Thanks to everyone for the replys. DallenC we live in northern WV near Clarksburg. Bobcatbess,thank you for the compliment. Buckstopshere, yes it does swirl backwards. CheeseheadinOhio , We hunted both public and private land. My buck came from pulic land but the other two came from the ranch we where staying at. It was near Fort Robinson at Crawford,NE. As far as DIY I guess you could say it was, we were unguided. Although we did pay to stay and hunt on the private land. Thanks again!