thicketmaster
Active Member
- Messages
- 148
Lets hear what you think about about the area you hunt winter kill predictions this year? I hope we don't have another 07 winter! If we do I bet there will be a big reduction in tags!
This years deer winter kill predictions?
- Thread starter thicketmaster
- Start date
elks96
Long Time Member
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- 3,802
Lol... I would say we are a long ways from the doom and gloom. The has been adding up lately, but the deer were in incredible shape this fall. I fact I do not remember seeing healthier deer in my time. The fawns were healthy, most were big etc. our late moisture really added some great forage to be eaten now. Also we are not seeing the cold like we did back in 07 08 and really not even close to as much snow. Deer and elk around here seem to be he's
Thy and holding strong.
We still have about 6 weeks we need to dodge bitter cold and even with all this snow it it is not hard and crusted making thing easier to dig. We will have some winter kill but not the doom and gloom yet.
Thy and holding strong.
We still have about 6 weeks we need to dodge bitter cold and even with all this snow it it is not hard and crusted making thing easier to dig. We will have some winter kill but not the doom and gloom yet.
Kayak_to_hunt
Active Member
- Messages
- 308
I am seeing a lot of snow on the winter grounds here in Central Colorado - a whole lot..
From what I see it is already getting hard on the deer and we are only to the 2nd week of Feb. Still a long way to go but right now this has not been a easy winter on the deer around here.
From what I see it is already getting hard on the deer and we are only to the 2nd week of Feb. Still a long way to go but right now this has not been a easy winter on the deer around here.
Coloradoboy
Very Active Member
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- 1,388
Eagle county and Gunnison county are sitting on the fence in my opinion...
Coloradoboy
Coloradoboy
elks96
Long Time Member
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- 3,802
Again, I would have to say that in most areas we are barely above average for snow fall. But we have simply not seen the really hard cold that is so brutal on the animals. Add in the snow while a little deep is not crusted or iced it is pretty easy going. Last night it was only in the mid 30s here and today it was up in the 40 most all day. I am still seeing deer that look very healthy and most around here went into the winter in incredible shape. T was a great year for putting on fat and the deer went into things in really great shape...
I would suspect that barring a hard freeze streak of consecutive days with really cold temps we will come out of this winter in good shape. I sure am not finding the nothing on the winter range this winter like I did in 07 and 08. In that winter my note showed over 30 found dead at this point in the winter, most in groups of 3 to 4. I have only found 4 this winter all young ones and all singles.... Most likely coyote kills...
It is different in different areas, but I can tell you nw Colorado is no where close to the snow and cold we had in 07and 08
I would suspect that barring a hard freeze streak of consecutive days with really cold temps we will come out of this winter in good shape. I sure am not finding the nothing on the winter range this winter like I did in 07 and 08. In that winter my note showed over 30 found dead at this point in the winter, most in groups of 3 to 4. I have only found 4 this winter all young ones and all singles.... Most likely coyote kills...
It is different in different areas, but I can tell you nw Colorado is no where close to the snow and cold we had in 07and 08
elks sometimes you make it very hard to hold my comments on the positive side of life, but I'm sure you know more than I so by all means... enrich us with your wisdom. It is the internet after all and how much you say counts for at least as much as what you say...
In 07 and 08 I stopped counting @ 350 carcasses within sight of my house, but I'm sure your 30 is a more accurate and all encompassing view. There were more killed between dark and dawn last night within sight of my driveway than your season totals. But you saw a fat one in Oct so I'm sure there will be none killed tonight.
This one is gonna get ugly (I mean the winter I'm sure elks is a ruggedly handsome guy)
In 07 and 08 I stopped counting @ 350 carcasses within sight of my house, but I'm sure your 30 is a more accurate and all encompassing view. There were more killed between dark and dawn last night within sight of my driveway than your season totals. But you saw a fat one in Oct so I'm sure there will be none killed tonight.
This one is gonna get ugly (I mean the winter I'm sure elks is a ruggedly handsome guy)
ColoradoOak
Very Active Member
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- 1,920
At the risk of sullying my good reputation, I have to agree with squirrel on this one. There is a hell of a lot of snow in some areas of northern and central CO. Other areas are faring much better.
thicketmaster
Active Member
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- 148
I hunt in NW Colorado and this is the area I watch and I agree/ think that we have been lucky so far I just keep thinking of the 07/08 winter and the number decline of deer numbers I saw the next year. Deer numbers are still down! It would be a bad deal if we have another die off like 07/08 IMO I think the Dow should cut all doe tags period until the herd is back where it was.
elks96
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 3,802
>elks sometimes you make it very
>hard to hold my comments
>on the positive side of
>life, but I'm sure you
>know more than I so
>by all means... enrich us
>with your wisdom. It
>is the internet after all
>and how much you say
>counts for at least as
>much as what you say...
>
>
> In 07 and 08 I
>stopped counting @ 350 carcasses
>within sight of my house,
>but I'm sure your 30
>is a more accurate and
>all encompassing view. There
>were more killed between dark
>and dawn last night within
>sight of my driveway than
>your season totals. But
>you saw a fat one
>in Oct so I'm sure
>there will be none killed
>tonight.
>
>This one is gonna get ugly
>(I mean the winter I'm
>sure elks is a ruggedly
>handsome guy)
But didn't we cut back the evil governors tags that were causing all this?
Seriously I have not seen a Positive post from you unless it was your excitement about loosing opportunity. But there are just some people who can't be positive at all. While I can not dispute the fact that you found a lot of dead deer around your place, I do have my numbers. As of Feb 1 in 07/08 I had found 28 deer. By this week (Feb. 13th) that number jumped to 54. By the first week of April that number jumped to 819 deer in Colorado and 256 deer in WY. Elk were 434 dead found in 07/08. All were untouched, dead animals, none were killed by yotes and none were hit by cars etc.
This year is just not anything like 07/08. You might have isolated pockets where significant die off is occurring, 07/08 was historic in the widespread nature. Record snow was found all the way across the state and through out much of WY. Hell I have picture on the WY/CO boarder from that year of 20 foot plus tall drifts. Same area this year currently is holding 2-3 foot deep drifts and many of the south facing slopes are bare ground. My travels this winter have taken me through out the NW section of the state and there is absolutely no comparison between this year and 07/08. Especially in units 2, 10, 201, 3, 4, 5, 11, 21, 22, 211 etc... There is average snow fall in those unit. Infact I would almost say below average in 2, 3, 4 on winter grounds. And average snow fall to slightly above average in 10, 21, 22, 11, 211, 12... Around Rifle there is slightly more than average snow fall on winter ranges. Again a huge factor in this area was the late rains in the fall and the huge amount of growth our brush put on top. Most deer are still eating off the tops of plants, not needing to paw and dig.
So while you might live in an area where the deer are dropping like flies. It does not appear to be that way here in the NW. Today we lost probably 6-8 of snow depth. and temp look good for that trend to continue.
So say all you want about my devilishly good looks, but many parts of the state are in good shape. Some not so much, but to call it anything like the 07/08 winter would be a mistake. I will stand by my observations and still say that the herds around here are still looking healthy. They are still decently fat and not dropping over no where near the rates we saw in 07/08...
>hard to hold my comments
>on the positive side of
>life, but I'm sure you
>know more than I so
>by all means... enrich us
>with your wisdom. It
>is the internet after all
>and how much you say
>counts for at least as
>much as what you say...
>
>
> In 07 and 08 I
>stopped counting @ 350 carcasses
>within sight of my house,
>but I'm sure your 30
>is a more accurate and
>all encompassing view. There
>were more killed between dark
>and dawn last night within
>sight of my driveway than
>your season totals. But
>you saw a fat one
>in Oct so I'm sure
>there will be none killed
>tonight.
>
>This one is gonna get ugly
>(I mean the winter I'm
>sure elks is a ruggedly
>handsome guy)
But didn't we cut back the evil governors tags that were causing all this?
Seriously I have not seen a Positive post from you unless it was your excitement about loosing opportunity. But there are just some people who can't be positive at all. While I can not dispute the fact that you found a lot of dead deer around your place, I do have my numbers. As of Feb 1 in 07/08 I had found 28 deer. By this week (Feb. 13th) that number jumped to 54. By the first week of April that number jumped to 819 deer in Colorado and 256 deer in WY. Elk were 434 dead found in 07/08. All were untouched, dead animals, none were killed by yotes and none were hit by cars etc.
This year is just not anything like 07/08. You might have isolated pockets where significant die off is occurring, 07/08 was historic in the widespread nature. Record snow was found all the way across the state and through out much of WY. Hell I have picture on the WY/CO boarder from that year of 20 foot plus tall drifts. Same area this year currently is holding 2-3 foot deep drifts and many of the south facing slopes are bare ground. My travels this winter have taken me through out the NW section of the state and there is absolutely no comparison between this year and 07/08. Especially in units 2, 10, 201, 3, 4, 5, 11, 21, 22, 211 etc... There is average snow fall in those unit. Infact I would almost say below average in 2, 3, 4 on winter grounds. And average snow fall to slightly above average in 10, 21, 22, 11, 211, 12... Around Rifle there is slightly more than average snow fall on winter ranges. Again a huge factor in this area was the late rains in the fall and the huge amount of growth our brush put on top. Most deer are still eating off the tops of plants, not needing to paw and dig.
So while you might live in an area where the deer are dropping like flies. It does not appear to be that way here in the NW. Today we lost probably 6-8 of snow depth. and temp look good for that trend to continue.
So say all you want about my devilishly good looks, but many parts of the state are in good shape. Some not so much, but to call it anything like the 07/08 winter would be a mistake. I will stand by my observations and still say that the herds around here are still looking healthy. They are still decently fat and not dropping over no where near the rates we saw in 07/08...
elks96
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 3,802
>I hunt in NW Colorado and
>this is the area I
>watch and I agree/ think
>that we have been lucky
>so far I just keep
>thinking of the 07/08 winter
>and the number decline of
>deer numbers I saw the
>next year. Deer numbers are
>still down! It would be
>a bad deal if we
>have another die off like
>07/08 IMO I think the
>Dow should cut all doe
>tags period until the herd
>is back where it was.
>
You nailed it. It is total BS that they have any doe tags at all. With the numbers down there should not be any doe hunters at all. In 2008, the only does I saw during 2nd season were hanging in a Camp. They had 2 dead and 6 doe tags total. They had shot the only 2 doe the saw. I hunted hard that year and only found 2 bucks...
The DOW needs to look more at managing quality and not quantity. that is for sure!
>this is the area I
>watch and I agree/ think
>that we have been lucky
>so far I just keep
>thinking of the 07/08 winter
>and the number decline of
>deer numbers I saw the
>next year. Deer numbers are
>still down! It would be
>a bad deal if we
>have another die off like
>07/08 IMO I think the
>Dow should cut all doe
>tags period until the herd
>is back where it was.
>
You nailed it. It is total BS that they have any doe tags at all. With the numbers down there should not be any doe hunters at all. In 2008, the only does I saw during 2nd season were hanging in a Camp. They had 2 dead and 6 doe tags total. They had shot the only 2 doe the saw. I hunted hard that year and only found 2 bucks...
The DOW needs to look more at managing quality and not quantity. that is for sure!
Kayak_to_hunt
Active Member
- Messages
- 308
Yea if I had saved points I would start to take a look at the NW units or the SW units as the units in these area's are doing way better than the rest of us this winter. Many places in the SW part of the state were dry until just a week ago.
Elks while it might be all sun and flowers in the North West where you are this state gets very different snow fall totals and I can say for a fact that unless it warms up a whole lot that central colorado or the Gunnison and Eagle units are already having a "hard" winter and it could turn into a horrible year if this snow that as I look out my window is still falling keeps up...
One of our local ski area's has gotten over 10 feet of snow in the past week... That is over 120"... All snow pack totals in this part of the state are at or over 145% so it is significant.
Not being negative it is what it is and I work on the snow so time to get out there on the 8" to 12" that fell just last night. Here on the East side of the divide at 8,500 feet this snowpack is above the sage and frozen solid. Not a good recipe for the deer.
Elks while it might be all sun and flowers in the North West where you are this state gets very different snow fall totals and I can say for a fact that unless it warms up a whole lot that central colorado or the Gunnison and Eagle units are already having a "hard" winter and it could turn into a horrible year if this snow that as I look out my window is still falling keeps up...
One of our local ski area's has gotten over 10 feet of snow in the past week... That is over 120"... All snow pack totals in this part of the state are at or over 145% so it is significant.
Not being negative it is what it is and I work on the snow so time to get out there on the 8" to 12" that fell just last night. Here on the East side of the divide at 8,500 feet this snowpack is above the sage and frozen solid. Not a good recipe for the deer.
Kayak_to_hunt
Active Member
- Messages
- 308
LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-14 AT 07:32AM (MST)[p]Here is some more concrete data on just how much snow Central Colorado or the area's in the Gunnsion basin have received..
Mt. Crested butte has seen 4.5? of water while Schofield pass has seen a whopping 9.2 inches of snow water equivalent. This equates to a third of our seasons snowfall in 12 days.
Every where from Eagle, to Aspen, to CB, over to Leadville and down to Monarch Pass are reporting similar numbers. This snow is real in this part of the state...
Mt. Crested butte has seen 4.5? of water while Schofield pass has seen a whopping 9.2 inches of snow water equivalent. This equates to a third of our seasons snowfall in 12 days.
Every where from Eagle, to Aspen, to CB, over to Leadville and down to Monarch Pass are reporting similar numbers. This snow is real in this part of the state...
Coloradoboy
Very Active Member
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- 1,388
Elks,
Im always wondering wondering where you are reporting from.. Meeker? Craig? Rangely? Rifle? Hayden? Maybell? Surprised we've never crossed paths.
Besides the fact, from what I've seen going from the Gunnison Basin, Eagle County and Now Garfield, Rio Blanco, and pieces of Moffat County. The NW part of the state is no where in the same shape that the central part of the state from my observations. As I sit in New Castle it is currently 40 degrees and raining.. Its surprising how much more snow Gypsum/Eagle have then the lower Roaring Fork Valley does. But Eagle/Gypsum also sit almost 1000ft higher in elevation. In my opinion the deer in the NW part of the state are not at as big of disadvantage than that in the Central part of the state whose wintering grounds sit at 8k plus fit like the Gunnison Basin. I honestly don't run around all winter with a note book documenting all the deer I find dead.. I usually don't start seeing the dead loss until spring when I get out shed hunting, but I imagine I'll find a few as usual. Like others have said before me; winter's roughly half way through. And although the temps have been getting warmer Im not counting my eggs before they hatch. All it takes is a good solid week and a half-two weeks of cold weather to put things in a bind. March and April can still be brutal SOBs.
A big problem I've witnessed in NW Co is how many deer fall victim to Lions...
Coloradoboy
Im always wondering wondering where you are reporting from.. Meeker? Craig? Rangely? Rifle? Hayden? Maybell? Surprised we've never crossed paths.
Besides the fact, from what I've seen going from the Gunnison Basin, Eagle County and Now Garfield, Rio Blanco, and pieces of Moffat County. The NW part of the state is no where in the same shape that the central part of the state from my observations. As I sit in New Castle it is currently 40 degrees and raining.. Its surprising how much more snow Gypsum/Eagle have then the lower Roaring Fork Valley does. But Eagle/Gypsum also sit almost 1000ft higher in elevation. In my opinion the deer in the NW part of the state are not at as big of disadvantage than that in the Central part of the state whose wintering grounds sit at 8k plus fit like the Gunnison Basin. I honestly don't run around all winter with a note book documenting all the deer I find dead.. I usually don't start seeing the dead loss until spring when I get out shed hunting, but I imagine I'll find a few as usual. Like others have said before me; winter's roughly half way through. And although the temps have been getting warmer Im not counting my eggs before they hatch. All it takes is a good solid week and a half-two weeks of cold weather to put things in a bind. March and April can still be brutal SOBs.
A big problem I've witnessed in NW Co is how many deer fall victim to Lions...
Coloradoboy
Coloradoboy
Very Active Member
- Messages
- 1,388
>Yea if I had saved points
>I would start to take
>a look at the NW
>units or the SW units
>as the units in these
>area's are doing way better
>than the rest of us
>this winter. Many places
>in the SW part of
>the state were dry until
>just a week ago.
>
>Elks while it might be all
>sun and flowers in the
>North West where you are
>this state gets very different
>snow fall totals and I
>can say for a fact
>that unless it warms up
>a whole lot that central
>colorado or the Gunnison and
>Eagle units are already having
>a "hard" winter and it
>could turn into a horrible
>year if this snow that
>as I look out my
>window is still falling keeps
>up...
>
>One of our local ski area's
>has gotten over 10 feet
>of snow in the past
>week... That is over
>120"... All snow pack
>totals in this part of
>the state are at or
>over 145% so it is
>significant.
>
>Not being negative it is what
>it is and I work
>on the snow so time
>to get out there on
>the 8" to 12" that
>fell just last night.
>Here on the East side
>of the divide at 8,500
>feet this snowpack is above
>the sage and frozen solid.
> Not a good recipe
>for the deer.
You're right on the money
>I would start to take
>a look at the NW
>units or the SW units
>as the units in these
>area's are doing way better
>than the rest of us
>this winter. Many places
>in the SW part of
>the state were dry until
>just a week ago.
>
>Elks while it might be all
>sun and flowers in the
>North West where you are
>this state gets very different
>snow fall totals and I
>can say for a fact
>that unless it warms up
>a whole lot that central
>colorado or the Gunnison and
>Eagle units are already having
>a "hard" winter and it
>could turn into a horrible
>year if this snow that
>as I look out my
>window is still falling keeps
>up...
>
>One of our local ski area's
>has gotten over 10 feet
>of snow in the past
>week... That is over
>120"... All snow pack
>totals in this part of
>the state are at or
>over 145% so it is
>significant.
>
>Not being negative it is what
>it is and I work
>on the snow so time
>to get out there on
>the 8" to 12" that
>fell just last night.
>Here on the East side
>of the divide at 8,500
>feet this snowpack is above
>the sage and frozen solid.
> Not a good recipe
>for the deer.
You're right on the money
DesertGhillie
Active Member
- Messages
- 271
LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-14 AT 11:01AM (MST)[p]When the winter is over, we'll see how it faired. After my last squabble, I think we all fight over useless sh*t! Everyone thinks they're the Oracle on hunting. We should be rallying rather than arguing. Like on the fact that we all have to apply for tags we don't even know the alloted numbers for! We should apply in late May, and get our tags in June/July. Get it together DOW!
tailchasers
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 5,313
LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-14 AT 03:38PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-14 AT 03:36?PM (MST)
LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-14 AT 03:36?PM (MST)
http://cwcb.state.co.us/public-info...ility-task-forces/Documents/DroughtUpdate.pdf
Colorado Drought Update.
ftp://ftp-fc.sc.egov.usda.gov/CO/Snow/snow/watershed/daily/co_update_snow.pdf
Colorado Snow Pack
This might offer some insight.
"Courage is being scared to death but saddling up anyway."
LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-14 AT 03:36?PM (MST)
http://cwcb.state.co.us/public-info...ility-task-forces/Documents/DroughtUpdate.pdf
Colorado Drought Update.
ftp://ftp-fc.sc.egov.usda.gov/CO/Snow/snow/watershed/daily/co_update_snow.pdf
Colorado Snow Pack
This might offer some insight.
"Courage is being scared to death but saddling up anyway."
Not sure any of us are experts on exact numbers but some of us can share our observations.
Grand Junction-Hotchkiss-Paonia-Somerset- area does not look too bad...Although recent rain(yes I said rain)on lower winter range could cause problems if it gets cold. Higher elevations have more than normal snow levels but looks good for water availability for game in spring-summer areas for those that make it. Deer numbers still down compared to before 07-08. Elk numbers seem to be holding steady and in some areas trending up a little.
Higher units near Gunnison look like winter wonderland and not looking good in my opinion.
Grand Junction-Hotchkiss-Paonia-Somerset- area does not look too bad...Although recent rain(yes I said rain)on lower winter range could cause problems if it gets cold. Higher elevations have more than normal snow levels but looks good for water availability for game in spring-summer areas for those that make it. Deer numbers still down compared to before 07-08. Elk numbers seem to be holding steady and in some areas trending up a little.
Higher units near Gunnison look like winter wonderland and not looking good in my opinion.
tailchasers
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 5,313
Unit 10 is in very poor shape. Deer numbers are slow low the numbers don't even seem realistic. The winter kills and predation have been devasting. Gonna be a while before it comes around.
"Courage is being scared to death but saddling up anyway."
"Courage is being scared to death but saddling up anyway."
elks96
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 3,802
>Elks,
>Im always wondering wondering where you
>are reporting from.. Meeker? Craig?
>Rangely? Rifle? Hayden? Maybell? Surprised
>we've never crossed paths.
>Besides the fact, from what I've
>seen going from the Gunnison
>Basin, Eagle County and Now
>Garfield, Rio Blanco, and pieces
>of Moffat County. The NW
>part of the state is
>no where in the
>same shape that the central
>part of the state from
>my observations. As I sit
>in New Castle it is
>currently 40 degrees and raining..
>Its surprising how much more
>snow Gypsum/Eagle have then the
>lower Roaring Fork Valley does.
>But Eagle/Gypsum also sit almost
>1000ft higher in elevation. In
>my opinion the deer in
>the NW part of the
>state are not at as
> big of disadvantage than
>that in the Central part
>of the state whose wintering
>grounds sit at 8k plus
>fit like the Gunnison Basin.
> I honestly don't run
>around all winter with a
>note book documenting all the
>deer I find dead.. I
>usually don't start seeing the
>dead loss until spring when
>I get out shed hunting,
>but I imagine I'll find
>a few as usual. Like
>others have said before me;
>winter's roughly half way through.
>And although the temps have
>been getting warmer Im not
>counting my eggs before they
>hatch. All it takes is
>a good solid week and
>a half-two weeks of cold
>weather to put things in
>a bind. March and April
>can still be brutal SOBs.
>
>A big problem I've witnessed in
>NW Co is how many
>deer fall victim to Lions...
>
>
>Coloradoboy
To answer your questions. I currently am in Rifle. In 07/08 I lived in Craig, worked in Hayden and then moved to Rangely and am now in Rifle. To answer your questions, I try to keep a journal of every day I am in the field. I started this journal in 2001, and I try to document what I see every day. Most of my time out this time of year is predator hunting, calling and some trapping. When I lived in Craig I spent much more time further north along the WY/CO border and now I am in rifle I spend a bunch of time in 10/11/21/22 and not as much time in Craig. I do however have lots of friends still in Craig and get up there a couple times each winter.
My journal is pretty complete. I can look in it and typically see the temps(according to truck), wind speed direction, sky conditions, etc. I also can tell you where I was, how many calling stands I made, number of coyotes seen, number called, number shot at, number missed, etc. It notes other hunters if any, and usually anything else out of ordinary. For most winters I have no winter kill data, but I did keep the data in 2007/2008 as that winter was unreal(and had reported dead elk that were being shot and left for dead by a rancher in that area). I am not making it point to find deer like I did in 07/08, just noting what I have seen in units 21/22/10/11 this year. My good buddy is keeping informed with what he is seeing further north.
It is a neat thing to have, but unfortunately the Journal is something that is really complete at times and not as complete other times.
It is a cool thing to have... Kind of like a man diary...
This last weekend I went through Eagle County and agree the snow id deeper and was getting added too as we speak, but temps were warm in upper 20s and lower 30s. I also agree it is too soon to say with a 100% ability what things will be like, but I can not see us loosing the total deer on a state wide level like we did in 2007/2008. that winter was unreal and the snow issues stretched from Durango all the way to Lander/Muddy Gap areas of WY.
Also realize that the original question is what we are seeing where we hunt... Thus my take in the NW is going to different than that of the central mountains, Durango, etc
This year I have not been out as much as usual, but still have 46 days in the field since Sept. 1.
The other thing that really screwed the deer in 07/08 was the DOW did not drop the tag numbers like they should have, infact I remember being in a meeting where the DOW person from Craig, called it a normal Mortality year and that feeding was not needed, and that counts indicated no need to reduce tag numbers. LOL! Talk about making a guy see red. Hopefully if they do have a die off this year they will be smart enough to cut tags back right away instead of waiting a year.
>Im always wondering wondering where you
>are reporting from.. Meeker? Craig?
>Rangely? Rifle? Hayden? Maybell? Surprised
>we've never crossed paths.
>Besides the fact, from what I've
>seen going from the Gunnison
>Basin, Eagle County and Now
>Garfield, Rio Blanco, and pieces
>of Moffat County. The NW
>part of the state is
>no where in the
>same shape that the central
>part of the state from
>my observations. As I sit
>in New Castle it is
>currently 40 degrees and raining..
>Its surprising how much more
>snow Gypsum/Eagle have then the
>lower Roaring Fork Valley does.
>But Eagle/Gypsum also sit almost
>1000ft higher in elevation. In
>my opinion the deer in
>the NW part of the
>state are not at as
> big of disadvantage than
>that in the Central part
>of the state whose wintering
>grounds sit at 8k plus
>fit like the Gunnison Basin.
> I honestly don't run
>around all winter with a
>note book documenting all the
>deer I find dead.. I
>usually don't start seeing the
>dead loss until spring when
>I get out shed hunting,
>but I imagine I'll find
>a few as usual. Like
>others have said before me;
>winter's roughly half way through.
>And although the temps have
>been getting warmer Im not
>counting my eggs before they
>hatch. All it takes is
>a good solid week and
>a half-two weeks of cold
>weather to put things in
>a bind. March and April
>can still be brutal SOBs.
>
>A big problem I've witnessed in
>NW Co is how many
>deer fall victim to Lions...
>
>
>Coloradoboy
To answer your questions. I currently am in Rifle. In 07/08 I lived in Craig, worked in Hayden and then moved to Rangely and am now in Rifle. To answer your questions, I try to keep a journal of every day I am in the field. I started this journal in 2001, and I try to document what I see every day. Most of my time out this time of year is predator hunting, calling and some trapping. When I lived in Craig I spent much more time further north along the WY/CO border and now I am in rifle I spend a bunch of time in 10/11/21/22 and not as much time in Craig. I do however have lots of friends still in Craig and get up there a couple times each winter.
My journal is pretty complete. I can look in it and typically see the temps(according to truck), wind speed direction, sky conditions, etc. I also can tell you where I was, how many calling stands I made, number of coyotes seen, number called, number shot at, number missed, etc. It notes other hunters if any, and usually anything else out of ordinary. For most winters I have no winter kill data, but I did keep the data in 2007/2008 as that winter was unreal(and had reported dead elk that were being shot and left for dead by a rancher in that area). I am not making it point to find deer like I did in 07/08, just noting what I have seen in units 21/22/10/11 this year. My good buddy is keeping informed with what he is seeing further north.
It is a neat thing to have, but unfortunately the Journal is something that is really complete at times and not as complete other times.
It is a cool thing to have... Kind of like a man diary...
This last weekend I went through Eagle County and agree the snow id deeper and was getting added too as we speak, but temps were warm in upper 20s and lower 30s. I also agree it is too soon to say with a 100% ability what things will be like, but I can not see us loosing the total deer on a state wide level like we did in 2007/2008. that winter was unreal and the snow issues stretched from Durango all the way to Lander/Muddy Gap areas of WY.
Also realize that the original question is what we are seeing where we hunt... Thus my take in the NW is going to different than that of the central mountains, Durango, etc
This year I have not been out as much as usual, but still have 46 days in the field since Sept. 1.
The other thing that really screwed the deer in 07/08 was the DOW did not drop the tag numbers like they should have, infact I remember being in a meeting where the DOW person from Craig, called it a normal Mortality year and that feeding was not needed, and that counts indicated no need to reduce tag numbers. LOL! Talk about making a guy see red. Hopefully if they do have a die off this year they will be smart enough to cut tags back right away instead of waiting a year.
elks96
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 3,802
>Unit 10 is in very poor
>shape. Deer numbers are slow
>low the numbers don't even
>seem realistic. The winter kills
>and predation have been devasting.
>Gonna be a while before
>it comes around.
>
>
>"Courage is being scared to death
>but saddling up anyway."
Unit 10 has been in the dumps for a long time. Winters, too many elk, too many lions, too many bobcats, too many yotes, etc. Not to mention the range in the unit sucks (too many weeds, and sheep as well).
I would not even consider a unit 10 tag if it was 3 points to draw a 3rd season tag.
>shape. Deer numbers are slow
>low the numbers don't even
>seem realistic. The winter kills
>and predation have been devasting.
>Gonna be a while before
>it comes around.
>
>
>"Courage is being scared to death
>but saddling up anyway."
Unit 10 has been in the dumps for a long time. Winters, too many elk, too many lions, too many bobcats, too many yotes, etc. Not to mention the range in the unit sucks (too many weeds, and sheep as well).
I would not even consider a unit 10 tag if it was 3 points to draw a 3rd season tag.
Coloradoboy
Very Active Member
- Messages
- 1,388
>>Elks,
>>Im always wondering wondering where you
>>are reporting from.. Meeker? Craig?
>>Rangely? Rifle? Hayden? Maybell? Surprised
>>we've never crossed paths.
>>Besides the fact, from what I've
>>seen going from the Gunnison
>>Basin, Eagle County and Now
>>Garfield, Rio Blanco, and pieces
>>of Moffat County. The NW
>>part of the state is
>>no where in the
>>same shape that the central
>>part of the state from
>>my observations. As I sit
>>in New Castle it is
>>currently 40 degrees and raining..
>>Its surprising how much more
>>snow Gypsum/Eagle have then the
>>lower Roaring Fork Valley does.
>>But Eagle/Gypsum also sit almost
>>1000ft higher in elevation. In
>>my opinion the deer in
>>the NW part of the
>>state are not at as
>> big of disadvantage than
>>that in the Central part
>>of the state whose wintering
>>grounds sit at 8k plus
>>fit like the Gunnison Basin.
>> I honestly don't run
>>around all winter with a
>>note book documenting all the
>>deer I find dead.. I
>>usually don't start seeing the
>>dead loss until spring when
>>I get out shed hunting,
>>but I imagine I'll find
>>a few as usual. Like
>>others have said before me;
>>winter's roughly half way through.
>>And although the temps have
>>been getting warmer Im not
>>counting my eggs before they
>>hatch. All it takes is
>>a good solid week and
>>a half-two weeks of cold
>>weather to put things in
>>a bind. March and April
>>can still be brutal SOBs.
>>
>>A big problem I've witnessed in
>>NW Co is how many
>>deer fall victim to Lions...
>>
>>
>>Coloradoboy
>
>To answer your questions. I currently
>am in Rifle. In 07/08
>I lived in Craig, worked
>in Hayden and then moved
>to Rangely and am now
>in Rifle. To answer your
>questions, I try to keep
>a journal of every day
>I am in the field.
>I started this journal in
>2001, and I try to
>document what I see every
>day. Most of my time
>out this time of year
>is predator hunting, calling and
>some trapping. When I lived
>in Craig I spent much
>more time further north along
>the WY/CO border and now
>I am in rifle I
>spend a bunch of time
>in 10/11/21/22 and not as
>much time in Craig. I
>do however have lots of
>friends still in Craig and
>get up there a couple
>times each winter.
>
>My journal is pretty complete. I
>can look in it and
>typically see the temps(according to
>truck), wind speed direction, sky
>conditions, etc. I also can
>tell you where I was,
>how many calling stands I
>made, number of coyotes seen,
>number called, number shot at,
>number missed, etc. It notes
>other hunters if any, and
>usually anything else out of
>ordinary. For most winters I
>have no winter kill data,
>but I did keep the
>data in 2007/2008 as that
>winter was unreal(and had reported
>dead elk that were being
>shot and left for dead
>by a rancher in that
>area). I am not making
>it point to find deer
>like I did in 07/08,
>just noting what I have
>seen in units 21/22/10/11 this
>year. My good buddy is
>keeping informed with what he
>is seeing further north.
>
>It is a neat thing to
>have, but unfortunately the Journal
>is something that is really
>complete at times and not
>as complete other times.
>
>It is a cool thing to
>have... Kind of like a
>man diary...
>
>This last weekend I went through
>Eagle County and agree the
>snow id deeper and was
>getting added too as we
>speak, but temps were warm
>in upper 20s and lower
>30s. I also agree it
>is too soon to say
>with a 100% ability what
>things will be like, but
>I can not see us
>loosing the total deer on
>a state wide level like
>we did in 2007/2008. that
>winter was unreal and the
>snow issues stretched from Durango
>all the way to Lander/Muddy
>Gap areas of WY.
>
>Also realize that the original question
>is what we are seeing
>where we hunt... Thus my
>take in the NW is
>going to different than that
>of the central mountains, Durango,
>etc
>
>This year I have not been
>out as much as usual,
>but still have 46 days
>in the field since Sept.
>1.
>
>The other thing that really screwed
>the deer in 07/08 was
>the DOW did not drop
>the tag numbers like they
>should have, infact I remember
>being in a meeting where
>the DOW person from Craig,
>called it a normal Mortality
>year and that feeding was
>not needed, and that counts
>indicated no need to reduce
>tag numbers. LOL! Talk about
>making a guy see red.
>Hopefully if they do have
>a die off this year
>they will be smart enough
>to cut tags back right
>away instead of waiting a
>year.
Very meticulous you are indeed. I might have to start doing that when my CRS syndrome worsens at old age. CRS= Can't Remember Sh*t LOL
Rifle eh? Im right up the valley from you at the moment in good ol' Screw Castle.
Coloradoboy
>>Im always wondering wondering where you
>>are reporting from.. Meeker? Craig?
>>Rangely? Rifle? Hayden? Maybell? Surprised
>>we've never crossed paths.
>>Besides the fact, from what I've
>>seen going from the Gunnison
>>Basin, Eagle County and Now
>>Garfield, Rio Blanco, and pieces
>>of Moffat County. The NW
>>part of the state is
>>no where in the
>>same shape that the central
>>part of the state from
>>my observations. As I sit
>>in New Castle it is
>>currently 40 degrees and raining..
>>Its surprising how much more
>>snow Gypsum/Eagle have then the
>>lower Roaring Fork Valley does.
>>But Eagle/Gypsum also sit almost
>>1000ft higher in elevation. In
>>my opinion the deer in
>>the NW part of the
>>state are not at as
>> big of disadvantage than
>>that in the Central part
>>of the state whose wintering
>>grounds sit at 8k plus
>>fit like the Gunnison Basin.
>> I honestly don't run
>>around all winter with a
>>note book documenting all the
>>deer I find dead.. I
>>usually don't start seeing the
>>dead loss until spring when
>>I get out shed hunting,
>>but I imagine I'll find
>>a few as usual. Like
>>others have said before me;
>>winter's roughly half way through.
>>And although the temps have
>>been getting warmer Im not
>>counting my eggs before they
>>hatch. All it takes is
>>a good solid week and
>>a half-two weeks of cold
>>weather to put things in
>>a bind. March and April
>>can still be brutal SOBs.
>>
>>A big problem I've witnessed in
>>NW Co is how many
>>deer fall victim to Lions...
>>
>>
>>Coloradoboy
>
>To answer your questions. I currently
>am in Rifle. In 07/08
>I lived in Craig, worked
>in Hayden and then moved
>to Rangely and am now
>in Rifle. To answer your
>questions, I try to keep
>a journal of every day
>I am in the field.
>I started this journal in
>2001, and I try to
>document what I see every
>day. Most of my time
>out this time of year
>is predator hunting, calling and
>some trapping. When I lived
>in Craig I spent much
>more time further north along
>the WY/CO border and now
>I am in rifle I
>spend a bunch of time
>in 10/11/21/22 and not as
>much time in Craig. I
>do however have lots of
>friends still in Craig and
>get up there a couple
>times each winter.
>
>My journal is pretty complete. I
>can look in it and
>typically see the temps(according to
>truck), wind speed direction, sky
>conditions, etc. I also can
>tell you where I was,
>how many calling stands I
>made, number of coyotes seen,
>number called, number shot at,
>number missed, etc. It notes
>other hunters if any, and
>usually anything else out of
>ordinary. For most winters I
>have no winter kill data,
>but I did keep the
>data in 2007/2008 as that
>winter was unreal(and had reported
>dead elk that were being
>shot and left for dead
>by a rancher in that
>area). I am not making
>it point to find deer
>like I did in 07/08,
>just noting what I have
>seen in units 21/22/10/11 this
>year. My good buddy is
>keeping informed with what he
>is seeing further north.
>
>It is a neat thing to
>have, but unfortunately the Journal
>is something that is really
>complete at times and not
>as complete other times.
>
>It is a cool thing to
>have... Kind of like a
>man diary...
>
>This last weekend I went through
>Eagle County and agree the
>snow id deeper and was
>getting added too as we
>speak, but temps were warm
>in upper 20s and lower
>30s. I also agree it
>is too soon to say
>with a 100% ability what
>things will be like, but
>I can not see us
>loosing the total deer on
>a state wide level like
>we did in 2007/2008. that
>winter was unreal and the
>snow issues stretched from Durango
>all the way to Lander/Muddy
>Gap areas of WY.
>
>Also realize that the original question
>is what we are seeing
>where we hunt... Thus my
>take in the NW is
>going to different than that
>of the central mountains, Durango,
>etc
>
>This year I have not been
>out as much as usual,
>but still have 46 days
>in the field since Sept.
>1.
>
>The other thing that really screwed
>the deer in 07/08 was
>the DOW did not drop
>the tag numbers like they
>should have, infact I remember
>being in a meeting where
>the DOW person from Craig,
>called it a normal Mortality
>year and that feeding was
>not needed, and that counts
>indicated no need to reduce
>tag numbers. LOL! Talk about
>making a guy see red.
>Hopefully if they do have
>a die off this year
>they will be smart enough
>to cut tags back right
>away instead of waiting a
>year.
Very meticulous you are indeed. I might have to start doing that when my CRS syndrome worsens at old age. CRS= Can't Remember Sh*t LOL
Rifle eh? Im right up the valley from you at the moment in good ol' Screw Castle.
Coloradoboy
Oak that had to hurt... rub some dirt on it.
The winter range is emptying out and the dying range is getting loaded up. I saw a multi hundreds nose-tail line of deer headed down into the "corridor of death" (I-70) 2 days ago. 30- 40 nice bucks in there but where they are headed nothing good awaits them.
Damn horn hunters are already busting them out of their micro - habitats into the deep stuff, eagles are looking fat and happy though. Older does are still slick haired for the most part, fawns are starting to "fuzz up", not good for this stage of winter. Another foot expected and most basins are running 125%- 150% of average, ugly indeed.
The winter range is emptying out and the dying range is getting loaded up. I saw a multi hundreds nose-tail line of deer headed down into the "corridor of death" (I-70) 2 days ago. 30- 40 nice bucks in there but where they are headed nothing good awaits them.
Damn horn hunters are already busting them out of their micro - habitats into the deep stuff, eagles are looking fat and happy though. Older does are still slick haired for the most part, fawns are starting to "fuzz up", not good for this stage of winter. Another foot expected and most basins are running 125%- 150% of average, ugly indeed.
bragabit
Active Member
- Messages
- 811
I have been watching the weather for the Eagle area. It showed 45 most of the day with south winds. I hope that the "warm" winds will cut the snow pack down fast. Accuweather is predicting 50 for Saturday. I was just looking for an update to if the sage and other browse is starting to break throught the snow?
Coloradoboy
Very Active Member
- Messages
- 1,388
>I have been watching the weather
>for the Eagle area.
>It showed 45 most of
>the day with south winds.
> I hope that the
>"warm" winds will cut the
>snow pack down fast.
>Accuweather is predicting 50 for
>Saturday. I was just
>looking for an update to
> if the sage and
>other browse is starting to
>break throught the snow?
It was warm to day. It has been warming up the past few days and the snow has been melting on the south facing slopes. It is supposed to snow a couple inches tomorrow, havent seen any extreme cold forcasted for the future so things are looking good so far.
Coloradoboy
>for the Eagle area.
>It showed 45 most of
>the day with south winds.
> I hope that the
>"warm" winds will cut the
>snow pack down fast.
>Accuweather is predicting 50 for
>Saturday. I was just
>looking for an update to
> if the sage and
>other browse is starting to
>break throught the snow?
It was warm to day. It has been warming up the past few days and the snow has been melting on the south facing slopes. It is supposed to snow a couple inches tomorrow, havent seen any extreme cold forcasted for the future so things are looking good so far.
Coloradoboy
elks96
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 3,802
LAST EDITED ON Feb-23-14 AT 08:34PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Feb-23-14 AT 06:36?PM (MST)
Let's see here ... Temps in the 40s and fifties with some wind and rain. All south facing slopes from eagle to rifle are melted off with green growing. Things have been warm and melting fast we had out snow pile go from 4 foot high in our front yard to a wet spot on the grass....
My adventures took me up to Walcott and back this weekend. Also drove through a good chunk of 42 tonight and still see good fat healthy deer.
Also I talked with biologist from Meeker area where they have been collaring a bunch of deer. They have seen a higher fawn survival rate thus far and actually deer weights are as high as they have ever seen in the meeker area. Take it how you want but things are in pretty good shape state wide with a few pockets of higher than normal snow on the winter grounds.
Let's see here ... Temps in the 40s and fifties with some wind and rain. All south facing slopes from eagle to rifle are melted off with green growing. Things have been warm and melting fast we had out snow pile go from 4 foot high in our front yard to a wet spot on the grass....
My adventures took me up to Walcott and back this weekend. Also drove through a good chunk of 42 tonight and still see good fat healthy deer.
Also I talked with biologist from Meeker area where they have been collaring a bunch of deer. They have seen a higher fawn survival rate thus far and actually deer weights are as high as they have ever seen in the meeker area. Take it how you want but things are in pretty good shape state wide with a few pockets of higher than normal snow on the winter grounds.
elks96
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 3,802
LAST EDITED ON Feb-23-14 AT 06:45PM (MST)[p]For what it is worth.... From DOW this last week.
This email provides general background on the conditions that Colorado?s big game have experienced so far this winter.
Colorado?s big game herds have adapted to survive the typical snowfall and cold temperatures that occur during most winters. The animals generally seek lower elevations and south facing slopes where lower snow depths allow access to forage. However, if deep and crusted snow and extreme cold temperatures remain for extended periods, the conditions can deplete the animals? resources, resulting in starvation and higher mortality. In Colorado, deer and bighorn sheep are usually the first species impacted when extreme cold and deep snow persist in winter range.
Throughout each winter, our wildlife managers and biologists monitor big game herds, visually assessing the animals? body condition. This includes gathering an index of body fat content from the examination of bone marrow from road-killed deer and elk. In addition they observe herd activity and snow conditions while conducting annual ground and aerial surveys during the winter.
Through the end of January, we have seen normal winter conditions in the Northeast, Southeast and Southwest regions. Snow depths and temperatures have not been excessively cold.
Until recently, conditions in the Northwest region have also been near normal; however, heavy snow accumulations from late January storms have changed conditions for big game.
Elk and deer herds wintering in the Eagle, Vail and Middle Park areas are being closely monitored. Wildlife managers in the area are reporting snow accumulations far exceeding normal conditions on the winter range for this time of year. Given current conditions, they do not foresee widespread losses of deer and elk; however, weather forecast indicate that the area may experience additional heavy snowfall. Regardless, it will be difficult for wildlife managers to make future 'crystal ball' type predictions regarding what the rest of the winter and mother nature may inflict on our wildlife.
In Area 6, the far northwest corner of the state, survival rates have been very high (mid 90%); however, mortality could increase rapidly in the coming weeks given the heavy snow and colder temperatures that came in early December and late January. Current snow conditions are difficult on most winter ranges due to snow crusting that occurred after the snow melted during a period of warm weather in late December into early January.
On the positive side, the area biologist reports that in the White River herd, fawn weights were up across the board and body condition for does was higher than past years in the Piceance. This should translate into better odds for survival than in years past.
Commissioners and CPW employees may receive questions from the public about this winter?s impact on big game and well-intentioned individuals may request that CPW initiate a feeding program in the Northwest Region to reduce losses in some herds.
We appreciate and share the public?s concern for wildlife, but Colorado?s experience with emergency winter feeding is that it is warranted only in extreme conditions and by policy, is not initiated until winter-related mortality is anticipated to exceed 30% of a major big game population.
Given that the onset of severe conditions in parts of Northwest Colorado did not occur until late in the season, we do not expect widespread losses exceeding this threshold.
It is important to consider that feeding can cause more harm than good. It can result in an increase of disease transmission by concentrating big game animals. It can lead to habitat damage due to over-browsing and can alter the normal winter movement patterns of the animals. In addition a feeding operation requires a tremendous commitment of personnel, equipment and funding. Most significantly, previous feeding programs initiated by Colorado Parks and Wildlife have not significantly improved the survival of the animals.
Therefore, we are not contemplating a feeding program in Northwest Colorado at this time.
It is important to know that CPW distinguishes between 'winter feeding', conducted for the purpose of reducing big game mortality, and 'baiting', which is used to redistribute animals to reduce game damage liability and for other management purposes.
While CPW does not believe that conditions warranting winter feeding are currently present in the NW Region, there may be instances during the remainder of the winter where baiting, particularly for elk and usually involving placement of hay, may be necessary to ease conflicts with ranching operations or move animals away from highways or for other redistribution
This email provides general background on the conditions that Colorado?s big game have experienced so far this winter.
Colorado?s big game herds have adapted to survive the typical snowfall and cold temperatures that occur during most winters. The animals generally seek lower elevations and south facing slopes where lower snow depths allow access to forage. However, if deep and crusted snow and extreme cold temperatures remain for extended periods, the conditions can deplete the animals? resources, resulting in starvation and higher mortality. In Colorado, deer and bighorn sheep are usually the first species impacted when extreme cold and deep snow persist in winter range.
Throughout each winter, our wildlife managers and biologists monitor big game herds, visually assessing the animals? body condition. This includes gathering an index of body fat content from the examination of bone marrow from road-killed deer and elk. In addition they observe herd activity and snow conditions while conducting annual ground and aerial surveys during the winter.
Through the end of January, we have seen normal winter conditions in the Northeast, Southeast and Southwest regions. Snow depths and temperatures have not been excessively cold.
Until recently, conditions in the Northwest region have also been near normal; however, heavy snow accumulations from late January storms have changed conditions for big game.
Elk and deer herds wintering in the Eagle, Vail and Middle Park areas are being closely monitored. Wildlife managers in the area are reporting snow accumulations far exceeding normal conditions on the winter range for this time of year. Given current conditions, they do not foresee widespread losses of deer and elk; however, weather forecast indicate that the area may experience additional heavy snowfall. Regardless, it will be difficult for wildlife managers to make future 'crystal ball' type predictions regarding what the rest of the winter and mother nature may inflict on our wildlife.
In Area 6, the far northwest corner of the state, survival rates have been very high (mid 90%); however, mortality could increase rapidly in the coming weeks given the heavy snow and colder temperatures that came in early December and late January. Current snow conditions are difficult on most winter ranges due to snow crusting that occurred after the snow melted during a period of warm weather in late December into early January.
On the positive side, the area biologist reports that in the White River herd, fawn weights were up across the board and body condition for does was higher than past years in the Piceance. This should translate into better odds for survival than in years past.
Commissioners and CPW employees may receive questions from the public about this winter?s impact on big game and well-intentioned individuals may request that CPW initiate a feeding program in the Northwest Region to reduce losses in some herds.
We appreciate and share the public?s concern for wildlife, but Colorado?s experience with emergency winter feeding is that it is warranted only in extreme conditions and by policy, is not initiated until winter-related mortality is anticipated to exceed 30% of a major big game population.
Given that the onset of severe conditions in parts of Northwest Colorado did not occur until late in the season, we do not expect widespread losses exceeding this threshold.
It is important to consider that feeding can cause more harm than good. It can result in an increase of disease transmission by concentrating big game animals. It can lead to habitat damage due to over-browsing and can alter the normal winter movement patterns of the animals. In addition a feeding operation requires a tremendous commitment of personnel, equipment and funding. Most significantly, previous feeding programs initiated by Colorado Parks and Wildlife have not significantly improved the survival of the animals.
Therefore, we are not contemplating a feeding program in Northwest Colorado at this time.
It is important to know that CPW distinguishes between 'winter feeding', conducted for the purpose of reducing big game mortality, and 'baiting', which is used to redistribute animals to reduce game damage liability and for other management purposes.
While CPW does not believe that conditions warranting winter feeding are currently present in the NW Region, there may be instances during the remainder of the winter where baiting, particularly for elk and usually involving placement of hay, may be necessary to ease conflicts with ranching operations or move animals away from highways or for other redistribution
Coloradoboy
Very Active Member
- Messages
- 1,388
>Been about 10 days since
>the last post. Any news
>ColoBoy or Squirrel ? Many
>dead deer on the I-70
>or Gunnison?? Got my fingers
>crossed. Thanks.
I don't have time to read elks report... but I do spend about every day in the eagle valley working and recreating so I have a fair idea as to whats going on...
Heres all you need to know from the DOW's synopsis..
"Elk and deer herds wintering in the Eagle, Vail and Middle Park areas are being closely monitored. Wildlife managers in the area are reporting snow accumulations far exceeding normal conditions on the winter range for this time of year. Given current conditions, they do not foresee widespread losses of deer and elk; however, weather forecast indicate that the area may experience additional heavy snowfall. Regardless, it will be difficult for wildlife managers to make future 'crystal ball' type predictions regarding what the rest of the winter and mother nature may inflict on our wildlife."
It was warm today though in Minturn where I was wokring today but the snow is on its way supposably, Alot of the elk and deer have pushed clear down to the I70 corridor. A ranch outside of eagle on the southside of the highway, heading towards Wolcott has been haying 40 to 50 head every day. Deer are looking in fair shape..... On a sad note I did stumble upon two dead deer (doe and fawn) this past weekend out looking for lion tracks...
Coloradoboy
>the last post. Any news
>ColoBoy or Squirrel ? Many
>dead deer on the I-70
>or Gunnison?? Got my fingers
>crossed. Thanks.
I don't have time to read elks report... but I do spend about every day in the eagle valley working and recreating so I have a fair idea as to whats going on...
Heres all you need to know from the DOW's synopsis..
"Elk and deer herds wintering in the Eagle, Vail and Middle Park areas are being closely monitored. Wildlife managers in the area are reporting snow accumulations far exceeding normal conditions on the winter range for this time of year. Given current conditions, they do not foresee widespread losses of deer and elk; however, weather forecast indicate that the area may experience additional heavy snowfall. Regardless, it will be difficult for wildlife managers to make future 'crystal ball' type predictions regarding what the rest of the winter and mother nature may inflict on our wildlife."
It was warm today though in Minturn where I was wokring today but the snow is on its way supposably, Alot of the elk and deer have pushed clear down to the I70 corridor. A ranch outside of eagle on the southside of the highway, heading towards Wolcott has been haying 40 to 50 head every day. Deer are looking in fair shape..... On a sad note I did stumble upon two dead deer (doe and fawn) this past weekend out looking for lion tracks...
Coloradoboy
seeds and stems here...
We had some big dumps of snow (bad)
We had a HUGE meltdown for 4 days with a bit of a breeze (108MPH on Kenosha) This took little knife edges on what I call the "stony/bony ridges" (cause that is generally all that is there, rocks and skeletons) this was good...kinda
We got winter back and the crust is like I've never seen before.
A guy shot 4 cows the other day and the herd ran for a couple miles and he said not one elk broke through the entire time he watched them go (100 head). The deer and elk can walk anywhere on the crust they want in the am. Trouble is they have nowhere to go but the stony/bonys and it is standing room only there, there was food on the stony/bonys from our incredible wet summer but it can't support 100 elk/acre for long.
This one is going to be bad how bad remains to be seen, one month to go to be sure.
On a mild winter the eagles have to fish for a living.
On a normal winter they eat red meat for a living.
On a hard winter they never feed on the same carcass for 2 days (it freezes, and the good parts have already been et)
On a killer winter they fly from one to another and never return living off eyeballs and axxholes.
The eagles are now in between #3 and #4, happy eagles are never a good sign.
What is the possession limit on baldys anyway?? I couldn't find it in the brochure, musta been an oversight at the printer.
We had some big dumps of snow (bad)
We had a HUGE meltdown for 4 days with a bit of a breeze (108MPH on Kenosha) This took little knife edges on what I call the "stony/bony ridges" (cause that is generally all that is there, rocks and skeletons) this was good...kinda
We got winter back and the crust is like I've never seen before.
A guy shot 4 cows the other day and the herd ran for a couple miles and he said not one elk broke through the entire time he watched them go (100 head). The deer and elk can walk anywhere on the crust they want in the am. Trouble is they have nowhere to go but the stony/bonys and it is standing room only there, there was food on the stony/bonys from our incredible wet summer but it can't support 100 elk/acre for long.
This one is going to be bad how bad remains to be seen, one month to go to be sure.
On a mild winter the eagles have to fish for a living.
On a normal winter they eat red meat for a living.
On a hard winter they never feed on the same carcass for 2 days (it freezes, and the good parts have already been et)
On a killer winter they fly from one to another and never return living off eyeballs and axxholes.
The eagles are now in between #3 and #4, happy eagles are never a good sign.
What is the possession limit on baldys anyway?? I couldn't find it in the brochure, musta been an oversight at the printer.
Tomichi
Active Member
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Squirrel I think Golden?s are 3 a day 6 in possession
And Bald?s are 2 a day 4 in possession.
You should probably check that out just to be safe.
I'm pretty sure I saw it on the internet so it has to be true!
I don't mess with them much; the wife thinks they taste like sage grouse.
And Bald?s are 2 a day 4 in possession.
You should probably check that out just to be safe.
I'm pretty sure I saw it on the internet so it has to be true!
I don't mess with them much; the wife thinks they taste like sage grouse.
Tell the Mrs. to boil them first and change the water a couple times like you do with spring bear meat, then bbq with spicy sauce, you'll be amazed.
Last time they sent over Heinrich Himmler (MC) to the house and I handed him a gorgeous Baldy out of the freezer the look on his face was priceless. I thought he was going to go face down right there in my garage. He wanted to shoot me, baton me, cuff me, but in the end he had to say Thank you and walk away, it had to almost kill the bastard... priceless.
Last time they sent over Heinrich Himmler (MC) to the house and I handed him a gorgeous Baldy out of the freezer the look on his face was priceless. I thought he was going to go face down right there in my garage. He wanted to shoot me, baton me, cuff me, but in the end he had to say Thank you and walk away, it had to almost kill the bastard... priceless.
Tomichi
Active Member
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Gunnison is in good shape now. The coyotes are doing well on top of the crust and getting their share plus some of ours. south slopes are bare near the valley floor but it is still deep above them. It is still a very small basin if you are a mule deer. Road kill has been significant but not horrific. The shed season hits them the 15th....I wish we could push it back to the first of April for 2014 but it isn't a very fluid regulation. wish we didnt need it at all but some folk,s behavior made it mandatory..
There are some shed bucks looking pretty tough right now. over all just a normal winter at 8000 feet,but it has been warmer then I thought it would be.
None of my family will burn points this year. I will hunt archery but not gunny winter deer....just the summer vacation deer.
There are some shed bucks looking pretty tough right now. over all just a normal winter at 8000 feet,but it has been warmer then I thought it would be.
None of my family will burn points this year. I will hunt archery but not gunny winter deer....just the summer vacation deer.
elks96
Long Time Member
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I did not make it up valley past Glenwood Springs this last week. Same story from here in Rifle and through lout the north west. Warm and sunny storms keep coming through but snow lines are 8000 to 9000 feet. In town we are getting rain. Today it is well into the 50s here and sunny.
Last weekend I covered around 4 miles of winter range on foot and several more on county roads. I did not find a dead deer that had not been hit by a vehicle. Today I hiked 4 miles near town and found only 1 dead deer. Last weekend I looked at several hundred deer and none of them stood out as unhealthy. They looked healthy fat and content. The south slopes are totally bare around rifle. Grass is greening up. Some shorter forbes getting green etc.
Despite getting storm we are staying really warm. Rifle Gap has thawed and is 30 percent open water. These conditions existed from Rifle north past meeker and west to Utah.
Last weekend I even saw two Sartre doe who appeared to have triplets from last year still alive. Can not say for sure but it was good to see. Also noticed a ton of yearlings on the winter range....
So from here things are still really looking good. We appear to have warmer temps for the forecast despite more potential for weather. The storm pattern is not bringing any of those cold northerly storms but more from the warmer regions of the pacific....
Last weekend I covered around 4 miles of winter range on foot and several more on county roads. I did not find a dead deer that had not been hit by a vehicle. Today I hiked 4 miles near town and found only 1 dead deer. Last weekend I looked at several hundred deer and none of them stood out as unhealthy. They looked healthy fat and content. The south slopes are totally bare around rifle. Grass is greening up. Some shorter forbes getting green etc.
Despite getting storm we are staying really warm. Rifle Gap has thawed and is 30 percent open water. These conditions existed from Rifle north past meeker and west to Utah.
Last weekend I even saw two Sartre doe who appeared to have triplets from last year still alive. Can not say for sure but it was good to see. Also noticed a ton of yearlings on the winter range....
So from here things are still really looking good. We appear to have warmer temps for the forecast despite more potential for weather. The storm pattern is not bringing any of those cold northerly storms but more from the warmer regions of the pacific....
txhunter58
Long Time Member
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Just a small piece of the puzzle, but this link is interesting. Snowpack looks pretty good at this point. Don't want too little either:
ftp://ftp-fc.sc.egov.usda.gov/CO/Snow/snow/watershed/daily/co_update_snow_sites.pdf
txhunter58
venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)
ftp://ftp-fc.sc.egov.usda.gov/CO/Snow/snow/watershed/daily/co_update_snow_sites.pdf
txhunter58
venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)
C
crookedarrow
Guest
Talked to the Forest Service and the local Gunnison office this week. Normal winter was the report. Some cold and snow, but not real extended. Does have been doing fine since 07/08 with twins being a common which is a reflection of their health.
Not going to hunt there this year, but one of my hunting buddies was pushing to go back so we got the report.
Not going to hunt there this year, but one of my hunting buddies was pushing to go back so we got the report.
elks96
Long Time Member
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NW, is still in really good shape. We just never got the cold that we usually see. It was a warm winter, despite the higher than normal snow. There is still lots of snow high which is good but tons of bare ground in the lower elevations. Been getting wind and rain that has pretty much melted everything off. Things got green really early this spring and the animals seemed to notice. Instead randomly browsing area they were heading to the good stuff and pigging out.
I have spent 10 or so days in the field the last month and have not found hardly any winter kill at all. Other than vehicles, I would venture there was pretty low mortality this winter. Not to mention the Coyote population are down a lot through out the NW compared to what they were 5-6 years ago.
I have spent 10 or so days in the field the last month and have not found hardly any winter kill at all. Other than vehicles, I would venture there was pretty low mortality this winter. Not to mention the Coyote population are down a lot through out the NW compared to what they were 5-6 years ago.
elks96
Long Time Member
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>Thanks elks. Curious, why the decrease
>in yote population?
About 3-4 years ago the rabbit population took a huge nose dive in the area. I mean big time, to the point that when out hunting in the winter a person could spend days out and not cross hardly any rabbits. Last year a few rabbits showed back up, but this year the rabbits are back to what I would consider "normal" populations.
The rabbits are so vital to pup survival that when the population of rabbits crashes the coyotes population turns down as well.
I also theorize that not only did the rabbits bottom out, but the deer population also bottomed out pretty hard. In 07/08 the yotes fed well, and that summer had large litters and thing looked good only to hit a winter where the few deer left were strong and healthy, which meant hard times on the yotes, which was increased by the drastic decrease in rabbits.
Just what I have seen. Usually on a slow winter I kill 10 coyotes, decent winters I get around 20, great yotes hunting means 30+ yotes down. This winter I shot at exactly 1 coyote, and got another with the truck. I know they are around but not nearly like they were from 04 to 09.
Once the rabbits cycle up, the pups will live etc.
Now the bears and the cougars are a different story. At least we filled the lion Quotas in most of the state this year. Last year was hard because lack of snow in the lower country.
>in yote population?
About 3-4 years ago the rabbit population took a huge nose dive in the area. I mean big time, to the point that when out hunting in the winter a person could spend days out and not cross hardly any rabbits. Last year a few rabbits showed back up, but this year the rabbits are back to what I would consider "normal" populations.
The rabbits are so vital to pup survival that when the population of rabbits crashes the coyotes population turns down as well.
I also theorize that not only did the rabbits bottom out, but the deer population also bottomed out pretty hard. In 07/08 the yotes fed well, and that summer had large litters and thing looked good only to hit a winter where the few deer left were strong and healthy, which meant hard times on the yotes, which was increased by the drastic decrease in rabbits.
Just what I have seen. Usually on a slow winter I kill 10 coyotes, decent winters I get around 20, great yotes hunting means 30+ yotes down. This winter I shot at exactly 1 coyote, and got another with the truck. I know they are around but not nearly like they were from 04 to 09.
Once the rabbits cycle up, the pups will live etc.
Now the bears and the cougars are a different story. At least we filled the lion Quotas in most of the state this year. Last year was hard because lack of snow in the lower country.
elks96
Long Time Member
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LAST EDITED ON Mar-26-14 AT 02:51PM (MST)[p]>Thanks elks. Curious, why the decrease
>in yote population?
The yotes got hit with a perfect storm. for last 15 years I have aggressively(according to my wife obsessively) have hunted coyotes. I really noticed the coyote population sliding down in 2010. It was pretty darn low this year.
Basically it is the typical predator prey cycle. We had a big rabbit die off a couple years back. In fact 2 years ago, a person could look for a couple days and not find a rabbit. There were a few around but hardly any at all. The rabbits seem to just be coming back. Last year the rabbit numbers were OK, this year they seemed to be average. Of course the predators are usually a couple years behind the prey populations.
3-4 years ago the rabbits died off big time. I also feel that the population took a bit of a dive due to the low numbers of deer. Figure 07/08 the deer, and a lot of elk, dropped like flies. The yotes had it really good that winter as they could cruise around on the snow eating all the dead animals. At that point there were still decent rabbit numbers as well. So lots of coyotes... But that next winter almost all the rabbits were gone (got some disease) and the deer populations were low and those that were around were strong and healthy. It was an easy winter for deer thus they did not fall victim to predation as easy.
As a result low deer populations, low rabbit populations added up to lower coyote numbers.
Of course bear still hit out deer really hard as do lions. But at least this year we had enough snow to fill most of the lion quotas.
I kind of hope the coyotes come back a bit. In a bad year I killed 10 yotes, a good year I could get 30. This year I killed one with my truck, but have not seen but a couple others. In a couple years if the rabbits keep coming back the yotes will get thicker again.
>in yote population?
The yotes got hit with a perfect storm. for last 15 years I have aggressively(according to my wife obsessively) have hunted coyotes. I really noticed the coyote population sliding down in 2010. It was pretty darn low this year.
Basically it is the typical predator prey cycle. We had a big rabbit die off a couple years back. In fact 2 years ago, a person could look for a couple days and not find a rabbit. There were a few around but hardly any at all. The rabbits seem to just be coming back. Last year the rabbit numbers were OK, this year they seemed to be average. Of course the predators are usually a couple years behind the prey populations.
3-4 years ago the rabbits died off big time. I also feel that the population took a bit of a dive due to the low numbers of deer. Figure 07/08 the deer, and a lot of elk, dropped like flies. The yotes had it really good that winter as they could cruise around on the snow eating all the dead animals. At that point there were still decent rabbit numbers as well. So lots of coyotes... But that next winter almost all the rabbits were gone (got some disease) and the deer populations were low and those that were around were strong and healthy. It was an easy winter for deer thus they did not fall victim to predation as easy.
As a result low deer populations, low rabbit populations added up to lower coyote numbers.
Of course bear still hit out deer really hard as do lions. But at least this year we had enough snow to fill most of the lion quotas.
I kind of hope the coyotes come back a bit. In a bad year I killed 10 yotes, a good year I could get 30. This year I killed one with my truck, but have not seen but a couple others. In a couple years if the rabbits keep coming back the yotes will get thicker again.
tailchasers
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Fur prices have also help knock the coyote population back. Anyone with a squeaker has been out calling dog. Seen more people out this year than years past. Not a bad thing...
My son has been aggressively shed hunting this year (3-4 days a week sijce February) and has seen very few dead deer in 21. Now unit 10 has been another story. He has come across near a dozen deer in 3 different pods with fresh winter deaths. Most of the deer in the family pods were found dead in close proximity to eachother too. Not sure what is happening in unit 10 but it ain't good.
"Courage is being scared to death but saddling up anyway."
My son has been aggressively shed hunting this year (3-4 days a week sijce February) and has seen very few dead deer in 21. Now unit 10 has been another story. He has come across near a dozen deer in 3 different pods with fresh winter deaths. Most of the deer in the family pods were found dead in close proximity to eachother too. Not sure what is happening in unit 10 but it ain't good.
"Courage is being scared to death but saddling up anyway."
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