Elk Tag numbers

[ELKOHOLIC]

What did they decide this year for Elk tag percentages for the different hunts? How much did it change from last year? If I recall they were going to shift how they allocate the tags. Thanks for the help

 

[elkhunterUT]

25% archery

60% any weapon (10% early, 30% mid, 17% late, 3% multi-season)

15% muzzy

 

[elkhunterUT]

Allocations across weapon types stayed the same (25/60/15). What changed was the spread of the 60% of the any weapon tags across the various rifle hunts. Only 10% now for early rifle hunts-that is a big change

 

[ELKOHOLIC]

What was early rifle last year?

 

[elkhunterUT]

What was early rifle last year?

It varied in previous years depending on the unit. Not all LE elk units had mid-season or late hunts in previous years, so in that case a large majority of the 60% allocation went to the early rifle hunt, Those units that did have mid-season or late hunts were at smaller allocations than what is specified in the new plan now

All LE elk units will now have mid-season and late hunts and the bulk of the 60% allocation for rifle tags will go to those 2 hunts. The overall # of early rifle tags will be reduced considerably.

 

[Iddogguy]

So my question is will there be more elk tags overall. Will the archery & multi season & muzzy stay close to prior years? You’d think shifting tags out of the highest harvest hunts would let more tags become available with close to the same amount of harvest.

 

[matt23]

So my question is will there be more elk tags overall. Will the archery & multi season & muzzy stay close to prior years? You’d think shifting tags out of the highest harvest hunts would let more tags become available with close to the same amount of harvest.

I heard on a pod cast this year will stay about the same on tag numbers besides the late archery hunt will have extra tags added. I think I heard around 5 per unit for the December hunt. But it will increase in future years. Don't crucify me if I'm wrong though.

 

[Deerlove]

I thought they planned on issuing more tags across they the board because they wanted to bring the age class down? That was before the record breaking winter.

 

[elkhunterUT]

Yes-With the reduction in age objective I think we should see some tag increases, except for early rifle hunts. Those will have some significant reductions across most units with only 10% allocation.

 

[Wbrim]

I thought they planned on issuing more tags across they the board because they wanted to bring the age class down? That was before the record breaking winter.

That was my understanding. It was intended to be somewhat of a gradual change over the next couple years, to try and gauge the adjustment. I expected a notable jump in tags this year, to get things changing. Then again, like you mentioned, winter may be a big factor this year…

 

[Airborne]

Here are the harvest stats from last year below. As you can see not a big difference between early and late with mid season being maybe 15% behind. Moving tags out of the rut isn’t going to change the overall harvest too much. Maybe issue a few more tags but it’s not going to solve point creep. I think this surprises a lot of people.

Now lowering age objectives will help with point creep since that would enable more tags to be issued. It would also help herd health since a 1 to 1 bull to cow ratio is a disaster waiting to happen, more bull tags need to be issued on some of our units.


Archery: 43.0%
Muzzleloader: 74.4%
Early Rifle: 81.9%
Late Rifle: 79.9%
Multi Season: 84.6%
Mid season: 66.8%

 

[Iddogguy]

Here are the harvest stats from last year below. As you can see not a big difference between early and late with mid season being maybe 15% behind. Moving tags out of the rut isn’t going to change the overall harvest too much. Maybe issue a few more tags but it’s not going to solve point creep. I think this surprises a lot of people.

Now lowering age objectives will help with point creep since that would enable more tags to be issued. It would also help herd health since a 1 to 1 bull to cow ratio is a disaster waiting to happen, more bull tags need to be issued on some of our units.


Archery: 43.0%
Muzzleloader: 74.4%
Early Rifle: 81.9%
Late Rifle: 79.9%
Multi Season: 84.6%
Mid season: 66.8%

I agree with your assessment. I think the mid-season & late season may have slightly lower harvest, but I’d bet the age class of bulls harvested is a lot lower than the early rifle hunts. Looks like about half the new hunts are late archery. I can’t imagine a high success rate, or many bulls killed that are over 4 years old. I guess we’ll know these answers next year.

 

[JakeH]

So my question is will there be more elk tags overall. Will the archery & multi season & muzzy stay close to prior years? You’d think shifting tags out of the highest harvest hunts would let more tags become available with close to the same amount of harvest.

With the reduced age objectives they will increase the overall number of tags for almost every unit, I think they plan on moving into this rather gradually for the next few years. I would nor expect a big jump, but a noticeable bump for sure.

 

[deadibob]

Should be
40% archery
20% rifle
40% muzzy

 

[SDBugler]

Lots of changes this year with the rifle allocations, season dates and the age objectives. I have a couple questions:

1.) When do they finalize how many tags are gong to be available?

2.) Question for the locals - will there be any rut activity/bugling during the mid-season rifle hunt?

Most of my elk hunts have been archery hunts in September. However, I have called in and shot three rifle bulls in NM on 10/12, 10/15, and the bull in my signature pic on 10/16. Just wondering if the bulls will still be talking on the mid-season rifle hunts in UT. Granted they will have been pressured for over a month straight and will have the general hunters in the field at the same time (whereas in NM they at least get a short break between seasons to settle down)

I usually apply for archery or ML tags tags in UT but I already have an AZ archery tag and so my September is already booked. Was looking at possibly throwing my name in the hat for a mid-season rifle tag but don't want to waste 18 points if they are not talking.

 

[elkhunterUT]

Lots of changes this year with the rifle allocations, season dates and the age objectives. I have a couple questions:

1.) When do they finalize how many tags are gong to be available?

2.) Question for the locals - will there be any rut activity/bugling during the mid-season rifle hunt?

Most of my elk hunts have been archery hunts in September. However, I have called in and shot three rifle bulls in NM on 10/12, 10/15, and the bull in my signature pic on 10/16. Just wondering if the bulls will still be talking on the mid-season rifle hunts in UT. Granted they will have been pressured for over a month straight and will have the general hunters in the field at the same time (whereas in NM they at least get a short break between seasons to settle down)

I usually apply for archery or ML tags tags in UT but I already have an AZ archery tag and so my September is already booked. Was looking at possibly throwing my name in the hat for a mid-season rifle tag but don't want to waste 18 points if they are not talking.

Tag #'s won't be fully finalized and approved until the May 4th Wildlife Board meeting, but recommended tag #'s should come out as early as next week and will be reviewed/discussed in WB working meeting and RAC meetings through mid-April. Obviously the app period ends on 4/27 before the final approvals, but should know pretty well where things will go after the RAC meetings.

There will most definitely still be some rutting activity during the mid-season rifle hunt. Could be a really good hunt and could see some good draw odds this year on that hunt as people start to realize the change in allocations across the rifle hunts. The one big downside to that mid-rifle hunt is the competition with other hunters chasing spikes, etc.

 

[SDBugler]

Tag #'s won't be fully finalized and approved until the May 4th Wildlife Board meeting, but recommended tag #'s should come out as early as next week and will be reviewed/discussed in WB working meeting and RAC meetings through mid-April. Obviously the app period ends on 4/27 before the final approvals, but should know pretty well where things will go after the RAC meetings.

There will most definitely still be some rutting activity during the mid-season rifle hunt. Could be a really good hunt and could see some good draw odds this year on that hunt as people start to realize the change in allocations across the rifle hunts. The one big downside to that mid-rifle hunt is the competition with other hunters chasing spikes, etc.

Thanks for the info!!!!!

 

[Airborne]

I'm sitting on 17 elk points (resident) and I'm cashing out this year. Decisions...decisions

I'll probably go archery on one of the high end units but man these new mid seasons have me thinking. They are risky in that you have a lot of competition on the mountain but you will have a lot of upside potential on some of the better units. The question is how many points is it gonna take to pull a primo unit mid season elk tag?

 

[ELKOHOLIC]

The mid season hunt is generally the toughest hunt of all. Your not going to here much bugling.

 

[treedagain]

The mid season hunt is generally the toughest hunt of all. Your not going to here much bugling.

Depends on the unit

 

[elkhunterUT]

Depends on the unit

yep, nearly all of the units I know well should still have some rutting activity going on, especially during the early part of the Oct 7 - Oct 19 mid-rifle hunt. They may not be bugling their guts out like end of September, but there will be some rutting activity/bugling still in most units.

 

[SDBugler]

Tag #'s won't be fully finalized and approved until the May 4th Wildlife Board meeting, but recommended tag #'s should come out as early as next week and will be reviewed/discussed in WB working meeting and RAC meetings through mid-April. Obviously the app period ends on 4/27 before the final approvals, but should know pretty well where things will go after the RAC meetings.

There will most definitely still be some rutting activity during the mid-season rifle hunt. Could be a really good hunt and could see some good draw odds this year on that hunt as people start to realize the change in allocations across the rifle hunts. The one big downside to that mid-rifle hunt is the competition with other hunters chasing spikes, etc.

One more question. So if tag numbers have not been finalized yet, then how can they post if a tag is available to NR's yet?

 

[Airborne]

I'll take a stab at this question

10% of tags go to Nonresidents. If a unit has historically issued very few overall tags then the DWR knows that they are not going to hit that threshold of 10 or so tags wherein one of those tags would go to a nonresident.

Basically it's a projection off of historical tag numbers and counts. A unit is not going to double or triple the amount of animals on it when it's counted from one year to the next so they have some idea on what they are going to do regarding tag numbers going into the draws before the counts happen.

That's the best explanation I have for it, maybe I'm wrong

 

[matt23]

One more question. So if tag numbers have not been finalized yet, then how can they post if a tag is available to NR's yet?

View attachment 106667

Some units don't offer a non resident tag. Only residents can apply. So if it's only in blue it's a residents only tag I believe.

 

[SDBugler]

Some units don't offer a non resident tag. Only residents can apply. So if it's only in blue it's a residents only tag I believe.

Yes I know that. That is exactly what it says in the booklet. I understand the percentage splits between res/non-res. I also understand the percentage splits between different seasons. However, if they haven't officially proposed and officially approved tag numbers, then how do they know if there are enough tags available to provide a non-resident tag?

With the new splits 30% of tags go to mid-season rifle, 25% to archery, 17% late rifle, 15% muzzy, 10% early rifle, and 3% late. It is a pretty fine line between 30 - 25%. For example, how do they know there is enough tags available for a Book Cliff LCR mid season rifle but not for an archery tag if they haven't finalized numbers yet? Do they also assume tag numbers will not decrease from the previous year when posting the booklet?

 

[elkassassin]

Them DREADED SmokePoles Though Bob!

''Should be
40% archery
20% rifle
40% muzzy

 

[Vanilla]

Yes I know that. That is exactly what it says in the booklet. I understand the percentage splits between res/non-res. I also understand the percentage splits between different seasons. However, if they haven't officially proposed and officially approved tag numbers, then how do they know if there are enough tags available to provide a non-resident tag?

With the new splits 30% of tags go to mid-season rifle, 25% to archery, 17% late rifle, 15% muzzy, 10% early rifle, and 3% late. It is a pretty fine line between 30 - 25%. For example, how do they know there is enough tags available for a Book Cliff LCR mid season rifle but not for an archery tag if they haven't finalized numbers yet? Do they also assume tag numbers will not decrease from the previous year when posting the booklet?

Read Airborne’s post again. He gave a great answer.

 

[Iddogguy]

I called one of the Region Offices today. I was told they will have the recommended tags quotas posted online or they'll be available in the offices by April 6. Curious what nonresidents hunts will have bonus permits.

 

[deadibob]

I'll take a stab at this question

10% of tags go to Nonresidents. If a unit has historically issued very few overall tags then the DWR knows that they are not going to hit that threshold of 10 or so tags wherein one of those tags would go to a nonresident.

Basically it's a projection off of historical tag numbers and counts. A unit is not going to double or triple the amount of animals on it when it's counted from one year to the next so they have some idea on what they are going to do regarding tag numbers going into the draws before the counts happen.

That's the best explanation I have for it, maybe I'm wrong

A unit won’t double or triple animal numbers on a unit from one year too the next but the DWR count can double or drop in half from one year to the next.?

 

[deadibob]

Them DREADED SmokePoles Though Bob!

I hear you. Here is my opinion on hunting technology because I guarantee you that the DWR is gonna half ass it like everything else so they can say look we did something about this issue, problem solved.

If we are making changes to lower success rates so that we can increase tag numbers then we need big changes.
ARCHERY: TRADITIONAL ONLY. ie. LONG BOWS OR RECURVES ONLY. It would be too hard to draw a distinctive line on compound bows.

MUZZLELOADER: TRADITIONAL SIDELOCK (percussion caps only) or FLINTLOCK RIFLES ONLY!

RIFLE: (tricky) either have optics restrictions like no larger than 6x or 9x scopes or something similar to this. We could also have dated technology type restrictions like no tech that was available before 1970 or 1980. pick a date (pre-64? that would cut out modern equipment completely ).

Serious restrictions like these are what it is going to take to make any meaningful impact.

 

[Vanilla]

Good thing I've got a pre-64 Model 70! Bring on the rifle hunt, baby!

 

[30Hart]

With this winterkill less elk and deer tags all around.

 

[Airborne]

I think it would be really interesting if the DWR tried out @deadibob weapon restrictions on just one general deer unit over a three year period and compared the harvest rates to the past and other surrounding units. It would give an idea if these things do lessen harvest rates and how much of an effect it would be. You could also measure the demand for this type of hunt. I don't think it would piss off too many folks to try it out for a bit--do it on some ho-hum unit like the La Sals and see what happens.

 

[elkassassin]

Ya!

I Can't Imagine What Good Your Favorite Camo Is Gonna Do You Packin that Pre-64 with No Optics On It!

Good thing I've got a pre-64 Model 70! Bring on the rifle hunt, baby!

 

[elkassassin]

Piss On The LaSals!

Let's Try It On The Henries!

I think it would be really interesting if the DWR tried out @deadibob weapon restrictions on just one general deer unit over a three year period and compared the harvest rates to the past and other surrounding units. It would give an idea if these things do lessen harvest rates and how much of an effect it would be. You could also measure the demand for this type of hunt. I don't think it would piss off too many folks to try it out for a bit--do it on some ho-hum unit like the La Sals and see what happens.

 

[deadibob]

Good thing I've got a pre-64 Model 70! Bring on the rifle hunt, baby!

Ya!

I Can't Imagine What Good Your Favorite Camo Is Gonna Do You Packin that Pre-64 with No Optics On It!

Yep pre-64, THE RIFLEMAN'S RIFLE!

BESS I honestly think in a lot of places that Camouflage is actually ANTI-Camo. In my limited experience animals seem much calmer when I'm dressed in regular duds than when I am in camo. I think over the years animals have come to know the dangers associated with camo.

 

[deadibob]

I think it would be really interesting if the DWR tried out @deadibob weapon restrictions on just one general deer unit over a three year period and compared the harvest rates to the past and other surrounding units. It would give an idea if these things do lessen harvest rates and how much of an effect it would be. You could also measure the demand for this type of hunt. I don't think it would piss off too many folks to try it out for a bit--do it on some ho-hum unit like the La Sals and see what happens.

That would be good to do a side by side comparison. I don't see how it wouldn't drastically reduce success rates at least with the archery and muzzleloader hunts. I also think draw odds will improve because it takes more time and dedication to master that weaponry.
I think these weapon changes will weed out a lot of the lukewarm "I put in for the hunts because I'm a guy and that's what my buddies do" type of hunters. Personally I would like to see those non-committed types out of the game completely. As a general rule a lot of these guys are the ones bending the laws because they don't have as deep a commitment to sportsmanship or the respect for wildlife as those who put hunting over all other activities. A lot of guys get a tag just so they can get out and drink for the weekend.