This happened to me/What would u do?

D

DW

Long Time Member
Messages
14,332
I had the good fortune of shooting a 5pt bull opening morning in a colorado general unit a couple wks ago. After takein the pics I was putting the camera away and digging out my knives for the task at hand. As I look up a 4pt bull stumbles down the hill and lays down 50yds away. As he came down I could clearly see some Jackwagon shot him high in the right rear leg and he was dragging it behind him. There were 5 other guys in camp, my dad had tagged out which left 4 other bull tags (maybe). It was opening morning, I hadn't heard a nearby shot recently. He was hit hard and was layin 50yds from me. If he didn't die soon I suspected he would, some cold January night a few months from now, suffering until then. The law says I can't shoot, my morale compass and personal ethics say different. I reached for my gun, settled the cross hairs on him.........
 
I'll let this breath a few days. Tell me what u would do, then I'll tell u what I did, in this situation, and in 1 similar 10yrs ago. Hope everyone's fill in their tags!
 
I'd let him lay there and suffer.....I have no heart



"As democracy is perfected, the office of the President represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day, the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be occupied by a downright fool and complete narcissistic moron."
- H.L. Mencken, the Baltimore Evening Sun, July 26, 1920
 
settled the cross hairs on him.........

But then you got to Thinking:

If I Shoot Him I must Tag Him!

I already have one Bull down!

T'ain't Legal to Shoot/Kill 2 Bulls!

So You decide to do the Right Thing!

You Call the Game & Fish knowing they are working on Cases way more Serious than this,but You're doing the Right thing!

2-3 days Later the Game & Fish Contact you & You take them in to Find the Spoiled Bull!

The Game & Fish start asking all kinds of Questions & are wondering if it was you that shot the Bull in the first place!

Now You've wasted Your time!

And you've Wasted their time!

And the Animal was totally Wasted!

But you done the Right thing,Right?

You'll do the Right thing next time,Right?








[font color="red"]From My Smokin Cherry Red Hot Barrel & My Dead Cold Hands I Shall go down Fighting for American Pride & Rights!
I Know I'm Out Numbered by Pusssies & Brainwashed Democrats that'll Throw Their Hands in the air & I know I can't Lick the U.S. Military by Myself when they Turn on us but I'll make
you one Guarantee,They'll be Enduring a Situation where I Hope to Hell All Americans become True Americans once again & Stand up for their Rights!
 
I wouldn't shoot him.

That said, it real easy to say that right now behind my computer. Being in the field and watching him die might make that decision more difficult. At the end of the day I would probably try and determine how bad he was hurt. If there was any inkling I though he could make it (and elk are tough animals) then I would definitely let him be. If I was 100% sure he wouldn't make it, then it gets really tough...
 
I tell my buddies with tags and let them decide if they want him or not. Then I walk away as if it didn't happen. Someone else shot it, it's not my business and I don't need any citation for putting it down.

Eel

It's written in the good Book that we'll never be asked to take more than we can. Sounds like a good plan, so bring it on!
 
Just from your description of where he was shot would indicate a wound he will not recover from and end up dying after suffering for possible days.
I know it is not legal, but I hate to see an animal suffer, I guess you can figure out what I would do.

RELH
 
>Shoot him and pick the one
>with the bigger rack?



LOL




2311idiot.jpg
 
If it is clearly a mortal wound, I'd had shot him. Squared away the meat and then called the game officer and tell him the situation.

Seen a doe a couple years ago, I had my buck tag filled and was helping another guy in camp. None of us had doe tags. Seen a doe stumbling with guts hanging out, we took a video, shot her. Took the meat out and called the game warden. We found a camp nearby with a doe tag, gave them the meat then with the gamey's permission and that was the end of it.
If you are honest with the game warden, they are going to be realistic and understandable...
I told him, if he needed to write me a ticket then I'd take it due to technically breaking the law but I wasn't about to let an animal suffer like that no matter what the ticket cost.


Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"


>wah wah wah......
a certain individuals response on 8/12/2014 to anyone that commits suicide.
http://www.monstermuleys.info/dcforum/DCForumID11/19864.html
There are many things that would be nice to wish for or say but then I would be just like him.
 
I would put the animal out of his misery and got someone in camp to tag him so the meat would not go to waste. Moral ethics trumps the law in this situation. IMO
 
Put him out of his misery and suffering. There's a point where laws and rules are bull chit. I'd sleep better knowing that elk wasn't suffering.


Traditional >>>------->
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-27-14 AT 07:30AM (MST)[p]This happened to me as well. I was a Park Ranger, not a Game Warden. Some hunters came to me wanting to know if they shot a wounded bull, could they put their cow tag on it? (NO!). I tried unsuccessfully to raise Warden(s)or other F&G personnel to no avail. The hunters led me to where a 5 pt. bull elk was down. He could barely get up and walk w/o stumbling, and had a large open wound on his right flank. I put him down with my service revolver, submitted an incident report to my agency. Later contacted the Warden who came out to investigate. The only bullet retrieved from the carcass was mine. Apparently a gore wound from fighting...I was a bit worried maybe it wasn't a fatal wound after all, but the bull appeared to be in pretty dire straits to me, and I felt I did the right thing; did not want the animal to suffer what appeared to me as a slow, debilitating death. Whatever the circumstance, I feel it only right to contact the Game & Fish department persons in your state. I guess there might be some afraid of the "let no good deed go unpunished" mentality, and worried if they had done the right thing as well.I would hope that ethics would supercede law in these instances. I have to admit, the meat was no good as the bull was fevered and had probably been wandering quite awhile in fevered and sick condition (according to the personnel who retrieved it). Also +1 to Mtnman comments.
 
While I absolutely agree with everyone ethically who would put it down, it would still be against the law.

It would be my luck that the warden would walk up just as I shot, or not believe me, or decide to follow the law to the letter.

A conviction for over limit would carry a hefty fine and loss of hunting privileges in most if not all western States for 10 years.

And then you would be reminded on MM that "once a poacher, always a poacher":)

Maybe the best option would be to let it lay and make an effort to contact a warden.

Eel

It's written in the good Book that we'll never be asked to take more than we can. Sounds like a good plan, so bring it on!
 
I would 100%, without hesitation (once I determined the animal was fatally hit and suffering), shoot it.

I would then take proper care of the animal, field dress, etc. and contact the nearest GF office.

I would document everything via video or camera.

If the GF wanted to cite me for it, so be it. That's what judges are for.

I don't see how, if you handle it professionally, any warden or judge that was worth a chit would throw the book at a person who ethically and morally did the right thing.

I have to sleep at night and I would live with any consequences if I knew in my heart I did the right and proper thing. In some rare cases, the laws are just not black and white.
 
I would leave him lie. I would try to quarter out my elk as quietly as possible in hopes that the wounded bull would stay put. Then if I heard from other hunters who were looking for a lost elk I could tell them where to go, or send someone from my own group up there to finish it off and tag it.

I only feel a moral obligation to end an animals suffering if I am the one who made it suffer in the first place.

Any other way of handling this will result in a poaching investigation with me as the leading suspect. If I shot the other bull and quartered it and then told the full story as written above, the Game officers are just as likely to believe that I either shot both bulls and then fabricated the story to try and get away with it or shot two bulls thinking it was the same one.
 
I'd like to say I'd put it out of its misery and then try to find who may have wounded it or someone who wanted to tag it. I hate to see an animal hurt and suffering like that.

HOWEVER, this did happen to me. Or similar. A few years back, hunting Colorado. It was about 4 days into the hunt and a smaller 4-point came walking down the hill through really thick stuff and he was wounded....really hurt. I felt bad, was sure no one was tracking him, could tell that he'd probably suffer like that for at least a few more days. I thought about putting him down, but I live by the rule "someone is always watching" and didn't do it. I would have had to tag that deer and I wasn't willing to do it.

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com
Will you LIKE MonsterMuleys.com on Facebook! I need a friend....
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-27-14 AT 10:40AM (MST)[p]The ethical thing would be to put it out of it's misery. But I wouldn't do it. I would try to contact F@G and let them deal with it. If you think that the wardens or a judge will be kind hearted and realize it was the right thing to do, you might get the surprise of your life. I had a buddy kill a moose in Idaho with an elk tag. The horns looked just like an elk. I know everyone on here will say a moose looks nothing like an elk but under these cicumstances it looked like an elk and he shot it. Got over to it and was sick. He did the "right" thing and called the wardens who looked at it and said " it does look like an elk here's your ticket. He went before a judge and the horns were used as evidence. The judge looked at them and "huh, I would of probably shot it myself, looks like an elk. Here's your $3000.00 fine". Just not worth the chance.
 
Find cell phone service, call warden or friend with tag. There is no guarantee you will find an understanding warden. If that fails.......
 
I had a similar situation w/ a pronghorn, although more natural in context. I was watching a smaller rutting buck chase does, all of the sudden the buck face plants into the ground in a pile of dust. Upon recovery the buck gets up dragging his rear-end across the ground- looking through my spotting scope I can see a compound fracture to the left rear leg and blood spraying out of a severed vessel. The buck must have stepped in a badger or prairie dog hole, etc. They're not very structurally resilient, high rate of speed, and thus the fracture. Conundrum- shoot and put it out of its misery (not legal unless I want to fill my tag on this goat), let nature play its part out(nature is a MF'er and it would probably be a day or a few before the yotes get to him), call F&G (once in cell phone range, which I wasn't then, and provide GPS coords)...? The latter being the most applicable, nature is nature and maybe this is the process that needs to be carried out, but the first would be the most merciful.
 
I always try to do what's right.... and follow the law. When the two diverge, I'll follow the law. I don't need a "poacher" label and certainly don't want the potential of missing 10 years of hunting for doing what's right!
It's not all "black & white" out there! Lots of gray and every circumstance is different. Had I been there, I might have a different opinion and I'd never fault a guy for doing what he feels is right.
Zeke
 
I would leave it. Doing the "right" thing is not worth the potential legal consequences.

My happiness and potential suffering trumps the animals suffering.
 
If the elk looks that sick to bed 50ds from you he can be found again and put out of his misery. Ethically the right thing to do is:

1) find someone that has an unfilled tag to hunt the bull and shoot it same day as you found it.

2) find a game warden to come and handle the situation.

As much as it hurts you that the elk is suffering, Don't Shoot It! here in NM you will be fined for shooting it and if you gut it, you will be fined for taking into possession, and then you will be over the limit and it can go on and on and on.
 
Why is someone a 'jackwagon' because of a misplaced shot? What if the shooter was about to crest the hill after his/her elk?
 
I would not shoot it. There very well could be someone tracking that bull. You do not hear every shot that is take, especially if it was in the bottom of another canyon.

Get one of you buddies with a tag and come back latter and if he is still there then have him shot and tag it. That is if he is willing. If he has moved before you get back; as bad a shape as you have said he is in, he should not be far away and should be easy to track.
 
Hey BuzzH!

Don't Try that BullShhitt here in TARDville!

You'll get your Ass Handed to you in a Quick Hurry!

Not Sayin I disagree with you!

Just sayin!



>I would 100%, without hesitation (once
>I determined the animal was
>fatally hit and suffering), shoot
>it.
>
>I would then take proper care
>of the animal, field dress,
>etc. and contact the nearest
>GF office.
>
>I would document everything via video
>or camera.
>
>If the GF wanted to cite
>me for it, so be
>it. That's what judges are
>for.
>
>I don't see how, if you
>handle it professionally, any warden
>or judge that was worth
>a chit would throw the
>book at a person who
>ethically and morally did the
>right thing.
>
>I have to sleep at night
>and I would live with
>any consequences if I knew
>in my heart I did
>the right and proper thing.
>In some rare cases, the
>laws are just not black
>and white.
>
>
>
>












[font color="red"]From My Smokin Cherry Red Hot Barrel & My Dead Cold Hands I Shall go down Fighting for American Pride & Rights!
I Know I'm Out Numbered by Pusssies & Brainwashed Democrats that'll Throw Their Hands in the air & I know I can't Lick the U.S. Military by Myself when they Turn on us but I'll make
you one Guarantee,They'll be Enduring a Situation where I Hope to Hell All Americans become True Americans once again & Stand up for their Rights!
 
I think curlycoyote put it best. There is nothing more to say.

Mark
muledeer.jpg


My hunting spot is so secret, not even the elk have found it yet.
 
Leave it be. Let nature run its course. Nature is brutal, but so is the law. I think it is just as ethical not to shoot it, to not break the law, as it is to put it out of its misery. Unless you are willing to put your own tag on it, then you can't shoot it. There just really isn't a way you can defend yourself even if you did it with the best of intentions. How can you prove you didn't poach it and then just change your mind about it?

Unless of course, Russell shot it. ;-)






HOOK 'EM!
_______________________________________

Since I am frequently asked about my religion on this site and others, I have created a profile that explains my beliefs. If you are interested in finding out more about my faith, please visit the link below:

http://mormon.org/me/6RNQ/
 
A lot of factors go into the decision. Am I confident no other hunters are in the vicinity that may be tracking the bull? Am I confident that another in my camp would tag it? Could I get to camp and get a buddy back to shoot the animal and tag it? How far are you from a road or cell reception that you could report it to the F&G? There are surely other factors that I haven't thought of as well.

The law is well intended, but no law can accommodate every scenario. It is against the law, but I believe it is the ethical thing to do, and shows great respect for the animal. That said, I don't think it is unethical to abide by the letter of the law, either.
 
This would definitely be a tough call. My first instinct would be to put him out of his misery but I've heard a lot of horror stories involving the Fish and Game when people were trying to do the "right" thing. It all depends on the warden, some can be cool and understanding and others are by the book thumpers.

I had a buddy who killed his first buck on opening morning when he was 15 years old some years back with his dad and sister. As they were going through the check station there was a rookie warden and an older veteran warden checking the game and tags. My buddy had killed his buck several miles in so they quartered it up and took all the meat out and of course the head.

When the rookie warden came up to them and started checking the deer and tags he asked them in an angry tone, "where are the testicles? They're supposed to be attached to each side of the quarter." Anyway the rookie warden went on and on and was threatening them with all kinds of things until the veteran warden walked over and said, "nice buck son, is this your first?" to which my friend replied "yes". He then turned to my buddy's dad and said, "you guys are just fine, you guys can take off. Have a good day."

I also had a run in with a warden in Strawberry once. I was by myself and was loading a decent 3x4 that I had killed an hour earlier into my truck. He pulls up like a bat of hell, jumps out and runs over to me and says, "let me check your tag." I said, "sure it's right here on the antler." He looks it over and says in an angry d-bag tone, "you cut the wrong date out, you cut the wrong date out." To which I replied, "no, I believe it is the 20th" and he says, "no it's not it's the 21st, now cut the correct date out or I'll cite you." So of course I complied. At that point I started questioning myself, geez maybe I am confused about what day it is. So when I get home the first place I head is to is a calendar and wouldn't you know it, that sonuva B was WRONG! I was pissed, well not too pissed because I had a nice buck in the back of my truck. I was thinking though he should get his facts straight before threatening someone, especially the way he did it. This was before cell phones mind you, at least ones that would tell the date otherwise I would've whipped out my phone and shoved it in his face.

Back to the story at hand. After thinking about this for a while I think I would finish cutting up the elk I just shot and see what the other bull does. If he is still there then I would head back to camp to see if someone wanted to put their tag on it. I have a hard time trusting warden's and I'm sure they wouldn't trust me either if I said I was just trying to do the "right" thing. I got enough to deal with without getting slammed with fines and my hunting rights taken away.
 
If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound...?

Life in the wild can be brutal and tragic...

I came across a similar situation this year while on a Nevada muzzy bull elk hunt.

We found a 5 x5 bull wrapped big time in a downed barbwire fence...

Multiple strands twisted around each other - on a very short leash...

NDOW was called - "you can shoot him if you have a TAG."

Otherwise - "we will send someone out the next day."

Fast forward - no bolt cutters (just wire cutters) - a 800 lbs pissed off animal wanting to gouge and dismember anyone near him - what do you do???

After some unsuccessful rope work - he was finally tired enough to let us hack through the short strand of wire with a pulask axe.

No one hurt - the bull seems to live on...

So... I guess the philosophic question is - do you shoot, shovel and shut up?

No harm - no foul...

Nevada Badger

p.s. hopefully I will follow soon with video?!?
 
Nice Job Nevada Badger!

Bet the Game & Fish would killed him!










[font color="red"]From My Smokin Cherry Red Hot Barrel & My Dead Cold Hands I Shall go down Fighting for American Pride & Rights!
I Know I'm Out Numbered by Pusssies & Brainwashed Democrats that'll Throw Their Hands in the air & I know I can't Lick the U.S. Military by Myself when they Turn on us but I'll make
you one Guarantee,They'll be Enduring a Situation where I Hope to Hell All Americans become True Americans once again & Stand up for their Rights!
 
I don't know what I would do but if I were DW I'd be very careful about posting what he did.


[font color="blue"]I don't make the soup,I just stir it.[/font]
 
Frankly, as the law prohibits it - I would never do it. Walk out and get someone from your camp with a legal tag, take him back there, and if the bull was as wounded as you say, he'd be there, or leave a blood trail you could follow. Let someone else shoot it. But I wouldn't.

"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
 
>If a tree falls in a
>forest and no one is
>around to hear it, does
>it make a sound...?
>
>Life in the wild can be
>brutal and tragic...
>
>I came across a similar situation
>this year while on a
>Nevada muzzy bull elk hunt.
>
>
>We found a 5 x5
>bull wrapped big time in
>a downed barbwire fence...
>
>Multiple strands twisted around each other
>- on a very short
>leash...
>
>NDOW was called - "you can
>shoot him if you have
>a TAG."
>
>Otherwise - "we will send someone
>out the next day."
>
>Fast forward - no bolt cutters
>(just wire cutters) - a
>800 lbs pissed off animal
>wanting to gouge and dismember
>anyone near him - what
>do you do???
>
>After some unsuccessful rope work -
>he was finally tired enough
>to let us hack through
>the short strand of
>wire with a pulask axe.
>
>
>No one hurt - the bull
>seems to live on...
>
>So... I guess the philosophic question
>is - do you shoot,
>shovel and shut up?
>
>No harm - no foul...
>
>Nevada Badger
>
>p.s. hopefully I will follow
>soon with video?!?

Similar thing happened to my dad and I a couple a year's back. Here is link to the post http://www.monstermuleys.info/cgi-b..._thread&om=4862&forum=DCForumID34&archive=yes

Muliefanatic
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-29-14 AT 08:47PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Oct-29-14 AT 08:43?PM (MST)

First, thanks for all the responses to my question. One of the reasons I posted it was to see how my thought process lined up with other hunters. Not surprising it is similar to a lot of yours. Before I tell you what I did in this situation I want to give you a little background on my last 14 seasons in this area. It's an area with a lot of elk and a lot of hunters. It's four miles of steep(greasy when wet)tore up road to get to our base camp. Then a four mile horseback ride to our spike camp. This is the third time in 14 seasons this scenario has played out in front of me. The first time was a 6pt bull and I had a cow tag. He came from a fair ways and was limping on his front and trailing a couple other bullls. He'd been headed uphill and I thought he looked to have a good chance of surviving his wounds.I never raised my gun and I never saw him again, but I wasn't looking for him either. The next time I was dressing a cow in a ravine when a shot rang out from close range. The kind of close you feel in your chest and duck your head out of instinct. I look to the top of the ravine as a string of elk start across. Cows, spike, more cows then the last in line limping with a visible blood spot on her paunch. When I caught up to the young hunter he was glad the chase was over. Seems he wounded her over a mile ago and was getting to the end of his comfort level from camp. I've also come across 6-8 dead and rotting elk in those 14 years (sad it's been so many I can't remember the exact number). Some were a few weeks old from the archery season. The rest were only a day or two old.
Uncle sage, I had the red ass a while back and it had less to do with you and more to do with my experiences the last 14 years in this spot, as well as some threads I was reading.
Derquhart this is an area where shots are generally under 200 yards. An elks ass is 3 feet from his heart. There's lots of elk in this area so you don't need to take marginal shots. Missing by 3 feet in this area won this hunter the title of Jackwagon in my book! JMO
Tri that takes out the long range shooting argument as well.
Curlycoyote I doubt this bull traveled over half mile as wobbly as he was coming in. I was there for an hour longer dressing and boning my bull. No other hunter came by. I came back a couple hours later on horses to pack him out and still saw no one else.
Zeke made a comment recently in another thread, he always,ALWAYS follows up every shot and looks for blood. And cutbow gave us a recent example of why being persistent and follow up and search is so important. These things most of us learned at a young age and I took for granted everyone knew.
I've read a lot of threads of guys finding dead animals and guys losing animals,"help lost dutton bull","Book cliffs","Unethical....Great loss","found bull 16D", and who can forget "anybody lose a Wasatch bull". coupled with my experiences in recent years is what's shaped my responses to some threads on MM recently. To say I'm frustrated by what I see and read is an understatement. I know things happen at times and believe me I'm not being judgemental. We just need to improve our decision making and limit this as much as possible. It winds up being a waste of a terrific renewable resource!
NVbighorn there's plenty of things in this life I worry about. My first game violation is way down on my list of worries. I went to school with a lot of guys that went on to become game wardens 30 years ago. A lot of their expressed attitudes were "Everyone's committing a violation. It's our job to figure out what violation they're committing." I think that's a lot of young wardens attitudes. As much as I hunt and fish I'm bound to eventually inadvertently commit a violation and then come in contact with that eager young warden. No matter how hard I try to follow every game law odds are one day I will get a violation.
..... I settled the crosshairs on him and had that right vs wrong conversation in my head. It was all I could do to lower my rifle an empty it as my season was over. He got up, stumbled off the shelf we were on and down the next hill out of sight.I spent an hour dressing my bull then headed back to camp. Five guys had filled their tags that morning leaving only one unfilled tag. The tag belonged to a 14 year old on his second elk hunt looking to shoot his first elk. I didn't want to ask his dad to make that his son's first elk harvest experience. So I didn't even mention the 4pt to anyone in camp. The next morning he and his dad headed up to the area I shot my bull to try and get his first bull. A few hours later at the tent door stood of smiling 14 year old holding a 4x5 rack he'd just shot making us 6 for 6! His dad and grandad we're all smiles as well! His dad mentioned seeing a dead 4X4 by a tree and I told him the story from the morning before. Seems he didnt make it through the night,and to be honest, I'm still not sure I made the right decision.......
Thanx for reading my story
 
We've all read this before but this situation reminded me of it. "A peculiar virtue in wildlife ethics is that the hunter ordinarily has no gallery to applaud or disapprove of his conduct. Whatever his acts, they are dictated by his own conscience, rather than that of onlookers. It is difficult to exaggerate the importance of this fact.
Aldo Leopold
 
Great stories DW. Thanks for sharing. That would definitely be a tough call. It sucks hearing about all the wasted animals and unfortunately it does happen. Granted I'm not innocent of it. I can say though that out of all the years of I've been hunting I've only lost two animals both of which were spike elk back when I was younger. I was more anxious to just shoot instead of thinking first and taking better shots.

It made me sick to my stomach losing them and I spent a day or two trying to find them with no luck.
 
DW, as difficult as it probably was I think you made the right decision. It was your decision to make and I would not have judged you either way. I hope you understood what I was saying. A public forum might not be the best place to say the wrong thing. It was easy for us to say "I would have..." or "I would not have...". We weren't in your shoes. I would hate to see that young by-the-book LE guy cite someone for doing what they felt was morally and ethically right because they admitted something on an internet forum.



[font color="blue"]I don't make the soup,I just stir it.[/font]
 
JUDAS NVB!

We were gonna get the 'Rest of the Story' until You CHIMED in!



>DW, as difficult as it probably
>was I think you made
>the right decision. It was
>your decision to make and
>I would not have judged
>you either way. I hope
>you understood what I was
>saying. A public forum might
>not be the best place
>to say the wrong thing.
>It was easy for us
>to say "I would have..."
>or "I would not have...".
>We weren't in your shoes.
>I would hate to see
>that young by-the-book LE guy
>cite someone for doing what
>they felt was morally and
>ethically right because they admitted
>something on an internet forum.
>
>
>
>
>[font color="blue"]I don't make the soup,I
>just stir it.[/font]












[font color="red"]From My Smokin Cherry Red Hot Barrel & My Dead Cold Hands I Shall go down Fighting for American Pride & Rights!
I Know I'm Out Numbered by Pusssies & Brainwashed Democrats that'll Throw Their Hands in the air & I know I can't Lick the U.S. Military by Myself when they Turn on us but I'll make
you one Guarantee,They'll be Enduring a Situation where I Hope to Hell All Americans become True Americans once again & Stand up for their Rights!
 
I knew what u were saying nvb, and thanx for your comments. Elkassassin u did get the rest of the story brother. I'm the type that pretends to b no one but myself.
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-30-14 AT 07:22AM (MST)[p]It's been an interesting and thought provoking discussion. Thank you DW.

Eel

It's written in the good Book that we'll never be asked to take more than we can. Sounds like a good plan, so bring it on!
 
Ok you've answered all the questions except one;
Am I going with you to that "spot" next year? Haha

Good thread DW.
It made us all do a little reflecting.
Zeke
 

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