Pavant down the tube for deer
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elkassassin
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As long as it's not YOUR family, who gives a chit, right?
That'd Be The Word Out Of The Hossy's Mouth Right There!
That'd Be The Word Out Of The Hossy's Mouth Right There!
elkassassin
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Just Look At It This Way Hossy:
Which Is The Way You Wanna Look At It!
You're A Lucky SUM-BITTCH!
You & Your Family All Have Tags!
Which Is The Way You Wanna Look At It!
You're A Lucky SUM-BITTCH!
You & Your Family All Have Tags!
elkassassin
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One More Question Hossy?
What'd The Government Approved/Electric Stihl's Cost You This Year?
What'd The Government Approved/Electric Stihl's Cost You This Year?
hossblur
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elkassassin
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Muley_73
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Hossy,
If you already know why are you asking? The truth is you actually don't already know, you have no idea you just paint your own narrative.
hossblur
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I believe you have a dedicated tag, right?
But we know the reason I ask you and Bess, and we know the reason it's so secretive.
Because, having tags, while calling for tag cuts exposes the hypocrisy.
It shows you to not be serious actors. Serious actors who really believed that fewer tags were the answer, would either not have one, or have one and burn it.
Ya, I know, blah, blah, blah, I haven't **** a deer in.......
If the DWR sucks, why do you need the DWR to tell you what to do?
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Muley_73
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Hoss,
My grand total of days spent hunting on dedicated tag this year....0. Haven't even stepped foot on the unit at this point. Rest of the family this year...zero Utah general tags.
As far as serious actors....been playing that game with family for 4 decades...your internet banter and silliness is low level entertainment at best.
And just because I know you love the vagueness, I'm actually pretty excited about some new and renewed pipelines that have recently opened up. Good luck with your hunts this year and keep up the entertainment.
hossblur
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Zero because they didn't draw, or zero because they didn't put in. And yes, there is a difference.
As to your dedicated, well, welcome to OPPURTUNIST Land.
I don't love the vagueness, it's just how guys that "played the game" speak. Easy to be right 100% of the time if you do.
Ticks N Tines
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I was not going to post on this thread when I first saw it, but I think we need to get back on track as it has just become a couple guys arguing.
This year I spent 2 days down on the Pahvant (Fillmore) area hunting spikes, cows, and deer. We had a kid in our group with a deer tag and myself and a buddy had spike/cow tags. We stayed together for the most part. Saw close to 30 bucks opening morning, 10 or so does & fawns, and about 50 elk. Most of the bucks were very young, but there were a few 3-4 year old type bucks we saw as well (I think the bigger bucks hang out in different areas).
I hunt this area quite a bit and it seems to have faired very well from the winter. Deer seem to be good in numbers and in good shape.
Now having said that, I know there's a huge group of old timers that hunted this place back when it was absolutely PACKED with deer. Those guys are always talking about the "Good Ole Days" and how there were big bucks all over. Those guys are always complaining and I totally understand it. I would complain too if I saw the drastic change that place has made. But lets be honest, it's a LE elk area now, and that's the main focus and draw.
A few years back I talked to a Biologist that explained to me why the deer pops have suffered since those old days. I know there were some bad winters in the 90s that took a bunch out, but his answer was very different. The biologist talked about "CATTLE". He said back in the 80s there were 5x the amount of cattle grazing that unit and the deer numbers exploded. Then when they reduced the number of cattle grazing, the deer numbers dropped big time. He was saying the cows mow down all the tall grass making room for the good forbes to sprout for the deer, or something to that affect. His answer was much more detailed than my overview of the conversation, so Take it for what it's worth, but just wanted to share what I heard. This guy is a very seasoned Biologist and I think what he said has merit, but I would like to hear what you guys think about it.
Carry on
This year I spent 2 days down on the Pahvant (Fillmore) area hunting spikes, cows, and deer. We had a kid in our group with a deer tag and myself and a buddy had spike/cow tags. We stayed together for the most part. Saw close to 30 bucks opening morning, 10 or so does & fawns, and about 50 elk. Most of the bucks were very young, but there were a few 3-4 year old type bucks we saw as well (I think the bigger bucks hang out in different areas).
I hunt this area quite a bit and it seems to have faired very well from the winter. Deer seem to be good in numbers and in good shape.
Now having said that, I know there's a huge group of old timers that hunted this place back when it was absolutely PACKED with deer. Those guys are always talking about the "Good Ole Days" and how there were big bucks all over. Those guys are always complaining and I totally understand it. I would complain too if I saw the drastic change that place has made. But lets be honest, it's a LE elk area now, and that's the main focus and draw.
A few years back I talked to a Biologist that explained to me why the deer pops have suffered since those old days. I know there were some bad winters in the 90s that took a bunch out, but his answer was very different. The biologist talked about "CATTLE". He said back in the 80s there were 5x the amount of cattle grazing that unit and the deer numbers exploded. Then when they reduced the number of cattle grazing, the deer numbers dropped big time. He was saying the cows mow down all the tall grass making room for the good forbes to sprout for the deer, or something to that affect. His answer was much more detailed than my overview of the conversation, so Take it for what it's worth, but just wanted to share what I heard. This guy is a very seasoned Biologist and I think what he said has merit, but I would like to hear what you guys think about it.
Carry on
Muley_73
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LMAO.. some of both Chief. I'm not right 100% of the time, wrong plenty. I just choose to fight the battles I want to be involved in a little different than you.
I always live in the Opportunist land.. every single season.
Dedicated this year...might hunt..might not.
LE Elk tag for wife
CO mule deer for me and some fam
NM coues tag for me
Rez Buff tag for me
Nephew with a sheep tag
Son with Idaho Mule deer
Bear for some fam
and a few others....
I hunt every year...A LOT. That doesn't mean I can't disagree with the management of the Utahs deer herds...or anything else. I'll keep playing the game and hope things turn out the way that I'd like to see them and our wildlife and opportunities flourish (in that order, that's one of the difference between you and I)
hossblur
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Great. I hope you hunt a lot.
The only difference between us, is I don't advocate for taking that from others, you do.
heartshot
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I was wondering after reading the original post if there were any other experience on the Pahvant this year. The doom and gloom of the Pahvant was based on the OP's 2 day experience that was "bitter cold, windy and wet the whole time"
Ticks N Tines saw 30 bucks opening morning, so that is an opposite read from doom and gloom.
I would love to go back to the1984 rifle hunt and be sitting on top of Mt Catherine when all the deer funneled to the top opening morning. Oh the stories my brother's would tell.
Ticks N Tines saw 30 bucks opening morning, so that is an opposite read from doom and gloom.
I would love to go back to the1984 rifle hunt and be sitting on top of Mt Catherine when all the deer funneled to the top opening morning. Oh the stories my brother's would tell.
Letshunt
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Between my family and friends we have hunted the pahvant range the better of 40 years. It’s no secret that deer #’s are down throughout Utah and the west. Speaking of tha pahvant directly, it is way down. We had 20 trail cameras up this summer from the north end to the south end. In some deep nasty places and in places where we’ve hunted and killed big deer in the past (90s and early 00’s)
From all the scouting and trail cam pics. There are two bucks in the 70s and a bunch of bucks in the 130-150s and a ton of does with fawns. So there is a chance in 2-3 years that some of those bucks make it through to 4-6 years of age. They cut tags way back three years ago but over the last 2 years have increased the general deer tags by 200-400 more tags the last couple years. If they keep increasing that’s back to where they were 4 years ago it will still be terrible.
The winter didn’t help the unit but it wasn’t terrible as far as fawn survival. So who knows what’s going to happen in the next couple years but when you only get a tag every 3-4 years it’s hard to have a lot of hope for the pahvant.
From all the scouting and trail cam pics. There are two bucks in the 70s and a bunch of bucks in the 130-150s and a ton of does with fawns. So there is a chance in 2-3 years that some of those bucks make it through to 4-6 years of age. They cut tags way back three years ago but over the last 2 years have increased the general deer tags by 200-400 more tags the last couple years. If they keep increasing that’s back to where they were 4 years ago it will still be terrible.
The winter didn’t help the unit but it wasn’t terrible as far as fawn survival. So who knows what’s going to happen in the next couple years but when you only get a tag every 3-4 years it’s hard to have a lot of hope for the pahvant.
elkassassin
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And When Joe Blow Hunter Only Gets A Tag Every 3-4 Years What's Their Attitude?
It's:
I'M KILLING SOMETHING!
It's:
I'M KILLING SOMETHING!
Neverdrawn
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Round and round it goes. I have a youngster that works for me who killed a two point last year and was exstatic, as was I to see his excitement. I helped him gut it and lo and behold it had no ovaries, uterus or any other way to produce fawns, so I wasn't too concerned about him decimating the population. Funny enough there is a good crop of fawns this year, so even with the wanton killing of that buck the does got bred, or we have some immaculate conception going on here. The one thing I noticed more than anything was the wintering deer in the unit were where habitat restoration has taken place over the past few years. Who coulda guessed? If only they had cut tags instead of habitat restoration we'd still have one buck to grow big, but a continually declining herd. There are ways to help declining herds, but cutting buck tags are way down the line. Cutting doe tags, if the range can handle growth, now that makes sense. They have the tools to carry and birth fawns.
FixedBlade
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Very interesting, reasonable conclusion I think on the cattle.I was not going to post on this thread when I first saw it, but I think we need to get back on track as it has just become a couple guys arguing.
This year I spent 2 days down on the Pahvant (Fillmore) area hunting spikes, cows, and deer. We had a kid in our group with a deer tag and myself and a buddy had spike/cow tags. We stayed together for the most part. Saw close to 30 bucks opening morning, 10 or so does & fawns, and about 50 elk. Most of the bucks were very young, but there were a few 3-4 year old type bucks we saw as well (I think the bigger bucks hang out in different areas).
I hunt this area quite a bit and it seems to have faired very well from the winter. Deer seem to be good in numbers and in good shape.
Now having said that, I know there's a huge group of old timers that hunted this place back when it was absolutely PACKED with deer. Those guys are always talking about the "Good Ole Days" and how there were big bucks all over. Those guys are always complaining and I totally understand it. I would complain too if I saw the drastic change that place has made. But lets be honest, it's a LE elk area now, and that's the main focus and draw.
A few years back I talked to a Biologist that explained to me why the deer pops have suffered since those old days. I know there were some bad winters in the 90s that took a bunch out, but his answer was very different. The biologist talked about "CATTLE". He said back in the 80s there were 5x the amount of cattle grazing that unit and the deer numbers exploded. Then when they reduced the number of cattle grazing, the deer numbers dropped big time. He was saying the cows mow down all the tall grass making room for the good forbes to sprout for the deer, or something to that affect. His answer was much more detailed than my overview of the conversation, so Take it for what it's worth, but just wanted to share what I heard. This guy is a very seasoned Biologist and I think what he said has merit, but I would like to hear what you guys think about it.
Carry on
middlefork
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Starts at page 63
"All grazing animals prefer some plant species and ignore others. Ungrazed plants receive a competitive growth advantage and gradually increase in vigor and abundance. Because of this, the shift in plant composition associated with grazing is always away from the forage preferences of the grazing animal. Grazing by a single species of animal always results in detrimental plant composition changes of plants preferred by that grazer. Consequently, grazing by two or more grazers with different forage preferences can result in better maintenance of forages preferred by the grazer of primary importance."
I haven't been back and won't be back to Pavant this year. Tomorrow I'm off to Wyoming Region G for a deer/elk archery hunt with my son and a grandson. I just hope things are not as bad up there as they were at Pavant was, but we do expect a below normal year. I won't have a tag, but my son has a deer tag, three elk tags and a bear tag, so it should be interesting. The grandson isn't old enough to hunt until next year, and the older grandkids are too wrapped up in HS sports to go with us.
Most years lately I have had a lot of deer in my yard in Mantua all year long, but I found two dead ones this spring and haven't seen any live ones all summer. That is good news for my sapling fruit trees.
I hope all of you have a good year.
Most years lately I have had a lot of deer in my yard in Mantua all year long, but I found two dead ones this spring and haven't seen any live ones all summer. That is good news for my sapling fruit trees.
I hope all of you have a good year.
Opening weekend in Wyoming region G deer/elk hunt for a comparison with Pavant.
Three days bow hunting, only my son had tags, me and my grandson just along for company.
Elk:
5 bulls, four were 6 points and one large 5 point, shots at two good sized 6 points. Heard numerous other bulls bugle.
Spotted about 50 cows/calves.
Deer:
0 bucks
Five does
Four fawns
We would have seen multiple bucks and many more does on a normal year, with the ground we covered. I am glad I didn't waste my points putting in for deer this year.
Three days bow hunting, only my son had tags, me and my grandson just along for company.
Elk:
5 bulls, four were 6 points and one large 5 point, shots at two good sized 6 points. Heard numerous other bulls bugle.
Spotted about 50 cows/calves.
Deer:
0 bucks
Five does
Four fawns
We would have seen multiple bucks and many more does on a normal year, with the ground we covered. I am glad I didn't waste my points putting in for deer this year.
