Proposed ballot initiative to ban lion hunting

scpaisley

scpaisley

Active Member
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Looks like a new bill up for vote net year will be set to ban mountain lion hunting. With the wolf plan, a rumor to bring the wolverine back, this is going to be make it even harder on CO ungulates.
coloradosun.com

Ban on hunting mountain lions and bobcats in Colorado could land on 2024 ballot

Animal groups are gathering signatures for a ballot initiative that could ask voters to ban mountain lion, bobcat hunting and trapping in 2024
coloradosun.com coloradosun.com
 
I think it’s pretty obvious what the plan is. I would also be willing to bet lion hunting will get nixed. Just remember if you live on the west slope your opinion doesn’t matter.
 
I'm freaking annoyed by the fact that people who have never contributed to the Pittman-Robertson Act get to decide where that funding goes.
 
Yep these bastards are calculating, waiting for a big presidential election year, stuff will already be on edge. They will frame it as a blue (save kitties) vs red (evil hunters) issue and pass it in Co… gagged the CPW from comment. Hell 3 or 4 anti hunters on our wildlife commission. This state is losing it. If we were smart we would fight fire with fire. Need a big push from tribal folks talking about banning hunting as colonialism, we have to be craftier in our defense. Funny thing is I’d love to see BHa, REMF, hell all those influencers actually show up and fight… but I’ll believe it when I see it
 
So you Puzzys just going to roll over? Get off the couch, do something, talk to people. It’s not over. Grim yes, but there is work to do!


What need to get ballot box biology off the books. If it doesn’t happen we will always be on the defense.
 
How does one get such things on a ballot? Signatures? I’d be willing to do some foot work for it. It’s worth putting effort into, it’s just a lot of red tape I would guess?
 
There needs to be more offense against the leftists that push this stuff. Go after the stuff they like to do. Ban dog walking in wintering areas or areas where wildlife are present. Ban bike riding in winter areas and areas where animals gather...something like that, stop being on the defensive all the time.
 
Yeah it’s probably time to be a pain in the ass. Go after the ski cos, if you can leverage them it would be huge.
 
marburg said:
There needs to be more offense against the leftists that push this stuff. Go after the stuff they like to do. Ban dog walking in wintering areas or areas where wildlife are present. Ban bike riding in winter areas and areas where animals gather...something like that, stop being on the defensive all the time.
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Completely agree, we just need a small team of very very good attorneys who want to do this full time…
 
I'm sure the yes/no vote map by county is going to look exactly like the wolf vote map... only the counties that this won't effect will be the yes votes.
 
Hopefully cpw quadruples the quotas this coming season to help with the impending doom. I can't imagine how many full time cat trappers they are going to have to hire to deal with this. I know how busy our local officers stay with dealing with problem cats first hand. I lease my pasture out to a fellow that runs sheep and goats. The last two lion kills I have had here I couldn't even get anyone out to look because they were too busy dealing with other problem cats!
 
montezumarchery said:
Hopefully cpw quadruples the quotas this coming season to help with the impending doom. I can't imagine how many full time cat trappers they are going to have to hire to deal with this. I know how busy our local officers stay with dealing with problem cats first hand. I lease my pasture out to a fellow that runs sheep and goats. The last two lion kills I have had here I couldn't even get anyone out to look because they were too busy dealing with other problem cats!
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Impending? Things are already getting a little sporty around here.

Some yard cats from this year, all a bow chip shot from the porch.
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So where are all the big money conservation groups on this issue?
DSC, SCI, RMEF, MDF and others should be using some of the millions they bring in to fight this initiative. Isn't this a real threat to hunting as we know it in Colorado? I would think this would be top priority for these groups.
 
elkantlers said:
So where are all the big money conservation groups on this issue?
DSC, SCI, RMEF, MDF and others should be using some of the millions they bring in to fight this initiative. Isn't this a real threat to hunting as we know it in Colorado? I would think this would be top priority for these groups.
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I know RMEF just sent out their intent to fight the bill.
 
The initiative process is never really grassroots and should really be done away with. I used to work for the company that managed most initiatives in CA and your would be surprised to learn where most come from, many from out of State. They are designed to have emotional impact, meaning they lack scientific value and are sometimes unconstitutional, at times winning by a simple majority, meaning 51% of voters get to tell the other 49% that they are SOL (**** out of luck) - a tyranny of the majority.
 
chrisamx said:
The initiative process is never really grassroots and should really be done away with. I used to work for the company that managed most initiatives in CA and your would be surprised to learn where most come from, many from out of State. They are designed to have emotional impact, meaning they lack scientific value and are sometimes unconstitutional, at times winning by a simple majority, meaning 51% of voters get to tell the other 49% that they are SOL (**** out of luck) - a tyranny of the majority.
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I've long said it was all based on emotions, if they can ratchet up the emotion of it then it is so much easier to get people on your side.
 
I've lived it in Cali......those cute lion cub pics are heart warming.....losing that initiative is a promise...sorry
 
montezumarchery said:
Are there any deer left around there!??
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One…and everything and everyone is trying to kill his poor azz.
Homer said:
I've lived it in Cali......those cute lion cub pics are heart warming.....losing that initiative is a promise...sorry
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Yup. Lions are mystical creatures that very few will actually see in the wild so people think they’re saving unicorns and chit. And the CPW will become an agency of dogcatchers who get the call when theres a snake in your garage or a bear in your apple tree.

But you‘re right, pretty pics don’t help.;)
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I think we have a shot at winning this. These are already in CO and not endangered. Surprisingly the wolf issue almost failed. I think this one will fail.

Need stories from California, where they did ban hunting them. Like dog and people attacks.
 
I asked the local game warden when he set traps to catch the lion killing livestock on my place if I could dispatch the cat. His response was "only if you feel your life is in threat"... it was going to be the first time that my life was a concern!
Sadly he moved on and killed some goats 1/4 mile up the road, never came back to the pile of sheep he got at my place.
 
So why is no one taking a play from the antis books? Why not run a ballot initiative that ensure the right to hunt and fish? That protects traditional means of harvest and preserves Science based management over ballot box? I mean if the Big dogs got together and ran a ballot initiative to protect hunting, define it as a science based process, etc. A lot of people could easily get behind that.

We should have done it 30 years ago. But no one has taken the time to go such a direction.
 
It's been tried a couple of times and never gained enough traction. With the political shift now in this state I doubt it will ever be able to get on the ballot let alone get enough votes.
 
elks96 said:
So why is no one taking a play from the antis books? Why not run a ballot initiative that ensure the right to hunt and fish? That protects traditional means of harvest and preserves Science based management over ballot box? I mean if the Big dogs got together and ran a ballot initiative to protect hunting, define it as a science based process, etc. A lot of people could easily get behind that.

We should have done it 30 years ago. But no one has taken the time to go such a direction.
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Abso-freaking-lutely! I get the feeling like if they did that and took the initiative and did some real good then they wouldn’t be able to solicit us every time there is an “attack” it’s like they live on their heels and only get punched in the face… not in the habit of punching first or punch back…
 
ORIONTHEHUNTER said:
It's been tried a couple of times and never gained enough traction. With the political shift now in this state I doubt it will ever be able to get on the ballot let alone get enough votes.
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No it has not been tried. It has been talked about and no one has taken it on seriously as a cause. No the RMEF, Not the MDF, Not the CBA, Not the BHA. It has been talked about but never brought forward.

The Wolf issue passed by 1%…. Just 1%. There any many who supported the wolves that also support hunting. Virtually no one who was opposed to the wolves would be anti hunting.

It could happen if just one group took it serious and tried…

Oh just assuming it would fail is just waving the white flag. If anything the wolf issue proved that things are not all lost in Colorado. At least not yet. But sadly while I was in Colorado, no one was willing to champion this idea and provide such protections to hunting and science based wildlife management…
 
Your wrong it was tried a couple times and never got enough votes. Google is your friend. They've also tried to move the fall bear season up to an August 1st start date and it also failed a couple times.
 
I believe this was proposed as a legislative process rather than a ballot initiative. The legislative approach has been proposed several times and struggles to get traction. Latest attempt was Fall 2023.
 
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It has not been tried as a ballot measure! Us hunters are at the mercy of the elected to get something done in our favor. Clearly they don't feel it is in their best interest to support us.
 
ORIONTHEHUNTER said:
You’re wrong it was tried a couple times and never got enough votes. Google is your friend. They've also tried to move the fall bear season up to an August 1st start date and it also failed a couple times.
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No it has been talked about but no one has really stepped up and pushed for it. The August 1st bear was joke the guy proposing failed entirely to research and provide the reason. It was a weak attempt and when proposed did not even get the support of everyone who would normally support it. It was nice to see someone try but it failed because there was absolutely nothing to support it…

2106 there was a bull introduced to Committee, but it failed in Committee. Why? Because no one did any foot work ahead of the bill.

In 2023. People talked about it but no one ever actually picked it up. Again it has not really be tried in an organized and thoughtful way.

For example, think about the anti hunting groups. They spend years talking about things they want to ban. They spend years on social media testing arguments, recruiting members and then they start to run articles, they recruit “scientist” they pay them to speak out. Only after a long time do they start to organize and push for a change. They also don’t do it as one group. They come as power house…

Before any of the “so called” attempts. Did we make sure that CBA, MDF, RMEF, RMBS, Colorado Lredator Hunters, Trapping Association, WTF, Pheasant Forever, were all united in the language and the move?

Did we see a well organized social
Media campaign? Advertising? Billboards? Etc.

The answer is no. It has never been taken on seriously by any NGO and as a result never taken seriously by the legislature.

Also running fit as a ballot initiative is a great idea then we avoid the politics/tit for tat Bs they will weaken it…
 
elks96 said:
No it has been talked about but no one has really stepped up and pushed for it. The August 1st bear was joke the guy proposing failed entirely to research and provide the reason. It was a weak attempt and when proposed did not even get the support of everyone who would normally support it. It was nice to see someone try but it failed because there was absolutely nothing to support it…

2106 there was a bull introduced to Committee, but it failed in Committee. Why? Because no one did any foot work ahead of the bill.

In 2023. People talked about it but no one ever actually picked it up. Again it has not really be tried in an organized and thoughtful way.

For example, think about the anti hunting groups. They spend years talking about things they want to ban. They spend years on social media testing arguments, recruiting members and then they start to run articles, they recruit “scientist” they pay them to speak out. Only after a long time do they start to organize and push for a change. They also don’t do it as one group. They come as power house…

Before any of the “so called” attempts. Did we make sure that CBA, MDF, RMEF, RMBS, Colorado Lredator Hunters, Trapping Association, WTF, Pheasant Forever, were all united in the language and the move?

Did we see a well organized social
Media campaign? Advertising? Billboards? Etc.

The answer is no. It has never been taken on seriously by any NGO and as a result never taken seriously by the legislature.

Also running fit as a ballot initiative is a great idea then we avoid the politics/tit for tat Bs they will weaken it…
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Pretty sure anyone can be the spear point on a drive like this…..are you too busy?
 
In liberal states like california….it is amazing how much harder it is to get the signatures verified for right leaning ballot innitiatives than it is for the left leaners….almost seems fishy…….
 
Homer said:
In liberal states like california….it is amazing how much harder it is to get the signatures verified for right leaning ballot innitiatives than it is for the left leaners….almost seems fishy…….
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Left seems more intent on letting their heart strings guide their decisions. Thats why all these drives to get things on the ballot pull at peoples heart strings rather than rely on science and facts. It sounds better to them to hear "Save your corgis ancestors and bring the voice of the wolf back to the woods!" over "We want to put a species here that will hunt down and destroy your ungulate populations, possibly attack hikers, in order to make hunting an extinct function so you don't have any other reasons to own a gun.". Just makes it hard for someone to present hunting in a tugging of the heart strings kind of way. We need a wordsmith
 
It would be cool to see a ballot initiative that brought back the spring bear hunt along with a rule preventing bans on ethical predator hunting. Like most bans, a few bad apples in the media ruins it for the majority of responsible hunters.
 
Better take in serious as a heart attack, they did the same thing here in Oregon to ban using dogs on bear and lion and the out of state money POURED in. and it worked, they ran ads showing dipchits making poor kills out of trees and 55% of the voters sucked it up. It's been a long time ago now but RMEF was useless on it, so I hope you have better luck.

We can still shoot them 10 months a year with a cheap over the counter tag but without dogs you know how many get killed. guess what our deer numbers have done since the ban....
 
See that’s why the name of the initiative would need to be: save the fawns and calves! Center it around saving elk and deer populations and the purpose of the initiative would be to continue to have ethical predator hunting… just gotta think like them. Heck they went with “ban trophy hunting” to stop cat hunting, pretty effing effective
 
Homer said:
Pretty sure anyone can be the spear point on a drive like this…..are you too busy?
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I am 99% sure it can’t be done by a NR. Again it would take the NGOs to handle this due to the money and organization needed. Sadly no one was willing to take up the issue while I was in Colorado still…
 
Believe me....I do very little....but I don't get on the internet squawking that "someone needs to do something!!!!"
 
Homer said:
Believe me....I do very little....but I don't get on the internet squawking that "someone needs to do something!!!!"
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Congratulations... But you do get on the internet to squawk about others squawking about something needing to get done...
 

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