I am going to buy a long range gun, and am trying to decide which scope to buy. Have any of you guys tried either of these scopes? I will be getting custom turrets. And I know there is a large price difference, but everything i hear about Vortex is great. so im stumped on which one to get? any info would be greatly apreciated!
Vortex Viper 6.5-20x50 or Huskemaw LRH 5-20x50??
- Thread starter Dirt1
- Start date
BIGJOHNT
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 5,185
Go with who ever is building your rifle. They know what works. It may be a good idea to go to a few 1000yard shoots and see whats working for the guys there.
The old school guys like Leupold and the guy that build my gun does also. It the 6.5 x 20 x 50 vx 3 LR . They now have the newer mark 4 .
If you go with the reticle build for your load. It will only work for the load,temp,eleavation ect. If you go with the turret you can make adjustments and have different turrets for different loads and bullet weights.
The old school guys like Leupold and the guy that build my gun does also. It the 6.5 x 20 x 50 vx 3 LR . They now have the newer mark 4 .
If you go with the reticle build for your load. It will only work for the load,temp,eleavation ect. If you go with the turret you can make adjustments and have different turrets for different loads and bullet weights.
Good long range scopes are made by Vortex, Nightforce, Bushnell, Weaver, Huskemaw, and Leupold. Although I personally think the Leuopolds are way overrated for their price range. I left out the expensive ones like S&B, Premier, USO...etc
Good luck with whatever you do, learn to dope the wind and PRACTICE!
Mike
Good luck with whatever you do, learn to dope the wind and PRACTICE!
Mike
H
Heatman75
Guest
I bought the huskemaw, I sent my custom 300rum up to them and had them build a load that worked well and had them make me 200 rounds, they built me two different turrets for it, I really like it, it's easy to use and is very clear no matter what zoom power you have it on, my twelve year old son was busting rocks at 820 yards with it, but you need to look at them all and decide which one you like the best, good luck.
Custom turrets are going to be the simplest to use. But they will not be as accurate as getting regular turrets and learning how to dial for each situation.
What do the military guys use? Mil/mil reticle/turrets. They don't use any custom turrets for the gun because guns are not always the same.
Powder temp variation from 20* to 80* is going to have a big effect on muzzle velocity (some powders more than others, some are very temp resistant), barometric pressure, temp, humidity (not a huge factor but it does play a role)...etc all play roles in the bullets flight. For most calibers, up to 500 or 600 yds their trajectory is very similiar across environmental conditions. Get past that range and you end up with variances in trajectory that can cause you to easily miss or wound game.
For example;
We start hunting in the morning at 4500' elevation and 20* temps (I don't have my ballistic calculator handy so I'll just use numbers off the top of my head) with 50% humidity. Lets call the station pressure (uncorrected barometric pressure) at 27.5". I see a buck at first light at 800 yds. He's bedded down and not going anywhere. I get setup for the shot, pull out my pda or consult my dope chart for 27.5" pressure and 20* temp and know that I need to dial 5.4 mils or 19.5 MOA. I dial my turret up to that range, and BOOM...... WHACK! Buck is down.
Same situation can be said for later in the day except we are at 7000' elevation or around 23" pressure and 50* temps. That same correction at 800 yds may be around 5 mils instead of 5.4! That's 11.5" difference between the two! You didn't have to swap turrets, you know exactly where to dial... you're reducing your margin of error.
Do you really want to have to swap your custom turrets while on the mountain, or the night before you hit the trailhead without verifying that you didn't bump your turret off a click or two when you took your turret off and put on your new one? You are going to have to guess what the environmental conditions are and what turret you need for the next day of hunting. While you may have a correction card for environmental conditions, you may as well learn how to actually shoot for environmental conditions and do it the right way! In hunting situations, you don't always have time to get everything right, you need to reduce the margin of error as much as possible when shooting long range and trying to end an animals life. Custom turrets ain't exactly the way to go imho.
Mike
What do the military guys use? Mil/mil reticle/turrets. They don't use any custom turrets for the gun because guns are not always the same.
Powder temp variation from 20* to 80* is going to have a big effect on muzzle velocity (some powders more than others, some are very temp resistant), barometric pressure, temp, humidity (not a huge factor but it does play a role)...etc all play roles in the bullets flight. For most calibers, up to 500 or 600 yds their trajectory is very similiar across environmental conditions. Get past that range and you end up with variances in trajectory that can cause you to easily miss or wound game.
For example;
We start hunting in the morning at 4500' elevation and 20* temps (I don't have my ballistic calculator handy so I'll just use numbers off the top of my head) with 50% humidity. Lets call the station pressure (uncorrected barometric pressure) at 27.5". I see a buck at first light at 800 yds. He's bedded down and not going anywhere. I get setup for the shot, pull out my pda or consult my dope chart for 27.5" pressure and 20* temp and know that I need to dial 5.4 mils or 19.5 MOA. I dial my turret up to that range, and BOOM...... WHACK! Buck is down.
Same situation can be said for later in the day except we are at 7000' elevation or around 23" pressure and 50* temps. That same correction at 800 yds may be around 5 mils instead of 5.4! That's 11.5" difference between the two! You didn't have to swap turrets, you know exactly where to dial... you're reducing your margin of error.
Do you really want to have to swap your custom turrets while on the mountain, or the night before you hit the trailhead without verifying that you didn't bump your turret off a click or two when you took your turret off and put on your new one? You are going to have to guess what the environmental conditions are and what turret you need for the next day of hunting. While you may have a correction card for environmental conditions, you may as well learn how to actually shoot for environmental conditions and do it the right way! In hunting situations, you don't always have time to get everything right, you need to reduce the margin of error as much as possible when shooting long range and trying to end an animals life. Custom turrets ain't exactly the way to go imho.
Mike
G
greg12
Guest
Dirt, I would go with the Vortex.
G
greg12
Guest
Yes, I do.
one_dryboot
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 5,107
I've had the huskemaw and killed alot of animals with it the last 4 years from 60-934 yards. Practice and get to know your setup and you can shoot custom turrets with precision in different elevations, temps ect. But if you think its simply range, dial turret and shoot you are mistaken. no matter how good the gun is the person behind pulling the trigger must be able to get it done and know what to do in different situations. But you also must know your limitations.
well said dryboot...
The PST has exposed turrets that you dial for the range. The Viper is more of a traditional hunting scope with the covered turrets, and I don't believe is near the quality judging by the price difference.
The Viper HS is the PST with covered turrets and in your traditional second focal plane. Not a long range scope, but could be with the right reticle using holdovers. The Viper HS LR (Long Range) has exposed turrets but they are only 1/2 MOA clicks (that's 3" per click at 600 yds).
The PST series has both MOA and Miliradian (Mils) turret adjustment options. They are going to be 1/4MOA and 1/10Mil clicks (.25" and .36" at 100 yds). Have reticles with marks that match your turrets, and have lit reticles. The FFP models are also available which mean first focal plane. The reticle shrinks/grows with adjustment of the magnification range thus the reticle marks subtend the same distance at all distances. IE: 1 MOA hash marks on the reticle will still be aprox. 1" at 100 yds at 4X AND at 16X.
The PST definitely holds zero. I've had my gun strapped in its soft case to the back rack of a 4-wheeler going over rough roads all day and had it not lose zero. I was busting rocks at 856 yds the other day, dialed back down to zero and threw down a .23MOA group at 100 exactly on the X. I would definitely buy one again but I also shoot tactical competitions where the lit reticle and FFP come in handy!
If purely for hunting I'd still go with the PST, but in their SFP model and just make sure if using the reticle for a holdover that you are on the correct magnification to ensure your reticle is accurate. Hope this helps.
If you want more reading, head over to Snipershide.com and read all the sticky posts related to newbie shooters and terminology and re-read it until you start to grasp the concepts. Good luck.
Mike
The PST has exposed turrets that you dial for the range. The Viper is more of a traditional hunting scope with the covered turrets, and I don't believe is near the quality judging by the price difference.
The Viper HS is the PST with covered turrets and in your traditional second focal plane. Not a long range scope, but could be with the right reticle using holdovers. The Viper HS LR (Long Range) has exposed turrets but they are only 1/2 MOA clicks (that's 3" per click at 600 yds).
The PST series has both MOA and Miliradian (Mils) turret adjustment options. They are going to be 1/4MOA and 1/10Mil clicks (.25" and .36" at 100 yds). Have reticles with marks that match your turrets, and have lit reticles. The FFP models are also available which mean first focal plane. The reticle shrinks/grows with adjustment of the magnification range thus the reticle marks subtend the same distance at all distances. IE: 1 MOA hash marks on the reticle will still be aprox. 1" at 100 yds at 4X AND at 16X.
The PST definitely holds zero. I've had my gun strapped in its soft case to the back rack of a 4-wheeler going over rough roads all day and had it not lose zero. I was busting rocks at 856 yds the other day, dialed back down to zero and threw down a .23MOA group at 100 exactly on the X. I would definitely buy one again but I also shoot tactical competitions where the lit reticle and FFP come in handy!
If purely for hunting I'd still go with the PST, but in their SFP model and just make sure if using the reticle for a holdover that you are on the correct magnification to ensure your reticle is accurate. Hope this helps.
If you want more reading, head over to Snipershide.com and read all the sticky posts related to newbie shooters and terminology and re-read it until you start to grasp the concepts. Good luck.
Mike
For several months been using a viper HS with the deadhold reticle for long range shooting out to 1340. ( as far as my CRF1200 will read)
1/4 min clicks , 50 min travel I get 43 min up using nightforce 20 degree bases
I take the elevation cap off when I want to dial and put it back on when guns in the scabbord. A little insurance it doesn't get moved accidentally
Use the windage marks on the reticle for wind hold out to 8 min which is plenty
Use the elevation marks on the reticle for quick shots out to 600 when there isn't time to dial they match up almost exactly to 4 5 and 600 for my load
Great scope, glass is plenty good for me. $500 vs $1700 for nightforce
7-8oz lighter too
Researched huskemaw for months and there is just to many bad reviews
1/4 min clicks , 50 min travel I get 43 min up using nightforce 20 degree bases
I take the elevation cap off when I want to dial and put it back on when guns in the scabbord. A little insurance it doesn't get moved accidentally
Use the windage marks on the reticle for wind hold out to 8 min which is plenty
Use the elevation marks on the reticle for quick shots out to 600 when there isn't time to dial they match up almost exactly to 4 5 and 600 for my load
Great scope, glass is plenty good for me. $500 vs $1700 for nightforce
7-8oz lighter too
Researched huskemaw for months and there is just to many bad reviews
Muley_73
Very Active Member
- Messages
- 2,788
Dirt,
Come on over and you can take a look at the Vortex I just put on Garretts 300wm. Or give me a call and we can go out and shoot some time. I think it depends on the money. If you are really going to spend the cash you should probably just save a little longer and buy a NightForce!!!
Come on over and you can take a look at the Vortex I just put on Garretts 300wm. Or give me a call and we can go out and shoot some time. I think it depends on the money. If you are really going to spend the cash you should probably just save a little longer and buy a NightForce!!!
one_dryboot
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 5,107
So you seriously researchd huskemaw for a month? you must have alot of time on your hands. So how many bad reviews did you dig up in a months time? im really curious!
>Custom turrets are going to be
>the simplest to use.
>But they will not be
>as accurate as getting regular
>turrets and learning how to
>dial for each situation.
>
>What do the military guys use?
> Mil/mil reticle/turrets. They
>don't use any custom turrets
>for the gun because guns
>are not always the same.
>
>
>Powder temp variation from 20* to
>80* is going to have
>a big effect on muzzle
>velocity (some powders more than
>others, some are very temp
>resistant), barometric pressure, temp, humidity
>(not a huge factor but
>it does play a role)...etc
>all play roles in the
>bullets flight. For most
>calibers, up to 500 or
>600 yds their trajectory is
>very similiar across environmental conditions.
> Get past that range
>and you end up with
>variances in trajectory that can
>cause you to easily miss
>or wound game.
>
>For example;
>We start hunting in the morning
>at 4500' elevation and 20*
>temps (I don't have my
>ballistic calculator handy so I'll
>just use numbers off the
>top of my head) with
>50% humidity. Lets call
>the station pressure (uncorrected barometric
>pressure) at 27.5". I
>see a buck at first
>light at 800 yds.
>He's bedded down and not
>going anywhere. I get
>setup for the shot, pull
>out my pda or consult
>my dope chart for 27.5"
>pressure and 20* temp and
>know that I need to
>dial 5.4 mils or 19.5
>MOA. I dial my
>turret up to that range,
>and BOOM...... WHACK!
>Buck is down.
>
>Same situation can be said for
>later in the day except
>we are at 7000' elevation
>or around 23" pressure and
>50* temps. That same
>correction at 800 yds may
>be around 5 mils instead
>of 5.4! That's 11.5"
>difference between the two!
>You didn't have to swap
>turrets, you know exactly where
>to dial... you're reducing your
>margin of error.
>
>Do you really want to have
>to swap your custom turrets
>while on the mountain, or
>the night before you hit
>the trailhead without verifying that
>you didn't bump your turret
>off a click or two
>when you took your turret
>off and put on your
>new one? You are
>going to have to guess
>what the environmental conditions are
>and what turret you need
>for the next day of
>hunting. While you may have
>a correction card for environmental
>conditions, you may as well
>learn how to actually shoot
>for environmental conditions and do
>it the right way!
>In hunting situations, you don't
>always have time to get
>everything right, you need to
>reduce the margin of error
>as much as possible when
>shooting long range and trying
>to end an animals life.
> Custom turrets ain't exactly
>the way to go imho.
>
>
>Mike
when i spot a buck/bull at 800yds, i generally like to stalk and hunt them. guess im weird like that.
>the simplest to use.
>But they will not be
>as accurate as getting regular
>turrets and learning how to
>dial for each situation.
>
>What do the military guys use?
> Mil/mil reticle/turrets. They
>don't use any custom turrets
>for the gun because guns
>are not always the same.
>
>
>Powder temp variation from 20* to
>80* is going to have
>a big effect on muzzle
>velocity (some powders more than
>others, some are very temp
>resistant), barometric pressure, temp, humidity
>(not a huge factor but
>it does play a role)...etc
>all play roles in the
>bullets flight. For most
>calibers, up to 500 or
>600 yds their trajectory is
>very similiar across environmental conditions.
> Get past that range
>and you end up with
>variances in trajectory that can
>cause you to easily miss
>or wound game.
>
>For example;
>We start hunting in the morning
>at 4500' elevation and 20*
>temps (I don't have my
>ballistic calculator handy so I'll
>just use numbers off the
>top of my head) with
>50% humidity. Lets call
>the station pressure (uncorrected barometric
>pressure) at 27.5". I
>see a buck at first
>light at 800 yds.
>He's bedded down and not
>going anywhere. I get
>setup for the shot, pull
>out my pda or consult
>my dope chart for 27.5"
>pressure and 20* temp and
>know that I need to
>dial 5.4 mils or 19.5
>MOA. I dial my
>turret up to that range,
>and BOOM...... WHACK!
>Buck is down.
>
>Same situation can be said for
>later in the day except
>we are at 7000' elevation
>or around 23" pressure and
>50* temps. That same
>correction at 800 yds may
>be around 5 mils instead
>of 5.4! That's 11.5"
>difference between the two!
>You didn't have to swap
>turrets, you know exactly where
>to dial... you're reducing your
>margin of error.
>
>Do you really want to have
>to swap your custom turrets
>while on the mountain, or
>the night before you hit
>the trailhead without verifying that
>you didn't bump your turret
>off a click or two
>when you took your turret
>off and put on your
>new one? You are
>going to have to guess
>what the environmental conditions are
>and what turret you need
>for the next day of
>hunting. While you may have
>a correction card for environmental
>conditions, you may as well
>learn how to actually shoot
>for environmental conditions and do
>it the right way!
>In hunting situations, you don't
>always have time to get
>everything right, you need to
>reduce the margin of error
>as much as possible when
>shooting long range and trying
>to end an animals life.
> Custom turrets ain't exactly
>the way to go imho.
>
>
>Mike
when i spot a buck/bull at 800yds, i generally like to stalk and hunt them. guess im weird like that.
Great Deals at Camera Land
