Quota on elk units?

[Twoshooter]

When will they have the non-resident quotas available for elk? I know they set most of that stuff in April, but the elk drawing for non res is way before that. With some of the unit boundaries changing I was wondering how it will change quotas. I also wish they would tell you what units you can buy the archery license for with a type 1 tag before the application deadline.

 

[WapitiBob]

You can see the archery units by looking at last years regulations.

 

[TOPGUN]

With the big change made in units for this season there is no way before the draw that tag numbers will be known if you put in for one of them. The archery seasons will probably stay like they were with the old unit numbers and you can see all of those like WB stated by going into the 2013 Regulations and they are on page 7-19.

 

[jm77]

NR elk quotas are based on the number of tags in the unit the year before. The G&F Commission doesn't approve elk quotas or seasons until late April or early May and NR are already drawn by then.

 

[MAT]

>With the big change made in
>units for this season there
>is no way before the
>draw that tag numbers will
>be known if you put
>in for one of them.

What are you referring too? The 2014 application book only has minor changes for this year. Are you talking something else?

 

[WapitiBob]

The combined/modified units NW of Cody.

 

[SDBugler]

>NR elk quotas are based on
>the number of tags in
>the unit the year before.
>The G&F Commission doesn't approve
>elk quotas or seasons until
>late April or early May
>and NR are already drawn
>by then.


I'm impatiently waiting for the draw results. So if the NR quotas are based on last year's tag allocation, then how do they address the new combined units this year? Will they increase the tag numbers since the units got larger? I'm sitting on max points and gambled this year and applied for one of those "combined" units.

 

[delmag1942]

They will be available the same day as the results, like every year.

 

[TOPGUN]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-18-14 AT 09:36AM (MST)[p]>They will be available the same
>day as the results, like
>every year.


***That is incorrect. All that is done right now is the posting of the individual draw results and that will be out before the end of this month. The individual unit season dates and tag numbers will not be known until they are posted online in the Final Regulations that are voted on by the Commission and signed and that is generally in late April.

 

[delmag1942]

The results will show how many NR drew in each unit though? The quota's in the Spring will not affect the NR #.................?

 

[TOPGUN]

>The results will show how many
>NR drew in each unit
>though? The quota's in the
>Spring will not affect the
>NR #.................?


***What results are you talking about? There are no total stats of any sort coming out that I'm aware of when each person finds out in the next week or so if they drew a tag. The final quotas will affect the NRs, as well as the residents, because of the leftover tags that will be available to everyone online in July.

 

[WapitiBob]

There has to be an unpublished "quota" in order to have a nr draw, otherwise it would make every hunt unlimited.

 

[TOPGUN]

>There has to be an unpublished
>"quota" in order to have
>a nr draw, otherwise it
>would make every hunt unlimited.


***That is obviously true WB, but it's unpublished as you stated until the Final Reg comes out in late April. With elk it could bite you if they happen to cut tag numbers in the unit a NR applies for in January. Am I not correct in telling delmag that the only way he will get tag numbers is to wait for the FinalReg to be posted?

 

[WapitiBob]

Well, it's the only way i'm going to post on the web but I'll know who has them in a day or two and I'll have 2015's in hand before I apply next year.

Yes, if they happened to cut tags like they did for Antelope, you could be going off last years numbers and be applying for a unit with few to no tags. Not a good deal for NR's that are paying the prices we are paying.

This all fuels my intention to ask the Dept to move the Elk draw to the end of April. Not that it will do any good but the above scenario is but one of several reasons I will outline to them. We just don't have enough information to make an informed decision on where to spend our WY Elk money.

 

[feduptwo]

back in the day of paper applications there was a valid reason to have different non resident vs. resident draws because you had to have someone physically enter every applicant into the system. Now that paper apps aren't even allowed there is really no valid reason to have a staggered draw.
The way I understand that it works for elk is they go off last years quota. If the quota gets cut nr's get a greater %. If the quota gets added to the nr's get a smaller %. Since deer and antelope aren't drawn till after the winter counts are done there is always the right amount of tags given as far as %.
Push it back to the same as the resident deadline.
It probably benefits everyone except outfitters as a lot of people decide where there going based on the first state they are successful for.

 

[BuzzH]

delmag,

The NR draw being so early can impact NR applicants, but it could also impact Residents as well. Depending if quotas are reduced or increased the outcome can be a positive or a negative.

The only difference being that the Residents will know what the quotas are before they apply.

Heres a few things that could happen:

1. NR's could actually get a higher percentage of total tags in any given unit if the actual quotas are lowered.

2. NR's could actually get a lesser percentage of total tags in any given unit if quotas are increased.

Of course the same can be said for Residents, but in reverse.

3. NR's may not even be able to apply for some units if there is a new hunt assigned after the NR draw closes. (yes, it does happen).

Finally, the bottom line is that elk quotas typically dont shift that much from year to year. No question that the elk quotas, in particular bull permits, dont really change a lot.

IMO, its not a big enough problem to ask the GF to change the draw to a later date. If I were a NR of Wyoming, I'd be glad they hold the draw this early. It really allows you a lot of flexibility in applying for other States when you have the draw results by late February.

I think the chance you tag in quota changes is pretty easily trumped by knowing so early.

Just my opinion.

 

[SDBugler]

Any idea how they will address the "combined" units (see my post #6 above).

For example, I applied for unit 54 which added a portion of previous unit 121. Will they include some of the previous 121 tags from last year? Or will they just go with last year's quota for unit 54/65. I gambled on that unit this year hoping that the tag numbers would increase slightly and also be a slightly larger unit with the benefit of the longer season.

 

[lostinOregon]

You will be able to go to the draw odds that are posted the same day as the results to see how many NR tags were handed out. I look at it every year. You have to add it up from the 4 types of draws but that's the first time you will get a look at the numbers.

Rich

 

[BuzzH]

They probably have a good idea on about where the quota will be. My "guess" is it will probably be less than the total number of combined tags last year. Thats what I've seen in the past anyway.

Hard telling not knowing though...

 

[WapitiBob]

Buzz, it's a bid deal when they continually post opening dates of Oct 15 and continue to change them to Oct 1 after we have applied, and as you noted, when they don't list a hunt then add it, year after year. Yes, you could take a chance but I don't know anybody willing to burn points and assume a date will get moved off the one on the preliminaries.

 

[WapitiBob]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-18-14 AT 09:00PM (MST)[p]And there's no reason not to know. They know exactly how many tags they allotted for the new hunts. Our draw is done with hard numbers. It's real easy for the dept to publish those numbers along with the tentative seasons. I'll have those quotas well before the draw next year.

 

[TOPGUN]

>You will be able to go
>to the draw odds that
>are posted the same day
>as the results to see
>how many NR tags were
>handed out. I look at
>it every year. You have
>to add it up from
>the 4 types of draws
>but that's the first time
>you will get a look
>at the numbers.
>
>Rich


***Good point Rich! I completely forgot that they do post the draw odds quickly so you could add them up to get a total just like you said.

 

[delmag1942]

Buzz/Rich......That you for articulating what I was trying to say!

No doubt part of WY early elk draw is $. Mid-Draw season would guarantee less applicants in the special draw (general for instance) In my opinion,

 

[sjhgraysage]

SDBugler

From the new map I printed it looks to me that most of what used to be elk unit 121 is now in elk unit 53. Am I looking at it wrong??

 

[SDBugler]

I believe the eastern third/half of unit 121 was merged into 54. Really hard to tell on their map and no verbal description of new boundary.

Hope the draw results come out soon!

 

[delmag1942]

Brian,

I would say about the east 40% of 121 migrated into 54/65.

David

 

[WapitiBob]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-19-14 AT 12:20PM (MST)[p]They won't release a legal descr. until the Commission finalizes everything.
The new 54 includes the portion of the old unit 50 East of 212 and the jeep trail, and that eastern chunk of the old 121. You can figure it out with a topo.

 

[WapitiBob]

total 2014 Elk quotas for area 54:

type 1; 50 (8 nr)
type 2; 25 (4 nr)
type 4; 50 (8 nr)
type 9; 35 (6 nr)

The NR totals (16%) are then split special and regular, PP and Random.

 

[SDBugler]

Thanks WBob!
Where did you find that info?

Looks like a couple more NR tags available this year.

 

[WapitiBob]

There could be rounding errors in the NR amounts. I just took 16% and rounded up/down.
Info is from the Dept.

 

[TOPGUN]

>Thanks WBob!
>Where did you find that info?
>
>
>Looks like a couple more NR
>tags available this year.


***WB has a sweetie in the draw section that feeds him all that information, LOL!

 

[SDBugler]

I need a girlfriend like that in every state!
I wonder if my wife would mind?