Socialism
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Forthewall
Long Time Member
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- 3,327
Your Welcome, you may now return to putting Hitler mustaches onto your Obama posters.
NMPaul
Moderator
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- 8,104
Well we just created another huge Bureaucracy and increased the percentage of takers with one piece of legislation.
The percentage of State/Federal workers and people on some kind of government assistance has never been higher and now we have just increased it. We will be running out of people that actually earn and produce something to pay for those on the Government nipple.
Some of you guys can now poo poo it all you want (I can see that is now your MO) but, someone will pay for it.
Ever notice the government never gets smaller.
**********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
The percentage of State/Federal workers and people on some kind of government assistance has never been higher and now we have just increased it. We will be running out of people that actually earn and produce something to pay for those on the Government nipple.
Some of you guys can now poo poo it all you want (I can see that is now your MO) but, someone will pay for it.
Ever notice the government never gets smaller.
**********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
4
440sixpack
Guest
You know when I went out to feed the horses this morning I waited around a while to see if the sun came up. there were some clouds in the east so I was getting a little worried for a bit but I'll be damned if it didn't . so already I can see the health care bill isn't as bad as the republican't said it was.
If I can survive until dark without any sky falling on me it's going to be safe to say we're going to survive.
If I can survive until dark without any sky falling on me it's going to be safe to say we're going to survive.
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,104
HD, I enjoy your posts as much as the next dumb axx.
However, for a guy that posts as much as you do in the political forum you are full of crap if you do not feel strongly about this one way or the other.
This is the most significant political happening in at least the last 10 years or more.
It seems the MO for guys that are sympathetic of the left is to poo poo it as not being a big deal, and you cannot deny that it is.
You know when I went out
>to feed the horses this
>morning I waited around a
>while to see if the
>sun came up. there were
>some clouds in the east
>so I was getting a
>little worried for a bit
>but I'll be damned if
>it didn't . so already
>I can see the health
>care bill isn't as bad
>as the republican't said it
>was.
>
> If I can survive until
>dark without any sky falling
>on me it's going to
>be safe to say we're
>going to survive.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
However, for a guy that posts as much as you do in the political forum you are full of crap if you do not feel strongly about this one way or the other.
This is the most significant political happening in at least the last 10 years or more.
It seems the MO for guys that are sympathetic of the left is to poo poo it as not being a big deal, and you cannot deny that it is.
You know when I went out
>to feed the horses this
>morning I waited around a
>while to see if the
>sun came up. there were
>some clouds in the east
>so I was getting a
>little worried for a bit
>but I'll be damned if
>it didn't . so already
>I can see the health
>care bill isn't as bad
>as the republican't said it
>was.
>
> If I can survive until
>dark without any sky falling
>on me it's going to
>be safe to say we're
>going to survive.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
Of course, Al hasn't explained fully. Obama has not acted alone. He has acted with the support of most Democrats. The plain inference from Al's comments is that that a vote for Obama and any other Democrat is a vote for Socialism. Now that the truth has been admitted from within the inner sanctum, the voters can take this into account, for example by voting against all Democrats/Socialists in November 2010 and November 2012.
I'm guessing those ill-considered words by Al Sharpton are going to come back to haunt both him and the Democrats. The fact is there is simply too much truth in them.
I'm guessing those ill-considered words by Al Sharpton are going to come back to haunt both him and the Democrats. The fact is there is simply too much truth in them.
4
440sixpack
Guest
Paul I'm really not in favor of this bill, but I wasn't in favor of attacking Iraq either and where did that get me?
In my opinion there are some good things in this bill, and there are some expensive things in it, but in the end I don't see it making or breaking us. I also thing a single payer system is in our future, I see no way to avoid it, I admit I'm not wild about it but I've yet to hear one other idea that's viable. we have the most expensive health care in the world, we can argue if it's the best or not all day but in the end does it matter if most of us can't afford it? so that's why I say big deal, we're just started down the road we're going to have to take anyway so don't get so up tight about it.
In my opinion there are some good things in this bill, and there are some expensive things in it, but in the end I don't see it making or breaking us. I also thing a single payer system is in our future, I see no way to avoid it, I admit I'm not wild about it but I've yet to hear one other idea that's viable. we have the most expensive health care in the world, we can argue if it's the best or not all day but in the end does it matter if most of us can't afford it? so that's why I say big deal, we're just started down the road we're going to have to take anyway so don't get so up tight about it.
Just in case you thought I was dreaming this:
http://www.opposingviews.com/i/al-sharpton-americans-voted-for-socialism-when-they-elected-obama
http://www.opposingviews.com/i/al-sharpton-americans-voted-for-socialism-when-they-elected-obama
LAST EDITED ON Mar-22-10 AT 05:36PM (MST)[p]Socialism is just a word?, and who is Al Sharpton, is he the president or something? I sure hope I draw one of those socialized elk tags soon, certainly hope you word haters didn't put in, come on, stand on your princibles and do the right thing, don't apply. Public animals and public land, public drawings, Its classic socialism. I don't know about you, but Im turning red just thinking about it.
B
BomberBlackies
Guest
Piper, boy you seem ecstatic about this. Did this remind you of the first time?
CAforkedhorn
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 3,529
Bomber, Piper's first time wasn't a good experience. The sheep kicked him in the nuts and his medical insurance didn't cover pre-existing conditions! 
Piper, how's your period?
Zigga, don't forget the knee pads!
Hdude, Lil' Jimmy wants his share!
Piper, how's your period?
Zigga, don't forget the knee pads!
Hdude, Lil' Jimmy wants his share!
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,104
Piper, if you had not noticed all words are words. Duh! Most words mean something.
Here is definition of socialism right off of Dictionary.com
3. (in Marxist theory) the stage following capitalism in the transition of a society to communism, characterized by the imperfect implementation of collectivist principles.
1. a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/socialism
I think that saying Obama is a Socialist is a pretty fair assessment.
He firmly believes in wealth re-distribution as he stated on a NPR address prior to him even becoming a Senator.
Hope this is what you guys wanted, because this is what you got.
Please read bottom quotes. Cant argue with them.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
Here is definition of socialism right off of Dictionary.com
3. (in Marxist theory) the stage following capitalism in the transition of a society to communism, characterized by the imperfect implementation of collectivist principles.
1. a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/socialism
I think that saying Obama is a Socialist is a pretty fair assessment.
He firmly believes in wealth re-distribution as he stated on a NPR address prior to him even becoming a Senator.
Hope this is what you guys wanted, because this is what you got.
Please read bottom quotes. Cant argue with them.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
So how did the 3 get placed in front of number one? number three described a Marxist theory in which socialism is replaced with communism. Your cute NMpaul, maybe twisted talk radio could be in you future. Because we have socialized public hunting of socialized wildlife in the US, does that mean it will become communistic, and we will all get an equal part of the animal? no matter how hard you hunt? Your pathetic, you know as well as I do that hunting is going to go the other way, and it already is. You know as well as does the rest of the world does that communism doesn't work well for society, and our country will never go that way despite the fact that we have socialism in our system and always have had. Communism is dead, get over it, the rest of the world has.
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,104
Piper, congratulations! That was the weirdest response I have ever read.
However, thanks for saying I was cute.
WTH are you talking about. What does hunting have to do with it???
Was this a drug induced post??
BTW, #3 was placed in front of #1 because it was more relevant for the sake of the post. I did not even list #2 because it was not relevant.
Is this your latest and greatest talking point that hunting is like socialism????
Did you come up with that yourself???
Frikkin weird is all I can say.
When I go hunting I do not think about political theologies. I go hunting. I love hunting and am thankful for every chance I get to go and every tag I draw.
Please do not try to explain your weird little theory about hunting. It will make me dizzy. I must not have the brain cells to see the relationship that hunting has with socialism.
BTW, let your buddies in Venezuela and Cuba know that Communism is dead. No one has told them yet.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
However, thanks for saying I was cute.
WTH are you talking about. What does hunting have to do with it???
Was this a drug induced post??
BTW, #3 was placed in front of #1 because it was more relevant for the sake of the post. I did not even list #2 because it was not relevant.
Is this your latest and greatest talking point that hunting is like socialism????
Did you come up with that yourself???
Frikkin weird is all I can say.
When I go hunting I do not think about political theologies. I go hunting. I love hunting and am thankful for every chance I get to go and every tag I draw.
Please do not try to explain your weird little theory about hunting. It will make me dizzy. I must not have the brain cells to see the relationship that hunting has with socialism.
BTW, let your buddies in Venezuela and Cuba know that Communism is dead. No one has told them yet.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
What was relevant about number three? I guess your idea is to show that socialism leads to communism, which is not true, except in your mind I guess. I pointed out that(according to number one) hunting public animals ect, is engaging in socialism, and that doesn't mean that its going to turn into communism. That we have socialism in our country now, and the past is the past. I don't believe in any gateway theory, and I believe that some things in our society may work better when their socialized, (health care comes to mind) Do you have any statistics to prove otherwise?
B
BomberBlackies
Guest
Hugo Chavez has at least two favorite people in the USA. Sean Penn and Piper.
LAST EDITED ON Mar-22-10 AT 09:07PM (MST)[p]In fact, predatory capitalism can lead to communism, Read about Karl Marx. and the society he lived in when he developed his theories, Look at the have and have not society that finally gave Chavez power in Venezuela.
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,104
Piper, I know that I will regret wasting my time arguing with you, however, keep in mind I stupidly responded to your post saying that "socialism is just a word".
That was the purpose of my post, from there you went into some other dimension. I am not going to try to keep up. I do not appear to be from the same planet as you.
I will stick with my original post. Socialism is a word, but, it means something. The definition from dictionary.com that I supplied the link to, though you did not seem to like the order of how I cut and pasted (so sorry).
Obama, is a socialist through his actions and his previous statements.
Piper, all your other stuff about hunting and socialism, sharing parts of the animal, gate way theories, something about talk radio, me being pathetic, your request for me to supply statistics for some strange point you were trying to make, I will have to concede to you.
Because, I do not feel like trying to decipher your strange posts, and being drug into pointless argument.
I need to save my brain cells for arguing with my wife.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
That was the purpose of my post, from there you went into some other dimension. I am not going to try to keep up. I do not appear to be from the same planet as you.
I will stick with my original post. Socialism is a word, but, it means something. The definition from dictionary.com that I supplied the link to, though you did not seem to like the order of how I cut and pasted (so sorry).
Obama, is a socialist through his actions and his previous statements.
Piper, all your other stuff about hunting and socialism, sharing parts of the animal, gate way theories, something about talk radio, me being pathetic, your request for me to supply statistics for some strange point you were trying to make, I will have to concede to you.
Because, I do not feel like trying to decipher your strange posts, and being drug into pointless argument.
I need to save my brain cells for arguing with my wife.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
H
hoytme
Guest
The primary difference between socialism and communism in the end is how it was brought about. Communism is brought about by force, socialism is brought about through democratic means.
4
440sixpack
Guest
This fear of socialism is pretty funny really, we're at least half socialist as it is but the bed wetters think the sky has just fallen.
The days of staking out a claim and keeping the bad guys off died with John Wayne, it's not possible to have the population we have and everyone go a different direction. I wish it was, I really do but there is a reason almost every other high population nation has gone to communism or socialsm and it's called survival. who can name another nation with our population density that is more capitolist than we are and they're making it work? if you can find them we better be studying them.
The days of staking out a claim and keeping the bad guys off died with John Wayne, it's not possible to have the population we have and everyone go a different direction. I wish it was, I really do but there is a reason almost every other high population nation has gone to communism or socialsm and it's called survival. who can name another nation with our population density that is more capitolist than we are and they're making it work? if you can find them we better be studying them.
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,104
Dude, number one I will have you know I did not wet my bed last night.
As far as another nation with a huge population to compare to that really does not work. Every nation has its own history and beginning. Ours is unique to others as theirs is unique to ours.
No doubt we were a socialist society before this HCR, however, we are now even more so.
I dont like the way the country is headed, and from your posts you do not either.
Piper, I like Margaret Thatcher's quote. It is a simple way to understand the danger of Socialism.
He currently have the highest percentage of people either on public assistance, or Federal/State workers. There is no doubt that many of these people are needed. However, we are now increasing that percentage and directly reducing the percentage of people that actually produce something. Where is the breaking point??
I dont know, but, at some point someone has to pay the bills. I for one dont trust the cockroaches in DC to run this ship.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
As far as another nation with a huge population to compare to that really does not work. Every nation has its own history and beginning. Ours is unique to others as theirs is unique to ours.
No doubt we were a socialist society before this HCR, however, we are now even more so.
I dont like the way the country is headed, and from your posts you do not either.
Piper, I like Margaret Thatcher's quote. It is a simple way to understand the danger of Socialism.
He currently have the highest percentage of people either on public assistance, or Federal/State workers. There is no doubt that many of these people are needed. However, we are now increasing that percentage and directly reducing the percentage of people that actually produce something. Where is the breaking point??
I dont know, but, at some point someone has to pay the bills. I for one dont trust the cockroaches in DC to run this ship.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
Throughout the world people are basicly the same in most ways, human nature crosses a lot of boundrys. I think there is a danger in too much concentrated wealth, history has some stories about that, in fact I believe the founders of this country were fearful of that. I dont think you have to have big government to have good government, The rightwing tries to confuse those two aspects.
Piper-you have that part right but how can you say it is the right that advocates big government being good government? I will admit that Bush was not good at reducing government and he committed way too much of our resources to expanding things. The democrats continuously expand government at hyperspeed and it has nothing to do with good government. People have awakened to the fact that adding to entitlements and government jobs is our downfall. I know the democrats will continue to expand government at a fast pace until november but I still have hope that we can throw enough of the bums in both parties out to right the ship of state. It is sinking. If we don't get balance of power back then I really think we will face a revolution of some sort. If not violent then surely a taxpayer revolt where citizens refuse to pay the mandates and go to a more underground cash economy like what happened in Russia before their collapse. Not enough workers to pay for the programs.
4
440sixpack
Guest
Paul we have a superior attitude in this country and some of it is deserved, but we're still human and if you can't find an example of a society working as we want ours to work you can't say for sure it can be done.
If it can be done how will it be? we had 6 years of full reepublican control and health care was a bigger wreck after them than before. it's easy to say let capitolism take it's course and all will right itself but in the field of life and death I think as a society that's unacceptable. we wouldn't make K-12 education a matter of buy the best you can afford or go without would we ? education is a right but staying alive to attend class depends on your finacial ability? what has this bill done that is that far off from just this?
If it can be done how will it be? we had 6 years of full reepublican control and health care was a bigger wreck after them than before. it's easy to say let capitolism take it's course and all will right itself but in the field of life and death I think as a society that's unacceptable. we wouldn't make K-12 education a matter of buy the best you can afford or go without would we ? education is a right but staying alive to attend class depends on your finacial ability? what has this bill done that is that far off from just this?
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,104
>Throughout the world people are basicly
>the same in most ways,
>human nature crosses a lot
>of boundrys. I think
>there is a danger in
>too much concentrated wealth,
>history has some stories about
>that, in fact I
>believe the founders of this
>country were fearful of that.
>I dont think you have
>to have big government to
>have good government, The rightwing
>tries to confuse those two
>aspects.
Cant disagree with any of that.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
>the same in most ways,
>human nature crosses a lot
>of boundrys. I think
>there is a danger in
>too much concentrated wealth,
>history has some stories about
>that, in fact I
>believe the founders of this
>country were fearful of that.
>I dont think you have
>to have big government to
>have good government, The rightwing
>tries to confuse those two
>aspects.
Cant disagree with any of that.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
NMPaul
Moderator
- Messages
- 8,104
>Paul we have a superior attitude
>in this country and some
>of it is deserved, but
>we're still human and if
>you can't find an example
>of a society working as
>we want ours to work
>you can't say for sure
>it can be done.
>
> If it can be done
>how will it be? we
>had 6 years of full
>reepublican control and health care
>was a bigger wreck after
>them than before. it's easy
>to say let capitolism take
>it's course and all will
>right itself but in the
>field of life and death
>I think as a society
>that's unacceptable. we wouldn't make
>K-12 education a matter of
>buy the best you can
>afford or go without would
>we ? education is a
>right but staying alive to
>attend class depends on your
>finacial ability? what has this
>bill done that is that
>far off from just this?
>
I agree with everything except the part about staying alive to attend class.
You have said yourself that everyone in this country gets health care. Hell the ones with no insurance some times get better care going to the emergency room. They do not kick you out because you are a drain on society, illegal, or any other reason.
The republicans did not fix it, but, sometimes the cure is worse than the disease. Time will tell.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
>in this country and some
>of it is deserved, but
>we're still human and if
>you can't find an example
>of a society working as
>we want ours to work
>you can't say for sure
>it can be done.
>
> If it can be done
>how will it be? we
>had 6 years of full
>reepublican control and health care
>was a bigger wreck after
>them than before. it's easy
>to say let capitolism take
>it's course and all will
>right itself but in the
>field of life and death
>I think as a society
>that's unacceptable. we wouldn't make
>K-12 education a matter of
>buy the best you can
>afford or go without would
>we ? education is a
>right but staying alive to
>attend class depends on your
>finacial ability? what has this
>bill done that is that
>far off from just this?
>
I agree with everything except the part about staying alive to attend class.
You have said yourself that everyone in this country gets health care. Hell the ones with no insurance some times get better care going to the emergency room. They do not kick you out because you are a drain on society, illegal, or any other reason.
The republicans did not fix it, but, sometimes the cure is worse than the disease. Time will tell.
***********************************
Margaret Thatcher: "The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money."
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own." - Unknown
4
440sixpack
Guest
Yes you're right we don't let most of them die, so why is it we're going to be more socialist by letting them know we aren't going to let them die than making them beg for it? isn't it just doing what we're already doing in a more simple mannor? I don't see why all the theatrics about this.
![IMG-20211130-WA0017[1].jpg](/xf/data/xfmg/thumbnail/42/42736-1121cf0b6b3ef95bd3f3b220f7c8ae2d.jpg?1706048007)
