Rem. 700 Sendero Accuracy

M

Meander

New Member
Messages
3
I recently purchased a Remington 700 Sendero SFII chambered for the 7mm Remington Mag. With the exception of adjusting the factory trigger down to 2.5 pounds there have been no modifications made to the rifle. I carefully cleaned the barrel after each shot for the first ten shots fired through the rifle. I then carefully cleaned the barrel after each five shots for the next ten shots fired through the rifle. Since then I have used multiple combinations of bullets, powders and primers to find a load this rifle likes. Bullets: Nosler 140 grain Ballistic Tips, Nosler 160 grain Accubonds, Hornady 139 grain Interbond, Hornady 162 grain SSTs, Barnes 160 Grain TSXs, and Berger 168 grain VLDs. Powder: RL22, H1000, Retumbo. Primers: Fed GM215M and Rem 9 1/2M. To date I have yet to achieve a 100 yard bench rest group under 4 inches with this rifle. I have small hands so I dislike the huge palm swell on the HS Precision stock but in no way feel this is causing the accuracy problem. The scope is a VX2 3-9 with a target dot reticle.

What was this rifle manufactured to shoot? Does Remington have a specific factory load this rifle was meant to shoot with? If so what is it? As you can appreciate I spent a little extra money for this super duper "long range tack driver" and so far I'm very dissapointed.
 
Meander, Sorry to hear of your disappointing results thus far. You most certainly have something other wrong than the load you're using. To answer one of your questions, i don't believe Remington offers a accuracy guarantee but certainly anything over 2" is completely unacceptable and i would expect 1" groups or better.

Is your barrel free floating? No pressure points on the barrel?

Are your scope base(s) and rings good and snug?

Stock to barreled action screws good and snug?

Have you tried a different scope? one that you know to be good?

Have you checked the crown, end, of your barrel, make sure it was done clean and even?

Are you shooting off a very good solid rest on fairly high scope power at a small target with little or no shake?

Hate to include this but, not knowing you, a flinch could be giving you these kinds of groups too. Have you eliminated, in your own mind, your own skills as the cause?


These are only some of the possibilities, enough to look at for a start anyway and keep us posted on the progress of your shooter. Sounds like a fine gun and you have every right to expect a good shooter.

Joey
 
That's too bad. I would follow Sage's and Completes advice but there is something amiss with a sendero shooting that poorly. I highly suspect it is your scope. Switch it with another that you know shoots well and give it a try and make sure your bases are tightened down and rings are snug. That gun should do much better than that and I'd call Remington and talk to them a bit about it. I'm assuming this was a brand new gun and not a used one but if the scopes not the issue I'd suspect the barrel the bedding with that stock and it's bedding block shouldn't be the issue ( but nothing's perfect in todays world). Good luck and keep us informed! Remington will make it right for you.
 
I own a Sendero and it's one slick shooting sucker. I have 2 buddies that own them as well and theirs are tack drivers as well. I wouldn't think it is the gun, probably more of a scope or mounting problem like stated above. Try mounting a different scope on it and see how it shoots and make sure everything is secure when you try the different scope.
 
One thing to make sure of when you're trying to find the issue is only change one thing at a time unless you are pretty knowledgable about firearms. That way you're eliminating one issue at a time. Make sure you're not introducing more variables as you go that can compound your issues. When ever any gun wouldn't shoot the first thing we always looked at was the scope and it's mounting by using a scope we know shot well and made sure it was put on correctly. A loose mount can throw shots like that very easily and and a scope with loose internals can have you wondering too. I've seen a few bad scopes over the years on quite a few guns but in all fairness Leupold's usually are pretty damn reliable. 90% of the time it was with the scope or it's mounting and usually was in the mounting because a thread had hung up and the base or ring wasn't tight. When shooting make sure you aren't adjusting the scope for groups using different loads just let them land where they are to see if the mounting was the issue. Then if you see you're making progress then adjust your scope and see if it holds the groups. Just shoot 3 shot groups to make it easier and see how that holds. If you're making progress then you know you've probably solved the issue. Your groups with that setup should be less than 1 1/2" very easily on a nice cool morning that's sunny with no breeze to make it easy. Shoot the same loads if you can for consistancy sake. Most sendero's will shoot at or under an inch with the right loads pretty consistantly. If she's still not grouping pull your frame in to 50 yards and shoot a group or two with a cool barrel and see what she does. If it's stacking them in there at 50 then it should be doing it at 100. If not swap out the scope if you haven't already done so and repeat all the steps starting at 50 yds. If your groups tighten and remain consistant after adjusting then you'll know it's the scope not the gun. You can test it ( the bad scope) on another gun you know shoots well to know for sure. Leupold scopes are warranted for life so send it in and they'll fix it for you. I'm hoping that it is the scope or mounting because that's the easy fix in the equation and the one that's the most common in situations like these.
 
Gentlemen,

It is certainly possible that I'm making mistakes in the process of setting up this new rifle,and I will go over everything again, but I think I have a problem with the rifle. My father was a gunsmith for the majority of my life and all of these things are routine.

I first started with a Huskemaw 5-20 scope where the poor groups were first encountered. I then switched to the Leupold knowing it was proven to be accurate on other rifles... same results I shoot a .375 Ultra mag from a bench on a monthly basis and obtain consistent 0.5" groups at 100 yards. Controlling flinch with a 7 mag is not an issue.

I'm headed out to buy a box of factory ammo to shoot. I'll let you know what happens.

How do I go about contacting Remington if I can't get this thing to shoot?

Thanks in advance.
 
Meander, Thanks for the info. Thanks for not taking offense that it may have been you, obviously not the case...

Sounds like you really may be in need of their customer support division. I'm hoping you find satisfaction as a lot of us have come to expect and depend on one main thing from Remington thru the years...that they can shoot well right out the box.

http://www.remington.com/support/

Good luck and again, please keep us informed on how it goes.

Joey
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-16-09 AT 02:25PM (MST)[p]Meander, if you take out your Remington warranty booklet there should be contact information in there. Makes sure you follow the steps in the manual if you have a defective firearm to make sure you comply with what they want to the letter. They may just have you send it to a repair center but most likely would have you return it to the factory. I would include some targets that you shot and make sure you outline the steps you went thru to make sure it was the firearm and not the optics. I'm sure that some of the steps we suggested were a little redundant, but there are individuals on here of all ability levels and nobody has a way of knowing one's ability and many issues that weren't gun related have been solved in the same fashion. I can understand your frustration with the situation but Remington has been pretty good standing behind their products in all my past dealings with them. Good luck and I hope everything works out just fine. CA

Here is a phone number off another thread that may help you but I would use the number in your manual if you have one in there. the number is 1-800-243-9700 and it's option 4 for production rifles and you'll be on hold a while according to the poster. Hope this helps. One other thing if you don't get any satisfation I'd call the custom shop at 315-895-3200 and they may point you in the right direction. Tim McCormick used to be the head of that shop but since they moved I'm sure that could be different or he may have retired by now.
 
you very well might have obtained a lemon. its just a product...like everything else. sometimes "bad" one are produced. i am by no means a remington fan, but they claim the sendero is there most accurate production rifle. good luck.
 
nothing to add that others have not. but i have to comment on the HS palm swell also, who in the hell did they build this stock for?! they make an ok stock, but that palm swell is somehting else! i dont have small hands, and have buddy's that go 6'6", and they also say it is uncomfy for them. the B&c is the same way.

even with the bedding block, they have to be skim bedded, fnny that a McMillan is more true than any stock on the market, made with layered fiberglass. u get what u pay for i guess. rant over!
 
Reddog I think they may have done that because that's a weak point in most stocks but a nice palm swell when done correctly makes a comfortable stock. What you addressed has been the #1 complaint I've heard about those stocks over the years and it hasn't changed so I think they need the material in that area. I fully agree on McMillan making the better/ stronger stock but those HS stocks have seen many years of hard service in law enforcement sector and with other applications and they do their job. Bedding doesn't hurt anything as we both know but there are literally hundreds of them in use on swat teams that never have been or will be bedded and they flat shoot. There's a percieved advantage to that type system in harsh conditions and it's ease of cleanup and simplicity in field operations makes the design a plus especially with multiple operators. They're not McMillans equal(IMO)but they're a good reliable product like you said.
 
Okay. Went back to the hills today with a box of factory Winchester 150 grain Power-Point loads, and a few of my own reloads with Berger 168 grain VLDs. The setup was a portable bench with sand bags. Pretty stable overall. Shooting 100 yards. 0-1 mile an hour wind. Huskemaw 5-20 scope. The red dots on the target are one inch circles, and the target grid squares are also one inch. I'm shooting a little better than four inch groups this time, but I'm still very dissatisfied. Take a look-see and let me know what you think is happening.

This top pic is the target shot by the Winchester factory loads. Five shots at each dot, except for the top left and top right dots where there is six shots at the left dot and four at the right dot.
100_5054.jpg


This pic is of the target shot by my 168 grain Berger VLD reloads. Four shots at each dot.
100_5055.jpg
 
I think you are right in not being satisfied with those groups. I don't really see a pattern that would point to one explanation or another. When looking at the individual groups there looks to be concern or maybe a clue for cause but then the group next or below it dispels the possible theory.

Two to three inch groups are just not acceptable for nice a setup like you have. Being the gun is new, i'd go straight back to Remington with it. If you take it to a smith, they may say that "he" messed it up and not care to back up their product.

Again, please continue to fill us in on how Remington reacts to this, as i see it, accuracy, Quality Control issue. Great learning and interesting post for the forum, not necessarily a good thing for you. Good luck!!

Joey
 
Meander I agree with Sage and he makes an EXCELLENT point about the smith. Get out your manual and call Remington and discuss it with them. They'll probably tell you to ship it back to them. I suspect that you have a bad barrel. The phone numbers I posted up for you should work to contact them but make sure you follow return policy to the letter in the manual to avoid any delays & include all the targets or copies for them to see. Good luck on this and hang in there they'll get the situation straightened out. They are a good company and stand behind their products. Keep us posted & good luck. CA
 
Man that is a bummer. Must be a bad barrel. I have a Sendero in 7MMRUM and have shot many different Factory loads through it. The only one that shoots is the Remington Premier Scirocco loads. All others would not group very well. The Premiers group under .70"@100 off a bench with just sand bags, have yet to vice the gun down. I am hoping to work a load up this summer. I have a buddy who shoots a Sendero in 300RUM and it is a tack driver as well so I know they can shoot.

Sage/Boskee have great advise. Contact Remington and get that gun back to them. Please keep us posted on how they respond.
Thanks and good luck.
 
Yep,
good point about the gunsmith, Rem might would try to pass blame on the smith, thats good thinking.

Please let us know what happens, I wonder if it is determined to be a bad barrel if the fluting has anything to do with it? Fluted barrels are pretty, and lots of them shoot well, but they have always worried me a little.
 
wow, no pattern at all with those groups (no pun intended)

if it were me, i'd take this oppertunity to put a Krieger or Lilja on it!
 
You might want to send your scope back to Huskemaw. A friend of mine has one of the best of the west custom rifles with that exact same scope and was having the same problems as you are. He sent it back and they said they found some kind of problem with the scope. He got it back and it shoots under an 1" at a 100 yards now.
 
Another thing, not all rifles will shoot great at 100. Some like to pattern them better at 200 or so. My .257 wby shoots right about an inch at 100 yards, but shoots damn near 1/2 MOA at 300 with the same load.
 
I wouldn't be concerned about the groups with the Bergers yet. Take the advice given and have the rifle checked by Remington. Then start over if need be. I have found Berger bullets to need a bit more work to get accurate, and using them in a rifle that is having problems only compounds the problem. I also know guys with Sendero rifles, and they are shooters. Bet Remington will make sure yours is. Keep us posted. mtmuley
 
"You might want to send your scope back to Huskemaw. A friend of mine has one of the best of the west custom rifles with that exact same scope and was having the same problems as you are. He sent it back and they said they found some kind of problem with the scope. He got it back and it shoots under an 1" at a 100 yards now."

Had the same exact thing happen to a friend. His gun would not group at all, sent his gun back, a best of the best gun too, and they said there was a problem with the Huskemaw and said they fixed it and are returning it.
 
Firstpoowas8inches,

That's pretty amazing, a rifle that shoots loose at 100 but tightens up at 300. Mind boggling.
 
Reddog,

I'm being a smartass. I don't see how a rifle that groups poorly at 100 yards could correct it's innaccuracy at a further distance. It seems to defy the laws of physics. On my rendition of the posters name, I saw that done on another forum to him and laughed my rear off at it.

BeanMan
 
>Reddog,
>
>I'm being a smartass. I
>don't see how a rifle
>that groups poorly at 100
>yards could correct it's innaccuracy
>at a further distance.
>It seems to defy the
>laws of physics. On
>my rendition of the posters
>name, I saw that done
>on another forum to him
>and laughed my rear off
>at it.
>
>BeanMan

Me too BM....Still laughing


horsepoop.gif


Disclaimer:
The poster does not take any responsibility for any hurt or bad feelings. Reading threads poses inherent risks. The poster would like to remind readers to make sure they have a functional sense of humor before they visit any discussion board.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-24-09 AT 09:43PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Jun-24-09 AT 09:42?PM (MST)

well dont laugh too hard guys, its true. pysics dont take in account rigle twist and yaw. their is a long article by Dan Lilja on the subject, but i couldnt dig it up.

I found this to be true in my 30-378 and 270 wby. i i got a laugh out of the name also! off the campfire wasnt it?

http://yarchive.net/gun/ammo/bullet_spin_rates.html
 

Click-a-Pic ... Details & Bigger Photos

Member Gallery Photos and Videos!

Screenshot_20211126-231927_Gallery.jpg
CBEF3776-9BB7-44E3-9380-01E9CD6482E2.jpeg
5246ABE3-50BB-4977-90FC-71BF828DEF5E.jpeg
20210921_185946.jpg
2022 Deer 3.png
D33EDA85-AB64-46A4-AACB-065A71201EC1.jpeg
20211225_112432.jpg
IMG_0563.png
934917B8-77B3-464F-956D-C49794B47FD9.jpeg
100_0740.JPG
EAA6C3B4-F358-41AC-A948-ADFEE87B5A2E.jpeg
L1030077.JPG
Back
Top Bottom