No More Baiting

[Dangbig]

YOU might be able to pick up a new muzzy and shoot one accurately, but you are in the minority. Not many guys can shoot them as far and as accurate as a center fire. Same holds true with archery. 100 yards today is like shooting a muzzleloader 300 yards today (yes, guys could and would shoot 300 with open sights or a 1x, and be very deadly back in the day). 10 years ago only a select few could do it. Now anyone can do it if they know how to shoot decent. But past 100 or past 300 is a whole different story and requires much more than just a capable weapon. Take scopes off all the guns you want, the same guys killing big deer every year, will still kill big deer with whatever weapon is available. Guys who want to limit technology seem to be the ones who struggle with killing any size of deer. You can limit the weapon, you can’t limit the killer.

Sounds like you’re just mad about everyone’s method of hunting except for yours. You aren’t the problem. Just everyone else.

the poor rifle hunters hahahaha you mean the guys that have the highest success rates? Yeah I sure feel bad for the 2 point slayers. It’s not for a lack of deer, it’s a lack of patience and hunting abilities. (Most of the time).

I can shoot my rifle effectively at 750 all day but there is seldom a time I don’t have a hunter between me and that distance so I don’t
I know guys who can shoot musket over 400 at elk but that is hours of practice and load tests
I tend to agree the same guys kill the game year in and year out regardless of technology
I mostly hunt with a musket kill the same amount as before wound less than I did with my hawken long ago
Habitat, predators, winter range are what we need to look at not crying about a scope
A lot of old timers used 22s and a spotlight is that still a thing? Poaching is still one of our biggest predators isn’t it?
I bet night vision replaces the spotlight not nearly as obvious
Just a rant thanks for listening

 

[middlefork]

Whitworth rifle - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Carp]

Second, not an archer anymore, I enjoy being in the mountains during the archery hunt, and have talked to many archers. Two things I have found out from them is that they can kill a deer way farther than the old bows and they still wound a lot of deer. The changes I would like to see on the deer hunt method is not for me, but for my Grandkids and other hunters. If it is going to be a muzzleloader let it be a primitive hunt like it was originally intended. The

First, utah doesn’t have a “primitive weapon” hunt. They have a muzzleloader hunt. The definition of that legal muzzleloader is very liberal compared to some other states, but it is still that, just a muzzleloader. But the hunt was never defined or designed as primitive. And no, it’s not as easy as just sitting at a bench and hammering steel at unreal ranges like you can with a rifle. Anyone who’s played with one long enough knows that. Something else to keep in mind, your standards as accurate and comparable to your browning might satisfy your standards, and it might fall way short for others.

second, there’s been guys launching bombs at animals 100+ Yards, extremely accurately, for many years. Long before slider sights, sight tapes, expandable heads and bows exceeding 300 FPS were ever even a dream. You just didn’t have social media platforms for them to tell you about it from. But there was dudes doing it, on purpose, every year.

you want to take scopes off a muzzleloader, that’s fine. But all hunts need reevaluation and adjustments made to weapon definitions if that’s the road we want to go down. It won’t fix anything short or long term. Look at average success data pre and post legalization of magnified scopes. Nothing changed, for success in that time.

 

[elkassassin]

But The Blind Think that Once Scopes are YANKED off of SmokePoles everything is Fixed!

WAFJ!

 

[cannonball]

Nothing is written in stone when it comes to hunting. Look at the great step of banning baiting. Just hope that the muzzleloading hunt changes to a more primitive hunt like Oregon for example. Several other states around us are also smarter than Utah for muzzleloading restrictions.

 

[Hawkeye]

OK buckhorn & grizzly?

I'll Take My Mid Grade Scope off My SmokePole!

But there's Change for All 3!

Slider Sights on Bows Are Now Out-Lawed!

And Turrets of any Kind are Out-Lawed on Rifles!

LET'S HEAR THE BAWLING!

OK Elkass, let’s do it. I hunt with all 3 of those weapon types and I’m on board! No bawling here!

Hawkeye

 

[elkassassin]

Hey Hawkeye!

I Won't Even Have To Take any Scopes off!

I Have SmokePoles That never had a Scope mounted on them!

I Still Have a Recurve & a couple Plain Jane Compounds!

Got a Few Rifles with Outdated NON-TURRET Scopes!

I Don't Have To Buy or Remove a FRICKEN Thing!

About 47+ Other Changes Hawkeye & We'll be going somewhere!

OK Elkass, let’s do it. I hunt with all 3 of those weapon types and I’m on board! No bawling here!

Hawkeye

 

[Giddyup]

I don't think so. I think most hunters realize baiting was a big factor in killing big buck. They want to give the buck a chance of more of a fair chase. I would also like to see some units like the Paunsaugunt where the deer's water supply is limited, eliminate cameras. Actual there are a lot of places you go where a dozen cameras will be looking back at you. To me that is an evasion of privacy. that would be one more step to help some big bucks get through the season. One day maybe the WLB will be brave enough to buck the few and take action.

They should ban trail cams all together, statewide

 

[Dangbig]

How about we go back to all lead bullets !!! They have advanced a ton.....

 

[Dryfly]

YOU might be able to pick up a new muzzy and shoot one accurately, but you are in the minority. Not many guys can shoot them as far and as accurate as a center fire. Same holds true with archery. 100 yards today is like shooting a muzzleloader 300 yards today (yes, guys could and would shoot 300 with open sights or a 1x, and be very deadly back in the day). 10 years ago only a select few could do it. Now anyone can do it if they know how to shoot decent. But past 100 or past 300 is a whole different story and requires much more than just a capable weapon. Take scopes off all the guns you want, the same guys killing big deer every year, will still kill big deer with whatever weapon is available. Guys who want to limit technology seem to be the ones who struggle with killing any size of deer. You can limit the weapon, you can’t limit the killer.

Sounds like you’re just mad about everyone’s method of hunting except for yours. You aren’t the problem. Just everyone else.

the poor rifle hunters hahahaha you mean the guys that have the highest success rates? Yeah I sure feel bad for the 2 point slayers. It’s not for a lack of deer, it’s a lack of patience and hunting abilities. (Most of the time).

Do not agree at all. My son hunts only with a muzzle-loader, mostly because he wrestled and that was the only season he wasn't wrestling. Was a year round wrestler on our states team.

He could shoot a muzzy accurately to about 100 yards with a 1X scope. I could do a bit better, and I would actually prefer a ghost ring open sight to a 1X scope myself. We put a variable power scope on it, and he is good as gold out to about 250 yards now.

I have hunted with a bow since the late 70s. Mostly in recent years, I have met many who claim they can shoot to 100 yards with a bow.
I have invited several of these folks to shoot with me. Zero yet have hit my small target at 100 yards. None. Literally none at all. You are welcome to come give it a go if you care to.

Again, I don't care what sight you use. Shooting a broadhead tipped arrow at 100 yards takes much skill, there are no short-cuts, and few can actually do it with any consistency at all. Most couldn't tune a bow to shoot accurately that far, even if they could shoot well enough to shoot it.

I am mad about nothing, nor against any weapon a person chooses. I have no clue where you imagined all of that drivel from, but it didn't come from my post, except in your own mind. To each their own. I have advocated no damn changes at all for any weapon.

My only point is few can shoot a bow accurately at 100 yards, regardless of the sight. I could teach someone to hit the target, at 200 yards with a good muzzle-loader, in an afternoon, so could you. Count on years and many hundreds of shots to get there with a bow.

I don't believe you have done much at all with newer bows. They are certainly faster, but they don't make you any more accurate. My newest bow is 3 years old. It is far lees forgiving, and far more picky about perfect form, than the one I shot in the early 80s. By far. Though it is indeed much faster.

 

[Gator]

When I coached wrestling I too did ML a lot more. Now that I don't Ref or coach it been rifle for me.