schoolhousegrizz
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I am hearing that Wyoming may decrease their non res tag quota. Heard it on an Epic Outdoors podcast. Buzz, what are you hearing?
I’m sure they will factor in lost revenue to WY due to the reduced number out-of-state visitors.
Yes, Wyoming residents Deserve it. As much as I would hate to see it happen. The Wilderness bill is where Wyoming does not treat non-residents how other states do. If this passes in a handful of years and they got rid of the Wilderness bill, then Outfitters would pretty much be out of a job. I hate to see somebody out of a job, but the Wilderness bill is a joke.
Thanks Buzz!
Yes, Wyoming residents Deserve it. As much as I would hate to see it happen. The Wilderness bill is where Wyoming does not treat non-residents how other states do. If this passes in a handful of years and they got rid of the Wilderness bill, then Outfitters would pretty much be out of a job. I hate to see somebody out of a job, but the Wilderness bill is a joke.
Thanks Buzz!
In terms of quality and quantity, the state of Wyoming already provides its residents the best resident hunting of any western state. How can a resident complain when they already have it so good?
I have been considering establishing residency in Wyoming for a few years because it is so good. I personally enjoy elk, deer, and antelope. If they make things even better for residents, I just might have to do it. Those of you who are avid hunters might want to consider the same.
You'll love winter.In terms of quality and quantity, the state of Wyoming already provides its residents the best resident hunting of any western state. How can a resident complain when they already have it so good?
I have been considering establishing residency in Wyoming for a few years because it is so good. I personally enjoy elk, deer, and antelope. If they make things even better for residents, I just might have to do it. Those of you who are avid hunters might want to consider the same.
Why would Wyo need to bump the elk quota to 8500? Compromise on what? Go to a 90/10 split on elk and NR will still get the same number of elk tags. I personally, even as a resident, don't advocate for changing the split for elk. But I would fight tooth and nail against increasing the NR quota.I ran the numbers with E/D/A a cpl years ago and it results in a revenue increase. Bump the NR Elk quota to about 8,500 and the revenue gain would be hard to ignore. Not that I want to see it but a 90/10 split and 8,500 Elk quota would be a reasonable compromise.
You would think that should be true but you might be surprised. After WYOGA made its last push to increase the quota I had a few after Comm meeting discussions with Outfitters in attendance. They were defiantly more interested in more Gen tags than they were in losing LQ tags. Two had no problem decreasing to 10% NR elk tags if it meant more gen tags. They felt they would sell the same amount of NR LQ tag hunts regardless given the percentages the go DIY vs guided and the increase in residents that are going guided due to pressure and grizzly issues. One Outfitter hadn't even thought of it. It wasn't until after i mentioned if he wanted more gen tags he should advocate for a reduction in the Res/NR split that his eyes lite up and he he sadi great idea. I suppose it has a great deal to due with where the Outfitters operate as well.WYOGA isn't going to just sit there and watch almost half of their NR LQ customers go away.
so as proposed the outfitters do not get 30% of the NR General tags? also? Thats the tag grab I would think they would want!SF0094 is one but has a provision that 30% of the nr 10% go to outfitted hunters along with price increases.
2022...If it passes, will it be for the 2020 season or the 2021 season?
It would be great if the western states could get together. Seems we like to pound each other's NR. For the most part NM, AZ,UT,NV,ID,WY,MT,CO share borders and in many cases share animals. Be great if their were agreements on pricing and tag # for the NR for those states. Standardized prices, standardized tag #.
It may not be popular elsewhere, but those 8 states represent the vast majority of public land hunt oppurtunity.
Maybe its a pipe dream, but if we in Utah are giving up tags to NR, I feel better about them going to border state guys who may winter our deer/elk, or where their animals we winter.
As a Utahn I support what Wyoming is attempting.
Or at least eliminate unlimited OTC for NR and move towards OTC with caps or unlimited draw but you have to apply.Wish Colorado would go 90/10.
This is not true.If all you residents got your way and restricted the non-resident tags, how would you pay for your Game Department? I read the Wyoming Game Department is 85% funded by non-resident license fees.
90/10 is too restrictive to NRs. To be fair, it is
“National Forest” and citizens who aren’t lucky enough live in one of the western states should be able to participate in our great pastime. While many times I have wished it was easier to draw tags in special areas, l believe it’s fair to share the wealth. Although Colorado is doing it for revenue, 35% max seems fair. 15% off the top to wealthy landowners that sell the tags is out of line.
That’s why NR don’t hunt Oregon. Oregon doesn’t rely on hunting as much as Wyoming to support its economy.Oregon is fairly restrictive to non residents.....
Whatever residents don't buy are rolled into NR quotas and leftover draw. That's why nonresidents get around 50% of antelope tags. At 90/10 residents would get a better shot at the higher demand licenses.In my eyes, Wyoming doesn’t have enough resident hunters to have much of a choice. To put it simply, there are not enough residents to even manage their herds. Let alone rely on the residents to fund their operations.
So trying to make a claim that other states set nonresident tag allocations around those numbers is irrelevant because those other states have populations of resident hunters that greatly exceed the number of resident hunters than Wyoming.
It’s like comparing apples to oranges
Guess I missed the discount the western states guys get in whitetails? You know, all us guys getting to pay for tags, plus leases or guides.
The increase or cost in the West to DIY is nowhere near what you fellas hit us with if we go east.
None of us are going whitetail hunting for $650, $750, $850. It ain't happening.
I've yet to see one bill in any state east of Colorado for lowered prices for dudes from mtn states.
I wish one state would go all in and give zero tags to NR. I mean we could settle all the hyperbole on the issue and see if NR and their dollars matter, and see how many resident tags go unfilled when there isn’t out-of-state plates on pickups in the woods. Then, maybe then, we could focus on issues of wildlife management and the real challenge being those who want none of us to hunt.
Come to Virginia, you get 6 deer tags (3 buck and 3 doe) and 3 turkey tags when you buy your big game license...You can buy a bear tag too and be out the door for less than 300. Lots of public land throughout the state.
But you have to use a stick right? You guys aren't trustworthy enough for guns??
Whatever residents don't buy are rolled into NR quotas and leftover draw. That's why nonresidents get around 50% of antelope tags. At 90/10 residents would get a better shot at the higher demand licenses.
Doesn't matter this year the bill is dead.
Yes, Wyoming residents Deserve it. As much as I would hate to see it happen. The Wilderness bill is where Wyoming does not treat non-residents how other states do. If this passes in a handful of years and they got rid of the Wilderness bill, then Outfitters would pretty much be out of a job. I hate to see somebody out of a job, but the Wilderness bill is a joke.
Thanks Buzz!
That an invite ?!!!Come to Virginia, you get 6 deer tags (3 buck and 3 doe) and 3 turkey tags when you buy your big game license...You can buy a bear tag too and be out the door for less than 300. Lots of public land throughout the state.
Of course it’s their state legislatures right to keep us from hunting if they want. I don’t think anyone is arguing that they don’t have the right. What I as a NR want is for them to NOT decrease or eliminate my hunting opportunity.Call me crazy, but am I the only one that thinks a state should be able to do whatever it wants in a situation like this regardless of what the nonresidents might think about it?
I am a nonresident of Wyoming that does apply there each fall and I hope to draw some quality tags one day in that state. With that said, I still believe that the State of Wyoming has every right to kick out every single nonresident hunter if they created a bill and passed that bill. would it suck? yes it would! Would I blame them if they decided that is what they wanted? Not one bit.
We all feel entitled to other states animals when the reality is they give us permission to hunt their animals. If they want to take that permission away that is their right. I grew up in Arizona (no longer live there) where I got to be around giant elk my whole life. But drawing one of those tags is next to impossible most of the time, and giving 10% of those top tier premium elk tags to nonresidents each year only makes it tougher for a resident to get one of those tags. I would have loved to keep that 10% of tags in state if possible. AZ doesn't have crazy numbers of elk so it would be easy to justify keeping all of the tags in state. But being civil and allowing other states to come hunt does have some benefits.
I am glad states keep their hunting borders open to allow us all to do what we love all over the country, and I hope they continue to do so. But i also believe that they have the right to allow whomever they want to hunt their resource whether the out of staters like it or not. If the residents of a state were to vote on and pass something like that, it is their right no matter what it costs their economy.
again, I hope all the states will keep allowing out of state hunters because it allows me to hunt more and gives me something to do on the years I don't draw. I just believe we all feel entitled to something that doesn't belong to us and we forget that it's a privilege and not a right to hunt other states.
I do feel the same! I just think it is our responsibility as nonresidents to accept whatever they decide to do with their state. If they kicked out all nonresidents there would be an uprising of angry people that believe it is their right to hunt someone else's deer. When we all we should be worried about is enjoying it every chance we get and being good stewards of the opportunity while it lasts. If it goes away by the state's choosing I don't believe we have the right to tell them why we "deserve" to hunt their state, because we don't deserve it. We are lucky to get to hunt other states and I hope it continues. I just support them being able to kick me out if they would like to.Of course it’s their state legislatures right to keep us from hunting if they want. I don’t think anyone is arguing that they don’t have the right. What I as a NR want is for them to NOT decrease or eliminate my hunting opportunity.
if you enjoy hunting Wyoming, I would think you’d feel the same.
I do feel the same! I just think it is our responsibility as nonresidents to accept whatever they decide to do with their state. If they kicked out all nonresidents there would be an uprising of angry people that believe it is their right to hunt someone else's deer. When we all we should be worried about is enjoying it every chance we get and being good stewards of the opportunity while it lasts. If it goes away by the state's choosing I don't believe we have the right to tell them why we "deserve" to hunt their state, because we don't deserve it. We are lucky to get to hunt other states and I hope it continues. I just support them being able to kick me out if they would like to.
The wildlife does not belong to the state of Wyoming. The federal government has given states the right to manage wildlife. The wildlife lives on National Forest and BLM land that belongs to ALL of us, as does the wildlife. States take federal funds to help manage the wildlife. I think we DO deserve to hunt that state.I do feel the same! I just think it is our responsibility as nonresidents to accept whatever they decide to do with their state. If they kicked out all nonresidents there would be an uprising of angry people that believe it is their right to hunt someone else's deer. When we all we should be worried about is enjoying it every chance we get and being good stewards of the opportunity while it lasts. If it goes away by the state's choosing I don't believe we have the right to tell them why we "deserve" to hunt their state, because we don't deserve it. We are lucky to get to hunt other states and I hope it continues. I just support them being able to kick me out if they would like to.
I do hope the borders stay open. I really do. I only make the point that in the end they are gonna do what they want and whatever that is I will accept it because they have the right to vote on how they manage the animals in their state.The wildlife does not belong to the state of Wyoming. The federal government has given states the right to manage wildlife. The wildlife lives on National Forest and BLM land that belongs to ALL of us, as does the wildlife. States take federal funds to help manage the wildlife. I think we DO deserve to hunt that state.
There is no doubt however that Wyoming could get away with limiting NR's to 10%, but because I like to hunt Wyoming, I have to at least make an effort to try and maintain what opportunity is still there for me.
If we want to maintain your opportunity in Wyoming, we've got to support outfitters on some of their positions and contact Wyoming legislators when we feel the threat. The outfitters are not looking out for all NR's, but most of the clientele is still NR's, and therefore the work they do to save hunting opportunity for their clientele can benefit all NR's. In the end though, NR's just have to try and get involved in the process some to hopefully preserve what we have for as long as we can.
What’s wrong with G now? G currently has trophy bucks and provides LOTS of opportunity for residents to hunt. What unit in the west pumps out as many big bucks and let’s so many people hunt it?I do hope the borders stay open. I really do. I only make the point that in the end they are gonna do what they want and whatever that is I will accept it because they have the right to vote on how they manage the animals in their state.
I honestly think they need to limit both resident and nonresident tags more than they currently do. G and H would be much better deer units than they already are if they went away from unlimited resident tag numbers and were more conservative with how many animals get killed each year. They do have a lot of deer but unlimited resident tags is not sustainable forever. I am no biologist but I think limiting those unlimited tags would be a much better option in the long run.
Guess I missed the discount the western states guys get in whitetails? You know, all us guys getting to pay for tags, plus leases or guides.
The increase or cost in the West to DIY is nowhere near what you fellas hit us with if we go east.
None of us are going whitetail hunting for $650, $750, $850. It ain't happening.
I've yet to see one bill in any state east of Colorado for lowered prices for dudes from mtn states.
Why wouldn’t the landowner tags come out of the quota? You want them just to add them additionally to the LQ tags? Heck in the area you’re in the majority of the landowners that qualify for landowner tags don’t even take them.Maybe next session someone could propose overhauling the landowner tag law. Those tags come out of the tag pool and in some LQ units that is a fair percentage of all the tags. Much bigger problem, IMO.
The way that legislation was written, there's NO WAY it would have passed. Of course that's my own opinion. Last I checked it wasn't worth that much.
NR fund nowhere near 80% of the WY game dept.
The dept budget shows about 60% of their revenue comes from licenses, 80% of that 60% coming from nr, for a nr contribution of about 48% of the total dept revenue. Still a healthy amount but not 80%.
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Thats BS that non-residents are "contributing more/hunter" to the local economy. I spend more per day when I go on vacation too. Ridiculous argument.Here's an interesting article in regard to the significant revenue impacts nonresidents have on budgets and local economies.
Hunters crucial to Colorado economy
Big game hunting brings in big bucks for Coloradowww.gohunt.com
According to the article the CPW collected $38 million from nonres and only $7.6 million for nonres deer and elk license sales.
Here's an interesting read about outdoor economic contributions in Colorado. The average non-resident big game hunter spends more money per day, and the economic output contributed by non-resident big game hunters makes up nearly 50 percent of the total. In other words, there are a chunk fewer nonres hunters but nonres are contributing more/hunter to local economies.
Here's another interesting article that goes beyond license sales. It tells the importance of hunters to local economies.
Big-game hunting is big money for Colorado
Hunting generates $38.1 million annually in total economic output in Larimer County.www.coloradoan.com
Non residents provide quite a bit, but get so little respect it seems.
OK I will give your the 48% but now add in the 25% federal aid portion. now you have 73% of the budget not supported by resident hunters. Now add in the grants at 8% that is most-likely federal dollars as well. Now you have 81% of the budget not being paid by resident hunters.
So the 80% figure is not so far fetched.
Serious question about volunteering time to those projects - where can a person find a list of upcoming projects to donate time to? Is it invitation only?There is one common thing I see in Wyoming at local G&F meetings, habitat improvement projects, big game transplants and tagging operations, fence removal and modification projects, water projects, task force & mule deer initiatives and the multitude of fundraisers for wildlife management: 99.9% of attendees and volunteers are Wyoming residents.
OK I will give your the 48% but now add in the 25% federal aid portion. now you have 73% of the budget not supported by resident hunters. Now add in the grants at 8% that is most-likely federal dollars as well. Now you have 81% of the budget not being paid by resident hunters.
So the 80% figure is not so far fetched.
Not a superiority at all I fully believe residents should have a majority of licences but if we cant use those funds to calculate the percentage then they should be thrown out for both sides. If 80% of the department revenue from license sales if from Non residents then it is completely acceptable to say that the majority of funding comes from non residents.Most of the P/R funds don't even come from people that buy licenses...the excise tax is paid by anyone that buys ammo, firearms, etc...a majority that buy those items, don't hunt.
I'd use caution with over-playing your NR superiority hand, when it comes to funding.
I can attest thst Bryon is a good guy and does more than his fair share to help the non-resident.I for one don't want to get rid of NR hunters. I have met and enjoy some great people who are NR. Heck, my father is a NR. I just feel Wyoming should make it a 90/10 split across the board for all big game species. Not sure how many businesses will go bankrupt by doing this.
In terms of quality and quantity, the state of Wyoming already provides its residents the best resident hunting of any western state. How can a resident complain when they already have it so good?
I have been considering establishing residency in Wyoming for a few years because it is so good. I personally enjoy elk, deer, and antelope. If they make things even better for residents, I just might have to do it. Those of you who are avid hunters might want to consider the same.
Wyom
Wyoming is at full capacity. Thanks for looking
Wow, WYOGA has the power to close public land...funny stuff and wacky even for you Hoss.
Ask WYOGA how their 60-40 bills went the last couple times they tried to run that.
Ask them how much time and money they've spent trying to keep 90-10 from happening.
They're playing defense...
Agreed.....i dont think doing away with wilderness gig will put outfitters out of business. A lot of time and money goes into a camp 10+ miles in the wildernessI guided 5 years in the wyoming wilderness, of all the clients we took (30+/year), I can count on 1 hand the amount of those hunters who would have even considered undertaking that hunt on their own had the law not been present. There will always be the need for those outfitters wilderness law or not. It is far from easy to do a backcountry camp 15+miles in for the average horse hunting DIY hunter. . I think 90/10 for LQ is what it should be like most other states, and I do think its only a matter of time before change happens.
Wow, WYOGA has the power to close public land...funny stuff and wacky even for you Hoss.
Ask WYOGA how their 60-40 bills went the last couple times they tried to run that.
Ask them how much time and money they've spent trying to keep 90-10 from happening.
They're playing defense...
Did they have power or was the average resident hunter just indifferent and uninformed?True enough now, but they did have the power, long ago, to get the wilderness areas shut down for the NR to hunt big and trophy game.
Yes it's open I hunt it every year.So wilderness is open?
As usual a nice spin around reality