsburg where there are no bears, no coyotes, no cougars and no mean old wolves.
Best of all, they leave the lights on so you won't have to worry about the dark.
U
unclebuck32
Guest
When I was out at beaverhead shed hunting I had seen 5 wolves in 1 day and 2 more wolves another day that were much smaller than the first 5, so I had seen 7 wolves in a little area..... hard to believe there are only 13 more wolves in our entire state of New mexico!?!?! REALLY HARD TO BELIEVE!!!!!
CompassWestOutfitters
Active Member
- Messages
- 236
man its all about where you put your money and where it goes! I have friends in WY and MT out of work, familys moving, a way of life gone......
www.200inches.com
www.200inches.com
H
hornhunter247
Guest
+1 gator but I think the numbers are higher seeing as how I laid eyes on a pair in 15 last year, my buddy in kentucky has great footage of them! But you guys better start thinking of a way to fight your fight because if all you do is go into yelling "kill them all" your gonna lose! Come up with a management plan that involves hunters like nm already does for it's ibex, oryx, and barbs and see if a few guys put a skin on the wall! But good luck I've seen how its turned out up north because of ranchers and sportsmen screaming the wrong message! And by the way I'm done with this subject!
I just call em as I see em!
I just call em as I see em!
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,102
LAST EDITED ON Aug-31-10 AT 11:21PM (MST)[p]>LAST EDITED ON Aug-31-10
>AT 08:30?PM (MST)
>
>It's the day before grouse season,
>with elk season on the
>horizon and all some of
>you guys can think to
>post about is is the
>20 wolves we have in
>NM.
>Seriously, 20. The wolf numbers here
>haven't really increased in the
>12 years they have been
>here. We are not talking
>about Idaho or Wyoming or
>Montana. We are talking about
>NM, where we have limited
>wolf habitat and very few
>wolves.
>They are a non-issue. I repeat,
>20 wolves are less important
>than about 100 other issues
>impacting wildlife on public lands.
>
>Think fire suppression, development and habitat
>reduction, roads, drought and lots
>of other factors that contribute
>to significant loss of elk
>and elk reproduction yearly.
>See RMEF on elk issues
>The persistence seems illogical and it
>leads me to the only
>conclusion left: irrational and individual
>fear.
>Wolves are wild and scary and
>maybe for some people they
>are too much to contemplate.
>
>Not everyone is cut out for
>wild places and wild things.
>For those people maybe a
>nice internet cafe with lattes
>and comfy couches would be
>a better fit.
>I suggest finding a place like
>New York or Pittsburg where
>there are no bears, no
>coyotes, no cougars and no
>mean old wolves.
>Best of all, they leave the
>lights on so you won't
>have to worry about the
>dark.
Greg, that is about a dopey a post I have read in a long time.
Who ever mentioned being afraid of a wolf or a coyote.
I am not going to repost all my concerns about wolf reintroduction in the rocky mountain states.
However, it is in my experience that someone makes personal attacks when they have nothing else to offer.
And personal attacks on the internet are even more juvenile and cowardly.
You have made 10 posts on the forum and you are already unable to respond without making personal attacks.
Another internet tough guy.
You were pretty hard to take seriously to begin with, but, now your just ridiculous.
>AT 08:30?PM (MST)
>
>It's the day before grouse season,
>with elk season on the
>horizon and all some of
>you guys can think to
>post about is is the
>20 wolves we have in
>NM.
>Seriously, 20. The wolf numbers here
>haven't really increased in the
>12 years they have been
>here. We are not talking
>about Idaho or Wyoming or
>Montana. We are talking about
>NM, where we have limited
>wolf habitat and very few
>wolves.
>They are a non-issue. I repeat,
>20 wolves are less important
>than about 100 other issues
>impacting wildlife on public lands.
>
>Think fire suppression, development and habitat
>reduction, roads, drought and lots
>of other factors that contribute
>to significant loss of elk
>and elk reproduction yearly.
>See RMEF on elk issues
>The persistence seems illogical and it
>leads me to the only
>conclusion left: irrational and individual
>fear.
>Wolves are wild and scary and
>maybe for some people they
>are too much to contemplate.
>
>Not everyone is cut out for
>wild places and wild things.
>For those people maybe a
>nice internet cafe with lattes
>and comfy couches would be
>a better fit.
>I suggest finding a place like
>New York or Pittsburg where
>there are no bears, no
>coyotes, no cougars and no
>mean old wolves.
>Best of all, they leave the
>lights on so you won't
>have to worry about the
>dark.
Greg, that is about a dopey a post I have read in a long time.
Who ever mentioned being afraid of a wolf or a coyote.
I am not going to repost all my concerns about wolf reintroduction in the rocky mountain states.
However, it is in my experience that someone makes personal attacks when they have nothing else to offer.
And personal attacks on the internet are even more juvenile and cowardly.
You have made 10 posts on the forum and you are already unable to respond without making personal attacks.
Another internet tough guy.
You were pretty hard to take seriously to begin with, but, now your just ridiculous.
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,102
>+1 gator but I think the
>numbers are higher seeing as
>how I laid eyes on
>a pair in 15 last
>year, my buddy in kentucky
>has great footage of them!
>But you guys better start
>thinking of a way to
>fight your fight because if
>all you do is go
>into yelling "kill them all"
>your gonna lose! Come up
>with a management plan that
>involves hunters like nm already
>does for it's ibex, oryx,
>and barbs and see if
>a few guys put a
>skin on the wall! But
>good luck I've seen how
>its turned out up north
>because of ranchers and sportsmen
>screaming the wrong message! And
>by the way I'm done
>with this subject!
>
>
>I just call em as I
>see em!
Best management plan in the world, in the end is just a piece of paper subject to the whim of bureaucrats, politicians, and voters that could care less if your kids ever get an elk tag.
If you think that some management plan is the answer in the long term I am certain you will be wrong.
This is not just "I think it will happen".
It is happening NOW in ID, WY, and along the same lines in CA.
Why it would be any different in NM, you would have to explain to me.
This is not about the present wolf situation in NM. This is about Wolves in the rocky mountain states and the importance of a Hunting organization siding against the pro wolf introduction movement.
>numbers are higher seeing as
>how I laid eyes on
>a pair in 15 last
>year, my buddy in kentucky
>has great footage of them!
>But you guys better start
>thinking of a way to
>fight your fight because if
>all you do is go
>into yelling "kill them all"
>your gonna lose! Come up
>with a management plan that
>involves hunters like nm already
>does for it's ibex, oryx,
>and barbs and see if
>a few guys put a
>skin on the wall! But
>good luck I've seen how
>its turned out up north
>because of ranchers and sportsmen
>screaming the wrong message! And
>by the way I'm done
>with this subject!
>
>
>I just call em as I
>see em!
Best management plan in the world, in the end is just a piece of paper subject to the whim of bureaucrats, politicians, and voters that could care less if your kids ever get an elk tag.
If you think that some management plan is the answer in the long term I am certain you will be wrong.
This is not just "I think it will happen".
It is happening NOW in ID, WY, and along the same lines in CA.
Why it would be any different in NM, you would have to explain to me.
This is not about the present wolf situation in NM. This is about Wolves in the rocky mountain states and the importance of a Hunting organization siding against the pro wolf introduction movement.
H
hornhunter247
Guest
In idaho they lost their battle with the pro wolf organizations over the simple fact that ranchers and sportsmen want a kill all solution, above and beyond the management entitlement section in the endangered species act. That means that the government can allow hunting and harvesting and killing of excess, aggressive, and wolves that wander out of the designated areas. This kill all attitude and approach helped the pro wolf orgs to get the wolves off the management entitlement section and back to regular endangered! That means no hunting or killing of that animal for any reason! Idaho had already been approved for a management level of 100 wolves, they currently have 550+. But that has been put on hold now. Wyoming hasn't even submitted a management plan. The anti's are well armed with using our own statements against us! They know how to turn things around and they are well organized! The wolves are already here and no group is going to stop that! The next best thing is to try to control the numbers and keep them within boundaries. And hunting is a great tool for that! But try to eliminate them and watch the pro wolf groups get the wolves out of the management entitlement section and then nm does have a serious problem!
I just call em as I see em!
I just call em as I see em!
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,102
Hornhunter247, I am trying to be done with this subject also.
I completely agree that NM does not have a true wolf problem yet.
The reasons for my posts on this is that a hunting organization better have a stance on wolves, and IMO it better be against any further reintroduction.
Hornhunter247, your posts have been sincere and well thought out.
However, IMO your last post makes my argument.
Where there are 2 sides of any argument there are extremes. In this case Kill every wolf side, and let the wolves completely create their own ecosystem.
Our federal and state lands are controlled by political forces.
There is normally some time of appeasement of both sides. Or the strongest side dictates policy.
Your post makes my point because history tells us the political forces in ID, WY, all dictated wolf policy.
Political forces dictated the end of predator control (leg hold traps, poisoning, hunting mountain lions) in CA,
The same goes true with Logging, over grown forests, spotted owl etc.
Science, biology all gets thrown out the window and the squeaky wheel wins the day.
The stronger the political force on these issues, the better chance of your side doing well in a political power struggle.
Taking a compromising stance on any of these issues would just have had worse results.
HH247, I am trying to be done with this also. I may not agree with you on everything, but, at least I can tell you have a well thought out position.
I completely agree that NM does not have a true wolf problem yet.
The reasons for my posts on this is that a hunting organization better have a stance on wolves, and IMO it better be against any further reintroduction.
Hornhunter247, your posts have been sincere and well thought out.
However, IMO your last post makes my argument.
Where there are 2 sides of any argument there are extremes. In this case Kill every wolf side, and let the wolves completely create their own ecosystem.
Our federal and state lands are controlled by political forces.
There is normally some time of appeasement of both sides. Or the strongest side dictates policy.
Your post makes my point because history tells us the political forces in ID, WY, all dictated wolf policy.
Political forces dictated the end of predator control (leg hold traps, poisoning, hunting mountain lions) in CA,
The same goes true with Logging, over grown forests, spotted owl etc.
Science, biology all gets thrown out the window and the squeaky wheel wins the day.
The stronger the political force on these issues, the better chance of your side doing well in a political power struggle.
Taking a compromising stance on any of these issues would just have had worse results.
HH247, I am trying to be done with this also. I may not agree with you on everything, but, at least I can tell you have a well thought out position.
G
GregMc
Guest
Paul, I simply said some people are afraid. I never mentioned you specifically but honestly, you seem a little touchy about it.
I'm headed out hunting so I'll leave you in peace.
I'm headed out hunting so I'll leave you in peace.
MNHunter
Active Member
- Messages
- 938
LAST EDITED ON Sep-01-10 AT 08:30AM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Sep-01-10 AT 08:25?AM (MST)
NMPaul,
I believe you are seeing the big picture. Political forces will dictate wolf policy and science/biology gets thrown out the window. Here in Minnesota we have more wolves than all of the West. Can we hunt them? No. Why? Because political anti orgs continue to fight every effort to delist them. It does not matter how many breeding pairs or individual wolves the agreements call for. It will never be enough for the pro-wolf crowd. Wolves do not follow or care about political/geographic boundaries. They will disperse into neighboring states. You can have the best plan on the planet but because your neighbors do not, it opens the door for the antis to continue fighting. This is how they attack the midwest states and now the mountain states. You will never get the pro-wolf orgs to stop their fight. The first time wolves were delisted in MN we even had a 5 year moratorium on hunting. That still wasn?t good enough. Having said all this, I am not comparing MN to NM in terms of terrain, wildlife, or management. However, even though the species of wolf is different, you will face the same problems that every other state in the union that has wolves continuously faces. You folks need to do what is best for your fine state. Hopefully there is enough precedent in the upper Midwest and the mountain states for you all to make an informed decision on the future (or lack thereof) of wolves in New Mexico.
"Whatever you are, be a good one."
- Abraham Lincoln
NMPaul,
I believe you are seeing the big picture. Political forces will dictate wolf policy and science/biology gets thrown out the window. Here in Minnesota we have more wolves than all of the West. Can we hunt them? No. Why? Because political anti orgs continue to fight every effort to delist them. It does not matter how many breeding pairs or individual wolves the agreements call for. It will never be enough for the pro-wolf crowd. Wolves do not follow or care about political/geographic boundaries. They will disperse into neighboring states. You can have the best plan on the planet but because your neighbors do not, it opens the door for the antis to continue fighting. This is how they attack the midwest states and now the mountain states. You will never get the pro-wolf orgs to stop their fight. The first time wolves were delisted in MN we even had a 5 year moratorium on hunting. That still wasn?t good enough. Having said all this, I am not comparing MN to NM in terms of terrain, wildlife, or management. However, even though the species of wolf is different, you will face the same problems that every other state in the union that has wolves continuously faces. You folks need to do what is best for your fine state. Hopefully there is enough precedent in the upper Midwest and the mountain states for you all to make an informed decision on the future (or lack thereof) of wolves in New Mexico.
"Whatever you are, be a good one."
- Abraham Lincoln
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,102
Thank you MN. I forgot about Minnesota. Perfect example of this being a political struggle, and not about establishing a population of wolves and managing it.
That will never happen. There is big money behind the pro wolf crowd. They have the east coast and west coast arm chair environmentalists that love to tell the Rocky Mountain states how they should run their forests.
As I said before, we do not have a big wolf problem in NM now, but, we better have our organizations on board for when it comes.
And it is coming.
That will never happen. There is big money behind the pro wolf crowd. They have the east coast and west coast arm chair environmentalists that love to tell the Rocky Mountain states how they should run their forests.
As I said before, we do not have a big wolf problem in NM now, but, we better have our organizations on board for when it comes.
And it is coming.
Hey guys I was not wanting to start another bickering match,I simply think if wolves are this big of a deal and everyone is this against them we better pool together.As solo individuals our voice goes unheard but as an org we will be heard.As for nmwf I actually suport what you guys are doing so keep it up!!However if you are wanting to preserve hunting you need to look at the big picture and wolves are a part of it!I also know it needs to be done one fight at a time.But to suport an org.we need to know the intire agenda.
H
hornhunter247
Guest
Paul I am done with this subject. Its one that no one wants to take an open stance on and don't blame people one bit! But people need to educate themselves and stand up for what you truly believe in! I for one don't feel that making a species go extinct is an option! And with less than 300 mexican wolves worldwide, imo we need to think about the bigger picture. And a target of 100 wild wolves within nm boundaries is not too many by any means!
I just call em as I see em!
I just call em as I see em!
S
stinkystomper
Guest
LAST EDITED ON Sep-01-10 AT 07:24PM (MST)[p]I guess I to am done with this argument. Here are some facts to ponder.
As the courts in montana view it the endangered species act is flawed. Why? It is to protect a species from going extinct and I agree this is always the correct thing to do. However the Mexican grey wolf and the rocky mountain wolves are not endangered. In fact the mexican greys are doing just fine in Mexico and the rocky mountain wolves are thriving in canada. The environmentalists have twisted the ESA to be viewed as only the populations in the continental US. The SFW is putting legislation through that states in order for an animal to be endangered their total numbers world wide have to be below a certain threshold. The ESA already basically states that, however the environmentalists have twisted the ESA to act as an act that must be viewed from one forest to another regardless of the overall population of that creature on a global scale. In fact the threshold (I don't know what the exact number is) is no where near being met for the rocky mountain or mexican grey wolf. The mexican may be threatened but not endangered. The rocky mountain wolf doesn't qualify for either list.
Once this act is pushed through the wolves will be delisted and the control of these creatures will be left to the states. Read the current mission of the sfw and rmef initiative. They both feel strongly that they are about to have the legislation that will allow them to put the last nails in this worthless coffin.
ego participate in Monasteriense muleys proinde ego sum bardus (I participate on monstermuleys therefore I am stupid)
As the courts in montana view it the endangered species act is flawed. Why? It is to protect a species from going extinct and I agree this is always the correct thing to do. However the Mexican grey wolf and the rocky mountain wolves are not endangered. In fact the mexican greys are doing just fine in Mexico and the rocky mountain wolves are thriving in canada. The environmentalists have twisted the ESA to be viewed as only the populations in the continental US. The SFW is putting legislation through that states in order for an animal to be endangered their total numbers world wide have to be below a certain threshold. The ESA already basically states that, however the environmentalists have twisted the ESA to act as an act that must be viewed from one forest to another regardless of the overall population of that creature on a global scale. In fact the threshold (I don't know what the exact number is) is no where near being met for the rocky mountain or mexican grey wolf. The mexican may be threatened but not endangered. The rocky mountain wolf doesn't qualify for either list.
Once this act is pushed through the wolves will be delisted and the control of these creatures will be left to the states. Read the current mission of the sfw and rmef initiative. They both feel strongly that they are about to have the legislation that will allow them to put the last nails in this worthless coffin.
ego participate in Monasteriense muleys proinde ego sum bardus (I participate on monstermuleys therefore I am stupid)
H
hornhunter247
Guest
Stinky your post needs a reply! Yes the mexican gray wolf is endangered! There are less than 300 in the world and most of them are in captivity. Yes the ESA is flawed, there are over 30 subspecies of gray wolf throughout the world. The ESA does not acknowledge sub species so if one gray wolf makes it they all do!
Now as for montana that is a whole different deal altogether. Right before they reintroduced wolves in that state, they found a free ranging wild pack which stopped the re introduction process. And that free ranging pack does not qualify them for the management entitlement section.
These are the facts, not interpretations of any one group or another.
Again I'm not for the northern wolves one bit! But I am proud to at least have seen one of the rarest ones in my home state and I hope the efforts continue to bring this species back from the brink of extinction!
I just call em as I see em!
Now as for montana that is a whole different deal altogether. Right before they reintroduced wolves in that state, they found a free ranging wild pack which stopped the re introduction process. And that free ranging pack does not qualify them for the management entitlement section.
These are the facts, not interpretations of any one group or another.
Again I'm not for the northern wolves one bit! But I am proud to at least have seen one of the rarest ones in my home state and I hope the efforts continue to bring this species back from the brink of extinction!
I just call em as I see em!
GOOD WORK BOYS!
So we are now debating the wolf issue, in Northen states!
In the meantime the "Jennings Bill", is still on the books!
I know it is a big concern about wolves in MN etc!
In the meantime, landowners here can slaughter elk and lope etc. But, we really need to focus on wolves in MN etc!
So we are now debating the wolf issue, in Northen states!
In the meantime the "Jennings Bill", is still on the books!
I know it is a big concern about wolves in MN etc!
In the meantime, landowners here can slaughter elk and lope etc. But, we really need to focus on wolves in MN etc!
Gator
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 18,135
You worry about the wolves now or you will end up in the same boat as Id,and Wyoming. only 20 wolves in NM and there is only 11 million illegals in the United States too. I don't beileve either numbers.
"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
sportsman01
Active Member
- Messages
- 356
I agree with what most of you are saying. However, for the last 3 months or so this is all this forum has been...debating, bickering, arguing, name calling, wishy washy stats, do's, don'ts, pro this org, anti that org etc, etc. This issue has absolutely ruined this forum.
Time for a change of subject. End this or take it to someone who can truly help. This forum wasn't setup as a pro or anti wolf movement. If someone really wants to make a move, setup a separate site or chapter dedicated to it.
Let's focus our efforts on displaying, encouraging, and promoting our way of life....ie...hunting and the outdoor way. Post some pics, let's hear some sweet stories, and moreover, encourage our youth to get invovled in the outdoors. I believe that's what the majority of us are here for.
Just my two cents....
Good luck and good hunting!
Time for a change of subject. End this or take it to someone who can truly help. This forum wasn't setup as a pro or anti wolf movement. If someone really wants to make a move, setup a separate site or chapter dedicated to it.
Let's focus our efforts on displaying, encouraging, and promoting our way of life....ie...hunting and the outdoor way. Post some pics, let's hear some sweet stories, and moreover, encourage our youth to get invovled in the outdoors. I believe that's what the majority of us are here for.
Just my two cents....
Good luck and good hunting!
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