Question

[sageadvice]

Has anybody came out with or tried the idea of having a very small transmitter type unit built into or attached to an arrow so that it would come off and attach at the entry site of a hit animal. This unit might then be able to be tracked by the shooter with his remote receiver.

I really liked archery hunting but we simply had too many animals that were never recovered. I know this still goes on, see and hear of it with the buds i hang and hunt with, some of them dang good hunters. Probably not practical but seems that in these days of modern electronics, something could be done with/to that first shot arrow helping big game recovery.

Joey

 

[BOHNTR]

In most states that would be illegal I suspect........I know it would be in my state. The key to archery, in my own opinion, is getting close and putting the arrow where it needs to go. If you hit them in the pocket.......they will not go far......and I don't care what animal it is.

BOHNTR )))---------->

 

[sageadvice]

BOHNTR, much respect and thanks for the info. I just see so many who do not practice enough, maybe don't get close enough, or then there a animals that do jump the string.

Joey

 

[fly4fish]

Although it may be illegal in most states, I believe it would benefit the wildlife. I am definetly not one of the few that have recovered every animal that I shot. I have had a muley buck and a bull elk that I wish I would have had a clean miss, but instead I spent the rest of the season looking for them and never did recover. If everyone used transmitting arrows, more game would be recovered and those people would not go shoot and possibly wound another. Has anybody on here with several kills not had any animals get away regardless of the weapon used?

 

[BOHNTR]

What about those animals that do NOT die of their wound? Wouldn't that same transmitter then aid the hunter in locating the animal again for another shot even though it would have survived? No thanks. I'll use my woodsman ship skills to the best of my ability and make sure I take good shots.

Will that prevent it from ever happening again?.......absolutely not.....but that's the same with ANY weapon one chooses to pursue critters. JMO

BOHNTR )))---------->

 

[mntman]

Actually this has been thought about many years ago and there are a wide variety of patents already established for just this type of traking device. Most have an "extended" nock that protrudes into the arrow with a small transmitter.

But if you wait for a good shot, practice and don't have "buck fever" you shouldn't need it anyway.

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"

 

[sageadvice]

BOHNTR, your skill level, and a bunch of others on this site, are not in question in my mind. It's the simple truth that a lot of mortally hit animals are not recovered by a lot of archery hunters out there. Knowing this and that being the reason i quit myself, it makes me wonder if with all the new tech stuff out there, maybe there is/was something that could help in this regard.

Joey

 

[Silentstalker]

Not sure if there is a product out there or not. Most likely not. My guess is it would not be cost effective to sell that type of equipment that would have to be attached to all your arrows in your quiver. I also believe it would be an unfair advantage for those hits that are non fatal (which through several thorough studies proves to be a high percentage).

Sage,

I think your intent in the question was good, but this type of thing could stretch into rifle and muzzle loader too. Each season I find numerous elk and mule deer after the general season rifle hunts that were shot and not found. The "trouble" with the archery hunter is he is so close he KNOWS he hit the animal. Unfortunately there are plenty of circumstances where a deer/elk is hit with a rifle and if it does not drop in it's tracks, it is not followed up to see if it was hit. Hunters of all weapon types owe it to the animal to get as close as possible and deliver a fatal shot. Practice, practice, practice!!! Just my opinion??

Have a great day!

Chad

 

[rather_be_huntin]

You could easily make a device that once activated only has say a 12 hour life to not give the hunter an unfair advantage at relocating an animal that would have otherwise survived.

I do believe the only purpose this would(should) serve would be a successful recovery of an expired animal. I don't know that it would do anything else however because in my opinion once you stick an animal your tag should be filled.

With that being said I think losing one should inspire one to get that much closer and/or work that much harder to be that much more accurate. Losing an animal is a part of the overall experience and makes a recovered animal that much better. The tracking of an arrowed animal is part of the hunt for me and I wouldn't use such a device even if it was available and legal.

 

[KILLERBEE]

SAGEADVISE: we got into a little dispute a few days ago, i dont want this one to be the same--

BUT--- the same thing happens on all weapons, you make it sound as if its "just archery"?

sure, it does happen, only a fool would try to argue that, but not any more than the animals lost during rifle and muzzy.

as a general rule of thumb---

people who dont put in the effort to "tarck"their animals would be considerd "LAZY" ?? right?


why would the "laziest" of hunters choose to hunt with archery equipment?


again- i dont want a pissin' match[ like you turned it into last time]

but that is B,S, IMO to blam ARCHERY hunters of loosing animals any more than any other weapon!

 

[BOHNTR]

Joey:

I understand exactly what you're saying and what your intent is.......it's to locate "mortally" wounded game that would not be found by a hunter due to poor tracking skills, etc. I just don't believe we should give another excuse not to practice or hone our hunting/tracking skills, as some would rely solely on the new tracking mechanism. Would you agree?



Quote: "You could easily make a device that once activated only has say a 12 hour life to not give the hunter an unfair advantage at relocating an animal that would have otherwise survived."

rather_be_huntin:

How would a device only lasting 12 hours not give a hunter an unfair advantage? Let's say someone hits a deer in a NON-VITAL portion of the body at 7:00am.......he basically has until dark to track that animal, using an illegal electronic tracking device, and can basically track/hunt down that animal again. How is that not an unfair advantage?

I guess I'm just not getting it folks.......I am getting older though so that may be the problem.




BOHNTR )))---------->

 

[sageadvice]

Chad, Thanks! Though i've taken much game in my life, some with a bow and much more with other means, i'm not 100% recovery myself. The feeling of a lost animal is sickening to say the least and if the % of those animals lost could be lessened, i'd be all for it.
It sticks with a guy,... the reason for asking my question.

Rather_ be_ huntin, Thanks for the info and your opinion. I do question your ending though, or maybe food for others thoughts, when you say you wouldn't use the device "if available or legal". When the case being you've felt certain of making a good hit and then later, at a point of finally giving up, as we most all have had to do at one point or another, a beckon pulse showing distance and direction to a downed animal might surely come in handy.

Joey

 

[sageadvice]

BOHNTR said; " I just don't believe we should give another excuse not to practice or hone our hunting/tracking skills, as some would rely solely on the new tracking mechanism. Would you agree?

Absolutely yes!...and you bring up a great if unsettling point! Part of the reason i quit was because with school, 3 sports athletics, and a job, among other outdoor interests, i didn't practice as much as i should have. I did, but i didn't. Also, my equipment wasn't what it is today. But i had plenty of good bucks to hunt on our property and i hunted them spot and stalk, a very rewarding game as you know. Looking back, i didn't put the needed time in to be really efficient at my game. Probably, a lot of "others" don't now as well. We, my best buds and i, lost some animals and that did it for me...

The hard part is the lost animals. Some are going to hunt anyway and i'd love to see "something" help. Sorry to be a "pain" but it is food for thought. Big dollars in this industry and many are fairly well heeled. It's an idea.

Joey

 

[rather_be_huntin]

>rather_be_huntin:
>
>How would a device only lasting
>12 hours not give a
>hunter an unfair advantage?
>Let's say someone hits a
>deer in a NON-VITAL portion
>of the body at 7:00am.......he
>basically has until dark to
>track that animal, using an
>illegal electronic tracking device, and
>can basically track/hunt down that
>animal again. How is
>that not an unfair advantage?
>
>
>I guess I'm just not getting
>it folks.......I am getting older
>though so that may be
>the problem.
>

Maybe I started my post out poorly for my point. The point of my post was to say that tracking an arrowed animal is part of the hunt and regardless if you successfully recover the animal or not your tag should be filled IMO. If you don't recover then that experience should motivate you to be a better hunter.

But I'll hit the ball back to you for fun. If you don't like 12 hours, make it 6, or 3, or what ever. I'm sure there is some scientific data that would say something like "90% of all fatally hit animals expire in 3 hours" or what ever the numbers end up being. Point is you could make the device die after a certain time frame to make tracking a non-fatally wounded animal almost unrealistic. In other words there has to be a battery life timeframe where you have enough time to recover but not enough to track a live moving animal. This is all based on such a device being a legal means of recovery of course.

I think we agree on the issue....just for different reasons I guess.

 

[rather_be_huntin]

LAST EDITED ON Jul-26-09 AT 09:58PM (MST)[p]>
>
>Rather_ be_ huntin, Thanks for the
>info and your opinion. I
>do question your ending though,
>or maybe food for others
>thoughts, when you say you
>wouldn't use the device "if
>available or legal". When the
>case being you've felt certain
>of making a good hit
>and then later, at a
>point of finally giving up,
>as we most all have
>had to do at one
>point or another, a beckon
>pulse showing distance and direction
>to a downed animal might
>surely come in handy.
>
>Joey

Joey I think this is a great conversation so no worries on questioning my opinion.

My opinion is that recovery is part of the hunt. It would be akin to being tipping your arrow with some sort of tranqualizer to ensure you can find the animal down or being able to use dogs to track a wounded animal. I think the idea itself is very well intentioned and I do think that you could eliminate nearly all ability to use it for bad intentions.

I'm an avid fly fisherman. Using the right flies in the right way in the right waters is by far the toughest part of fly fishing. But once you have a fish on the hook you still have to practice good fishing skills by keeping your line tight and letting a big one run a bit. Point is there is more to fishing that just getting a fish to bite your lure, fly, or bait. You still got get him in the boat/net to count.

I think it's the same with hunting. Recovery is part of the skill and experience and there is a very important reason I feel that way. I feel that way because a non-recovered animal teaches you something. It teaches you something you wouldn't have learned if you had a handheld device that took you to it and IMO the lesson you learn will make you a better hunter and maybe more importantly will drive you to be better. It will drive you to get closer, to practice shooting more. It will make you reflect and to even beat yourself up a bit which will make you better in the long run.

Let me ask you a question.....how would putting something like this in place benefit the deer?

 

[sageadvice]

huntin, Thank you, i meant no disrespect. I too prefer to catch trout with my fly rods, have been at it now 45 years, great game but again i haven't learned enough or spent near enough quality time on the water to become as good as some i've been blessed to fish with and call them my friend.

You, and BOHNTR, certainly make great points in this conversation. I keep going back, my thought keep going back to the guys out there that aren't neat the hunter, tracker, woodsmen that you guys are. Maybe that they are new to the sport and if so, do they need to lose a animal or two before they can walk proudly the rights of passage?

"how would putting something like this in place benefit the deer?"

The topic of "hit one and you're done" has been brought up in these pages, the last time not too long ago, where most seemed to vote in favor of such a "rule." You probably see where i'm going with this so i'll spare you but there are guys that give up too soon, don't look hard enough, just don't have your, and many others here, kinda skills. I think it would save more animals from being shot and better the quality of the overall hunt. Kinda like that... but again you make good points

Joey

 

[coltwayne]

I think that somthing like that would be handy for sure. But I think we need to draw the line somwhere on this technology thing. And in my opionion this is the place. I agree with bits and pieces from everyone about this. But I think its a bad idea, for the most part. I think we should just keep trying to make the best shots possible, and if you don't get one try again next time.

 

[sageadvice]

Well Gang, i got what i wanted, to hear some opinions on an idea i had, and it seems to have been already thought of, even developed some. I appreciate how you accepted my question as just that and all the great contributory opinions. In the long run, something like this might have merit, but i do agree that getting in close and picking your shots will always be number one with good skills at tracking and woodsmenship a close number two.

Good luck this coming season and may your arrows fly true,

Joey

 

[GotBowAz]

Joey,
I haven't seen anything mentioned about pass-through shots. Most of my shots I would be locating my arrow with a tracking devise at about 15 to 20 feet beyond where I hit the animal in the first place and probably stuck in the dirt or smashed in the rocks. I don't think most arrow stay in animals unless they have some kind of barbed broadhead if they don't pass through. I have seen elk pull arrows right out of them and then pile up. I would think the same would be true for the most part on a marginal shot or bad shot. In other words I would think it would be a short tracking job and you still would not recover the animal.

GBA

 

[sageadvice]

LAST EDITED ON Jul-27-09 AT 09:22AM (MST)[p]GBA, Yeah, i did think of that but not fully through. I mentioned in my opening question that maybe the transmitter would somehow come off and attach to the entry site. Certainly, there are other possibilities and/or considerations. Wouldn't probably help transmitter matters much either if it were embedded in the middle of a big ol bull either.

Thanks for all the interest fellows! Again, just food for thought and i'll let you guys carry on if you so choose.

Joey

 

[BOHNTR]

If one is going to use an "outside source" per se, I would much rather have folks use tracking dogs rather than electronic technology. Several states allow dogs to be used for tracking wounded game. From what I understand, on mortally wounded animals, the recovery rate with dogs is very high. Just another thought.

BOHNTR )))---------->

 

[Boskee]

LAST EDITED ON Jul-27-09 AT 12:59PM (MST)[p]Joey your intent is good as usual. But one thing I thought about that concerned me is that how many people would this encourage to take a shot they normally wouldn't take? Lets face it the majority of shots that stay in the animals aren't always the most lethal ones so if we made it easier for those to become successful I'm sure more of them would be taken. With some of these guys thinking that longer shots in archery are OK, this would only be a tool to them to assist them with their dream of the big rack. We need people taking better shots not more marginal ones and these types of things always seem to open the envelope a bit more than it is today. That's a far cry from your original intent but it's easy to see how it could lead to that line of thought and those actions to some. Sad but true. Regards, CA

 

[eelgrass]

Joey, knowing your concern and ethics, I would encourage you to look into some of the new bowhunting equipment on the market today. I had the same concerns as you a couple years ago. I saved up some money and got set up with a new bow. I was blown away at how easy it was to shoot. With a little effort you can get very comfortable and confident taking shots out to 40 yards and even farther. I added a range finder, and I have no reservations about letting one fly at an animal, if the right opportunity comes along.

I lost most of last year because of Forest closures due to fires, but this year should be better (I hope). I know you have a full plate this year with WY, but I bet you might join in the fun when you can.

Eel

 

[just4fun]

i'm one of those people that hold a patent on a tracking device (still in development), using an RFID chip. RFID's have no power source, they merely reflect the signal that is returned to the handheld unit which generated it. with the range is limited to about 30 yards, no one can use this for long range tracking and the only way to attach the chip to the animal is to shoot it. hit a bone or pass through, the chip stays attached to the animal for a limited time. maybe not practical for most, but possibly for some. for me, your question and the coments are great to see.

Just4fun

 

[mdwsthunter]

God knows I'm not a tree hugger, cause i'm not. i've got a trophy room to prove i love to hunt. i pretty much agree with BOHNTR on this one. I think in a perfect world it might work. Where all the animals were fatally hit. What about the ones that aren't? We would just run those animals into the ground with our relentless tracking. I always do everything i can to recover my animal, but even worse than not finding something i've shot that died is shooting an animal and tracking it for so long that my pursuit is what actually kills it. I guess there's good and bad with all new technology.