Pro i agree with moving the spike hunts away from ALL LE hunts that are going on, 100%.
But i have heard you say over and over that we have got to kill bulls, it's a no brainer to maintain herd sizes.
So....if we can't add on 100's of mature bull tags to keep the numbers in check with the objectives because we'll wipe the age class out, how else do you do it if you can't kill spikes?
You said-
"Spike tags were originally issued to give elk hunters something to hunt while some units put a stop on mature bull harvests for 5 years. It was NEVER intended to be a management tactic."
Wait a minute, that certainly describes a management tool to me!
Kill spikes, stop killing mature bulls for 5 years....BOOM..the Wasatch and Manti herds literally exploded!
And now it is most certainly used as a tool, no doubt about it.
And I'm sorry to all my archer friends of which i have many,i certainly am not knocking your sport but using primitive weapons is NOT the best "management tool" to control any species of game, they are simply not as efficient or effective enough for that task.
Primitive weapon hunting is more of a "privilege" in the hunting world, not a tool for management.
The DWR has a job to do and that job and first priority is to "manage" our wildlife the most effective and logical way they can, but toss out a few "perks" to appease ALL sporting groups.
I bow hunted and was a die hard archer for 15 years, i know first hand how low the success rate is.
Quadrupling or even doubling the archery permits and move them to during the rut to hit objectives numbers just doesn't make sense. Bowhunting is tough enough, let alone add in more competition to fight for that one bull at the wallow.
I see people complaining everyday on here of how many trailcams are sitting on THEIR water holes or wallows, now we want to double or triple the tags??
We have elk to kill, lots of them every year.
We are at 90% of our herd size on a statewide level, most units are full, some are even over.
I say we are doing something right, we indisputably the best elk state and there's a reason for that. We got this way from killing the right amount of spikes, along with the right amount of mature bulls. Now some of our other LE units have met objectives and elk need to be killed without hurting quality too much.
Everyone has been saying the Wasatch is dead now from all the LE tags and the thousands of spikes killed all these years...LMAO, that place still kicks monster bulls and always will! And it also gives hunters willing to "settle" for pisscutter 350" bulls everyday! When did 350" bulls become "pisscutters" anyway, that's a dang good bull!!
It's a fact that MOST LE elk hunters don't care to kill a 400" bull, they just want "nice bulls", yet there are just enough picky hunters that pass those medium bulls to let the stock mature...along with the 40% survival on spikes....it's the perfect balance an it's proven its self for all these years, has it not?? Show me where!!
As for season dates, yes the archery is too early, i agree.
Why not bump everything a week or two weeks later?
Hell I'd jump all over rifle elk hunting towards the end of September versus the front, we all know it gets better and wish we had another week!
Ok archers, I'm ready for my Crucifixion! ;-)