SFW - Utah Needs Your Help!

grizzly

grizzly

Long Time Member
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5,598
C'mon SFW, you're a big dog in this state. Help us out!

The Utah State Legislature is again considering a bill to get rid of Daylight Savings Time. Many are confused by Daylight Savings Time and don't realize it is the extra hour we have after school/work between March and November. Many people think it is the dark hours in the winter months. These spring/summer/fall months are obviously the best times for fishing, scouting, shooting guns/bows, grilling with the family, training your dog, a quick hike down by the river, soccer practice, etc...

According to The National Recreation and Parks Association, "Children today spend less time outdoors than any other generation, devoting only four to seven minutes to unstructured outdoor play per day while spending an average of seven and a half hours in front of electronic media."

I wouldn't even care if we stayed on Daylight Savings Time year-round, but to lose that extra time in the evenings where we can spend time outdoors with our families would be a horrible loss to sportsmen in this state.

___________________________________

H.B. 66 While Rep. Marsha Judkins is new to the Legislature, her inaugural bill on daylight saving time has already done several laps around the Utah Capitol.

Her proposal would put a nonbinding question on the ballot in 2020, allowing Utah?s voters to weigh in on an issue that has bedeviled lawmakers for years.

Judkins says the twice-a-year time changes throw off sleep patterns and mess with children?s schedules, and many families and groups want to see the clock stay consistent year-round.

?It's disruptive to all of our lives,? Judkins, R-Provo, said of the time changes.

Judkins said the bill language currently online is serving as a placeholder and will soon be updated with her preferred proposal.

Her plan is to let voters decide if they want to keep the status quo, go to year-round standard time or go to year-round daylight saving time. Lawmakers would consider the results but wouldn't be legally bound to act, she said, and Congress would also have to sign off on any plan to scrap time changes.

A massive survey conducted by the state in 2014 found that 67 percent of respondents favored following Arizona?s example and sticking to Mountain Standard Time all year.

______________________________

Contact your Legislator at this website and tell them to keep our after-work hours in the sunlight https://le.utah.gov/GIS/findDistrict.jsp
 
I agree with you grizz I do not think people realize they will lose that hour in the evening.
I personally like the extra hour.
This is my proposal move the clock a half hour forward this spring or fall back a half hour this fall which ever they designate and then leave it there permanently.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-22-19 AT 12:49PM (MST)[p]>Arizona does not have it, causes
>zero problems.

It doesn't get dark at 4:30 in Phoenix in December like it does in Northern Utah.

Just keep Utah on Daylight Savings Time year-round. This is what I propose.

Grizzly
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-22-19 AT 02:19PM (MST)[p]Uhhhh, Grizz- the bill does not take away daylight savings time. It actually provides an avenue to make daylight savings time year round.

The Bill states:
11 This bill:
12 ▸ provides for the state of Utah to remain on mountain daylight time year-round once
13 federal congressional legislation authorizes states to opt out of standard time.

So the bill is asking for the exact thing you want- "I wouldn't even care if we stayed on Daylight Savings Time year-round."

https://le.utah.gov/~2019/bills/static/HB0066.html
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-22-19 AT 03:32PM (MST)[p]^^^ She has said the current language is merely a placeholder for the actual "preferred" language. I would support the current language, but that will not be the bill that will be voted upon.

This is about the fourth year in a row they've tried this, last year it barely missed getting through the House (HB76 went 34-36) so they're trying again.

EDIT... From Trib article on Boomerang Bills (those that fail every year but get refiled anyway)... "Given the slight margin of failure last year, Judkins said she's cautiously optimistic that this could be the session the bill finally clears the Legislature."

Grizzly
 
The bill only asks to put the question to the people of Utah, and even then it's non-binding.

Seems like a weird thing to be so up in arms about.
 
^^^ Because of the desired end result. The same proponents have tried for years to go to Standard Time (we lose daylight during summer months). When they failed to get that passed, they decided to put it on the ballot knowing the most recent government survey had a 67% approval rating and would thus lead to their desired result.

This is an attempted end-around to go to Standard Time. For instance, there has never been a proposed bill to go to permanent Daylight Time as that's not the goal they seek.

Far too many people are confused by Daylight Savings Time as proved by the comments on the Governor's Office of Economic Development survey.

Even though the results showed support for Standard Time, the comments were overwhelmingly in favor of the opposite... they get confused by the names and actual results of proposed changes.

An example, one person who favored Standard Time said it was because Daylight Time contributed to global warming due to the extra hours of sunshine.

Outdoor-loving people will easily be the most harmed by Permanent Standard Time so we need to speak up and stop it before it gets going. No reason to let the ball gain steam.

Grizzly
 
>The same proponents have
>tried for years to go
>to Standard Time (we lose
>daylight during summer months).

The amount of daylight is the same regardless of how you set your clock.
This will not change the rotation of the earth.
 
>
>>The same proponents have
>>tried for years to go
>>to Standard Time (we lose
>>daylight during summer months).
>
>The amount of daylight is the
>same regardless of how you
>set your clock.
>This will not change the rotation
>of the earth.

I thought that was self-explanatory since I have already written in the OP, "it is the extra hour we have after school/work" as well as "that extra time in the evenings".

I didn't think I needed to continue with that qualifier but I can if you'd like.

Grizzly
 
You could always fish, scout, shoot your bow/gun, go for a quick hike by the river, practice soccer, or just spend time with your family in the morning when that daylight appears. Just a thought. Or continue to think this will negatively impact sportsman. Either way.
 
DST makes me mad, leave the time alone.

4b1db2ac644136c4.jpg
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-22-19 AT 06:46PM (MST)[p]we just lost it here in CA....2018 election

by referendum....



497fc2397b939f19.jpg

GOODWIN: Dems really do love Republicans -- when they're dead...
 
>You could always fish, scout, shoot
>your bow/gun, go for a
>quick hike by the river,
>practice soccer, or just spend
>time with your family in
>the morning when that daylight
>appears. Just a thought.
>Or continue to think this
>will negatively impact sportsman. Either
>way.

Do you really think dads are going to be getting their kids up to take them fishing before sunlight so they can pack the truck back up an hour later, drive home, get their kids cleaned up and on the school bus at 7:55 am? It's not going to happen.

There is a reason the golf industry is one of the biggest proponents of daylight savings time. It's not because people will just get up early and golf before work... outdoor activities overwhelmingly happen in the evenings.

Grizzly
 
>we just lost it here in
>CA....2018 election
>
>by referendum....

I thought California voted for permanent Daylight Savings Time...

"On Election Day, a majority of California voters, nearly 60 percent, voted in favor of a ballot proposal to leave the state in daylight saving time all year round." source: https://www.vox.com/midterm-electio...ts-ballot-daylight-saving-time-all-year-round

Did I misread this? As I've said, that is the best of both world's, IMO.

Grizzly
 
Id prefer year round daylight time. But then I go outside after work.

From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 
Yes I do. My dad did when I was a kid. I do it now with my kids. I work with a lot of people that work night shift and would love the extra daylight in the morning to do quick things with their kids in the mornings before they are off to school. Not everyone works 9-5 jobs. Fing with the clock a couple times a year impacts others negatively. I get it, you don't want to change it because it would screw with what works best for you. There is nothing wrong with that. Just say that. But admit that having DST screws up others. Don?t try to turn spin this into some horrible impact to sportsman.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-22-19 AT 07:41PM (MST)[p]mulecreek, more people work 9-5 than work night shifts... that's why they're called business hours. So lets focus on the large majority of people that work regular business hours. If somebody is going to lose (which of course will always happen), then lets minimize that to the most popular/common working hours, not the relatively few that work night shifts.

It is fine that you, or the people you work with, work night shifts... but the far majority do not. That's why DST is supported by home improvement stores, golf associations, grilling manufacturers, outdoor equipment manufacturers, Chamber of Commerce, National Institute of Health (they found increased exercise and Vitamin D from sunlight), and crime opponents (7% reduction in crime after DST), among others.

For reference, Nielsen TV Ratings shows a 16% reduction in TV ratings after Daylight Savings Time. Another study found that children were more likely to spend time outdoors during DST regardless of school hours, "We therefore conclude that, by shifting the physical activity mean of the entire population, the introduction of additional daylight saving measures could yield worthwhile public health benefits."

The science regarding exercise being more beneficial in the evenings as well as increased outdoor activity is clear. The lessening of TV-watching further bolsters that people are substituting TV time with outdoor time. The reason so many outdoor trade groups support DST is the same as well.

There is absolutely no reason to believe that people will substitute morning activities in place of evening activities. The science, polling, studies, and anecdotal data simply don't prove it. Regardless of your work schedule.

PS. Congrats on taking your kids fishing before school. As somebody who spends a lot of time outdoors in the morning, I can tell you with certainty that you're a rare breed as the rivers and parks are virtually empty of families during early morning hours.
 
>As somebody
>who spends a lot of
>time outdoors in the morning,
>I can tell you with
>certainty that you're a rare
>breed as the rivers and
>parks are virtually empty of
>families during early morning hours.
>

All the more reason to be out there in the morning
 
Best Start Getting Your Tails out of Bed in the Mornings & Quit Sleeping in!

Most of You Probably don't even know what the Midnight Sun is!










I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!:D:D:D
 
As someone who lived 22 years in Arizona and then the last 7 outside of Arizona I can assure you that you are completely over exaggerating how important it is to have Daylight Savings time. It helps with nothing, period, end of story. I know you posted all sorts of "facts" supporting it, but DST is not some magical thing. Time zones are important, daylight savings time is not. I get that you like it, but speaking from experience, Arizona has it figured out. The whole time change twice a year thing is a joke.

I think you would find that you would quickly adapt to it if they went away from DST. I lived in Alaska for a bit and the people up there have fully adapted to loads of sun in the summer and no sun in the winter. I'm sure they would love to have more sunlight hours in the winter up there but where they live dictates how much sun they get, not whether they are on DST or not.

I doubt many people care about DST as much as you do, and most would willingly adapt and move on with life rather than get lost in the weeds of something that has no real consequences. Like I said, i understand that you like your DST, but I wouldn't lose any sleep over whether or not it sticks around, and I wouldn't melt my keyboard trying to preserve it. It truly is not necessary to get through life, Arizona is proof of that.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-23-19 AT 10:46AM (MST)[p]It appears some people in southern states don't understand how Latitude affects daylight during different parts of the year. For southern states to apply their experiences in winter months to the northern states is completely incomparable. Two states currently opt out of Daylight Savings Time, not coincidentally they are southern states: Arizona and Hawaii. Lets look at how those states compare with northern states using today's data.

Billings, MT

Today at 5pm - 29F
Sunset at 5:07pm
Hours of daylight - 9:21

________________________

Salt Lake City, UT

Today at 5pm - 32F
Sunset at 5:34pm
Hours of daylight - 9:48

________________________

Phoenix, AZ

Today at 5pm - 62F
Sunset at 5:51pm
Hours of daylight - 10:21

_________________________

Honolulu, HI

Today at 5pm - 78F
Sunset at 6:36pm
Hours of daylight - 11:05

_________________________

Arizona already gets 33 minutes more daylight, over half the way to Daylight Savings Time, than SLC and an hour more than Billings... purely as a factor of Latitude. We can't change the hours of daylight, but we can change when those hours happen. Positioning those hours during peak usage times is the current impetus of DST.

What is not factored in here, but is equally as important, is that the angle of the sun lessens as you go further north. Therefore, evening sun, say the 30 minutes before/after sunset, is much stronger and more supportive of outdoor activities in the southern states as well. This only exaggerates the issue.

For people in warmer southern climates, with more outdoor opportunities during the colder six months of the year, to try and apply their situations (with more inherent evening daylight and temperatures naturally more inducive to outdoor activities) to the northern states is simply not a comparable scenario.

Grizzly
 
One more point of interest since I know so many people see things through a political lens... the Republican Party has tried to switch the whole country to permanent Daylight Savings Time in the past but the Teachers Unions have prevented that from happening. They say kids might have to walk to school in the dark... then change school start times since science has proven that would benefit children's education anyway.

I've never seen the whole big deal with changing clocks. It takes me about two minutes to change those that don't change automatically. One day a year I get an hour less sleep and another day a year I get an hour more sleep. My sleep cycle during an elk hunt is affected far more than that, yet I survive.

If everybody wants to go to permanent Daylight Savings Time, lets go for it, but the idea of losing 250 hours of summer evening daylight each year because of one hour of lost sleep is insane to me.
 
I think this was someones signature on here one time.....

Old Indian once said, only a white man would cut off one end of a blanket and sew it to the other end and think he has a longer blanket.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-23-19 AT 11:05AM (MST)[p]It doesn't matter to me. Now that I am retired, I have six Saturdays and one Sunday each week. I go to bed whenever I feel like it and get up whenever I feel like it, and life is great.
 
>LAST EDITED ON Jan-23-19
>AT 11:05?AM (MST)
>
>It doesn't matter to me.
>Now that I am retired,
>I have six Saturdays and
>one Sunday each week.
>I go to bed whenever
>I feel like it and
>get up whenever I feel
>like it, and life is
>great.


Big time envy here, 5 years to go
 
>I think this was someones signature
>on here one time.....
>
>Old Indian once said, only a
>white man would cut off
>one end of a blanket
>and sew it to the
>other end and think he
>has a longer blanket.

A fool would have a six foot blanket but only cover his feet, leaving the rest scrunched and unusable on the ground. A wise man would pull the blanket up so it offered the most benefit.

Grizzly
 
Grizz, you have a bad habit of attacking anyone that disagrees with you. I figured it was just passion over an organization you support, but I see that has nothing to do with it.

Anyway, didn't you say the reason you want permanent daylight savings time is so you have time after school and work to go recreate? Now you're saying for schools to adjust time to start in the daylight. So...which is it? If they start school 2 hours later so they can begin in the daylight, you just lost 2 hours on the back end after school to recreate.

Put me squarely in the camp that say....meh. I don't like changing clocks. I think it's a hassle and I really dislike the re-adjustment periods I go through every six months. But I'm not afraid of putting it to the people to see how they feel. As has been said by others, I'm not so incapable of adjusting that I have to worry too much about this stuff. I'm much more concerned about those actively trying to take hunting opportunities away from me than I am about what time the clock says it is while I'm hunting.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-23-19 AT 01:46PM (MST)[p]Vanilla, I never attacked anybody. Somebody used Arizona as a counter-point and I showed why that is not a strong argument as southern states are far different from northern states. Somebody else tried folk wisdom in an attempt to make a point, I used the same analogy to show why that "blanket" can remain the same size but be pulled up or down to be better utilized.

Have you ever noticed how you virtually never offer a positive response or even make an actual point other than attempt to make a negative counter-point. You don't make your case, you just attempt to shut others down. If you read my posts, they are always spelled out why I feel the way I feel and I try very hard to make sure to refrain from personal attacks... though I'm sure some slip through with the haze of the written word. I do and try and keep it substantive and on-point and not address the poster, just the post.

As to your school argument... I wonder why you picked an arbitrary 2 hours for your example rather than the 1 hour discussed via DST? Schools around here are from 8:15am - 2:30pm. Adjusting those to 9:15am to 3:30pm in no way would limit a parents ability to spend time outdoors after work at 5pm, which has been the established talking point as "regular business hours" (you can thank Dolly Parton for that).

And if anybody thinks the normal business hour doesn't end at 5pm, I challenge you to get on a freeway in a major city around that time and see for yourself what time the average person is driving home, and thus beginning their ability to spend time outdoors with their family.

The math is the math, that one hour of clock change in March equates to 238 hours of evening recreation time for the average American family.
 
>The math is the math, that
>one hour of clock change
>in March equates to 238
>hours of evening recreation time
>for the average American family.
>
Time is the same. Do you run inside as soon as the sun sets? I get the feeling you may be afraid of the dark.

Don't really care what Home Depot, the USPGA or Weber think. Are you seriously concerned about a Vitamin D deficiency in Utah? Since you seem to be so convinced that maintaining DST is a great thing and can provide such great examples as to why I am curious why you would even worry about it coming up for a vote in the Legislature. I mean if the Chamber of Commerce thinks its a great idea then that should make it a slam dunk to remain.
 
I'm with you 100% grizzy.

Keep DST and if we have to stay in one, it better be DST.

Year round standard time would suck.
 
I offered my indian verse purely for humor, nothing more. I live in Oregon and will retire Arizona. Daylight savings time paid 0% in that decision. When I was younger I really enjoyed that extra hour of daylight. As I have matured it is much less important. Let the people vote on it, that way more than half of you will be happy.
 
My kids have fun after dark too.

I don't care if there is day light savings or not. I don't see why people associate SFW with this.

When my kids are in school we have fun. When the kids are home and its daylight, we have fun. When my kids are home and its dark, we have fun.

Now I'm stuck trying to figure out what some racist Indian has to do with the argument.
 
Griz
You have some good points. More day light hours after regular work hours to play outside. I'm a golfer as well.
 
Grizz, you referenced someone as a fool. That is an attack.

And I spelled out my feeling on this every bit as clear as you have. It doesn't matter to me what the clocks say, I'm fine with it going to the voters of Utah to give a NON-BINDING opinion to the legislature.

If you can't understand that, it is not my problem.
 
I vote for the sun to stay up later and come up earlier during the winter month so I wouldn't have to shovel snow in the dark. It's scary and cold out there!

If we can have that, it would really be something.

The rest is ranting and drivel.

Zeke

#livelikezac
 
>Grizz, you referenced someone as a
>fool. That is an attack.
>
>
>And I spelled out my feeling
>on this every bit as
>clear as you have. It
>doesn't matter to me what
>the clocks say, I'm fine
>with it going to the
>voters of Utah to give
>a NON-BINDING opinion to the
>legislature.
>
>If you can't understand that, it
>is not my problem.

We saw the last time the voters gave the legislature an opinion on a non binding matter.


From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 

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