Mule Deer Solution?

[headshot05]

Here is my opinion, I'd like to hear everyone else?s full opinions.

1) make all units limited entry to go along with the existing limited entry units.
2) no waiting periods
3) if you draw any choice IE 1,2 or 3 you lose your points.
4) antler restrictions on each unit. 4 points on one side or better.
5) Cut tag numbers in units that need it until deer numbers are where they should be.
6) add one more rifle season to each unit and split the tags between the 2 rifle seasons. This will not apply more pressure to deer because it will be the same amount of tags. It will however give people less competition on each hunt.
7) you choose either archery on a unit, or an extended unit. Make the extended units their own units that have to be drawn as well.
8) eliminate DH because you shouldn't be allowed to hunt all seasons in a limited entry unit
9) set aside ?premium? draw tags that allows a person to hunt all seasons. This would replace DH
10) tags go to highest PP holders then follow down the point list.

 

[Elkslayer2015]

headshot05

1) make all units limited entry to go along with the existing limited entry units.

Answer it already is LE have you seen the points creep?

2) no waiting periods?

Answer.. that will cause terrible points creep.

3) if you draw any choice IE 1,2 or 3 you lose your points.

Answer.. That's what there proposing

4) antler restrictions on each unit. 4 points on one side or better.

Answer.. I would be okay with this but it's proven it doesn't work because we have abnormal bucks running around how would they get harvested?

5) Cut tag numbers in units that need it until deer numbers are where they should be.

Answer.. I agree with this I think you will see some this next season.

6) add one more rifle season to each unit and split the tags between the 2 rifle seasons. This will not apply more pressure to deer because it will be the same amount of tags. It will however give people less competition on each hunt.

Answer.. I Agree with this but how long would these hunt run for?

7) you choose either archery on a unit, or an extended unit. Make the extended units their own units that have to be drawn as well.

Answer.. I disagree with this The archery hunt is the lowest success rate out of all are hunts so I think it's fine the way it is.

8) eliminate DH because you shouldn't be allowed to hunt all seasons in a limited entry unit.

Answer .. yeah lets take away the least successful hunt away for what reason because you don't like the DH program makes sense.

9) set aside ?premium? draw tags that allows a person to hunt all seasons. This would replace DH

Answer.. we already have premium hunts

10) tags go to highest PP holders then follow down the point list.

Answer.. I Agree with this..

 

[middlefork]

Just shut down all the hunts completely for 5 years.

If after 5 years the herd has increased at least 50% reopen to hunting on a purely random draw basis with a reduction of at least 50% in current tag numbers.

No CMWU's , LE tags or conservation / convention tags.

If at the end of 5 years the herd has not improved 50% leave all units closed until the numbers come up.

 

[fullthrottle]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-05-19 AT 05:29PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Dec-05-19 AT 05:25?PM (MST)


>1) make all units limited entry
>to go along with the
>existing limited entry units.

My answer: I agree, all of our deer tags are limited entry. But they all should be in the same category.

>2) no waiting periods?

My answer: I like short waiting periods, but only for the initial draw. After the draw and tags are left over then it's fair game.

>3) if you draw any choice
>IE 1,2 or 3 you
>lose your points.

My Answer.. That's what there proposing
And I agree with doing this.

>4) antler restrictions on each unit.
>4 points on one side
>or better.

My Answer.. I would be okay
with this. And I believe it does work in 2-3 year spurts.

>5) Cut tag numbers in units
>that need it until deer
>numbers are where they should
>be.

MyAnswer.. I agree with this I
think you will see some
this next season. (I hope so)

>6) add one more rifle season
>to each unit and split
>the tags between the 2
>rifle seasons. This will not
>apply more pressure to deer
>because it will be the
>same amount of tags. It
>will however give people less
>competition on each hunt.

My Answer.. I Agree with this but
how long would these hunt
run for? (5 Days 1 week apart)

>7) you choose either archery on
>a unit, or an extended
>unit. Make the extended units
>their own units that have
>to be drawn as well.


My Answer.. I'm completely agree with this and would take it a step further. Make the archery only area of the wasatch it's own hunt, also have a separate early, and a separate late hunt in this area. This would give the DWR more revenue, it would provide more opportunity for guys to at least get a tag, the hunt would less crowded while improving the overall experience. This to me is a no brainer and a win all the way around. That being said I am a archery guy, just not a whinny one.

>8) eliminate DH because you shouldn't
>be allowed to hunt all
>seasons in a limited entry
>unit.

My answer: I tend to agree with this.

>9) set aside ?premium? draw tags
>that allows a person to
>hunt all seasons. This would
>replace DH

My Answer.. I'm against doing this. Keep hunts separate, this would provide more ways of getting out in the field without adding tags, and having a heavy impact in quality.


>10) tags go to highest PP
>holders then follow down the
>point list.

My Answer.. I Agree with this

That's a good list of questions, many of which I think could have a positive impact.

 

[hornkiller]

Elkslayer2015
Where is it proven that antler restrictions dont work?

I've seen it work very well 1st hand in wy bud!

 

[hunt30]

>Elkslayer2015
>Where is it proven that antler
>restrictions dont work?
>
>I've seen it work very well
>1st hand in wy bud!


Where has it been proven that antler point restrictions have been a big success in a mule deer population?

Here?s a link to a study done by the Wyoming fish and game. I agree with a couple of the above suggestions, but I don't think antler point restrictions are a good idea.

https://wgfd.wyo.gov/WGFD/media/con...ive/MULEDEER_ANTLERPOINTREGS_REVIE0006790.pdf

 

[BillyBoB]

When the state puts the wants from hunters (71% said they want more opportunity) which equates to revenue (which is what the state clearly wants) OVER what is best to help populations, it wont matter what they do to the regulations because when money and opportunity outweighs what's best for the herds, we all lose. Including the deer.
Other states aren't afraid to shorten seasons after a bad winter

I'm gonna make a prediction right now!
Although the division says they will be making drastic changes to tag allocations regarding units, they will still not sacrifice the revenue and make sure the opportunity is there. Instead of exploring the idea of increasing tag prices to make the revenue instead of more opportunity
I'm predicting now:
So if they decrease 500 tags in one unit, they will just add 500 tags in a different unit.

No unit closures and no shortened hunting seasons dates they've already distinguished season dates today in the meeting and our winter is just beginning
I can't wait until April when they decide on tag numbers
Could have predicted:
More late season muzzleloader tags now on all units. Gotta have that opportunity!
Some regions wanted a 3rd tier of buck-to-doe ratios and some regions didn't even mention the late season muzzy hunts. Meanwhile the northern regions wanted the late muzzy hunts (if accepted) to be primitive hunts (HAMS)

The board wanted to add groups of hunters to the list who were exempt from losing their points.
Mule deer plan committee members shared and acknowledged that previous board directors were clearly more interested in the revenue than herd populations.
No I can't see anything going wrong :/
Sigh






"Wildlife and its habitat cannot speak. So
we must and we will."
Theadore Roosevelt

 

[elkassassin]

Yes BillyBob!

We Got Bo Wanting to Take Opportunity away!(AKA EX-COMMUNICATE DH's!)

And the WB/DWR wanting even more Opportunity because they're claiming 71% want more opportunity!

WAFJ!










I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!

 

[Bocephus]

Bess as I have said before I think a lot of good has come from the program. I may have been harsh in the other thread and I apologize for that.

There have been some really impactful projects, guys and gals have worked their tails off, sweat, blood and probably some tears have gone into improving wildlife habitat through those projects. It's not fair to discredit any of the good and sweat equity that has come from that, and that was never the intent. Like I've said before I think initially it was a great program and still has some great value. So if I offended you by sharing my opinion which doesnt amount to much I apologize and really do appreciate the hard work and impactful work the dedicated hunter population has accomplished. I listened to the entire Board meeting yesterday and realize what a huge undertaking it is to try to appease everyone in this state. Public, private, CWMU, public non hunters, youth, houndsmen, cattlemen, landowners, and the list goes on. Tough task to be asked to sort all that out.

 

[elkassassin]

Hey Bo!

You know I've always Liked the Heck out of You & Still do!

There Ain't Nothin Perfect in this Huntin World We Live in!

I've offered To 'Give a Little' on My Part to Help make things Better!(Even as Bad as I Hate it!)

In My Eyes if We'd of had Proper Management the Deer Herd Surely wouldn't be in the Poor Shape that it's in today!

I've Seen the Deer Herd here in TARDville go Down Hill for Many Decades!

Seen a few changes that Helped but not many!

And when there was Change that Helped, the Deer Were Knocked back out due to Poor Choices & Poor Management in short order,SAD!

Alot of People HARP on one Reason,there are many,many reasons why!

And You'll NEVER See Changes HARSH Enough to Bring Em Back,As You've Heard me Say for Decades!

It's Proven This State Will Grow Quality Bucks & Bulls Just about Statewide!

But SWEET GEEZUS Don't Turn them all in to $$$ Signs like We've seen happen!

You'll Never Satisfy All Types & That's just How it is!

Anybody that would Vote for a 7 Year Management Plan are FOOLS!

Alot of Things can & will Happen in 7 years & Once that's Locked in by the WB/DWR You are SCREWED No Matter what happens!

Did We Not Just go through a management Plan for Several Years that has FAILED?














>Bess as I have said before
>I think a lot of
>good has come from the
>program. I may have been
>harsh in the other thread
>and I apologize for that.
>
>
>There have been some really impactful
>projects, guys and gals have
>worked their tails off, sweat,
>blood and probably some tears
>have gone into improving wildlife
>habitat through those projects. It's
>not fair to discredit any
>of the good and sweat
>equity that has come from
>that, and that was never
>the intent. Like I've said
>before I think initially it
>was a great program and
>still has some great value.
>So if I offended you
>by sharing my opinion which
>doesnt amount to much I
>apologize and really do appreciate
>the hard work and impactful
>work the dedicated hunter population
>has accomplished. I listened to
>the entire Board meeting yesterday
>and realize what a huge
>undertaking it is to try
>to appease everyone in this
>state. Public, private, CWMU, public
>non hunters, youth, houndsmen, cattlemen,
>landowners, and the list goes
>on. Tough task to be
>asked to sort all that
>out.











I know so many people in so many places
They make allot of money but they got sad faces

It Ain't Easy being Me!

 

[cantkillathing]

Come back in 5 years, our solution are locked out until then. Wade tried to get the WB to be more flexible.

 

[Vanilla]

It's interesting that antler point restrictions are still being touted as the answer to what ails Utah mule deer. The available data shows that they simply do not work outside of a very short term bandaid, and actually become detrimental over time.

And please, please, please do NOT turn Utah into a full preference point system state. The preference point system is by far the worst of the bad systems out there.

I want more vigorous and consistent counting and mandatory reporting for every tag. Once we get these two things in place we can start making educated decisions on the state of the mule deer based upon the better data we have available.