CoronaVirus Deaths Rates Slowing

Founder

Founder

Founder Since 1999
Messages
11,469
On Monday we were at 2,828. Today it’s showing 9,302 deaths, so it looks like the death double rate has increased. It was doubling every 2.5 days. Now it appears more in that 3.5 day range. That’s good news.
 
In terms of cases, the rate of increase is slowing but cases are still increasing at near peak levels. As many have said, because of testing bias the numbers don't tell the whole story. I suppose we could keep score by body count as well as any other method.
 
Founder said:
Probably not with this social distancing. Without it, can’t imagine how bad it could get. We’re paying a heavy price to stop this mess.
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Too heavy if you ask me.


But. And I'm no doctor.
It will be interesting(in a disturbing way) to see if the actual number of overall deaths is much higher.

I know one of Utah's deaths was a lady on hospice care. She died of corona, but if she was in hospice it would mean she was soon to be gone?

With some of the stats from Italy of really old folks with triple morbidity, it seems the result was assured regardless of how? Twisted subject I know.

Rush Limbaugh has stage 4 lung cancer. I would imagine if he gets it it kills him. But his cancer will most likely if not.

My dad had stage 4 lung cancer. His "official" cause of death was brain cancer. The brain cancer came from his lungs.
 
Us capitalists should stop using the body count to keep score. Lets use unemployment or other economic indicators when we talk about this pandemic. A lot more people know someone thats out of work than someone who died.
 
hossblur said:
Rush Limbaugh has stage 4 lung cancer. I would imagine if he gets it it kills him. But his cancer will most likely if not.
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Speaking of Rush, did you catch his speil on "doomsayers"? It's spot on and founders comment aligns with it.
 
No.

I usually catch some of his show(shocking for a flaming lib huh?) but I have to always be aware of whose house in working in. Let's just say when there are multiple pics of Obama in the man cave, Rush isn't on the radio.
 
I worked with a Polish gentleman (and a few Mexicans) in the saw filing room who spoke very little English. I made them listen to Rush every morning on the radio. They all became Rush fans. "Democrats no good!" the Polish guy would say. Since I retired I haven't listened to Rush except if I happen to be driving somewhere. I caught him on the radio the other day and he sounded in pretty good spirits.
 
hossblur said:
No.

I usually catch some of his show(shocking for a flaming lib huh?) but I have to always be aware of whose house in working in. Let's just say when there are multiple pics of Obama in the man cave, Rush isn't on the radio.
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lol! Never took you for a flamin lib hoss!
 
Bluehair said:
Us capitalists should stop using the body count to keep score. Lets use unemployment or other economic indicators when we talk about this pandemic. A lot more people know someone thats out of work than someone who died.
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That’s rough!
Death vs Jobless
 
I'm sure someone out there has that graph. I'm not suggesting a comparison, I'm saying instead of talking about "10,000 dead", we say "10,000,000 unemployed". But, we don't have daily unemployment numbers so that takes the fun out of it.
 
Who's going to make the call to go back to work? And when do they do it? What's the acceptable number of people to sacrifice? That should be a real political football. Trump will be blamed for killing people to benefit his rich friends.
 
10,000,000 unemployed every month will lead to 10,000 dead real quick.

Hell if the suicide rate doesn't go up, which it will, 1,400 of the ten million will kill themselves. That's pretty jacked up statistics.
 
The web site healthdata.org updated late yesterday (April 5th) Much of it changed dramatically for the better.
It has data for each state so you can look at projections for your state.
Rural states, and I will call Utah, Colorado, New Mexico and other Rocky Mountain states rural states , seemed to improve significantly.
Projected fatality for my state dropped 60% and duration of pandemic reduced by a month.
 
Gonna be hard to claim the moral high ground if this comes to fruition due to your TDS.

92354389_10222775112512088_3678971296722452480_n.jpg
 
DW said:
Gonna be hard to claim the moral high ground if this comes to fruition due to your TDS.

View attachment 4711
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NOT! I'll always feel more sorrow for someone who wanted to live and was taken by illness than someone who wanted destroy loved ones lives by selfishly taking their own life because they don't have a job to buy a bunch of crap they don't need. Time will heal unemployment, time will not heal death by virus.
I don't even know what TDS means, but don't care enough to look it up. I guess I have TDS if coincides with my opinion.
 
Tristate said:
10,000,000 unemployed every month will lead to 10,000 dead real quick.

Hell if the suicide rate doesn't go up, which it will, 1,400 of the ten million will kill themselves. That's pretty jacked up statistics.
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Pretty soon most all those people will be back to work but those 10,000+ will still be dead.
 
DW said:
lol! Never took you for a flamin lib hoss!
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I always figure if people ain't sure which side I was on, I was doing good.

It's pretty easy for me to tell guys who are blue collar or military. We talk to each other differently(I say more honestly).

I never took offense in the first place?
 
oilcan said:
Pretty soon most all those people will be back to work but those 10,000+ will still be dead.
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True, but how many of those 10000+ would have died with or without the virus? We don't know those numbers, and we will never know them. A lot of these people are dying from underlying issues, not the virus itself.
 
Founder said:
NOT! I'll always feel more sorrow for someone who wanted to live and was taken by illness than someone who wanted destroy loved ones lives by selfishly taking their own life because they don't have a job to buy a bunch of crap they don't need. Time will heal unemployment, time will not heal death by virus.
I don't even know what TDS means, but don't care enough to look it up. I guess I have TDS if coincides with my opinion.
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Folks who jumped out windows in 87', or in 09 might disagree that there isn't death via economy.

I'm betting heart attack deaths might as well.

That's without the domestic violence, substance abuse, suicide via cop, disease from " non essential surgery" shut down.

The time passed 2 months ago as to whether this IS SERIOUS.

The question is HOW serious.

10million unemployed folks. Millions more will join weekly.

We trade possible deaths daily.


University of Washington, used white house model. They say 126 deaths in Utah by August.

126. A freaking tragedy for the families.

But 126 people and for that we crash Utah's economy? Come on man.
 
Guys, I was only showing one tiny little way a bad economy effects the rate of mortality on a populace. In a depression the mortality rate jumps for every demographic for a multitude of reasons. Stroke, heart attack, homicide, accidental, medical malpractice, other viruses, etc.. An economic depression will kill far more people than this virus.

I have to say Founder your idea of someone killing them self as just a selfish choice and unimportant in deciding a course of action with this virus is disheartening. While they may not be your family they are your neighbors, and co-workers, and clients, and people who children valued and looked up to. They paid bills. Supported businesses, and families. They had a value, in life, much greater than they or apparently you recognize.
 
Tristate said:
While they may not be your family they are your neighbors, and co-workers, and clients, and people who children valued and looked up to. They paid bills. Supported businesses, and families. They had a value, in life, much greater than they or apparently you recognize.
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These are responsibilities. It is selfish to leave them to someone else.
 
Tristate said:
Selfish or not that doesn't mean you ignore their value.
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No one is ignoring their value, but I am saying that I have more sympathy for someone who dies of CoronaVirus than someone who decides to kill them self over a job loss and leaves their family and loved ones the baggage of the suicide and the problems that the one who kills them self is running from. Suicide is very selfish, especially if it's because of temporary unemployment.
Therefore I don't think that our focus should be on unemployment rates while ignoring CoronaVirus death.
Obviously keeping the economy running is important, but if it takes some slowdown and unemployment to save many thousands of lives, then I think it is worth it. I wouldn't trade the life of my loved ones for the many, many thousands that I've lost in my stock portfolio.
 
[QUOTE="hossblur, post: 1835609, member: 2503"


University of Washington, used white house model. They say 126 deaths in Utah by August.

126. A freaking tragedy for the families.

But 126 people and for that we crash Utah's economy? Come on man.
[/QUOTE]


126 is the number estimated to die now that we have been taking extreme measures to stop the spread. You have to ask how high would that number have gone if we hadn't done anything that hurt the economy? Maybe 10 times that number, maybe 1,000 times that? You need to look at the number of lives saved that would have been lost on and above the 126 and ask if that number of lives was worth crashing the economy. We'll never know what that number would have been so hard to say.
 
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Bluehair, I ain't confusing jack squat with murder but since you bring that up murder rates will go way up with unemployment rates. Quit being melodramatic. I am not defending suicide. I'm just telling you how it is and for some reason the truth bothers you.



"Therefore I don't think that our focus should be on unemployment rates while ignoring CoronaVirus death. "

You should be. That's just the next virus you are choosing to ignore.

"Obviously keeping the economy running is important, but if it takes some slowdown and unemployment to save many thousands of lives, then I think it is worth it. "

A "slowdown". Founder, THE FED came out and predicted %30 unemployment from this. That's the Fed. Not CNN. Not Fox news. The Fed. Do you realize the height of the great depression was %24 unemployment. Do you realize the average age of mortality was around 61. That's 20 years less than it is now. THAT'S BECAUSE A BUTTLOAD OF PEOPLE WERE DYING THEN. Lets just say with the advancements in modern medicine the average age of mortality drops five years to 76. YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT MILLIONS OF PEOPLE THE ECONOMY YOU PICKED KILLED.

" I wouldn't trade the life of my loved ones for the many, many thousands that I've lost in my stock portfolio. "

Nobody wants that. Here is the ugly ugly reality though. How many of your loved ones are you willing to trade right now in this generation to stop the deaths of many times more in many more consecutive generations.


Let me ask you this. If the Chinese invaded the west coast would you sit around and say, "Hey my stock portfolio isn't as important as mine and others lives. Plus communism is just a different political format than a capitalist Republic. Either way liberty and a stable economy isn't worth my life or people I care about. Let's give this Chinese empire a try." Put a figure on it. How many lives are worth the country you know and love?

Have you ever talked to people that survived the great depression? Even crazier have you talked people from other countries that survived the great depression. I know a German who came from a family of 7 boys. By the end of WW II only 2 were alive and none of them were killed in battle. You want to know what your family pet tastes like? You want to make decisions that risk puting yourself in prison or dead just so your kid can have a little food? You ever thought about what it would take to leave your family in Utah and sneak into Canada to work a crappy job that you could send the money back home? You ever lived in a world where you can't provide any kind of health care for your children or grandchildren? Now they have to worry about all kinds of diseases besides Corona virus that they never had to worry about before because you can't insure them. You think the government is going to fix that? This is the reality of %30 unemployment.

10 million people lost there jobs in the last couple of weeks. What do you think May 1st will look like? I got news Founder it's going to get worse. A lot worse. Where do those people get food, pay the bills, etc.? You think unemployment checks can cover %30 unemployment???? Get real. That's begging from a broke system. Where do you think the government is going to make up the deficits in their promises???? They are going to steal it from you. They are going to print money which devalues everything you and all those people you care about poorer. It's a sad downward spiral. As much as you can't admit it we are all connected in this. Even the selfish people that kill themselves, their kids that they leave behind, the retiree who survived the plague but is broke now at the age of 70, the high school dropouts, the dumb taxidermists in Texas, the cancer victims who have to beg the government for healthcare treatment, and the faithful who lay their worries on the Lord.
 
The last thing I want you to know is what most depressions lead to.

War. Disgusting bloody war. Not some war where we go hit some third world country living in the stone age and end up with a few thousand dead troops. I'm talking about disgusting bloody massacre wars where entire cities full of women and kids get burned to the ground. The kind of war you pray to all things holy no boy you know will ever have to witness.
 
Founder said:
No one is ignoring their value, but I am saying that I have more sympathy for someone who dies of CoronaVirus than someone who decides to kill them self over a job loss and leaves their family and loved ones the baggage of the suicide and the problems that the one who kills them self is running from. Suicide is very selfish, especially if it's because of temporary unemployment.
Therefore I don't think that our focus should be on unemployment rates while ignoring CoronaVirus death.
Obviously keeping the economy running is important, but if it takes some slowdown and unemployment to save many thousands of lives, then I think it is worth it. I wouldn't trade the life of my loved ones for the many, many thousands that I've lost in my stock portfolio.
Click to expand...


Founder. All we've been doing for a month plus is focusing on corona virus deaths.

25% of the American economy was vaporized for corona deaths.

We literally destroyed people's livelihoods, their kids futures, everything based on models, that are wildly inaccurate.

You sit at your house. Right now there are 500+ dudes in Smiths warehouse busting azz, risking getting sick, taking it home. Yet folks like yourself sit home and preach "a life isn't worth money".

If that's true, post your account # and pin #. If you TRULY believe money isnt worth a life, then YOU should empty YOUR accounts. Give the money to a trucker. Walk out, shut off YOUR water , electricity, GAS.

Because YOU have decided, money isn't worth a life.

Yet you won't do any of that. So a life, or death is figured into YOUR daily life.

Is a Questar guys life worth less than yours?


This argument you keep throwing out is beyond childish.

YOUR WIFE WORE AN N95 mask. You do realize PEOPLE MAKE THOSE right?

Is your wife's life worth more than the dude in the factory?

This "you can't work if your dead" argument always leaves out the most important part.

You can't work if there is no industry.

Which, you know. I saw your plea to support your sponsors.

Brother. If you want to bubble wrap yourself into your house and sit tight for 18 months until a vaccine, THATS YOUR DECISION. Your a grown man. Do as you see best.
 
Zwickey said:
[QUOTE="hossblur, post: 1835609, member: 2503"


University of Washington, used white house model. They say 126 deaths in Utah by August.

126. A freaking tragedy for the families.

But 126 people and for that we crash Utah's economy? Come on man.
Click to expand...

I doubt the trucker killed on 89 gives to chits about corona virus. Should we shut down trucking? I mean a life is worth more than money, right?


126 is the number estimated to die now that we have been taking extreme measures to stop the spread. You have to ask how high would that number have gone if we hadn't done anything that hurt the economy? Maybe 10 times that number, maybe 1,000 times that? You need to look at the number of lives saved that would have been lost on and above the 126 and ask if that number of lives was worth crashing the economy. We'll never know what that number would have been so hard to say.
[/QUOTE]
 
hossblur said:
I doubt the trucker killed on 89 gives to chits about corona virus. Should we shut down trucking? I mean a life is worth more than money, right?


126 is the number estimated to die now that we have been taking extreme measures to stop the spread. You have to ask how high would that number have gone if we hadn't done anything that hurt the economy? Maybe 10 times that number, maybe 1,000 times that? You need to look at the number of lives saved that would have been lost on and above the 126 and ask if that number of lives was worth crashing the economy. We'll never know what that number would have been so hard to say.
Click to expand...
[/QUOTE]


We do know the number, 10 million,of people laid off.

We do know the damage that is causing.

There is ZERO doubt what that is doing.
 


We do know the number, 10 million,of people laid off.

We do know the damage that is causing.

There is ZERO doubt what that is doing.
[/QUOTE]
I guess I agree with everything you just said but none of it has anything to do with the point I was making.
 
Hey Eel?

Did I Miss the 'STOP WORK IMMEDIATELY ORDER'?:D:D:D

eelgrass said:
Who's going to make the call to go back to work? And when do they do it? What's the acceptable number of people to sacrifice? That should be a real political football. Trump will be blamed for killing people to benefit his rich friends.
Click to expand...
 
Zwickey said:
We do know the number, 10 million,of people laid off.

We do know the damage that is causing.

There is ZERO doubt what that is doing.
Click to expand...
I guess I agree with everything you just said but none of it has anything to do with the point I was making.
[/QUOTE]


Sure it does.

Your point was a straw man.. If we hadn't done......

You can't disprove that.

That ship sailed.

We know what we know. This thing sucks. People will die. I dont want to die, dont want you to either. Everyone should live to be 90, and fade out poking the wife.

But that doesn't happen.

We send kids to die to keep oil flowing. We send dudes to die to eat crab. We kill construction dudes building stuff. We send cops to die.

I get calls all the time from folks with popcorn ceiling. Some of that crap is loaded with asbestos. I won't play with asbestos. But asbestos removal guys will.
I choose to not get paid to deal with a killer.

If Founder wants to hide it out, great. But don't be a hypocrite. Dont have gas, water, groceries, electric, then pretend a life isn't worth money.

It's silly. I don't support eradication of all guns, even though doing so would end gun deaths.

No one supports endi g vehicles to stop car deaths.

Everyone jumped on bored. We shut down.

But now we need to have a tough talk. And the silly, irrational, "money isn't worth a life" folks, need to be 100% discounted.

The real question is how many life's vs how much destruction?

Insurance companies do it daily
 
Jeezuz Hoss. We get it. You're pissed about the economy. You're pissed because a lot of people have lost their jobs. You're pissed cuz you don't think it will be worth it in the end. It might and it might not. Somebody had to make some decisions. Apparently those decisions weren't made on an internet hunting forum.
Screenshot_20200406-171550_Chrome.jpg
 
Hossblur said

"Sure it does.

Your point was a straw man.. If we hadn't done......

You can't disprove that.

That ship sailed.

We know what we know. This thing sucks. People will die. I dont want to die, dont want you to either. Everyone should live to be 90, and fade out poking the wife.

But that doesn't happen.

We send kids to die to keep oil flowing. We send dudes to die to eat crab. We kill construction dudes building stuff. We send cops to die.

I get calls all the time from folks with popcorn ceiling. Some of that crap is loaded with asbestos. I won't play with asbestos. But asbestos removal guys will.
I choose to not get paid to deal with a killer.

If Founder wants to hide it out, great. But don't be a hypocrite. Dont have gas, water, groceries, electric, then pretend a life isn't worth money.

It's silly. I don't support eradication of all guns, even though doing so would end gun deaths.

No one supports endi g vehicles to stop car deaths.

Everyone jumped on bored. We shut down.

But now we need to have a tough talk. And the silly, irrational, "money isn't worth a life" folks, need to be 100% discounted.

The real question is how many life's vs how much destruction?

Insurance companies do it daily"
[/QUOTE]

Dont disagree with most of that either
 
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The only thing more dangerous and deadly to the world human population than a virus is climate change. Just ask a scientist. The scientists we bow down to. Are we going down that road next? Or does government have an obligation to save us? By force if needed if it's for our own good?

Or do you think this shelter in place and mandatory shut down is a one time thing?
 
Founder said:
I’m no expert, so on this one I’ll trust the experts who have use locked down.
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www.realclearpolitics.com

Tucker Carlson: Dr. Fauci Is Suggesting "National Suicide"

TUCKER CARLSON, FOX NEWS: The emergence of a new and dangerous form of coronavirus became known to the public outside China about three months ago. The first case in this country appeared on January 21. Since the middle of March, much of America has been locked down in response. We're three...
www.realclearpolitics.com www.realclearpolitics.com


Problem is we are listening to only one type of expert.

Social policy isn't that simple

www.washingtonexaminer.com

Stephen Moore warns of modern-day ‘Great Depression’ if economy doesn’t reopen soon - Washington Examiner

Economist Stephen Moore predicted the country could be headed for a Great Depression if U.S. citizens recently unemployed due to the coronavirus are not sent back to work soon. “If we go much past May 1, we are facing a potential Great Depression scenario,” Moore said during a radio interview...
www.washingtonexaminer.com www.washingtonexaminer.com
 
NVBighorn said:
Jeezuz Hoss. We get it. You're pissed about the economy. You're pissed because a lot of people have lost their jobs. You're pissed cuz you don't think it will be worth it in the end. It might and it might not. Somebody had to make some decisions. Apparently those decisions weren't made on an internet hunting forum.
View attachment 4720
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Problem is, those decisions were based on a model that it's now clear were wildly inaccurate. In some cases 75% inaccurate.

But now the discussion isn't, "hey we need to adjust"because daring to mention that means your using old folks as cannon fodder. Or blood for stocks. Every life matters.

Of course the economy matters. It feeds me, houses me, waters me.

We are at a point where Founder can use a slogan, rather than honestly have to look at the fact that his existence is dependent on a risk assesment calculation.

It's also quite ironic that he bashes Trump non stop, then says he will "trust the experts who shut it down".

Trump in this case shut it down. Does he now trust Trump?

If not, why trust him on this?
 
eelgrass said:
The only thing more dangerous and deadly to the world human population than a virus is climate change. Just ask a scientist. The scientists we bow down to. Are we going down that road next? Or does government have an obligation to save us? By force if needed if it's for our own good?

Or do you think this shelter in place and mandatory shut down is a one time thing?
Click to expand...


When the economy collapses you are dependent on the government to survive. Kind if the opposite of capitalism. Or conservatism.

Seems one of the political parties favors that.
 

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