Pit bulls

M

mntman

Long Time Member
Messages
3,788
Never really had an opinion on them till the other day. I just got all cleaned up and got the kids out of the shower after getting home from Yellowstone. Sitting on the couch in my fleece pajama pants relaxing with my daughter. All of a sudden, I could hear this lady screaming her head off and two dogs going at it.
I run outside, jump the bushes and fence and run at the pitbull, the lady is whipping it with her leash cause it has her antique crippled lab by the throat and on the ground.
Just as I get there to grab that worthless POS, it runs. The lady is frantic, and now other neighbors stand at their doors and watch! No need to help jackasses. I was keeping my back to the lady with eyes on the pit bull, so when she took off running down the street I didn't know it. So the PB runs past me and attacks the lab again. I was trying to tell her to get in my house but she wasn't thinking clearly. She took off running again, this time the PB latched on and tried to keep the lady between it and me. That didn't work I plowed through that lady and chased the pb into a corner of the bushes and a house set on getting a hold of its neck and finishing that POS. I keep it there for a few seconds and then that lady takes off running again. This time my neighbor comes out and says that his her dog! It runs in side. I tried to catch the lady and her lab but she disappeared and didn't know where she went.
Had a little bit of an argument you could say with the owner but according to her, that dog wouldn't harm a flee! I called the animal control and got everything I needed and had them pay a visit to the owner. Can't find the lab owner, I would pay for part of her lawyer fees to fix that Fing PB.
I HATE them dogs now!

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"
 
Next time you hear a woman screaming outside, arm yourself first before you run outside into a possible dangeous situation.

RELH
 
Worthless things...I hate the "there are no bad dogs" soft headed logic...

My bird dog was bred to point, I did't teach her that. She will point if I want her to or not, it's what she was made for.

Pit bulls were bred to fight and kill, you don't have to teach them and they WILL do it at some point when a trigger is tripped...

I can't respect parents who have them around kids, one of those dogs looks at my kids wrong in a public place and they will be scooping it's brains off of the sidewalk with a shovel.....

-----------------------------------------------
http://andymansavage.blogspot.com/
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-25-11 AT 04:41PM (MST)[p]I don't like them and a ton of folks use them around here as catch dogs.. Let their kids play with them, etc. if they became extinct it wouldn't bother me.






edit: there's a n't in wouldn't
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-25-11 AT 02:25PM (MST)[p]I hate the POS's. I would love to see that breed and most of the soft heads that own them go extinct!


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Been known to put one or two out of my misery! Will continue the practice at every opportunity.

"whackin' a surly bartender ain't much of a crime"
 
Had labs and german shepherds all my life and never had one problem. Cousin has a pit and it has bit at my daughter twice. There won't be a third time. Never like them never will. Won't let me kids go to a house that has one. Just to much danger in my book.
 
A local police officer told me that they shoot more pit bulls than all other dogs combined.
 
>A local police officer told me
>that they shoot more pit
>bulls than all other dogs
>combined.

...........me too!


"whackin' a surly bartender ain't much of a crime"
 
That is the most worthless breed ever. They should all be considered a public safety issue and shot on site. You should have hung that S.O.B with that lady's leash. Did animal control haul it away to be put out of everyone's misery?
 
i was really hoping i was not going to click on this thread and read someone trying to convince everyone that they are just as safe as any other dog- thanks for some level thinking guys!

i'm sorry, but they should be outlawed IMO.

i know a couple who have them and will argue to the death that my lab is just as much , if not more dangerous as their pit- BULLCHIT. like andy said, it's in their blood, and if provoked it will show it's head.

and quit frankly, if you own a pit, and it bites my kid, that f'er is going to get killed by me or by the humain sociaty. if you own a lab, and it bites my kid- my first question to my kid would be "what were you doing to it"?

it comes with the breed. you should have taken a framing hammer to it's head!
 
I have no respect for the breed and I agree completely with andymans statement. I have found the majority of Pit owners are lacking a bit in the head and tend to be compensating for one thing or another. Tends to be a "tough man" syndrom of some sort in my opinion.

"Courage is being scared to death but saddling
up anyway."
 
PITBULL STORY......BEFORE I RETIRED I WAS ON A SWAT CALL WITH A DRUGGIE PENNED UP IN A HOUSE. HIS MOMMA WAS TELLING OUR COPS TO GET LOST OR SHE WAS GOING TO LET ALL 3 PITS OUT THE FRONT DOOR.....AND THERE WAS GONNA BE HELL TO PAY. SWAT SAID OK....SHE LET EM GO......ALL 3 DIED IN 6 SECONDS....ONE OF THE BULLETS HIT HER IN THE UPPER THIGH......BLOOD EVERYWHERE...AND SHE WAS CRYING HER AZZ OFF......DRUGGIE ARRESTED.....................YD.
 
They are the dog of choice for all the druggies and dope dealers. Partner and I kicked a dealers door on a "no knock" search warrant. Partner was first in and I was #2. Druggie's pit bull charged my partner and a 3 shot auto burst from his HK stopped that charge ASAP.

RELH
 
I had my service pistol on half squeeze on a pit once... He was about 5 feet from getting some 40 cals to the chest.


Had one try and rip my face off when I was a kid... My rottweiler put an end to that!
 
I watched the dog catcher shoot one a couple of days ago. It wasn't going without a fight though. They are good for nothing.
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I do not care for them one bit. I have seen a few that seemed fairly well mannered and I do think they get a bad rap from a lot of irresponsible breeder and owners. I would not have one and I darn sure would never trust one around my kids. I have also seen horrible aggression issues with other dogs including rotties, collies, aussie sheps., and others. It is interesting to look at bite statistics tracked by the CDC. A few of the breeds have a shocking track record. It is like anything else you own with assumed risk...you also assume the liability. If someone wants it more power to them. Keep them locked up and away from others who did not assume the risk. All (insert breed here) are not dangerous dogs but all (insert breed here) can potentially be dangerous. I hesitate to give into the idea of outlawing a breed of anything based soley on the bad behavior of a handful of dogs and their owners. If the motivation stems from a public safety standpoint then we would save a lot more human life and limb by outlawing liquor cabinets because a select few drink irresponsibly. Both ideas are equally absurd. Rather lets keep our freedom to choose and hold people accountable for their inability to choose wisely. That said I have zero affection for pits and would not lose any sleep over dispatching one into the dirt. I would take issue if the next stop was the GSD being outlawed.
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As stated earlier, these dogs were bred for fighting and killing. Just like hunting dogs are bred for hunting. Yea, many seem like nice little doggies, until that trigger mentioned above is tripped. Just wait until it is one of your kids or grandkids on the receiving end. My ex son-in-law had some friends over who owned one. I was just taking may 4 year old grand son back home. I'm a firm believer, that you can look in a dogs eyes and see his soul. I saw the look in that dogs eyes. I even called my ex son-in-law on my way home and told him to keep that dog away from the kids. His response was, "Oh that dog is so friendly with the kids, he's never hurt anyone!" My grandson was just sitting on the ground with everyone else, not even bothering the dog. That dog went on full attack. It resulted in a quick trip to the hospital to sew his scalp back together. They should have turned it over to authorities to check for rabies. Maybe it had his shots, but they took it out in the hills and shot it.
 
>I do not care for them
>one bit. I have
>seen a few that seemed
>fairly well mannered and I
>do think they get a
>bad rap from a lot
>of irresponsible breeder and owners.
> I would not have
>one and I darn sure
>would never trust one around
>my kids. I have
>also seen horrible aggression issues
>with other dogs including rotties,
>collies, aussie sheps., and others.
> It is interesting to
>look at bite statistics tracked
>by the CDC. A
>few of the breeds have
>a shocking track record.
>It is like anything else
>you own with assumed risk...you
>also assume the liability.
>If someone wants it more
>power to them. Keep
>them locked up and away
>from others who did not
>assume the risk. All
>(insert breed here) are not
>dangerous dogs but all (insert
>breed here) can potentially be
>dangerous. I hesitate to
>give into the idea of
>outlawing a breed of anything
>based soley on the bad
>behavior of a handful of
>dogs and their owners.
>If the motivation stems from
>a public safety standpoint then
>we would save a lot
>more human life and limb
>by outlawing liquor cabinets because
>a select few drink irresponsibly.
> Both ideas are equally
>absurd. Rather lets keep
>our freedom to choose and
>hold people accountable for their
>inability to choose wisely.
>That said I have zero
>affection for pits and would
>not lose any sleep over
>dispatching one into the dirt.
> I would take issue
>if the next stop was
>the GSD being outlawed.
>
4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg



it's probably just flying over my head, but what is a GSD?

i agree,and can understand (to a point) that bad owners make problems worse. but animals/ dogs are breed with instincts. you could go pick up a border collie from the puond that was born in the city, never seen a cow in it's life, take it to a cattle ranch, and although it wouldn't be great- it's instncts will show and the dog will be wanting to hurd cattle.

same with a bird dog, even if it's never hunted, it will want to go sniff out birds.

fit any breed into that catagory. pits have been bread to be a tuff, aggresive, fighting dog. the best owner in the world should always be on their toes and watch their pit around kids,other dogs, elderly people, or anyone.

like i said, if i find out a lab bit my kid, first thing i'm thinking is what they did to provoke it. if a pit bull bites my kid first thing i'm thinking is the dog is going to die. either from the justice system, or through some "special" steaks that i'm tossing over the fence.
 
I actually agree with NONYA on this. Dogs can't comprehend right from wrong. While the dog would definitely have to die for harming a human, ultimately, the owner of the animal has to be held accountable. Whether a financial penalty, an asskicking or both, a lesson needs taught. I had a problem with a neighbors extremely aggressive big black French breed dog (can't remember the name). Had a face to face, explained the results that would come in a second situation (and explained some Montana dog laws to the transplant). He is REAL careful now. mtmuley
 
GSD = German Shepherd. I've also had a chow which many would say is prone to be over aggressive. She was as mellow as any lab. Dogs are very instinct driven there is no question about that. However, the term Pitbull is very loosely used to define a broad range of dogs of varied genetics such as the St. Bernard, Mastiffs, Boxers, and English Bulldogs, Great Pyenees, Swiss Mountain Dog, ect., which also come from the Molosser group which are all considered pits.

Even if you narrow it down to specifically be talking about the American Pitbull Terrior or the Staffordshire (the two which have the look predominately associated with pits) you can have several deviations of sub genetics which would be manifest in behavior differences. Every bird dog is going to have different levels of hunting drive and these dogs are no different.

If I go slap a Sire GSP with a ##### GSP at random I really doubt I'd be able to sell the litter for the same premium that an expert who has bred German Shorthair Pointers for decades can get. Why? because not all instinct is created equal that's why. Not all German Shepherds will be police dogs. Some have it, some don't. I have zero affection for the pit but some folks are equally critical about GSD's. Some of it has merit and some of it is knee jerk reaction rubbish.

According to some charts, I have owned the #3 and #7 most dangerous dogs in the world with these three knuckleheads.....I've seen some Shepherds and some Chows that may have been...but as I said, not all dogs are created equal.

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1911, If we are talking about dog BITES then you are correct. Dog MAULINGS and dogs KILLING people is a different story.

As for bites, labs and shepherds are two of the worst, I was bit by a german shepherd once because I went in a house and it didn't know me. It bit my hip then let go.....not much harm done....

Look at this study, rotts and pitts are the issue;

"Studies indicate that pit bull-type dogs were involved in approximately a third of human DBRF (i.e., dog bite related fatalities) reported during the 12-year period from 1981 through1992, and Rottweilers were responsible for about half of human DBRF reported during the 4 years from 1993 through 1996....[T]he data indicate that Rottweilers and pit bull-type dogs accounted for 67% of human DBRF in the United States between 1997 and 1998. It is extremely unlikely that they accounted for anywhere near 60% of dogs in the United States during that same period and, thus, there appears to be a breed-specific problem with fatalities." (Sacks JJ, Sinclair L, Gilchrist J, Golab GC, Lockwood R. Breeds of dogs involved in fatal human attacks in the United States between 1979 and 1998. JAVMA 2000;217:836-840.)


And this is the account of the first 10 FATAL dog attacks of last year in the US;

California: A family-owned pit bull type dog attacked and killed a three-year-old boy on January 9 in Apple Valley, San Bernardino County. A news report indicates that the father left his son momentarily in the backyard to get a toy from inside the house, and upon his return he discovered that his son had already been attacked, and was not breathing. Authorities arrived at the scene, and shot and killed the dog. The incident was one of five fatal dog attacks in Southern California?s Inland Empire since 2006.
Illinois: A 56-year-old South side Chicago man was mauled to death by at least two pit bull type dogs in his home on January 17. In total, there were six pit bull type dogs found in the home, four adults and two puppies, owned by his daughter who may have been breeding the dogs, although this is not clear. The daughter also lived at the home but was not home at the time of the attack. The mauling was savage, with both ears bitten off, one of the man?s eyes completely gouged, and numerous bites throughout the man?s torso and extremities, suggesting more than one dog?s involvement. According to neighbors, these dogs did not have a history of aggression towards people, were friendly towards neighbors, and the daughter maintain good control over of the dogs. Authorities concluded that the death was ?accidental?.
Mississipi: The fatality involved a six-year-old girl who was playing in the snow outside her home and was attacked by a neighbor's pit bull dog. Apparently, only one dog was involved in the incident, but reports indicate that this dog lived with other pitbull dogs nearby. The probable cause of death to the victim were severe bite marks to the neck. In Terry, MS on February 12.
Minnesota: The victim in this incident was an 11-day-old boy in a car seat situated on the owner's bed. The dog involved was the family's unusually large , male 70 lb. Siberian husky. Injuries were inflicted to the victim's head. A story about this incident in which Dr. Polsky was interviewed can be accessed here. On February 18, in Independence, MN.
Pennsylvania: The victim was a 38-year-old female who was arguing with her mother in the early morning hours of February 19 in the Fishtown section of Philadelphia, when one of the family's pit bulls, an adult female, fatally attacked the victim as she fell backward during an argument. The mother was fighting with her daughter in an attemp to take the keys to the house away from her. According to news reports, when she fell backwards a lamp came crashing to the floor, which likely further exacerbated whatever aggressive tendencies this particular pit bull dog had momentarily as the incident unfolded. The mother said that the dog was in some sort of "protection-mode". The dog locked its jaws around the victim's neck and would not release. Reports indicate that neighbors, along with the mother, who also had five other pit bulls in the house, claim that all dogs were well-behaved and there were no problems between the dogs and the daughter. The daughter was familiar wih the dog involved in the incident. The daughter lived at the residence when she was not in jail or in drug-rehab. When the police arrived they shot two of the dogs, and the other four were taken to the SPCA.
Flordia: In Ocala, FL. on February 20. The breed of dog involved in the incident was the American bulldog, despite other reports initially stating the breed was pit bull. The victim in this case was a three-year-old girl who was playing in the yard, and then entered the caged area containing four tethered, American bulldogs. The toddler became entangled on one of the dog's tether, and was attacked and killed by a single, reproductively intact, male dog. The mother was cleaning the cages, and may have left the cage door unlatched, but this is unclear. She had gone into the house to use the restroom, and upon return discovered her child was inside the cage and mauled by the dog. The mother was operating a dog breeding business out of her home.
Georgia: On February 18 in Conyers, GA. The victim was a five-day-old infant fatally wounded by a pit bull type dog. The mother walked into her daughter's room, in response to the infant's crying, and discovered the dog on top of the infant in the bassinet.
Oregon. The victim was a four-year-old girl killed by the family 2 year-old Rottweiler. Details are sketchy for this case other than the fact that the mother discovered her badly injured child on the front lawn of the house, and shortly thereafter the child was taken to a Portland hospital where she was pronounced dead on arrival. The victim was the daughter of television's reality show "Ax Men",co-star Jesse Browning. According to an investigator, "apparently, the dog just snapped". In Astoria, Oregon on or about February 28.
Oklahoma. On March 8 on the Iowa Indian Reservation near Perkins, Oklahoma. Victim was an eight-month-old boy by two Rottweiler dogs brought into the home the night before for protection purposes. Initially news reports indicated that just one dog was involved, but this was changed to two dogs in subsequent reports. Both dogs were destroyed by animal control. Cause of death was blunt force trauma to the head, according to the medical examiner. Information on this case is sketchy. Note that other dog bite fatalities have occurred on Indian reservations in North America in 2010.
Flordia. The incident involved a three year old, male pit bull mix dog, who severely mauled a seven-day old infant. The incident happened on the bed where the infant routinely slept with his 16-year-old mother. According to news reports, this particular pit bull dog, slept in the same bedroom with the infant and his mother. The mother was home at the time of the incident, but slept through the attack and discovered injured the baby later, but the infant could not be revived. According to others who knew the dog, this pitbull mix dog displayed no previous signs of aggressive behavior towards people. In New Port Richey, Florida on or about April 13, 2010.

-----------------------------------------------
http://andymansavage.blogspot.com/
 
Hell, I have been bit by more women than dogs... I don't know if that's a good thing or bad thing..lol

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Disclaimer:
The poster does not take any responsibility for any hurt or bad feelings. Reading threads poses inherent risks. The poster would like to remind readers to make sure they have a functional sense of humor before they visit any discussion board.
 
>I actually agree with NONYA on
>this. Dogs can't comprehend right
>from wrong. While the dog
>would definitely have to die
>for harming a human, ultimately,
>the owner of the animal
>has to be held accountable.
>Whether a financial penalty, an
>asskicking or both, a lesson
>needs taught. I had a
>problem with a neighbors extremely
>aggressive big black French breed
>dog (can't remember the name).
>Had a face to face,
>explained the results that would
>come in a second situation
>(and explained some Montana dog
>laws to the transplant). He
>is REAL careful now. mtmuley
>
HOLEY SH!T! Me and MtMuley can agree on something!;)
 
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzz I was going to grab popcorn for this Pit bull pissing match but fell asleep !!!


@ Snort just make sure she has her rabies shot next time !!! ;-)
 
We are on the same page Andy. My point is simply that if an adult leaves a loaded .357 unsecured and it finds its way into the hands of someone who should not have had it such as a small child, is it the gun or is it the neglegence of the adult to blame when tragedy strikes? Some people choose not to own guns because of the potential risk. Some do. It is a tragedy anytime we lose the liberty to choose because the lowest common denomimator of society fails to employ common sense. Rather than forfeiting our liberty it seems more fitting to hold people accountable for neglegent decision making. Society gets outraged from horrific stories of dog attacks involving death or serious bodily injury and they very well should. The most widespread cause of death and serious injury in this country today is DUI crashes. Not to mention the link between alcohol and all other manner of crime such as assault, sexual assault, child abuse and neglect, ect. The victims from alcohol dwarf the victims of animal attacks by a wide margin. Every year you can bank on several thousand deaths of innocent third parties who will die from the actions of others poor choice to drink and drive. So by virtue of this do we go back to prohibition? What about hunting accidents, pool drownings ect. It is a slippery slope when we submit our liberties to choose. Today it might be somethimg you or I have no interest in so it can only benefit us. What about tomorow? Just my two cents and something I find worthy of consideration. If they were to cull every Pit next month and exterminate them from the planet I would not lose sleep over it. I would lose sleep over wondering what item is next on the agenda.

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I sold a gun to a guy the other day in the parking lot of cabelas. He had 3 pits with him in a beat up old trashy van. When the deal was done, he opened the door to get back in, and the one that was acting most aggresive jumped out of the van. The owner caught it in mid air. Had he not caught the dog, it would have attacked, and I would have killed it with my glock.

These dogs are bred to kill. Period. If you own one, you're an idiot.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-27-11 AT 09:36AM (MST)[p]Yukon, great story with a happy ending...I hate pits!!! Glad to hear all four bitches were shot...


Government doesn't fix anything and has spent trillions proving it!!!
Let's face it...After Monday and Tuesday, even the calender says WTF!
 
Actually they are good for something. Pig Hunting is a great use for them dogs.

Pets - No way.





Outside of a horse is good for the inside of a man.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jun-27-11 AT 04:09PM (MST)[p]After reading everyone's posts I am shocked at how many of you have absolutely no idea what your talking about. The breed in NOT the problem! Humans are the issue! Pits are instinctively very loyal and extremely easy to teach to do ANYTHING and will do ANYTHING to please their master. Unfortunately a big percentage of pits are owned by gangmembers, drugdealers, drug users and irresponsible morons who TEACH them to be very aggressive and dangerous animals. To say the breed should be exterminated is rediculous. For those of you who think ALL pits should be killed I have a few questions. Should we ban hunting because ALL hunters are serial poachers? Should we ban guns because ALL gun owners could snap at any moment and go on a shooting spree? Should we lockup everyone who has ever drank alcohol because they ALL at some point will drive drunk and crash into somebody and kill them? I could go on and on but I'm sure you get the point! The number of attacks would go down dramatically if anyone convicted of a felony or drug charge were not allowed by law to own a pitbull.
 
there's just too many examples of what these dogs have done to blame it on anything else but the breed. ive been around a lot of them and tend to believe it's the breed. i have border collies and no matter what i do to or with them, they have certain instincts that can't be changed. same goes for pits or any other animals with very few exceptions. it's just not worth the risk in my opinion. besides, any dog can bite, but pits are capable of much much more. i used to have a chow and he was mean as hell. but he wouldn't kill you. i see no use for them.
 
Ironically, it was a border collie that gave me a scar on my right hand when I was about 8 after attacking me in my yard on my front porch. Several months later the same dog attacked another neighbor kid which resulted in the border collie being put down by the County.


Did you know....

1.) About 40 people (children) per year die by drowning in 5-gallon water pails. A person, during their lifetime, is 16 times more likely to drown in a 5-gallon water pail than to be killed by a Pit Bull.

2.) Approximately 50 children in the US are killed every year by their cribs - 25 times the number of children and adults killed by Pit Bulls.

3.) Approximately 150 people are killed every year by falling coconuts. Therefore, you are more than 60 TIMES MORE LIKELY to be killed by a PALM TREE than a Pit Bull.

4.) Each year, 350 people drown in their bathtubs. You are 151 times more likely to be killed by your bathtub than you are by a Pit Bull.

5) Every year, more than 2,000 children in the U.S. are killed by their parents or guardians either through abuse or neglect. A child is more than 800 times more likely to be killed by their caretaker than by a Pit Bull.

6) It can be estimated that for every Pit Bull who kills, there are 10.5 MILLION that DON'T!
FATAL DOG ATTACKS: THE TRUTH BEHIND THE TRAGEDY
Extensive research and investigation has conclusively identified the ownership/management practices that are at the root of the rare, but perfect, storm when a dog becomes dangerous.

Function of Dog ?

Owners obtaining dogs, and maintaining them as resident dogs outside of the household for purposes other than as family pets (i.e. guarding/ protection, fighting, intimidation/status, irresponsible and negligent breeding).

Owner Management & Control of Dogs

Owners failing to humanely contain, control and maintain their dogs (chained dogs, loose roaming dogs, cases of abuse/neglect); owners failing to knowledgeably supervise interaction between children and dogs.

Reproductive Status of Dog ?

Owners failing to spay or neuter animals not used for competition, show, or in a responsible breeding program.

In 2006, 97% of the fatal attacks were the result of one or more of these reckless or criminal ownership practices.

Karen Delise
National Canine Research Council

All statistics can be cited or referenced by the National Canine Research Council upon request.
www.nationalcanineresearchcouncil.com

Can you spot the killer Pit Bull. This photo was taken just moments before all in the photo fell victim to his world renown killing spree.

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BREED SPECIFIC Legislation (BSL) was dealt a savage blow last week in an historic victory for American campaigners when the Supreme Court in Alabama ruled that there was no genetic evidence that one breed of dog was more dangerous than another, simply because of its breed.

Around the world, anti-BSL campaigners are rejoicing at the ruling that drew on evidence provided by genuine canine experts, which was favoured by the judges over subjective evidence, put forward by veterinarians and politicians. The court ruling and the evidence used may now be legitimately used to fight BSL in other countries such as Germany and Australia, as well as other US States. In the UK, the 1991 Dangerous Dogs Act could possibly be open to a direct egal challenge in the same way.

The action in Alabama was brought by the Washington Animal Foundation (WAF) against the city of Huntsville, which had claimed that American Pit BullTerriers were genetically dangerous.

The case centered on four pit bulls held in an animal shelter and adopted by three local women. The dogs were survivors of a group of over 50 pit bulls seized in a raid on a dog-fighting ring in April 2000. Half of the dogs died from injuries or disease, whilst the remainder including four puppies - were held at the City pound and put up for adoption.

Sheila Tack, an emergency room nurse at Crestwood Hospital, adopted two of the puppies that she named Justice and Elizabeth. Whilst they remained impounded, she visited them twice a week.

The other puppies, David and Nellie, were adopted by Kay Nagel, a military officers wife and resident of Redstone Arsenal, and Loyce Fisher, a civil service worker from Cullman.

However, the City Council refused to release the dogs, stating that they were a potential danger to human beings, although none had apparently displayed any aggression. The matter was referred to court for a legal decision on the dogs' fate. During a hearing last year, lawyers representing the city, Michael Fees and Greg Burgess, told Madison County Circuit Judge Joe Battle the animals were vicious and should not be re-homed.

The women, who did not have a lawyer, argued the animals were never trained to fight and conditioning can suppress any vicious tendencies the dogs might have.

Judge Battle agreed and on Nov 13 2001, declared the four young pit bulls were not dangerous because they were never trained to fight. The court allowed the city to destroy 21 adult pit bulls which had been used for fighting.

However, the City appealed Battle's ruling to the Alabama Supreme Court and asked the court for an order preventing the women from taking custody of the dogs. At this point, Seattle-based WAF became involved in the case and appointed Huntsville lawyer Mike Seibert to fight their case, based on evidence they gathered to counter the City lawyers claims that all Pit Bulls were genetically dangerous.

The foundation hired veterinarian Dr. Alan Jones of Hazel Green to examine the dogs. But the officers at the shelter do not allow anyone to have physical contact with the pit bulls, even vet Jones.

"They looked fat and happy," he said. "They seemed starved for attention and not aggressive at all"

Glen Bui, spokesman for WAF told a local newspaper that the dogs should be released.

"I believe that the City of Huntsville is wasting thousands of taxpayers' dollars attempting to destroy innocent dogs that were already given by the circuit court to the three women,' he said.

WAF filed an Amicus (third party) submitting genetic proof that Pit Bulls are not dangerous.

The city of Huntsville were backed by the extremist animal rights organization PETA that Pit Bulls were genetically dangerous, with evidence provided by veterinarians, none of whom was an expert in any specific canine or genetic field.

WAF cited case laws under Due Process of the law, and stated that it was unconstitutional to rule a specific breed of dog as dangerous in this way. They also claimed it was genocide to try to eradicate the pit bull breed.

WAF submitted evidence to the Supreme Court that they were able to provide:

1. Identification of expert treatises regarding the genetics of the breed in question

2. Testing and studies regarding genetics verses environment as the catalyst for a specific dog breed's aggression

3. Social contributions made by the American Pit Bull Terrier (i.e. as Assistance Dogs, Search and Rescue Dogs etc.)

4. The associations brief assisted the court as it had substantial knowledge concerning the issue before the court

5.The briefs filed by the City were insufficient to adequately address the far reaching issues involving genetic breed bias

6. The Foundation read all briefs and believed that innocent pet owners and innocent pets were not represented by either brief.

WAF co-founder Glen Bui told OUR DOGS this week: "The court granted WAF's petition and allowed us seven days to file amicus curiae (disinterested adviser). Myself along with Attorney Mike Seibert worked on the amicus long hours into the night, while WAF members Kay Nagel and Sheila Tack proofread and added input. It was finished with less than one hour before the deadline to file and Sheila raced to the US post office and sent it certified mail.

"Huntsville's entire case rested on affidavits from veterinarians claiming they examined the four pit bull pups and that they would pose a danger to the community because pit bulls are genetically dangerous. They also claimed the women had no legal right to adopt the pups, this was also addressed in the amicus brief."

On Friday, August 30, the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 in WAFs favour and ordered that the dogs should be released for adoption, accepting the evidence but forward by WAF that no breed of dog is genetically dangerous. "This is fantastic news," said Bui. "The city could appeal against the ruling, but Id like to think theyll give way and release the dogs to their new owners so that they can enjoy a good life. Two of them will be trained as Search and Rescue Dogs; the other two will become pets. The pit bulls have been evaluated and temperament tested before they are released, they are being spayed and neutered. The city did tell the media that the dogs would be released, so lets hope they keep their word."

Bui also told OUR DOGS this week: "For years the American Pit Bull Terrier has been alleged to be dangerous because of its genetics. Never has WAF found any genetic research proving that. When we were asked by three Huntsville women for help, they told us nobody else would help them, they had contacted everyone who fights BSL. We knew the women had to face the Supreme Court and this was a very serious case. We knew we had the genetic proof that no breed of dog is dangerous.

"We knew we also had statistics which proved the APBT has one of the best temperaments out of 185 dog breeds along with a strong legal defence. Being aware that never in the past had anyone ever argued the point, after contemplating the outcome if the women lost, I decided to bring WAF into the case, on the last day before the deadline for filing briefs in the Supreme Court WAF petitioned for Amicus Curiae.

"This case set a standard for future cases concerning BSL and genetics. We put several years of research into genetics and due process. We will use the statistics in Ohio; we have received assistance from state agencies in Ohio to investigate the Lucas County Dog Warden rulings on BSL in that State, as Ohio is totally BSL-controlled. Dog owners in Ohio really could use support right now. "It was a long battle and now we have proved the American Pit Bull terrier is not genetically dangerous."
4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
doesn't matter what some lawyer, etc says. statistics can be manipulated as well. pits are one of, if not the most dangerous breeds of dogs. just recently in albuquerque or somewhere in nm, a lady was mauled and killed by some pits while walking down the street. never heard of anybody being killed by a border collie. they are dangerous.
 
So is it all the genetic double helix to blame or is it training and handling? If I buy a horse with the right genes can I win the Kentucky derby without the proper training and conditioning?

Total drunk driving death toll so far this year. 5,282 souls. Who is calling for prohibition?? The silence on that one is deafening.

8th Utah drowning victim in 2 months. Have not heard the outcry to ban waterway recreation yet.
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=16142670

At least be consistent and stop playing into the hyperbole of one hot button topic.

4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
Isn't that Obama 2nd from the left?

Slick

"The Road goes on forever & the Party never Ends"
 
>Isn't that Obama 2nd from the
>left?
>
>Slick
>
>"The Road goes on forever &
>the Party never Ends"

LMAO!

1911, you make a good case. The only thing left to figure out about pit bulls is, what caliber to shoot them with.

Eel
 
I don't care to ever have a pitbull, but I find it really hard not to agree with 1911's logic..

horsepoop.gif


Disclaimer:
The poster does not take any responsibility for any hurt or bad feelings. Reading threads poses inherent risks. The poster would like to remind readers to make sure they have a functional sense of humor before they visit any discussion board.
 
We had a incident where a pit bull heard our fire engine coming and ran out into the road to greet it. My engineer saw it run across the road, but then it came back and squared up like he was going to take us on. Swerving and rolling a multimillion dollar apparatus is not an option. You can guess who won... the dog rolled 75 feet. And of course the owners were pissed that we ran over their dog. What ya gunna do?
 
>So is it all the genetic
>double helix to blame or
>is it training and handling?
> If I buy a
>horse with the right genes
>can I win the Kentucky
>derby without the proper training
>and conditioning?
>
>Total drunk driving death toll so
>far this year. 5,282
>souls. Who is calling
>for prohibition?? The silence
>on that one is deafening.
>
>
>8th Utah drowning victim in 2
>months. Have not heard
>the outcry to ban waterway
>recreation yet.
>http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=16142670
>
>At least be consistent and stop
>playing into the hyperbole of
>one hot button topic.
>
>
4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg




IF a miller lite were capable of running across the table and tearing the throat out of an innocent bar patron, your logic would hold water.....but comparing a living breathing animal with a brain to alcohol or running water is flawed logic and fallacious reasoning....


-----------------------------------------------
http://andymansavage.blogspot.com/
 
>We had a incident where a
>pit bull heard our fire
>engine coming and ran out
>into the road to greet
>it. My engineer saw
>it run across the road,
>but then it came back
>and squared up like he
>was going to take us
>on. Swerving and rolling
>a multimillion dollar apparatus is
>not an option. You
>can guess who won... the
>dog rolled 75 feet.
>And of course the owners
>were pissed that we ran
>over their dog. What
>ya gunna do?

Back up and run over it again!
 
As an object true. Once consumed it turns the person consuming it without the proper self control, in a Dr. Jekyl Mr. Hyde scenario with the brain capacity equal to that of a Pit. Think of it as a Pit which has instead of a bite, a several ton missile driving at velocities of up to and greater than 80 miles per hour. No Pits, no maulings. No booze, no alcohol related crashes.
4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
"If I buy a horse with the right genes can I win the Kentucky derby without the proper training and conditioning?"

maybe, maybe not but the best trainer in the world can't win it with a dink. not a good example.
 
Nor can the best horse win with a dink trainer. It is a combination of genetics and conditioning. One does not trump the other. That was precisely my point. Just because you buy a horse which would qualify as a registered quarter horse does not mean it is going to be exactly and equal to any quarter horse. One might be a fantastic speciman of the breed. The other might be, as you put it, a dink. So are there 'dink' dogs also or does the substandard deviation from breed standards only apply to horses? I would submit that this dink phenomenon you brought up exists in both equine and cannine principles of genetic behavior and traits. Like I said earlier, all dogs, even of the same breed, are not created equal. One of the reasons european working dog kennels are effective at producing quality dogs is their ability to identify and cull negative specimans from any given litter. Imagine that, two dogs grown in the same womb, one is good one is not. If same litter siblings can deviate that much it surely must be possible to suggest substrains within a breed may be technically the same breed while being different dogs altogether.

How many show standard dogs would pass working dog field trials in the same breed? Not very many. They may be 'the same dogs' but they are indeed very different.

If I am wrong about this you should be able to buy a cheap dink quarter horse on ksl in the morning and be selling its semen for $40,000 a vial by afternoon. After all a quarter horse is a quarter horse, and a pit bull is a pit bull right?
4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
Not to get off topic, too far, but....


QUIT BLAMING DRUNK DRIVING ON BOOZE!!!

I mean I get it...without booze there wouldn't be DD'ers, but its like blaming the pencil for poor spelling!....blame the idiot that chooses to consume and then drive.

Plenty of us just love to get sloshed while we sit at home, with our pitbulls! Why outlaw that?

That's my rant...sorry, now back to drinking!


48696fc97cd60c01.jpg
 
>Not to get off topic, too
>far, but....
>
>
>QUIT BLAMING DRUNK DRIVING ON BOOZE!!!
>
>
> I mean I get it...without
>booze there wouldn't be DD'ers,
>but its like blaming the
>pencil for poor spelling!....blame the
>idiot that chooses to consume
>and then drive.
>
>Plenty of us just love to
>get sloshed while we sit
>at home, with our pitbulls!
> Why outlaw that?
>
>That's my rant...sorry, now back to
>drinking!
>
>
>
48696fc97cd60c01.jpg

I'm with ya buddy just illustrating the many things in this world, such as dogs, which can have catastrophic consequence from misuse. I tried to spread it out and throw water, pools, hunting, and guns into the mix. I will stop abusing alcohol this way now. ;) Pop a top for me buddy.



4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
And I COMPLETELY understand where you were going....the outcome of the same IDIOT deciding to drink and drive, and owning pitbulls, may have the same consequences.

When handled properly, both can be safe. When abused....deadly!

But its neither the dogs, nor boozes fault. Both are doing what they were created to do. Blame the owner/drinker.


48696fc97cd60c01.jpg
 
Thank you tag for restoring my faith in human intellegence. I don't have to get out the jumbo crayons now. ;)
4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
While I completely understand.....and appreciate, 1911's infomercial, I remain unsympathetic to the breed.

I will even go so far as to agree that my refusal to change my opinion, even after being given the facts, borders on insanity. Oh well!

I shant bat an eye, when again presented with an aggressive pit bull and will terminate it's existance by whatever means available.

"whackin' a surly bartender ain't much of a crime"
 
I love this thread. I own a pitbull and a brittany. I have owned 2 pitbulls in my life and both never bit or attacked anyone. Both dogs were sweet and loving lap dogs. Furthermore our pitbulls interacted with hundreds of dogs every week at the local dog park without a problem. Our pit has never attacked another dog or person.

That is not to say there are bad pits out there but i have a feeling that most of the fault lies on the owner which i believe has been said on this thread already and which i believe to be 100% true.

Obviously there are exceptions to the rule but by and large I would say the owner of the dog is ultimately responsible for the actions of the dog. I wish not everyone would be so negative, any dog can be trained to be an attacking killing machine, but raised in the right environment with the right coaching a pitbull can be just as good of a dog as a lab can be.
 
even when presented with the facts???? 95% of all "facts" on the internet are made up on the spot.......Or maybe 98%?????

pit bulls have no place (except maybe hog hunting). Way to many areas dont track stats on type of dogs that attack. Apparently a coroner tracks cocnut deaths so the next time you want to get away with murder hit someone with a coconut, but if your pit growls at me, don't get mad when I give it some ventilation.....
 
Hahaha, I love the guys that say they want to put a hole in a dog for growling. i hope you dont mind that when you discharge your firearm to kill my innocent dog that i will gladly repay you. Just saying, sounds a little harsh for a growl dont you think? ;) Ive been growled at alot and still dont have a canine kill under my belt.
 
I owned a pitbull. got him when I was around 17 or so. he lived 16 years. Best dog by far I've ever known. Smart, humble, loyal.
Also physically unbelievable. Extremely athletic and powerful. Never once in his life did he ever behave agressively towards any person. Loved kids. Had a few problems with some other dogs but nothing to get worked up about. I lived in a middle class suburban neighborhood and after the initial shock of seeing a HUGE black pitbull in the neighborhood, every person on that street would go out of their way to see him. People loved him.

All that said, I don't think I'd ever own another. The stigma/hysteria that follows the breed is just too much. At this point in my life I'm more concerned about the liability/responsebility that goes along with ownership.

Also, There would be serious ramifications and repercussions against any pre-conceived grudge holding rednecks who harmed my dog. And I would sincerly hope their kids/wives were around to see that lesson taught.


the artist formerly known as "gemstatejake".
 
Every breed has its quirks/needs. I don't like pits, while there are people that can handle them and make them good dogs most cannot. Just like a bird dog, if you don't know how to handle/train it every hunting trip is bad. Its more of the owners than the dogs. But its really hard to polish a turd.

4b1db2ac644136c4.jpg
 
lol....it's probably more genetics than training, not 50/50. each dog breed has their own traits and instincts. i didn't say pits were the meanest but they are probably the most dangerous. all the training in the world sometimes cant change that, whether it's dogs, horses, monkeys, ets. ive been around lots of animals my whole life and different breeds have inherant traits. i still don't care for the pit breed.
 
Somebody earlier asked what happened after..
Animal control said I could press charges but it would be my word against theirs without the lab (proof). Wasn't going to try that. So searching for the lady and her lab but haven't found her yet.
The family is a bunch of pricks though and have seriously thought about tossing over a "special" snack for that dog.
I keep my hammer ready now, and I hope it doesn't happen but if it does, I sure hope I am there to finish this crap. Defending others and their property... = dead pit...

I am sure there has been a friendly pit bull out there at some point but don't see why anyone would ever want one as a family pet knowing the high risk with them... not worth it.

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"
 
i cant believe anyone would be o.k. with owning a dog that everybody, kids-women-elderly, are scared to death of?

i agree, owners make thing worse than they have to be. and i've seen pits that are the biggest babies ever. but it's a choice you make when you buy one. YOU HAVE A SMALLER MARGINE FOR ERROR. knowing full well that someone doesn't know your dog is any less harmless than the meanest pitbull- do really expect me to go ahead and let your pit "just growl" at my kid and wait to see if he's a bad one or not? sorry, but any tiny bit of agression , coming from a pit bull, is going to get a MAJOR deturant(sp?) and that pit better not be in my yard when it happens or it's a dead dog walking. if someone doesn't like it- not my problem- i didn't buy the dog that has the biggest reputation for being dangerous. it comes with ownership.

and meanwhile, i'll sit back happily knowing- if my lab ever gets out (it's never happened)- the thing that i have to worry about the most is if someone decided to keep such a great dog. and if not they will gladly take him to the pound- why? because they aren't afraid to go pet him in the first place:)
 
When I was in the Navy I lived with a friend who bought a pit puppy...we cropped it's ears and raised it for about a year and a half before I moved into base housing but I still miss that dog to this day...it's still with my friend in northern CA and it's in love with his kids...very solid owner IMO. My friend and I are still the only two people it will let pin it on the ground though...everyone else it kicks and growls like hell and always gets loose!! Hasn't ever bit a human though and it's 8 years old now...it's one of my favorite dogs I've ever known.

Another story, saw a pit attacking a guy in a wheelchair as 4 dudes beat the dog to death...nobody had any clue who's dog it was.

There's good and bad of almost every species on earth I think...wolves and snakes I'll never trust though, kill em all!!

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb37/Feleno/zFix.jpg[/IMG] ~Z~
 
Same thing!! People would argue to the death with you about the safety of owning a snake. Proper care and treatment of the animal and you will have no problems. I love my pitbull and the day she leaves us will be one of the sadest i have ever known.
 
My cousin and I rent a house together, he has a pit and I have a GSP. His pits name is Bo and he was about 4 when I got my GSP, Annie. Bo is one of the sweetest dogs I have been around and is a great pal to Annie. The only thing he has ever gotten aggressive with was my cousins pigs. Kids love him and he is gentler than my GSP. I know they have a bad reputation but I don't think that is reason to gut shoot every pit you see. I have been bit by labs, and dalmations, better gut shoot em boys!
Annie and Bo.
5078annie_and_bo.jpg

Hunt Hard. Shoot Straight. Kill Clean. Apologize to No One.
 
Too many stories like this out there...she sounds like some of those here.....



If you are comfortable living with the risk, that's your right....just keep it at home on a chain when you go for a walk in your Jenco jeans and wife beater.....

-----------------------------------------------
http://andymansavage.blogspot.com/
 
Good video Andyman.

You see, that's the problem. You can get bit by any dog. You can get mauled by a pit bull. They grab on and don't let go. And keep on attacking.

Have any dog you want. If your pit bull acts aggressive towards me I will defend myself. And I won't wait until I'm in bleeding either. If you can't live with that, then you're next.

Eel
 
wish I had one of these
5912dsc02015.jpg
for the pos that is always trying to get at me on the end of his chain. I guarantee if it ever does get off its going tear someone apart. I just hope its not one of my kids. It makes me so mad because it lives at the in laws house and I just know something bad is going to happen when im away and my wife takes the kids up there. It is very aggressive. My father in law used to feed it and it tried to attack him. Its my wife's brothers dog and he does have issues. I almost feel it should be my right to put it down before an accident does happen. Ive talked to my wife about it and she doesn't think its a problem and always says when shes visiting he doesn't let it off chain or kennel. well there is always the ooops factor and he hasn't shown any common sense in any of his life's decisions to date.







avatar_2528.jpg
 
I agree eel. A co-worker use to always tell me how funny it was to see my boys running down the street trying to to get away from his Blue Heelers. After the 2nd time my oldest son was bit by his dogs, the boy ran home grabbed a golf club, and preceeded in beating the dogs skull flat (he cornered it on his porch). When the dog owner told me the story about hearing his dog yiping, going to the door to see my son beating his dog with a 9 iron, I could not of laughed harder.
 
>Good video Andyman.
>
>You see, that's the problem. You
>can get bit by any
>dog. You can get mauled
>by a pit bull. They
>grab on and don't let
>go. And keep on attacking.
>
>
>Have any dog you want. If
>your pit bull acts aggressive
>towards me I will defend
>myself. And I won't wait
>until I'm in bleeding either.
>If you can't live with
>that, then you're next.
>
>Eel


Fukkin comedy...........



the artist formerly known as "gemstatejake".
 
GSJ, here is some Fukkin comedy for you......

About 10 years ago all my brothers and sisters came to my house for Christmas eve. My stupid brother brought his pit bull (the sweetest dog you ever met). Out of nowhere his dog latched onto my sisters 4 year old daughter's face. We peeled the dog off. While my wife and sister were taking the girl to the emergency room to get 24 stitches, I went and got my .22 pistol. I told my brother since it was his dog he could kill it or I would, it was up to him. He did it.

A 4 year old girl with 24 stitches on Christmas eve is a riot. You would have laughed your ass off.

Eel
 
Obviously sorry to hear that. Terrible experience for sure.
However, that in no way gives you any kind of green light to shoot someones dog for growling, giving you dirty looks or whatever. If the thing is actively comeing after you all bets are off of course and you gotta do what you gotta do.

A scenario where someone kills my dog pit or otherwise just because he's growling or they just don't like the looks of him is gonna end real bad. For everbody. And yeah, I'll say point blank, you turn the gun on me like you claimed you would you better make it a good one cuz at that point your life pretty much depends on it. Then one of us is dead and one of us is in prison due to someone's fear of a dog.

Given your experience I obviously understand the way you feel. My experiences were different is all and like I said, I'll never own another pitbull due to they way most people feel about them. Not worth it.


the artist formerly known as "gemstatejake".
 
The sad thing is the fact that people who seem otherwise intelligent defend the breed. There is your FUKKIN Joke!

The most common attacks by these beasts is on chioldren and I can promise you if one ever shows aggression towards my kids it will die, PERIOD!

I can understand the gangster wannabe types and drug dealers and underachieving overcompensating tough guys defending the breed but if a seemingly normal intelligent person cannot realize the breed was created with one thing in mind and INSTINCTIVELY does what it does just like a time bomb then , well maybe they are not so normal or intelligent.

I love my dogs and expect certain things based on training but also expect certain breed qualities based on instinct and do not expect to ever be able to train that out of them as it is impossible!

Your Pit might be the love of your life and mellow as any breed could be and I respect your love for him/her and right to own them but with that ownership comes responsibility and risk. It is just not worth those risks, IMO. The stigma is well earned and frankly if it didn't exist even more people would be bitten as they would not avoid them at all cost. If you own a Pit be glad people have placed them in this box because if they didn't more people would contact your pet and risk their life and health thereby causing the separation of you and your pet.

Bill

Look out Forkie, FTW is watching us!
 
I had a run in with a stocky pit mix while hunting in a popular canyon one year. It was off leash and I was in full camo. So I new I was in trouble when it saw me. As I got off the trail "I yelled catch your dog." The owner yells back "dont worry he wont bite." The dog charged me once and he called it back. "He yells again it wont hurt you." The dog comes again and I get behind my bow and grab an arrow out of the quiver and the effing thing runs right into the end of my thrusting very sharp never used arrow. The dog makes a retreat leaving a nasty blood trail. The owner then yells at me saying "he wasn't going to hurt me." I yelled back a few obscenities and say I'm not going to just stand their and let it get any closer then the end of my arrow while its snarling to find out.
 
>wish I had one of these
>
5912dsc02015.jpg
for the pos that
>is always trying to get
>at me on the end
>of his chain. I guarantee
>if it ever does get
>off its going tear someone
>apart. I just hope its
>not one of my kids.
>It makes me so mad
>because it lives at the
>in laws house and I
>just know something bad is
>going to happen when im
>away and my wife takes
>the kids up there. It
>is very aggressive. My father
>in law used to feed
>it and it tried to
>attack him. Its my wife's
>brothers dog and he does
>have issues. I almost feel
>it should be my right
>to put it down before
>an accident does happen. Ive
>talked to my wife about
>it and she doesn't think
>its a problem and always
>says when shes visiting he
>doesn't let it off chain
>or kennel. well there is
>always the ooops factor and
>he hasn't shown any common
>sense in any of his
>life's decisions to date.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
avatar_2528.jpg



You and me both brother...and I have a four month old! My wife just loves visiting them and says nothing will ever happen because even if it does she is there. She is 4'10" and 105 pounds soaking wet :( and I very much doubt she could do much to it.

We have argued about this before.
 
LAST EDITED ON Jul-02-11 AT 08:36PM (MST)[p]Pitbulls, have earned their reputation.

If you do not want someone killing your dog because he is being aggressive with them, choose another breed or control them.
 
The bottom line is this, breed a mean to dog to a mean ##### and you get a very high chance at having mean pups. It can happen with any breed. It' the breeding of these dogs without any regard for temperment. That being said I'm never going to own one and I don't want one near me or my family.
 
Labs are bred for and instinctively know to retrieve, pointers are bred for and instinctively know to point, heelers are bred for and know to heel and herd livestock, hounds are bred for and instinctively know to track and bay bears etc. and pits are bred for and instinctively know how to do what they do it is not their fault as such but is simply what they are bred to do.

There are mean dogs of every species and they may still carry every other fine attribute of the breed and there are nice dogs of every breed but guess what they still carry every other attribute of their breeding good and bad all it takes is a trigger.

My sis in law is a lesbian, tree hugging, vegetarian liberal with a Golden Retriever that has grown up in the city and never been exposed to a bird yet recently in the country at my father in laws house she found and grabbed the neighbors chicken and attempted to retrieve it, she was shocked because the dog had never been taught to retrieve birds but she was just doing what years of breeding told her to do when exposed to a trigger, I expect the same out of Pits.

Bill

Look out Forkie, FTW is watching us!
 
For 1911's theory on getting killed by a coconut instead of pit-bull mauling s....there's a helluva lot of pit-bulls in LaBarge and NO PALM TREES...I'm always packing somethin' in the pick-up when going to town...
 
1911, yep, other breeds of dogs can be dangerous too.

Not every black mamba will bite you. There are plenty of encounters where no one gets bit. Plus there are plenty of other snakes that are dangerous too. That doesn't mean I'll keep a black mamba around my kids. You can if you want, no law against it.

If I had a black mamba and it bit your kid, don't get pissed at me. He never bit anybody before. It would just be an unfortunate accident.

Eel
 
Eel. You need to re-read my posts. They can be summarized as follows.

1. I don't like pits, don't trust them, would never have one. If someone else does, more power to them. If something catastrophic happens, they should be ultimately held accountable.

2. If something negative results from the ownership of them it is the liability of the owner. As such from a legislative standpoint, we should go after negligent ownership and not limit our liberties with breed specific bans.

3. The term pit bull loosely encompasses a plethora of individual dog breeds. Many of which do not even remotely resemble the American Pit Bull Terrier or Staffordshire Bull Terrier.

4. Many preconceived notions surround the pit bull some of which are factually based and some of which are knee jerk reactions.

5. In the large scheme of things, there are many recreational activities exposing those engaged as well as innocent third parties to far greater danger. In the event there is an outcry for the greater good of society, are we willing to chip away at those also?? Or does the crusade of public safety conclude where our own dislikes stop and interests start?

6. The primary purpose of my last youtube post was to illustrate that in spite of all the 'experts' notions that these dogs are good for one purpose and one purpose only, to wit, take over and dominate the world one throat at a time, there are actually a lot that have been utilized for highly trained and certified service dogs. The secondary purpose was to watch a bunch of guys get their knickers in a bunch.

7. I prefer self control over government control. Government control can kick in once the individual manifests the lack of self control.
4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
OK 1911. We're on the same page. I have never called for the banning of certain breeds of dogs either. Only to defend myself if I fear an attack.

1911, do you write a citation if you stop a car and a child is not in an approved car seat, or in seat belts? I'm assuming you have such a law in Utard, but not sure. How do you feel about that law?:)

Eel
 
I use to be the guy that claimed pit bulls could be good dogs and that if they do have aggression it is most likely the owners training or lack there of. However I no longer share that attitude.

Here is my story! Five years ago I had a buddy that needed a place to live for a couple weeks and so reluctantly I allowed him to use my couch for the time being, he of course had a pit bull, me I had a male german shepard! The two dogs got along great and played for hours and we even left them in the kennel together for hours. One night we were bbq'ing some food and drinking some beers. Out of nowhere the two dogs started to fight, to this day I do not know what started the fight. In the five seconds it took, four grown men to get in the house where the dogs were, the pit bull had my german shepard by the nose and neck in his mouth and he was not letting go. Four grown men could not seperate the two dogs. I was certain it was going to be the end for my dog as the pit bull would not let go. I told the owner of the pit he had long enough for me to get my shotgun to get his dog off my dog or I was going to seperate them anyway I could. Needless to say he begged me to not kill his dog when I got back with my shotgun, at this very moment his dog let go long enough to get a betteranother grip on my dog and my dog was able to slip out and run away. After much convincing I agreed to not shoot the pit bull but my buddy was to keep his pit away from my dog at all times. The pit was not even allowed in the house when my dog was in the house and when I was not there the pit bull had to be locked in his car or with him where ever he went. Fast forward a week, I started to relax the rules, big mistake, and I allowed the pit to be locked in a different room as my dog when we were at work. I came home one day to find a pitbull size hole in the bedroom door where the pit was and a hole in my bedroom door about the size of his nose from where he tried to get at my dog again, also he had chewed thru the screen in the window trying to get out of the bedroom. Thank god I got home just in time to find this dog chewing thru the door. When my buddy got home from work I told him to get his crap, and get the f out of my house with his dog. We were in the living room arguing about the dog when the all the sudden this dogs ears went back and he began to low growl at my girlfriend. The dog needless to say launched himself at my girlfriend and I was able to catch him mid air with a right hook, the dog backed off and I went to my room and grabbed my shotgun and once again told him either he was going to shoot him or I was, and I wasn't going to let him talk me out of it twice. He would not do it so I got the privelege of doing it. Never again will I trust these dogs, and I don't care what anyone says. It was one thing to attack my dog but it is another to try and attack me or my girlfriend. The crazy thing is my girlfriend absolutely did nothing to provoke this behavior. I could see the dog being mad at me, I put my foot to his guts a few times. If I see them roaming without the owner I shoot first and ask questions later. To each there own I guess!!
 
My cousin had a Pit Bull, he got it when it was a young pup. We took it camping and with us on the horses, it was a great dog and a family pet. My kids would play with it and it got along good with the other dogs. When the Pit bull was about 6, my cousin came over to the house without his pit bull and when I asked where he was, I was told the dog bit a neighbor girl on the face and the girl had to get stiches. And the dog was put down. We don't know what triggered the dog to bite the little girl, but it did.
 
just so happens i just got home from camping- after being there for 2 days, 2 families pulled up and camped RIGHT NEXT TO US- oh well public land. low and behold out pops a pit bull- mind you- we ( are group) have 2 labs and 1 little lap dog(have no clue what breed) pit bull comes right over to are camp. i jog strait to it, grab it's coller and drag it right back to their truck. i told them up front " you pit bull is not allowed anywhere near my kids or dogs, if anything happens i WILL shoot your dog" the owner gives me the " oh, you have nothing to worry about with jeffry" i told him i dont know you or your dog and i'm just telling you up-front.

so funny thing is- his "nothing to worry about pit bull sits on a giant piece of chain untill we left today.---------------
if i didn't want my lab to go anywhere i could use bailing twine and not worry a bit.

sorry- as an owner , it's YOUR decision to think your dog is save, i will NEVER be reqired to think "YOUR DOG IS A SAFE ONE"

and to "GSJ", if your pitbull is attacking, or even pre-tending to attack my children, you better bet your ass i will be using any means to stop it before it starts, and i really dont give a %%%% if it's owner/ you dont like it. if you think your love for your dog is greater than mine for my kid- you wont ever win that battle buddy.
 
>just so happens i just got
>home from camping- after being
>there for 2 days, 2
>families pulled up and camped
>RIGHT NEXT TO US- oh
>well public land. low and
>behold out pops a pit
>bull- mind you- we (
>are group) have 2 labs
>and 1 little lap dog(have
>no clue what breed) pit
>bull comes right over to
>are camp. i jog strait
>to it, grab it's coller
>and drag it right back
>to their truck. i told
>them up front " you
>pit bull is not allowed
>anywhere near my kids or
>dogs, if anything happens i
>WILL shoot your dog" the
>owner gives me the "
>oh, you have nothing to
>worry about with jeffry"
> i told him i
>dont know you or your
>dog and i'm just telling
>you up-front.
>
>so funny thing is- his "nothing
>to worry about pit bull
>sits on a giant piece
>of chain untill we left
>today.---------------
>if i didn't want my lab
>to go anywhere i could
>use bailing twine and not
>worry a bit.
>
>sorry- as an owner , it's
>YOUR decision to think your
>dog is save, i will
>NEVER be reqired to think
>"YOUR DOG IS A SAFE
>ONE"
>
>and to "GSJ", if your pitbull
>is attacking, or even pre-tending
>to attack my children,
>you better bet your ass
>i will be using any
>means to stop it before
>it starts, and i really
>dont give a %%%% if
>it's owner/ you dont like
>it. if you think your
>love for your dog is
>greater than mine for my
>kid- you wont ever win
>that battle buddy.

OK "Buddy".
My particular dog lived his whole long life through without ever "pre-tending" to attack anyone. By definition that would make him a safe one......but thats not the point.

Point is, you hurt my dog you better have a real good reason. Of course I'm a reasonable/rational dude and not prone to hysterics/paranoia like some of you seem to be so I'd understand if you did what you had to do.......If not me and you are hitting the dirt. Point blank. And I don't give a $hit how YOU/YOUR kids feel about that. How'd you feel watching someone blow you labs head off for some minor percieved aggression? I'll bet you'd wanna kick somebodies a$$, right?

Something else to think about:
Wonder how many kids got bit by dogs due to the little angels antagonizing/teasing them? I know I learned that lesson the hard way as a youngster. I'll bet some of you did too. A dalmation and a St. Bernard were the teachers.......We lived in a $hitty neighborhood then with a couple pits on the block. It's a wonder I survived.

I'm sympathetic and sorry to everyone on this thread who's had trouble with pitbulls or other dogs. That type of thing is serious and not a joking matter.


the artist formerly known as "gemstatejake".
 
>1911,you flip flopped worse than a
>politician.


Do expound. If you think I switched positions anywhere there then you have a serious reading comprehension issue.

4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
Pitbulls kill people,lots of people,charge every owner in one of these cases with manslaughter and see how many dumbass's still want to own one.They should be killed,all of em.


"I actually agree with NONYA on this."
MTMuley
 
>>just so happens i just got
>>home from camping- after being
>>there for 2 days, 2
>>families pulled up and camped
>>RIGHT NEXT TO US- oh
>>well public land. low and
>>behold out pops a pit
>>bull- mind you- we (
>>are group) have 2 labs
>>and 1 little lap dog(have
>>no clue what breed) pit
>>bull comes right over to
>>are camp. i jog strait
>>to it, grab it's coller
>>and drag it right back
>>to their truck. i told
>>them up front " you
>>pit bull is not allowed
>>anywhere near my kids or
>>dogs, if anything happens i
>>WILL shoot your dog" the
>>owner gives me the "
>>oh, you have nothing to
>>worry about with jeffry"
>> i told him i
>>dont know you or your
>>dog and i'm just telling
>>you up-front.
>>
>>so funny thing is- his "nothing
>>to worry about pit bull
>>sits on a giant piece
>>of chain untill we left
>>today.---------------
>>if i didn't want my lab
>>to go anywhere i could
>>use bailing twine and not
>>worry a bit.
>>
>>sorry- as an owner , it's
>>YOUR decision to think your
>>dog is save, i will
>>NEVER be reqired to think
>>"YOUR DOG IS A SAFE
>>ONE"
>>
>>and to "GSJ", if your pitbull
>>is attacking, or even pre-tending
>>to attack my children,
>>you better bet your ass
>>i will be using any
>>means to stop it before
>>it starts, and i really
>>dont give a %%%% if
>>it's owner/ you dont like
>>it. if you think your
>>love for your dog is
>>greater than mine for my
>>kid- you wont ever win
>>that battle buddy.
>
>OK "Buddy".
>My particular dog lived his whole
>long life through without ever
>"pre-tending" to attack anyone. By
>definition that would make him
>a safe one......but thats not
>the point.
>
>Point is, you hurt my dog
>you better have a real
>good reason. Of course I'm
>a reasonable/rational dude and not
>prone to hysterics/paranoia like some
>of you seem to be
>so I'd understand if you
>did what you had to
>do.......If not me and you
>are hitting the dirt. Point
>blank. And I don't give
>a $hit how YOU/YOUR kids
>feel about that. How'd you
>feel watching someone blow you
>labs head off for some
>minor percieved aggression? I'll bet
>you'd wanna kick somebodies a$$,
>right?
>
>Something else to think about:
>Wonder how many kids got bit
>by dogs due to the
>little angels antagonizing/teasing them? I
>know I learned that lesson
>the hard way as a
>youngster. I'll bet some of
>you did too. A dalmation
>and a St. Bernard were
>the teachers.......We lived in a
>$hitty neighborhood then with a
>couple pits on the block.
>It's a wonder I survived.
>
>
>I'm sympathetic and sorry to everyone
>on this thread who's had
>trouble with pitbulls or other
>dogs. That type of thing
>is serious and not a
>joking matter.
>
>
>the artist formerly known as "gemstatejake".
>


you can like it or not, i dont really care- it's a choice YOU make owning a pit.
your LAB can bite my kid, and it will probably just get a kick or a "shew, get outta here" , if your "pitbull" bites my kid, it's not up to me to hope your" never hurt a sole" decides not to kill my kid.
simple, my kid vs. your dog= your dog is eating dirt, and you damn sure aren't going to have a say in the matter.

take someone to court, see how far you get;)

it's a choice YOU MAKE owning one, just because you think it's fine doesnt mean i have to.

it's like an ex child molestor moving next door and someone telling me if i catch him sneaking IN MY YARD, with my kids, i should just let it slide- it's not happening.
and we have nothing to worry about as long as YOUR dog stays in YOUR yard. if not, dont expect him to come home.
 
OK wbymann. Whatever you say.
It'll be YOUR choice to destroy my property without good cause and YOUR choice to deal with the consequences. Which would not be pleasant.














the artist formerly known as "gemstatejake".
 
"Do expound. If you think I switched positions anywhere there then you have a serious reading comprehension issue."

i don't and you jumped the fence.
 

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