Suing Satan

>"Suing Satan" - made me think
>that Trump was carrying out
>his threat to sue Cruz.
>
>
>This is about as funny.


Lol.....exactly what I thought
 
Hey dude?

Gonna have to show Me where I ever said they were My Heroes?

All You wanna Do is KILL People!

Well,I Guess You want other People to do the KILLIN but you want em all DEAD!





[font color="blue"]"I Don't get No Sleep!I Don't get No Peace!"
[/font]
 
And this crazy b!tch is one of the "eyewitnesses" that Lavoys family has to base their murder claims on. Very credible witness.

[font color="blue"]I don't make the soup,I just stir it.[/font]
 
Com'on bobcat we all know you're a sympathizer all you have to do is read your comments. maybe they're not heroes, you just respect them. Stoner actually called them heroes.

I am for killing terrorists you're right. deputize me and give the okay and I could shoot them just like rock chucks. no problem. they are a lot like rock chucks actually, they damage what belongs to me, cost me money and crap all over the place.












Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
>I am for killing terrorists you're
>right. deputize me
>and give the okay and
>I could shoot them just
>like rock chucks. no problem.
>they are a lot like
>rock chucks actually, they damage
>what belongs to me, cost
>me money and crap all
>over the place.


I just wanted to gas 'em so they'd flee the refuge building, but *I* get called Rambo...
 
Togglehead,

The only time I used the term hero for the Bundy group was when you tried to make hero's out of the terrorist logging protesters and I said the Bundys were the real heros if you compare the two groups.

I have alway said here that I am only trying to point out what made these people do what they did. I do not know anything about this Shawna Cox from Kanab UT. Maybe she was one of the plural wives of some of the Mormoany following. She does sound crazy.

I do know that we have just found out and there are evidently video's of some more yahoos whom should be in jail, and were basically inciting violence at the Malheur. Kieran Suckling, the main man of the Center for Biological Diversity and Garrett VeneKlassen of the NM Wildlife Federation spent almost two weeks there protesting the take over, getting in people faces and coming and going as they wished. These two guys are far more guilty of crimes against humanity and public lands users than the crazy Bundys and that bunch ever were, except for the fact that the Bundy bunch were armed and had the stupid radical militia people there. The Eco's are our real enemies. These guys and their organizations agendas cost the natural resource user and the American taxpayer dearly every year and they are only gaining steam and taking over the way the public land is used.
 
When did I ever say vandals are heroes? when did I say they shouldn't be hung? the only true thing you said is you called the Bundy gang heroes.

Given the choice between public land management by the eco's vs the Bundy butt bunch I'll take the eco's. at least it will stay public land and it will be protected. maybe over protected, but that's better than under protected.

Best case scenario the hippies and you seditionists keep fighting and kill each other then the rest of us meet in the middle and leave it the way it is. that would be perfect.

















Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
Toggle,

How truly ignorant you are!

Seditionists? Maybe the radical militia people, but for you to try and generalize the rest of us into this category is further proof of your stupidity!

Yeah lets see how the eco's manage the land? Like I said before you must be a card carrying member of the CBD. When Kieran Suckling was up there you guys must have been a##hole buddies. You both have the same Marxist modus operandi. Did he stay and go out drinking with you on the celebration party you had, or did he host it?

Kieran Suckling got paid $203,000 to be one of the top dogs at the "Center" last year. Dave Foreman, founder of Earth First and Kieran lived in Glenwood here for a while in their early drug LST mind expanding days. Many an old timer has said we missed the opportunity to tar and feather and drag these basta##s down the street when we had the chance.

Talk about Satan, look into these two individuals if you want a true picture of Satan.

These guys are on record of saying a human is no better than a cat or a rat or a snail.
 
Humans are a mammal at the top of the food chain that's all. this gives us the ability to take what we desire from the resources on the planet but it doesn't excuse us destroying it for future generations. so somewhere between the eco's and you clowns is a place we can live with and preserve a quality of life today and for the future.

The truth is if not for the hippies in the 70's this country would be a chithole today. they woke the nation up and saved it from environmental disaster.

Have they taken it too far? probably. but the way you change that is through modification of the ESA and other policy at the federal level. not by feeling sorry for yourself and demonizing people who are smarter and more successful at achieving their goals.

Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
Exactly, we are trying very hard and spending a lot of time and money and are using the best of the best to counteract the eco freaks and their endless amount of money and liberal judges that side with them.

The Arizona/New Mexico Coalition of Counties for Stable Economic Growth having 18 member counties from AZ and NM are in the courts right now against the Mexican Gray Wolf expansion and the Jaguar Critical Habitat suits and trying to protect the lives and livelihoods of the people here in the SW. What are you doing to help?

Most of the natural resource producers in the last 40-50 years are good conservationists and the only chithole today must be the one you live in. These old ranch families that have been there almost 150 years have managed the resource wisely or they darn sure wouldn't have lasted this long.

Go to northern NM and see the true pioneers, the direct descendants of the Spanish explorers, where these ranchers have been running livestock since the 1600's.

You ought to thank these ranchers and resource users for making this nation great and providing your fat a## with a plentiful, cheap food supply.

You fit right in with all of the liberal koolaid drinkers that run the show in Oregon. You guys can't even take your hounds out and run a cat or a bear. Pathetic is all I can say about your stupid state of mindlessness. At least in NM and AZ we can still hunt and fish and not be overwhelmed by a##hats like you.

Maybe you can sign on with WildEarth Guardians if you haven't already. You would fit right in. And to think you try to convince people here on MM that you are a worthy adversary of the hunting community and for that matter of the human race. You are the lowest form of excrement that I have witnessed in a long time Sonny.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-19-16 AT 01:22PM (MST)[p]



Stoned,

I noticed something about you. If anyone disagrees with your position then they automatically shills for the eco freaks/Liberals/oppressive government you despise. Has it ever crossed your mind that perhaps other American citizens enjoy freedom to express opposing opinions or are you like very other fake conservative and only love the Constitution if it fits your agenda? Why can't you stand for other people to hold different views and opinions then you. You are running off people who otherwise would support you and your cause.

Why should anyone thank Ranchers for choosing their way of life? Should we thank outfitters for all the fertilizer their horses leave up on the mountains too? Do you know what entity has actual policies to try and make a safe and affordable food supply? I will give you a hint and it isn't ranchers or farmers, it is the government. So you are saying we should thank the government for our safe and cheap food supply? Farmers and ranchers are in business and would sell their products to whomever pays the most without regard to who is hungry and that is the way it should be. The government wants to ensure a safe and cheap supply of food. That is why there are some many programs for ag producers to get access to the tax payers money.
I don't understand why fake conservatives hate the free market and the Constitution and both for the same reason. It's like they are brain washed into being always the victim just like Al Sharpton.

Nemont
 
Nemo,

I guess I view what is going on in our society much differently than you Nemo as well as Tog. I try to point out where I'm coming from and what is driving the eco movement and the ever growing federal government.

I guess we are too far apart philosophically in most walks of our life in the US today to come to any kind of understanding between either of the three of us.

No one and I repeat no one is more against feeding at the government trough, and for you to think that most of the public lands ranchers or other resource users that depend on the public land do so in any way that even tallies up to being subsidized, is not taking a hard enough look at the true economics of trying to exist on the public land. If it were so darned lucrative and fun everybody would be doing it. It is a supply and demand market driven economy, grazing cattle as well as guiding and outfitting hunters, as well as all of the other multiple uses on the public land. They are a way of life and many generations of hard working westerners have made this nation great for it. For you to try and claim otherwise is just an opinion of yours that can't truly be substantiated. It has been taking place on the public land or the lands of the western US for over 400 years. The Spaniards brougt the cattle and sheep into the southwest in the early 1600's

If you were to truly take time to even try and comprehend what I am trying to tell you, you could maybe understand. But no you just spout off your marxist liberal holier than thou capitalist yarns.

Both of you guys are living the good life on the backs of the federal government it seems. Nemo, your claiming to be a strict capitalist is good but that philosophy is becoming a thing of the past as the government takes over and controls all aspects of our lives and is controlling our very lives from cradle to grave. The huge overreach of the Federal Government and its Agencies is making serfs out of all of us. I guess you are a serf capitalist. Go back to work and make some more tax money to support your big government fix.

Yeah right, "hate the free market"! Give me a break and go give the CBD and WildEarth Guardians some donations as they fit your fairy tale marxist capitalist agnostic ideals better is seems.
 
Stoner,

Do you really believe in the free market? How about letting public land grazing go to the highest bidder and let the government maximize the return it gets from public lands?

I suspect you rather enjoyed the protection from competition for grazing lease that evil Uncle Sam gave you back when you had grazing allotments. So let's see if you are a capitalist or socialist.

Would you be willing for the government to get maximum value for it's grazing?

Nemont
 
Nemo,

Yes the government should get fair market value for the grazing. They do when you figure in all of the added costs of running on the public land, the huge permittee contribution into the improvements and also on the value of the grazing permit which as you know are traded on the open market and the IRS taxes on. If you figure all of this in and all of the other benefits and revenue s collected from the other users of the same land, yes the government is coming out ahead all the while giving the public a play ground where they can recreate, hunt, fish or basically do what ever they want.

If these public lands grazing ranches are so good Nemo maybe you had better go buy some as they are traded daily out here and you can get whopping 10 year basic leases, and most of them have many years worth of water, fence and other improvements already in place so all you do is load up your semi and haul in your cattle, and then go set in the shade drinking your koolaid as you will be making a ton of money being as how the government is will be giving you such a hot deal.

You are about as hard headed of a person I have ever run into Nemo, but maybe there is still hope for you, although you seem to have a hard heart and mind.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-23-16 AT 12:55PM (MST)[p]Why would I want to invest in land I don't own? That is the cardinal rule of investing, never ever put money into an asset you don't have control of.

Please show me the numbers that say the government is coming out ahead of public lands? The revenue doesn't come close to their budget, which is fine but certainly if the government were to run the grazing and other uses like a business, they could get much more revenue and be self supporting.

So you support a competitive bidding process for public lands grazing?


Nemont
 
Stoner you're more full of chit with every post.

Wouldn't an auction be the way to assess fair market value? wouldn't that take into account all the awful things you claim allotment holders must endure? the old saying is a thing is worth what someone will pay for it . if you're right the allotment holders save money when the bids come in lower than 1.86 an AUM. correct? WTF is your answer to that? you advocate costing produces money? do tell.

You say the farmers and ranchers detest the government trough. bullchit, total bullchit we jump to it. it's public record how much I've taken everyone here knows and I would have taken more if they'd give it. in the big picture it had little effect on my bottom line but I had no trouble cashing the checks. how many ranchers turned down the LFP in your area? be honest for once if you could. how many?

Honesty is the biggest difference between us. ag has more in common with the welfare mother than we do big business. you're either too dishonest or too dumb to accept it.











Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
>You say the farmers and ranchers
>detest the government trough. bullchit,
>total bullchit we jump to
>it. it's public record how
>much I've taken everyone here
>knows and I would have
>taken more if they'd give
>it.

hqdefault.jpg
 
Competitive bids might work on some seasonal allotments and a few other instances but on a big share of the allotments the commensurate property tied to the grazing allotment is an integral part of the allotment , that the federal grazing by law, is tied to or needed to make the public grazing there viable.

It is not practical in most instances and the eco's would always be throwing a wrench in the bidding process as well as the almost impossibility of handling the livestock in and out without the corrals, scales and improvements on the private land part of the ranch.

That doesn't take a genius to figure out that your stupid idea of bidding out all of the government leases would be a losing proposition. Just the additional government red tape to handle all of the complications of getting a new leesee every year would be a monumental hurdle. These short term bidders would have no incentive to manage the land, only reap and pillage. A big share of the present permittees have been good stewards of the land or they wouldn't still be in business.

LFP, and just what is that supposed good deal government program that everyone is evidently sucking on? It sounds like you have got it all figured out Tog. More power to you. Go suck the tit some more.

American Agriculture is heavily subsidized and especially cotton, dairy and a host of farm programs. It is called a cheap food supply The American citizen spends less on food out of their paychecks than the people of any other nation. We have an abundant and healthy food supply and you should thank your lucky stars or whatever diety you subscribe to.

What I keep pointing out here and you two guys aren't man enough or smart enough to admit it, but federal lands grazing isn't nearly as lucrative as you make it out to be, and further more, all things considered, the public lands grazers costs of producing a pound of beef is comparable to the private land producer.

There is a push right now to have the NMSU RITF do a new and comprehensive study to show the true costs and try and turn the tide of the subsidized grazing fee debate and propagandization tactics used by the radicals to convince stupid people like you guys as to what the real world out here is really like.

You say I don't know? I have been involved in USFS grazing allotments for 43 years, having owned them and still having family with them and all of my neighbors and friends whom have them and know 90% of the 70 plus permittees on the Gila National Forest as well as a host of permittees throughout NM and AZ and you try to tell me that I am wrong. I guess it is a different world up in the NW, but I don't think so. You can argue your simple minded ideas all day long but they still don't hold water.
 
Stone,

Can you find where anyone but you have used the word lucrative? You talk about that ranching a lifestyle but the facts are that the owners of the public lands don't owe anyone a lifestyle. Then you whine about the evil government but you are all for government rules that say the public lands grazing has to be tied to the base property and the grazer with the allotment should never face competition from others who may want to graze lands. So as long as your government cheese is the form of government protection from competition you are good with socialism. You are like every other fake conservative I have ever met, take with both hands and when whine when even a bit of you government cheese is taken away.


You should have the NMSU RITF do a study that shows something that was done in this century and not using data from 1988. Anything change in the cattle business since 1988?

Nemont
 
Nemo,

We are in the process to get and updated study from the RITF.

We are not necessarily for the different base property qualifications but rules are rules. We didn't make them but we just have to abide by them. Many public lands grazing allotments require a substantial base property, especially ranches whom have only summer public grazing lands and it only makes sense the rancher has the necessary private property to care for the cattle during the rest of the year on their private lands. That is only common sense and how are you going to possible put out something like that out on bids when it wouldn't even make sense. That landowner could probably outbid an outsider because he doesn't have to pay for hauling the cattle in and out and provide housing and care for the cattle. You don't even have one lick of common sense it seems to me.
 
So you are saying ranchers would be willing to pay more for their grazing if it were put out to bid? Wouldn't that mean then they would currently be paying under market value if they would be willing to pay more if there was a free market?


All I did was ask if you would support a bidding process. I already knew the answer that you would give because you hate the free market. You are right bidding wouldn't work but if as you admit current owners of grazing would bid higher because they could that means you should understand that means they are paying below market rates for that grazing.

I am fine with public lands grazers and the current system just don't pretend like it isn't a good deal for the ranchers. If it wasn't worth grazing public lands ranchers would fight so hard to keep it.

You don't have one shred of truthfulness when it comes to your government cheese and taking with both hands from the government you hate so much.

Nemont
 
Stoner may not be the sharpest knife but he knows he doesn't want to open it up to bids.

The auction idea isn't mine stoner, if you knew anything about allotments you'd know that. it was from a study which proposed the plan to Obama in 2011 which he chose to ignore.


I do know how to get the FSA money. so do all REAL producers. including the Hammonds you feel so sorry for.


http://farm.ewg.org/persondetail.php?custnumber=A09419096












Stay Thirsty My Friends
 
Go back and read my post again. I only am saying that the bid system won't work on a big share of the grazing allotments. Pretty darn simple.That is the only smart thing Obama ever did in his entire career perhaps. Bend down and kiss your emperor's shoes Sonny.


Real producers? I'm sure there have been many that have benefited from drought, disasters and the like but I don't know any around here.

They had a huge weather event, wind and snow in eastern NM at Christmas that killed a lot of cattle and really hit some dairies hard. I imagine those people will be getting some of this government assistance.
 

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