6.8 Western (fad or legit)

Just another caliber. Only a couple manufactures making rifles and ammo. My coworker has bought 3 browning hells canyon before the prices sky rocketed and since then he has sold all 3. He liked his 300 win mag more. I was able to go shoot with him and didnt seem that special to me. I guess shoot what ya like
 
From what i understand, it's being rolled out with fast-twist rifles, so essentially a 270wsm meant to spin heavies.
If you feel obligated to push 175-ish grains, but didn't feel the 7mm variants were good enough...then i guess it has a niche.
 
Don’t castrate me I’m already married and sown a couple seeds but it’s a pretty cool caliber. The military is going to adopt this round from what I read. I won’t be buying one already have enough rifles don’t need redundancy. Although it has my vote as legit.
 
The 30 06 is battle proven. They’ve tried to bury this round for decades. It will kill everything in North America. I’ve killed almost everything in NM using it. I have hunting rifles in 270, 308 and 300 mag also, no issues with them I just really like the 30 06. It’s like guns, girls and grub, everybody has their own preference.
 
As mentioned, the only thing it really has to offer is sending a .277 caliber bullet downrange with higher mass to it.

It is more legit than something like Hoyt pushing their fastest, most bestest bow ever and providing a game changer like never before :rolleyes:
 
The 6.5, now a 6.8. I'm just gonna wait until they get to 7mm :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: . Oh wait there areseveral of them!

Seriously, already a plethora of similar calibers and cartridges to choose from. But shoot what you like. Me? I'm more traditional. 7mm and 300 Win Mag.
 
I will say this: I’ve yet to walk into a store and not see 6.8 Western ammo on the shelves. Literally EVERY time.

For some having trouble getting ammo, maybe it’s worth buying a new gun and stocking up on ammo for years to come.

I have no idea if the cartridge had staying power, but the ballistics on it are impressive.
 
Vanilla said:
I will say this: I’ve yet to walk into a store and not see 6.8 Western ammo on the shelves. Literally EVERY time.

For some having trouble getting ammo, maybe it’s worth buying a new gun and stocking up on ammo for years to come.

I have no idea if the cartridge had staying power, but the ballistics on it are impressive.
Click to expand...
Interesting. Wonder if it is a marketing strategy to shift ammo production to the 6.8, hoping gun sales take off. Once you buy the gun, you're hooked on buying the ammo.
 
No clue on the reason, but I know I find 7 mm on average about one out of ever 10-12 trips. Is see 6.8 Western every single time. And a good amount of it. A person wanting to get a good rifle and stock up on years and years of ammo could do it right now with 6.8 Western. You could have a rifle and 20 boxes of ammo in less than a month. (Only because most places are restricting how many boxes you can buy at once)


I have no clue if that ammo will still be produced at this level 10 years from now, but it certainly solves a problem for someone out of ammo with resources to buy but no product available in their current rifle.
 
I knew an old master guide from Alaska many years ago tell me that by WW2 gun makers had already invented every caliber ever needed by modern man. The rest is just a reason to sell more sh_t to the hunting/shooting population. And there's nothing wrong with that either.
 
CHWino_1 said:
I knew an old master guide from Alaska many years ago tell me that by WW2 gun makers had already invented every caliber ever needed by modern man. The rest is just a reason to sell more sh_t to the hunting/shooting population. And there's nothing wrong with that either.
Click to expand...

Still waiting on the 6.7mm and 6.9mm to come out. Talk about game changers!
 
I traded an xbolt 300WM for one. so far I have been quite happy at the range with it. I have been shooting the factory 175grn ammo with impressive accuracy and very manageable recoil.
 
Vanilla said:
No clue on the reason, but I know I find 7 mm on average about one out of ever 10-12 trips. Is see 6.8 Western every single time. And a good amount of it. A person wanting to get a good rifle and stock up on years and years of ammo could do it right now with 6.8 Western. You could have a rifle and 20 boxes of ammo in less than a month. (Only because most places are restricting how many boxes you can buy at once)


I have no clue if that ammo will still be produced at this level 10 years from now, but it certainly solves a problem for someone out of ammo with resources to buy but no product available in their current rifle.
Click to expand...
This is one reason I made the trade for one. No shortage of ammo.
 
I was interested in looking at a 6.8 western a couple of months ago but I couldn't find anybody in this part of the country (SE) that had any rifles or ammo and haven't seen any available online.
 
RS said:
I was interested in looking at a 6.8 western a couple of months ago but I couldn't find anybody in this part of the country (SE) that had any rifles or ammo and haven't seen any available online.
Click to expand...
Yea I had a buddy that won it in a raffle and he had a strong liking to the same model 300WM of mine. I have seen them on Gun Broker and a few sites.
 
Bigfoot 1 said:
Since you started this thread I’ve had some time to research the 6.8 and quite frankly it’s very impressive. The wife’s not going to like you much because it’s going to be my next rifle purchase. Thanks for the heads up.
Click to expand...

This is why I don't get the hate of the 6.8 Western and the statements above about it being just like everything else. I realize that a lot of new cartridges are not "necessary," but when did we as hunters stop at "necessary?"

The ballistics of this cartridge are impressive. Maybe I'll sell my 7mm Rem Mag and switch over fully to 6.8 Western just to annoy the masses? :)
 
there all fads, i would agree that every caliber that's needed for what we do already exists. but who cares. new rifles are fun. im building one right now that calibers already exist that do what it does but its gunna be cool.

one thing i look a though is how it is for reloading. my own example is the 30 nosler i built. 300 RUM does what it does but the nolser does it with less powder and its a dream to reload for. found very few bullet/powders i cant get a good load out of. similar benefit to the 22 creed im building over a 22-250 AI. no need to fire form brass. thats a big plus to me
 
I can't tell if the tail is wagging the dog now days.

Having just done the new rifle thing for my son, wood stocks are very hard to find(xbolt). Is that because everyone wants plastic? Or because the manufacturer knows plastic is newer thus creating more sells?

The average hunter shoots what, less than a box of shells yearly? So that 7mm ain't funding ammo companies.

So, a new almost 7mm, will, as newer gun= more ammo expended setting it up.

That's just hunters, shooters are a different category.

I had a Remington semi auto 10 gauge. They discontinued the gun, meaning no parts. That meant, that gun became obsolete and I dumped it cheap, to get rid of it while I could.

I shoot 06'. My son now shoots 300 win.

They won't go obsolete in the next decade or so. Look at all the wsm cartridges that were all the rage. Now they are headed to obscurity. I'd imagine a clone of a 7mm, just barely better, isnt enough to stick.

Imo
 
hossblur said:
I shoot 06'. My son now shoots 300 win.

They won't go obsolete in the next decade or so. Look at all the wsm cartridges that were all the rage. Now they are headed to obscurity. I'd imagine a clone of a 7mm, just barely better, isnt enough to stick.

Imo
Click to expand...

I purchased my 7mm about 5 years ago and I settled on it over one of the "designer" cartridges because of that old saying, "If you need ammo you can walk into any sporting goods store in the country and find 7mm, 30-06, 300 win mag, 270, etc.

Your choices will not become obsolete, but I know from experience looking for both what you listed that the ammo for each is not easy to find right now and it hasn't been for nearly 2 years. Weird world we're living in for sure.
 
Vanilla said:
I purchased my 7mm about 5 years ago and I settled on it over one of the "designer" cartridges because of that old saying, "If you need ammo you can walk into any sporting goods store in the country and find 7mm, 30-06, 300 win mag, 270, etc.

Your choices will not become obsolete, but I know from experience looking for both what you listed that the ammo for each is not easy to find right now and it hasn't been for nearly 2 years. Weird world we're living in for sure.
Click to expand...


I was that same guy spouting that same line?
 
Bigfoot 1 said:
The 30 06 is battle proven. They’ve tried to bury this round for decades. It will kill everything in North America. I’ve killed almost everything in NM using it.
Click to expand...
Sheeesh! No wonder they are trying to bury this caliber! This is the answer to why mule deer and other animals are in decline! If you have almost killed everything in NM already and you are predicting it will kill everything else in North America, we need to get rid of the 30-06 quickly before all the animals are gone! ?
 
bonepicker said:
Sheeesh! No wonder they are trying to bury this caliber! This is the answer to why mule deer and other animals are in decline! If you have almost killed everything in NM already and you are predicting it will kill everything else in North America, we need to get rid of the 30-06 quickly before all the animals are gone! ?
Click to expand...
Yep, there’s not much left here but a few jackalope, I will eventually get around to them. If you’re a Non Resident you should skip applying for anything in this State.
 
JPickett said:
there all fads, i would agree that every caliber that's needed for what we do already exists. but who cares. new rifles are fun. im building one right now that calibers already exist that do what it does but its gunna be cool.

one thing i look a though is how it is for reloading. my own example is the 30 nosler i built. 300 RUM does what it does but the nolser does it with less powder and its a dream to reload for. found very few bullet/powders i cant get a good load out of. similar benefit to the 22 creed im building over a 22-250 AI. no need to fire form brass. thats a big plus to me
Click to expand...
.30 Nosler does what the RUM does? mtmuley
 
mtmuley said:
210 LRAB at 3160. In a RUM. So yeah. Pretty close. Been loading RUMS for 22 years. mtmuley
Click to expand...
I had it up as high 3090 I think. With spread over 3100 but accuracy dropped off up there. Started to show some pressure signs but still within Saftey zones. I’ve been pretty impressed with the 30 nosler
 
littlebighorn said:
It's gotta be a Fad because I didn't rush out to buy one. I already have more rifles than I know what to do with, including a 270WSM. Why a Western???
Click to expand...
Must be required in states west of the Mississippi. I'm really looking forward to the next version - the 6.81 Southern! Can't wait til it hits the market!! :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:

OK, I know some of you will have some really good reasons for it to be called a Southern!! Can't wait to see those! :) :)
 
Joe2Kool said:
Must be required in states west of the Mississippi. I'm really looking forward to the next version - the 6.81 Southern! Can't wait til it hits the market!! :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:

OK, I know some of you will have some really good reasons for it to be called a Southern!! Can't wait to see those! :) :)
Click to expand...

They already have one of those, but they called it Creedmoor.
 
littlebighorn said:
It's gotta be a Fad because I didn't rush out to buy one. I already have more rifles than I know what to do with, including a 270WSM. Why a Western???
Click to expand...
I was looking at some 6.8 brass today at our local gun store. How much more capacity does the 6.8 have over the .270 WSM? A fast twist .270 WSM probly runs close. mtmuley
JPickett said:
I had it up as high 3090 I think. With spread over 3100 but accuracy dropped off up there. Started to show some pressure signs but still within Saftey zones. I’ve been pretty impressed with the 30 nosler
Click to expand...
Have a buddy shooting the 199 Hammer at 3400. If you want to shoot copper, they are worth a look. I have been shooting the regular Accubond to hunt with for a long time. 200 grain right at 3200. It's been flawless on elk. mtmuley
 
The only thing the 6.8 western has to offer is pushing a 175 gr .277 downrange.

No different in offering really than the 6.5 CM, other than a more manly sounding name.
 
roadrunner said:
The only thing the 6.8 western has to offer is pushing a 175 gr .277 downrange.

No different in offering really than the 6.5 CM, other than a more manly sounding name.
Click to expand...
“No different”, like our last two presidents? One is bigger, carries more energy and the ability to kill larger game, more effectively, at longer ranges oh and the case is different too.
They sounds similar, thanks for the contributions!
 
Last edited:
mtmuley said:
I was looking at some 6.8 brass today at our local gun store. How much more capacity does the 6.8 have over the .270 WSM? A fast twist .270 WSM probly runs close. mtmuley
Have a buddy shooting the 199 Hammer at 3400. If you want to shoot copper, they are worth a look. I have been shooting the regular Accubond to hunt with for a long time. 200 grain right at 3200. It's been flawless on elk. mtmuley
Click to expand...
mtmuley, case volume between the two is 4.6 grains...
6.8 Western has case volumn of 74.0
270 WSM case volumn of 78.6
 
Vanilla said:
I will be the first to admit that I don't understand complete nonsense.
Click to expand...

Talking about the caliber itself. The only thing the 6.8 has to offer in a 6.8 (.277) is pushing a heavier bullet downrange like the the 6.5 (.264) did for it. Neither are an advantage over other calibers such as a particular belted magnum in a bullet offering of likeness in weight.

But if you think you need to go buy another gun that doesn't offer more than what is already available because you think there is an economic advantage for ammo and to complement your flat-brim, by all means go ahead. "A fool is easily parted from his money".

Try and keep up, you don't understand much of anything really...
 
roadrunner said:
But if you think you need to go buy another gun that doesn't offer more than what is already available because you think there is an economic advantage for ammo and to complement your flat-brim, by all means go ahead. "A fool is easily parted from his money".

Try and keep up, you don't understand much of anything really...
Click to expand...

I haven’t bought a 6.8, nor do I plan to or even want to. I’ve simply commented on objectively factual information relevant to the discussion. I realize facts aren’t your strength, so we’ll forgive your shortcomings here. But try to keep up, would ya?
 
Vanilla said:
I haven’t bought a 6.8, nor do I plan to or even want to. I’ve simply commented on objectively factual information relevant to the discussion. I realize facts aren’t your strength, so we’ll forgive your shortcomings here. But try to keep up, would ya?
Click to expand...

Facts? Let me help you out...

roadrunner said:
The only thing the 6.8 western has to offer is pushing a 175 gr .277 downrange.

No different in offering really than the 6.5 CM, other than a more manly sounding name.
Click to expand...

As always, you cherry-pick what you want in order to twist the meaning in an attempt to prove an irrelevant point that wasn't even being made. 1st, the comment about the one caliber and what it offered for it. 2nd of how that compared to the second caliber and what it offered for it.

Nowhere did I say the 6.5 was superior to the 6.8. You pretended I did.

Again, your arrogance shows how much of a mouthy punk you really are. You're not 5'4" are you?
 
Bigfoot 1 said:
The 30 06 is battle proven. They’ve tried to bury this round for decades. It will kill everything in North America. I’ve killed almost everything in NM using it. I have hunting rifles in 270, 308 and 300 mag also, no issues with them I just really like the 30 06. It’s like guns, girls and grub, everybody has their own preference.
Click to expand...
You've killed almost everything in NM? No wonder I can't draw a tag;).
Just messing with ya
 
roadrunner said:
Nowhere did I say the 6.5 was superior to the 6.8. You pretended I did.

Again, your arrogance shows how much of a mouthy punk you really are. You're not 5'4" are you?
Click to expand...

The next time I type “superior” will be the first time I typed it in this thread. You can’t even keep up with what you write yourself. I won’t ask you to keep up with me anymore because you can’t even keep up with you. And that’s saying something!

I’m happy to meet up for lunch if you’d like to measure my height.
 
Vanilla said:
The next time I type “superior” will be the first time I typed it in this thread. You can’t even keep up with what you write yourself. I won’t ask you to keep up with me anymore because you can’t even keep up with you. And that’s saying something!

I’m happy to meet up for lunch if you’d like to measure my height.
Click to expand...
Uh Oh. A measuring contest. mtmuley
 
man i'm glad i'm not getting flamed like this for my 22 creedmoor. i'm not old enough yet to shoot a 220 swift so i kinda had to do it.

im 6'5" by the way
 
I've Been Bunting Heads With a LAWYER All This Time?:D

Vanilla said:
The next time I type “superior” will be the first time I typed it in this thread. You can’t even keep up with what you write yourself. I won’t ask you to keep up with me anymore because you can’t even keep up with you. And that’s saying something!

I’m happy to meet up for lunch if you’d like to measure my height.
Click to expand...
 
Vanilla said:
The next time I type “superior” will be the first time I typed it in this thread. You can’t even keep up with what you write yourself. I won’t ask you to keep up with me anymore because you can’t even keep up with you. And that’s saying something!

I’m happy to meet up for lunch if you’d like to measure my height.
Click to expand...

Would you shut up already? My hell...
 
Vanilla said:
Doesn't surprise me at all that it went completely over your head once again.
Click to expand...

Which pretend reality are you talking about, you have so many?

You create these arguments in your head about a point that wasn't even attempted at being made, and then, you try and invalidate it by going down some make believe rabbit hole.

If you can't state an explicit instance where I "drew first blood", then it must be another one of your fake realities. You need to understand that a snarky response to a comment is hardly meaningful or constructive. I can name all three topics to exchanges we've ever had. If the first one hurt your feelings, then you're in the wrong profession.

If you've taken something out of context and never gave me a chance to elaborate or correct it, then I really don't know what to tell you and that's your problem, not mine.

If things really bother you that much, then you have a long hard road ahead of you going forward...
 
Roadrunner, I honestly don’t have a clue what you’re talking about from the three topics you’re referring to. I only know this thread. It’s pretty easy to see you have an ax to grind against me and that whatever prior topics you’re referring to really bothered you. I’d say I’m sorry, but I’m not. You’ve popped off in this thread like a petulant child. You keep saying I’m trying to create an argument. Again, you were the one that came after me. Good on ya, but a life lesson is if you’re going to take a shot you better not miss. You missed. Sorry, not sorry.

I have no clue what history you and I have, but whatever it is, build a bridge and get over yourself. It’s just the internet, little guy. I have no interest in internet rivalries. I’ve simply commented on the cartridge that was asked about by the OP in this thread and you’ve done your level best to make it about me. Again, get over yourself. Or just stop posting. Either way, I’ll be satisfied. Let the topic have its thread back.

The 6.8 Western has impressive ballistics. There are other cartridges that have impressive ballistics. Some people hate hunting and think buying guns is lame. Some like hunting and enjoy buying guns. If you’re in the latter group, the 6.8 Western may be for you…or it may not. It’s just a gun, lots of different guns out there. Just like there is lots of factory ammo out there for 6.8 Western.
 
Ballistics on the 6.8 are impressive. There was one time in my life when I couldn’t have enough guns, grub and girls. Now I’m just chasing guns and grub.
 
Vanilla, let me help you out...

I said:

roadrunner said:
The only thing the 6.8 western has to offer is pushing a 175 gr .277 downrange.

No different in offering really than the 6.5 CM, other than a more manly sounding name.
Click to expand...

You focused on this:

roadrunner said:
No different in offering really than the 6.5 CM, other than a more manly sounding name.
Click to expand...

You replied:

Vanilla said:
6.8 Western has nearly 60% more energy at 500 yards than 6.5 CM. Yep, sounds about the same. :ROFLMAO:
Click to expand...

How you got that I was trying to compare the two relative to their ballistics baffles me. The 6.8 Western offers the same for the .277 caliber that the 6.5 CM does for the .264, pushing a heavier bullet downrange for that caliber. Had I said performs the same, then you'd be correct and I would be wrong.

I don't have the ax to grind, but apparently your response shows you do.

The other two interactions we've had is when I "tongue in cheek" suggested you and elkassassin take your bantering back and forth to private messaging because you were taking away from the thread. It was annoying, just like this is as annoying as hell to others.

I guess you were threatened by that remark because the second time you first pretended that I was stating UT would lose its hunting rights during the trail cam debate, which I wasn't insinuating anything of the sort. You then gave a "history lesson" in your snarky and condescending way (just like your response to my post on this thread) and then followed it up with calling me an idiot because you didn't like me calling out your arrogant behavior.

I've avoided commenting on your posts since. You made an incorrect assumption on this thread, made an off-the-wall comment in retort, and then this AZGuy giggled with glee because he thought you were clever which means he didn't get my comment either.

I've seen you do this a lot with other forum members. You make incorrect assumptions, puff your chest out to correct what wasn't said, and then try to walk something back with ambiguity.

Who drew first blood? It wasn't me. Cheers...
 
roadrunner said:
I've avoided commenting on your posts since.
Click to expand...

You should go back to doing that. I mean that in all sincerity. There is not one single person on this thread besides you that gives two pieces of monkey crap what you think about me, myself included. I tried to tell you to build a bridge and get over yourself and let the thread be about what the OP started, but you can't do that for some reason.

Seriously, hold onto those previous interactions that I still don't remember even though you can give a play by play accounting all you want, but do it on your own time, snowflake. I'm more interested in hearing about what people think about the 6.8 Western cartridge on this thread than what you think about me. And I'm sure I speak for literally everyone else that feels the same. Give it a rest. Nobody cares.

I'm sorry you decided to let your feelings get hurt in the past. You should get over that. I'm sorry you have chosen to get angry with me. You can repent of that. But for the love of all that is holy, be in your feelings on this in private, PLEASE! Seriously, nobody cares. Thanks for ruining a thread.

6.8 Western...it appears to be a decent cartridge with a lot of available factory ammo right now.
 
Sometimes a good internet fight is more noteworthy than a new cartridge! JK

I shoot a 270 WSM but the biggest bullets that perform would be 150’s and I pretty much stick with the 140 Accubond but have shot lots of 130’s too.

There are no flies on the new 6.8 if a guy needs longer, heavy for caliber bullets (like the 6.5 Creedmoor). BC would be awesome. It’s “approaching” the 28 Nosler in bullet weight and performance but not quite. Of the two, I’ll take the 28 all day long. I know, apples to oranges since they’re not of the same caliber but that’s the best comparison I can make with my limited knowledge.

Zeke
 
deadibob said:
Ackley it and then you'll really have something.:) In Fact I was thinking of this just the other day after looking at my .277 bullets and no gun to shoot them in at the moment. It's either this or get another .270wsm;
Click to expand...

What about re-barreling a .270 WSM with a faster twist rate to push those longer sectional density bullets? That might be an eye opener.

Have been thinking about loading the 150 gr ABLR in the WSM. Currently shooting the 140's at 3200 fps.
 
Sorry I haven't read all the comments. This might've been brought up already. 6.8 western was designed to shoot .277 with high weight / B.C. bullets right?? Hence the reason you can't really compare it to a .270win or a .270WSM. However, if you were to re-barrel a 270WSM with a faster twist say 1-8" wouldn't that do the same thing? If it does wouldn't the 270WSM be better due to case volume and burn efficiency? According to what I've researched it would. The 6.8 western is definitely going to be a fad.
 
DBLung said:
Sorry I haven't read all the comments. This might've been brought up already. 6.8 western was designed to shoot .277 with high weight / B.C. bullets right?? Hence the reason you can't really compare it to a .270win or a .270WSM. However, if you were to re-barrel a 270WSM with a faster twist say 1-8" wouldn't that do the same thing? If it does wouldn't the 270WSM be better due to case volume and burn efficiency? According to what I've researched it would. The 6.8 western is definitely going to be a fad.
Click to expand...
I own a number of guns for many different reasons but I buy them primarily as an investment. Is a fad gun going to increase in value or decrease as it ages in your opinion?
 
Bigfoot 1 said:
I own a number of guns for many different reasons but I buy them primarily as an investment. Is a fad gun going to increase in value or decrease as it ages in your opinion?
Click to expand...
I think this depends on how popular it was at its peak. It needs to be somewhat known if you want to sell it in 20 years for a return but not so popular that everyone’s dad has one in their safe. You probably know this better than anyone, but a higher quality gun will be better in the long term (Remington and Savage are great for those who will use their guns but they start cheap and will sell for cheap I would say)
People collect for different reasons as well (my grandpa had this gun, this was the first caliber I used, this caliber is rare and there aren’t many available, I want all the calibers that were made in the model X of such and such manufacturer, etc.) so I would say it is hard to predict what the price will do.
Supply and demand will drive the prices and if you can predict future supply/demand, you will make money in more than just guns!
 
DBLung said:
Sorry I haven't read all the comments. This might've been brought up already. 6.8 western was designed to shoot .277 with high weight / B.C. bullets right?? Hence the reason you can't really compare it to a .270win or a .270WSM. However, if you were to re-barrel a 270WSM with a faster twist say 1-8" wouldn't that do the same thing? If it does wouldn't the 270WSM be better due to case volume and burn efficiency? According to what I've researched it would. The 6.8 western is definitely going to be a fad.
Click to expand...
You are correct, I built a 1:6.5 twist 270wsm for the Berger 170’s and the Hammer 168’s
 
Bigfoot 1 said:
I own a number of guns for many different reasons but I buy them primarily as an investment. Is a fad gun going to increase in value or decrease as it ages in your opinion?
Click to expand...
IMHO, it will decrease. Most rifles with out of production calibers are usually sold for their actions to be rebuilt into something else. 300 / 7mm SAUM's for example still have ammo on the shelf, but it's a pretty good prediction of what (could / will) happen to the 6.8 western.
 
AZGuy said:
It’s all the sudden getting hard to find. Still seeing some in stores .
Click to expand...
My local gun store had a bunch of brass for reloading. Not sure if they still have it though.

For me, I'd want the cartridge to soak for a few years to see how it does with availability of brass and loaded cartridges. For me I'll stick with my 280 ai.
 
Bwht4x4 said:
My local gun store had a bunch of brass for reloading. Not sure if they still have it though.

For me, I'd want the cartridge to soak for a few years to see how it does with availability of brass and loaded cartridges. For me I'll stick with my 280 ai.
Click to expand...
Love the 280AI!
 

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