Looking for some advice

[UtahMountainMan]

I am a utah bowhunter and Utah is really screwing up their deer management. I am going to start coming to New Mexico with my 2 sons to hunt. I dont know if we will have the money to do it next year, but could someone please help me on a few questions...

1 - Can we (my sons and I) apply as a group?
2 - Can we apply to just buy a preference point for deer or elk? In case we dont have the money for the tag and travel
3 - When is the soonest we can apply/buy a point and what is the deadline?

If anyone has any advice, helpful info, or can point me in the right direction to start studying and help me out I would appreciate it. We have never been out there and I dont really know where to start looking.

Anyway, PM me if you are kind enough to help me find an area to start looking at. I can exchange a LOT of deer/elk knowledge for bow and rifle hunters wanting to come to utah or if you have points for utah.

Thanks guys

 

[Brushhawg]

1. Yes you can apply as a group. The easiest way is for one person to apply for the hunt codes you all want and then for the other hunters to attach their application to yours. You will get an application reference number after you apply that your sons can use to attach their application to.

2. There are no preference points in NM. It is a true lottery system. Every year you will have the same chance as every other NR to draw regardless of what you drew the year prior. Applying as a group may hurt your odds to draw depending on the number of tags available for non-res. Realize that NR(without a guide) are allocated 10% of the total hunt tags for a given hunt code. That means if there are only 30 tags for a hunt code only 3 would be given to NR without guide max.

3. The application for bear and oryx is early Jan. The application for Elk, Deer, Antelope and Bighorn Sheep is typically early April. Reference the NMDGF website for exact info. Everything can be done online which is fairly straightforward and simple. Tag fees must be paid upfront before the draw and then are refunded if you don't draw. The soonest you can apply is typically late jan to early feb.


Hope this helps.

 

[nmtaxi]

If you think Utah deer hunting sucks, wait until you try NM . You can see what 30 years of mis-management looks like.

 

[muleybeast]

For the Utah hunters. We here in New Mexico welcome your tag fees, gas fees, hotels, etc. We have a great state and the deer hunting is pretty darn good. I think nmtaxi is a little disgruntled, maybe had a bad year who knows. The hunting in our state is fairly good. The January bow hunts are awesome, great weather, lots of bucks, if you can find the does, and a lot of cool rut activity. Best bet is to get out and off the roads. We find tons of deer, but off the beaten track. If you like cruising on a 4 wheeler, you'll see very little. Best units for bow, 2b, 34, and my favorite, unit 17. Best of luck...

 

[nmtaxi]

I welcome all out of staters. Just saying, if I was willing to spend the money on an out-of-state hunt, by all means come to NM for elk, oryx, ibex, antelope - whatever. But, unless you drew a really good unit - like the ones you rattled off - I would spend my muley money in CO or WY.
But - thank you for clarifying what kind of hunter I am - disgruntled, wheeler rider.

 

[Ropinfool]

we're closed.....try colorado.

 

[RabidRattleSnake1]

I think (most) everyone will welcome you to NM, but leaving UT deer for NM deer is a bad move. Come to NM for the other critters, but skip the deer. Like the earlier post you are better off in a different state. During the general rifle hunt you will see more deer in one day in UT than an entire week in NM.

 

[NMPaul]

CO is a much better bet for deer than NM. First it is closer to you, second there are much better herds, third you have a way to build points or just draw a unit.

NM, will put a tag in your hand (way to many tags for most units), but, do not expect to see many deer.

When people talk about unit 34 being a good unit for deer I think they are talking about the deer you see during Archer/rut.

You would not believe the number of people that run into me or call me here that have hunted several days during rifle and do not even see a deer on public land.
For someone to come to UT down here to hunt deer I think they would be very disappointed.
There are deer, but, be prepared to get in deep to find them with any consistency.

 

[sportsman01]

I agree with what the others are saying. Our deer herd here is ok but not great in the majority of the state. The closer you are to CO (2B)the better your chances. Also, as far as quality, unless you're hunting unit 2 (B or C) or Unit 5, your chances of seeing a GIANT are slim. For any doubters, just check the New Mexico Game and Fish Website and look at the county's were pope and young as well as Boone and Crockett deer come from in this state. The majority are from Rio Arriba. 34 has some deer, but even on the archery hunt you're still competing with 800 other people so good luck. Plus the horns are small and squatty and generally the deer body sizes are small. (This is all my own personal experience in this unit. A true expert of 34 would be NMPaul and he could definitely give you a more accurate account of 34) If you want great opportunities at other big game...by all means. I just wouldn't hold my breath on the deer herd. And while we're on the subject, good luck with Antelope as well. Unless you're going to private land...you have about an equal chance of winning the lottery as you do drawing one of those tags. This is a great state for hunting and most of us would welcome you as long as you follow our game laws...which i'm sure you would. So with that being said, good luck on your choices and the draw and if you are successful, let us all know.

Good luck and Good Hunting!

 

[Iowan]

Take this advice for what it is worth - I have hunted in New Mexico three times and other than mule deer along a road one time, I have only seen one. I was elk hunting on these trips. From what I have experienced the above advice it all pretty accurate and not locals just tryig to scare you off.

 

[WapitiBob]

I've seen more deer up here in my yard than I have in 34.

 

[mozey]

It's been twenty years, but I use to live in Utah. The deer there are generally much bigger both in body and rack. Ten years ago, when I first moved to NM, I tried to hunt deer as if I were in UT, and saw almost nothing--I was hunting way too high. It wasn't until I moved down to the foothills and in to the sage flats that I started seeing deer--mostly of the desert strain. A couple years ago I even found a set of sheds (from a unit not yet mentioned above) that on the hoof would have probably landed the owner in B&C:

So they're here, but it really does take a lot of time to learn how to hunt them, and rifle hunts are limited to five days. I'm the biggest DIYer that ever lived (mostly 'cause I'm cheap), but if your heart is still set on NM, and unless you have oodles of vacation to scout and learn a particular unit, I'd recommend shoppoing for an outfitter.

 

[NMPaul]

Mozey, good advice. That picture is an awesome deer. They are few and far between.

NM could be a great deer state, but, we would first need to cut the tags in half in most units, Crack down on poachers (take their trucks, guns, quads anything that had to do with the crime, 10K fine minimum, jail time or community service time, take their hunting privileges depending on the severity of the situation) and predator control, finally some control over the private land tags issued.

 

[greatwestern]

Paul, the provisions you list to thoroughly prosecute poaching cases(seizure of assets used in a wildlife violation, expensive civil penalty assessments applied to the illegal take of 'trophy' class animals, revocation of hunting priveleges in ALL states who are members of the Wildlife Violator Compact)have been in place for a couple of years....I worked very diligently to get them established. This is in addition to the standard criminal assessment and/or possible incarceration/community service

The inference in your post suggests that law enforcement in new mexico is tolerant of wildlife crime....they are not! Understaffed and under budgeted, sure

As a fourth generation new mexican, it is my observation that there remains a very pronounced anti-authority tendency in MANY regions of the state...the PEOPLE are those who are tolerant of wildlife crimes. Their relatives and friends are the perpetrators, and no one is going to 'be the rat' that gets his shady buddy nailed....THAT is the problem, even though this sort of passive complicity is highly self defeating, in that those who practice it are themselves victimized by such audacious theft of our public resources

I apologize for the lecture, but I hope that its clear enough for everyone...there's NOTHING to be gained in keeping quiet about a known wanton game crime. Take these jackoffs down at ANY opportunity

UtahMountainMan...a couple on here have wisely recommended pursuing your deer hunting endeavors in colorado....it is excellent advice. CO provides the serious mule deer hunter tenfold the opportunities NM does

that said, my state has some fantastic trophy muley hunting, yes, even outside of RA county...but damn! I just can't seem to remember exactly where right now... :^)

Mozey, that is one hell of a pair of sheds...Nah, he wouldn't have made all time (too many deductions) but everything told, that buck should be over 200 inches...nice find! I don't know when or where, but if it was in the last year or two....well, I know what buck I would hunt in that area

Cheers

 

[NMPaul]

Great western, I think your spot on about the tolerance for poaching in NM.

However, I have heard of several instances of G&F being called about something and either not responding or responding way after an effective period.

I do understand this can be from under staffing.

 

[luckless]

Greatwestern,
First... welcome to the site and welcome to the NM forum. Despite the idiocy going on in the other "help me" thread, the NM forum really is the best state forum, by far. We actually help many out of staters. I know Paul, Mozey and other provide much info often. I have loaned out my cabin to out of staters in an effort to get a kid on an elk. So don't let the current anti-out-of-state posts taint your opinion.

Secondly, you are dead on in regards to the anti-establishment crows. I married into NM and am generally accepted, but I still have a hard time figuring out how hunting ethics go out the window every season... I've personally never witnessed poaching by my family, but I'm quite sure it is because I refuse to hunt with anyone but my dad, uncle and father-in-law (a retired NMG&F warden)...

Again, welcome...


DC

 

[agrvarminthunter]

I can agree with your last comment nmPaul. After finding an elk that had been obviously poached recently in February of this year, I took pictures, contacted the state Game and Fish office once I got back home (Due to lack of cell phone service when I found it) and gave them the exact coordinates and the pictures of the elk that I had taken. There is obviously no seasons in February for elk and nothing was done that I know of and it has never been listed on Operation Game Thief.

 

[greatwestern]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-15-10 AT 05:08PM (MST)[p]10-4 Paul, I fully understand your frustration level...but it is all too common for game and fish to take the brunt of much misappropriated blame, though I didn't think that was your intent. Obviously, every agency has its shortcomings, but our state's department does a pretty decent job with the limited resources they have to work with. In any case, I wasn't bustin' on you, as I'm sure you realized straight away

Hey thanks Luckless....and don't worry, I ain't jaded. I've been prowling around this place for quite some time and am quite familiar with the goofy antics of some of the clowns on here. Should you run across a terse remark i've authored, it is most likely just a case of me thinking out loud while shaking my head at some of the drivel these guys spray

Though I am glad that such is not moderated out of the discussion, as such characters unfortunately make up a very real percentage of our hunting demographic, and it is pertinent to our collective interests to see what kind of mischeif these boneheads are up to

Varminthunter, do you know definitively that g&f did 'nothing' about the incident you reported? In many case such as the one you've described, there is simply very little anyone CAN do....finding an evidently illegally taken animal in the woods by no means guarantees any sort of conviction, as I'm sure you are aware. Many times there is just nothing to go on, and/or the priority of the incident is not great enough to warrant investing in its pursuit what are essentially extremely limited resources

That said, I commend your effort in making the report, and would suggest that you make follow up contact with the dept. to address your remaining concerns regarding your apparent impression that 'nothing was done' on their part

We are a family that must ALL stick together to effectively eradicate those who would have the despicable arrogance to steal what is rightfully ours

Crush them underheel at EVERY opportunity

*edited for clarity*

 

[greatwestern]

ALso, sorry as hell to jack your thread, Utah'Man

guess we kinda got off on a tangent there, eh?

Cheers

 

[m_freeman]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-19-10 AT 03:12PM (MST)[p]pay a hundred bucks to the huntin fool they will get you squared away for sure a hundred bucks will save you a thousand. http://www.huntinfool.com/benefits/analysis.asp as NR myself looking for better hunting areas will agree w/ all the posts above.
The HF will give you strategies and statistics in all the western states. The best way to approach NM is to apply for the NM premium hunts only and other good locations that will refund app fees. If you don't draw a premium hunt then fall back on the better OTC tags huntin fool has the numbers and strategies.
The reality is considering the demand for good hunts deer populations etc. this is the way to plan hunts these days.