PP/BP or random
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Mallardsx2
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I am all about pure prefrence points. Having said that, I feel that you should have to use them for ANY male species tag you draw.
If you draw a tag, you go to the back of the line.
In a system that operates like that (for deer, bear, Pronghorn, elk) it's pretty dang fair to everyone involved.
If you draw a tag, you go to the back of the line.
In a system that operates like that (for deer, bear, Pronghorn, elk) it's pretty dang fair to everyone involved.
elkhunterUT
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If a point system is required, I think Utah's system is the best overall: 50/50 Bonus point/Random
Conrad8899
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50/50 Bonus points random
Utah LE is ~49.999% preference, not bonus. Utah LE mistakenly uses the term bonus, but it operates as preference. And that is why Utah LE is one of the worst designs for NR hunters - not the best. The completely saturated preference side of the UTAH LE system is completely broken for NRs. I would hope that WY is studying the Utah mistake and will avoid it, but it sounds like they might replicate the preference error.
laffin
Leave it the way it is , it's working just fine.
You're not entitled to anything, you can't steal what someone else has acquired just because you don't want to work or wait like they have.
Waiting your turn is how things should be, call me old school but that's how we used to do it. save the" it's not fair " crap , I'm not buying it and that's the problem with most everything these days.
You're not entitled to anything, you can't steal what someone else has acquired just because you don't want to work or wait like they have.
Waiting your turn is how things should be, call me old school but that's how we used to do it. save the" it's not fair " crap , I'm not buying it and that's the problem with most everything these days.
elkhunterUT
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Wrong
There's a fundamental difference when having multiple bonus points vs multiple preference points. Both UT and AZ have it right, using bonus points for both sides of the draw. Whether the Bonus side is 50% like UT or 20% like AZ is up to the state and how much preference they choose to give to the max point guys. The more points needed to draw, would favor a 50/50 split to get those high point guys out of the pools in my opinion.
The 75/25 split used by WY and OR also works but even there I'd prefer using bonus points for slightly better odds of getting low random numbers based on the number of points.
The straight preference system in CO is a non starter in my book.
The 75/25 split used by WY and OR also works but even there I'd prefer using bonus points for slightly better odds of getting low random numbers based on the number of points.
The straight preference system in CO is a non starter in my book.
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elkhunterUT
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100% agree!!
SDBugler
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I would throw my opinion in since the OP asked, but then l would get chastised by a few in the WY forum as a "whining complaining non-resident" for simply giving my opinion on a forum that is intended for opinions/discussions and sharing thoughts/ideas!!
elks96
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Then 99% of people will never draw a tag and they will die with a pile of points and those who actually draw a tag will end up too old to even access the country.
But that will be the situation no matter how the draw system is set up. You can't change the fact that the demand greatly exceeds the supply.
gundog2
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Why not include the female (doe/cow) in the same draw with bucks and bulls? There is already point creep in the cow elk draw, so why not just put these in with the bull elk draw? Is a cow hunt really any different than a spike bull hunt? I think most states lump male and female in the same draw. Montana has a separate draw for doe and cow, but Montana is in a little different situation than most other states.
Mallardsx2
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Only reason I said males only is because that's part of why it wasn't approved to be brought up to the CPW commission by the Draw Process working group as a means to take peoples points. They decided that taking peoples points for B-list tags would make it too difficult to manage the herds and there would be a constant changing from a-list to b-list tags. A part of me understands but another part of me says that maybe they do in fact need to be that granular. I got no say in it. The people on the draw process working group didn't even know when the elk and deer rut was though....so take that for what it's worth.
If it was truly up to me, hunters wouldn't get a single tag without using all of their points.
MQQSE
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That’s why I’m trying to keep in the best shape I can. Pretty cool when the old dudes whack a big old ram.
elks96
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HAHA. Sure hope you don't have a little final destination action. But seriously why would we want to save the best hunts in some of the hardest and coolest country for the old guys. If anything shouldn't we try the opposite? Maybe for these super hard tags in hard lands we should give the drawing advantage to the younger hunters?
nripepi
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We all understand why you would want that but at the same time one would ask why did you buy points for the past 10 years when they couldn't help you unless they changed the system? It was easy to calculate how long it would take to draw back then.
WY would do well to be weary of more point systems. They rarely become as hoped, while the game agencies become dependent on the point fees.
Waiting periods should be used more often for Limited Quota hunts. Some people can draw multiple sheep tags in their lifetime, while the great majority will never draw one - CO for example. OIL or 5-10 year waits are needed on higher demand units.
At any rate- all States should have a CAP on the maximum points one can obtain- which allows everyone to get to the same level.
Utah's system is broken too. As with most point systems, it benefits those who were able and eligible to apply within a few short years of the start of the point system.
Tags that take up to 10 years to draw can be given on a preference point system. Over 10 years should just be given on a bonus (one app per point) system.
Waiting periods should be used more often for Limited Quota hunts. Some people can draw multiple sheep tags in their lifetime, while the great majority will never draw one - CO for example. OIL or 5-10 year waits are needed on higher demand units.
At any rate- all States should have a CAP on the maximum points one can obtain- which allows everyone to get to the same level.
Utah's system is broken too. As with most point systems, it benefits those who were able and eligible to apply within a few short years of the start of the point system.
Tags that take up to 10 years to draw can be given on a preference point system. Over 10 years should just be given on a bonus (one app per point) system.
Gorilla
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Whatever the solution is, I can garuentee the WGFD is not going to sell less points. A significant portion of thier overall budget comes from selling bonus points, which is simply too much $ to be made up somewhere else. So any thought/proposal that would result in fewer points sold each year can be taken off the table.
delmag1942
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Exactly!
BuzzH
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Not if you split the total quota instead of splitting by area.
elks96
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Haha. I can think of several ways the game and fish could make up the $$$ and not be a big deal. Points are easy but do we really want any state agency making $$$$ for selling absolutely nothing? Such a system goes against what most in WY stand for…
Right at the edge? You're over the edge and playing with fire.
Several NRs drew ram tags with 23 points in 2024. Everyone at 25 points could have had several different units (all except two units). And you are passing on those units and hoping the WY legislature retains some preference component to their system? If they go 100% BP-squared, you might not ever draw.
I feel badly for the folks who never had a chance. But you've had chances, and are just choosing to pass on the low & mid level ram units.
Two surveys on this - and neither one of them offered an option that matches the actual draft bill at TRW today. 100% BP-squared is still the draft bill. With a possible up to 4 years transition period. Which also exactly matches the task force's recommendation.
From today's agenda: https://wyoleg.gov/InterimCommittee/2024/06-202405146-012023SF0088INT-BonusPoints.pdf
From today's agenda: https://wyoleg.gov/InterimCommittee/2024/06-202405146-012023SF0088INT-BonusPoints.pdf
DeerHunter53
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I think putting the old guys on the hunts saves the animals as they cannot access the country like the young guys therefore increasing the overall age class. Preserving the animals so there are more for the next generation
Always two ways to look at something
nfh
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what makes a unit better than another? i am sure for a NR it's access. I have seen several old dudes take some dandy rams, the one common theme is horses to access the deep country.
most residents apply for an area they know. i could of drawn moose tag years ago but i would rather apply for a unit that is harder to draw due to its a area i know. Applying for an area across the state doesnt add up for me personally, its a chance i dont wont to take
sheep areas 1,2,3,4 and 5 have the same quality of rams. You just need to put the time and effort in. I am seeing nothing that shows these 5 units that one produces bigger rams than the other listed units. i always hear rumors area 3 produces smaller rams. I am able to see most the rams harvested and well some pigs have been taken. i personally hunted that unit. I scouted some big rams but i made a mistake of not seeing the big rams and shot a average ram. Even the outfitters that personally draw tags dont apply across the state cause of a rumor of some area produces better rams.
most residents apply for an area they know. i could of drawn moose tag years ago but i would rather apply for a unit that is harder to draw due to its a area i know. Applying for an area across the state doesnt add up for me personally, its a chance i dont wont to take
sheep areas 1,2,3,4 and 5 have the same quality of rams. You just need to put the time and effort in. I am seeing nothing that shows these 5 units that one produces bigger rams than the other listed units. i always hear rumors area 3 produces smaller rams. I am able to see most the rams harvested and well some pigs have been taken. i personally hunted that unit. I scouted some big rams but i made a mistake of not seeing the big rams and shot a average ram. Even the outfitters that personally draw tags dont apply across the state cause of a rumor of some area produces better rams.
LIK2HNT
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Not sure where you got your info.
Having 25 points now equals 24 in this years draw. My data shows nobody with 23 point drew. 24 points had up to 20% chance depending on what unit you applied. Very few units are NR DIY hunts due to wilderness.
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