Utah Expo

[bucks]

Wow!!!!
Congratulations to all bidders at this years Expo,Record numbers.
Day one total=1.136,500.00
Night 1 total = 1.780,000.00
Night 2 total = 2.840,500.00
Total auction =6.750.000.00

 

[bucks]

I cannot find the totals for last years virtual on line auction.But I think they were at 4.3 or 4.6 Million??

 

[elkassassin]

And That's Just Auction Money!

 

[hossblur]

When I looked out the window this morning, there were deer everywhere

 

[elkassassin]

Was That A WET Dream Hossy?

There Are Not Deer Everywhere Anywhere in TARDville!

 

[hossblur]

Bullllll shiiiiiittttt!!

$fw whored out $6.75 million in tags.

Mule deer, SAVED!!

BESS, you're not trying to tell me that the tens of millions $fw has raised, and the millions they pocketed, didn't "save the mule deer", as they promised, ARE YOU?

 

[Tristate]

Hey hossblur, you got a plan to save mule deer that doesn't involve hating on SFW?

 

[JakeH]

Bullllll shiiiiiittttt!!

$fw whored out $6.75 million in tags.

Mule deer, SAVED!!

BESS, you're not trying to tell me that the tens of millions $fw has raised, and the millions they pocketed, didn't "save the mule deer", as they promised, ARE YOU?

Who pocketed it hoss??? Who is taking the money? Come on man you've been on this kick for a decade + you got to have some names of the guys getting rich and stealing money from all of us.

 

[elkassassin]

You Know What I'm Telling You Hossy!

I've Told You For Years!

Maybe Decades!

These Types Of Organizations We Have Here In TARDville are Basically The Only Legal Gambling We Have Here To Play!

I Played Again!

I'll Lose Again!

But BY GAWD I Didn't Have To Drive Clear To Wendover To Throw It Out The F'N Window!

Bullllll shiiiiiittttt!!

$fw whored out $6.75 million in tags.

Mule deer, SAVED!!

BESS, you're not trying to tell me that the tens of millions $fw has raised, and the millions they pocketed, didn't "save the mule deer", as they promised, ARE YOU?

 

[hossblur]

Who pocketed it hoss??? Who is taking the money? Come on man you've been on this kick for a decade + you got to have some names of the guys getting rich and stealing money from all of us.

$fw does this for charity? Not a single guy takes a paycheck, right? Just checking.

You tell me apps came in, I'll let you borrow my calculator, and you can times that by $3.75 and then YOU can show us that money went to no one.

Who pays Don for his "consulting" work? Is it pro Bono?

Is Troy a daytime chemistry teacher? John does $fw, after his day job as an accountant?

You keep trying to add the word rich. I didn't say rich. I said they take money from whoring wildlife. And a bunch of dudes get paid, from the whoring.

From $fw website

Salt Lake City, UT: The 2021 Virtual Western Hunting & Conservation Expo (Hunt Expo) was a success raising $8.1 million with, on average, 94% of funds from state auction tags going back to wildlife agency conservation programs. The virtual Hunt Expo, hosted by Sportsmen for Fish and Wildlife and the Mule Deer Foundation, was held mid-February and drew more bidders to the online auction and more applications for Utah’s 200 limited entry tags than ever before.

8,100,000 x .94= 7,614,000


$8,100,000 - $7,614,000 =$486,000

So, from their own site, the tale for $fw was $486,000.

That's JUST the EXPO, last year, and does not include any of the banquet tags, or other tags they auction all year.



Again, from their site: 9% to admin.

 

[hossblur]

$fw does this for charity? Not a single guy takes a paycheck, right? Just checking

Since $fw site tells us 9% goes to admin, I feel it's safe to say, there ARE people at $fw whose livelihoods come from whoring wildlife.

Copy and paste this Jake so you don't feel the need to ask the same thing over and over.

 

[Tristate]

%9!?

 

[notdonhunting]

Bullllll shiiiiiittttt!!

$fw whored out $6.75 million in tags.

Mule deer, SAVED!!

BESS, you're not trying to tell me that the tens of millions $fw has raised, and the millions they pocketed, didn't "save the mule deer", as they promised, ARE YOU?

The deer herd is hurting everywhere in the west not just Utah, I do not know what other states are doing to help fix the problem but I there is some good stuff going on in Utah to try and fix the problem.

The DWR is actively revitalizing mule deer habitat.

Just to name a few.
The DWR along with BYU and USU are actively conducting mule deer research throughout the state of Utah.
The DWR is actively paying coyote bounties.

The SFW, MDF, RMEF and all the supporters of these organizations are paying for all this to be done and going out and helping with some of the projects to try and help the deer herd numbers.

Slamdunk is posting when some of these projects are taking place and he has reported back that outside of the men and women of these organizations and Dedicated Hunters there is not much others coming out to help.

My question where are you, what are you doing to help the deer herd out?

 

[notdonhunting]

Since $fw site tells us 9% goes to admin, I feel it's safe to say, there ARE people at $fw whose livelihoods come from whoring wildlife.

Copy and paste this Jake so you don't feel the need to ask the same thing over and over.

Why is just about SFW?
You do know that the RMEF has full time payed employees and the RMEF does get so called charity tags.
It is impossible to run organizations the size of RMEF and SFW without paying some people full time.

 

[bucks]

I was just pondering at all of the states and countries that participate in the expo!!!
Utah
Colorado
Wyoming
Nevada
Arizonia
Oregon
Washington
New Mexico
Montana
Texas
California
Kansas
Nebraska
Alaska
Canada
Mexico
Argentina
Spain
Yukon
New Zealand
I probably have missed some??BUT
WHAT IS WITH IDAHO!!!! WHY DONT THEY PARTICIPATE IN THE GAME??

 

[hossblur]

I'll call Wyoming and let them know all the deer migration work they are doing, and deer studies going on in Laramie, aren't really happening, cuz Doyles clients didn't drop $310,000 on the island?

Is it fair to ask what the deer population number was when $fw started pimping tags, and what it is today? Or, is asking for results, just rude? I mean we are decades into $fw "saving the mule deer", when does that get going?

Funny you point out $fw, MDF, dwr, AND RMEF, are doing.......

" One of these things is not like the other......", come on sing along with me.

"RMEF is not like the others,.......".

Great song!!

Anyone think to ask all those great "conservationists" in SLC last night if they'd like to scratch that check, and leave the tag?


Ive been to the fair. Seen folks buy FFA kids animals, scratch the check, give the kids back there animals.

 

[hossblur]

Why is just about SFW?
You do know that the RMEF has full time payed employees and the RMEF does get so called charity tags.
It is impossible to run organizations the size of RMEF and SFW without paying some people full time.

The RMEF banquet wasn't in SLC this week with 200 Utah tags.

Seems like a simple answer.


So, your saying $fw, takes tags, auctions them off, and pays people's salaries?

Have you told this to Jake? He seems confused on WHO gets the money $fw takes.

Im old enough to remember before $fw got 200 tags. They were a thing then, you know.


I don't care who they pay, or how much, as long as the money ain't coming from our tags

Let them raffle guns to pay salaries, none of my business. My buisness is the tags

 

[Tristate]

Dedicating your entire life to hate for somebody else's half a million dollars each year.?‍

 

[Tristate]

"RMEF is not like the others

No they just planted a representative on these forums that actively and knowingly lied to everyone on these forums.

 

[hossblur]

Dedicating your entire life to hate for somebody else's half a million dollars each year.?‍

Wildlife is held in trust by the citizens of the state of Utah. It's not $fw money, it's the citizens money.

I don't give 2chits what they got for a mule

 

[hossblur]

No they just planted a representative on these forums that actively and knowingly lied to everyone on these forums.

By planted you mean he created a top secret username that no one would know

BigFin, is super top secret agent man kind of thing.

He is so secretive he uses it on every forum he "is planted" on, including the one he pays for

 

[Tristate]

Wildlife is held in trust by the citizens of the state of Utah. It's not $fw money, it's the citizens money.

I don't give 2chits what they got for a mule

And SFW possesses none or sells any wildlife. Sell crazy somewhere else, Antihunter.

 

[Tristate]

By planted you mean he created a top secret username that no one would know

BigFin, is super top secret agent man kind of thing.

He is so secretive he uses it on every forum he "is planted" on, including the one he pays for

Isn't it funny how when I say RMEF lied to us you immediately know who it was.

 

[muledeer]

Honestly, I don't understand how more isn't done with the amount of money raised each year.

 

[notdonhunting]

I'll call Wyoming and let them know all the deer migration work they are doing, and deer studies going on in Laramie, aren't really happening, cuz Doyles clients didn't drop $310,000 on the island?

Is it fair to ask what the deer population number was when $fw started pimping tags, and what it is today? Or, is asking for results, just rude? I mean we are decades into $fw "saving the mule deer", when does that get going?

Funny you point out $fw, MDF, dwr, AND RMEF, are doing.......

" One of these things is not like the other......", come on sing along with me.

"RMEF is not like the others,.......".

Great song!!

Anyone think to ask all those great "conservationists" in SLC last night if they'd like to scratch that check, and leave the tag?


Ive been to the fair. Seen folks buy FFA kids animals, scratch the check, give the kids back there animals.

Sorry I did not know I had to have your permission to point out that the RMEF contributions to the help of mule deer recovery.

Some of them conservationists buy them tags and then give them to someone less fortunate than them.

The RMEF banquet wasn't in SLC this week with 200 Utah tags.

Seems like a simple answer.


So, your saying $fw, takes tags, auctions them off, and pays people's salaries?

Have you told this to Jake? He seems confused on WHO gets the money $fw takes.

Im old enough to remember before $fw got 200 tags. They were a thing then, you know.


I don't care who they pay, or how much, as long as the money ain't coming from our tags

Let them raffle guns to pay salaries, none of my business. My buisness is the tags

RMEF was getting conservation tags before the SFW and MDF was even established.
A conservation tag for a chapter banquet is no different than a conservation tag intended for the Western Hunting Expo.

As for jake, he is a big boy not my conversation.

SFW raffles off plenty of riffles and other items, so I supposed the salaries are not your buisness.

Isn't it more constructive to the conversation when you can answer to the points being made by someone making assumptions than constantly trying to circumnavigate around the points some one else is making!

 

[JakeH]

$fw does this for charity? Not a single guy takes a paycheck, right? Just checking.

You tell me apps came in, I'll let you borrow my calculator, and you can times that by $3.75 and then YOU can show us that money went to no one.

Who pays Don for his "consulting" work? Is it pro Bono?

Is Troy a daytime chemistry teacher? John does $fw, after his day job as an accountant?

You keep trying to add the word rich. I didn't say rich. I said they take money from whoring wildlife. And a bunch of dudes get paid, from the whoring.

From $fw website

Salt Lake City, UT: The 2021 Virtual Western Hunting & Conservation Expo (Hunt Expo) was a success raising $8.1 million with, on average, 94% of funds from state auction tags going back to wildlife agency conservation programs. The virtual Hunt Expo, hosted by Sportsmen for Fish and Wildlife and the Mule Deer Foundation, was held mid-February and drew more bidders to the online auction and more applications for Utah’s 200 limited entry tags than ever before.

8,100,000 x .94= 7,614,000


$8,100,000 - $7,614,000 =$486,000

So, from their own site, the tale for $fw was $486,000.

That's JUST the EXPO, last year, and does not include any of the banquet tags, or other tags they auction all year.



Again, from their site: 9% to admin.

View attachment 68139

Your b!tching about 9%????? Seriously dude?

You make it sound like they are completely hand over fist raking in the cash for there own personal gain. Dude of course people get paid they are doing work for the organization. 9% ain't sh!t. I've personally seen the habitat improvement done literally all over this state. Millions of dollars spent on these projects, hell you can't throw a stick in the bookcliffs and not hit a brush hogged area. Or a guzzler. That's probably millions just in that one unit, not to mention, diamond mtn, 3 corners, and all the general season unit projects, and that's just the NE part of the state. SFW, MDF, RMEF, have all contributed to those projects. You could argue if those projects are helpful or not, but it's all in part been funded by those groups, all of them. And all in conjunction with the DWR.

I keep asking you to show where they are miss managing the funds, and so far is all you have showed me is 9% going to administrative costs? Seriously That's your gripe? Come on dude you got to do better then that, it's been a decade + you got to have more to go on then that don't ya?

What % is RMEF running off of?

 

[bucks]

IDAHO!!!!!????/
WTF
WHY are they exempt from the game!!!!!

 

[grizzly]

Your b!tching about 9%????? Seriously dude?

You make it sound like they are completely hand over fist raking in the cash for there own personal gain. Dude of course people get paid they are doing work for the organization. 9% ain't sh!t. I've personally seen the habitat improvement done literally all over this state. Millions of dollars spent on these projects, hell you can't throw a stick in the bookcliffs and not hit a brush hogged area. Or a guzzler. That's probably millions just in that one unit, not to mention, diamond mtn, 3 corners, and all the general season unit projects, and that's just the NE part of the state. SFW, MDF, RMEF, have all contributed to those projects. You could argue if those projects are helpful or not, but it's all in part been funded by those groups, all of them. And all in conjunction with the DWR.

I keep asking you to show where they are miss managing the funds, and so far is all you have showed me is 9% going to administrative costs? Seriously That's your gripe? Come on dude you got to do better then that, it's been a decade + you got to have more to go on then that don't ya?

What % is RMEF running off of?

I don't get caught up in self-reported numbers as they can't be verified for accuracy.

RMEF releases third-party audited financials annually.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.rmef.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/RMEF-Final-2020-Audited-Financials.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjFscCD-f31AhX7IUQIHdubAk4QFnoECAMQAQ&usg=AOvVaw1fVoaGH5repgW8h5vXBSVR

The closest thing I've seen to an audit of SFW is right here. It didn't go well.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://le.utah.gov/audit/13_11rpt.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwis5-rO-f31AhVQH0QIHXFOBMQQFnoECB0QAQ&usg=AOvVaw31qyXR9sW0d2SmSE9N84LS

SFW has not earned my trust.

 

[JakeH]

What is wrong with it? SFW removed themselves from the project after the first year as it didn't fit inside there tax structure. And on top of that, that stuff had nothing to do with expo tags and conservation money. Nice try but you are still pulling at straws.

And on top of that, the attorney General stated at the end of the report that the audit left out that the organization had done a good job and the state was happy with there work.

I doubt there is anything they could do too earn your trust, lucky for them I doubt they give a damn.

 

[notdonhunting]

I don't get caught up in self-reported numbers as they can't be verified for accuracy.

RMEF releases third-party audited financials annually.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.rmef.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/RMEF-Final-2020-Audited-Financials.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjFscCD-f31AhX7IUQIHdubAk4QFnoECAMQAQ&usg=AOvVaw1fVoaGH5repgW8h5vXBSVR

The closest thing I've seen to an audit of SFW is right here. It didn't go well.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://le.utah.gov/audit/13_11rpt.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwis5-rO-f31AhVQH0QIHXFOBMQQFnoECB0QAQ&usg=AOvVaw31qyXR9sW0d2SmSE9N84LS

SFW has not earned my trust.

Grizzly
I can respect your argument, I can respect the argument that the SFW stole the contract from RMEF.
But this argument SFW should not have any conservation tags just because they are the SFW, that argument is crap.
If conservation tags are bad for one they are bad for all.
I personally believe conservation tags are needed they are the only way we are going to fund most of these needed projects and studies.

 

[grizzly]

What is wrong with it? SFW removed themselves from the project after the first year as it didn't fit inside there tax structure. And on top of that, that stuff had nothing to do with expo tags and conservation money. Nice try but you are still pulling at straws.

View attachment 68154

And on top of that, the attorney General stated at the end of the report that the audit left out that the organization had done a good job and the state was happy with there work.
View attachment 68157
View attachment 68158

I doubt there is anything they could do too earn your trust, lucky for them I doubt they give a damn.

You're either being deliberately misleading or don't understand what you just read. SFW received the initial wolf funds but can't be a lobbyist organization as a 501(c)(3) so they directed the funds to their sister organization, BGF.

The audit found the majority of funds were paid to SFW's former attorney's consulting business, that funds were comingled (which could lead to State funds being used to lobby the state legislature, which is unlawful), that proper reports and accounting weren't kept, and that payments should only be paid for performance and not up-front.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that the letter at the end isn't from the Attorney General as you wrote, it's from Greg Sheehan, the Director of DWR. For the record, the DWR is the same group that didn't exercise it's right to an accounting review of how taxpayer funds were used. Of course they're going to say everything went great, anything less would only implicate themselves in not being better stewards of public funds.

 

[elks96]

SFW is a bunch of crooks and the Don and his mafia are ruining all wildlife in UT. I am sorry but the commercialization of wildlife to the wealthy is wrong. IT is pathetic to think that anyone is happy with such a system. Yes 9% is an insane amount. It adds up to millions. It is even more sickening to think that this Expo was stole from a truly effective group like the RMEF.

Sorry but anyone that ignores the corruption around the EXPO and the RMEF is a fool. That process alone was enough to expose just how horrible the corruption is between the state and SFW.

 

[grizzly]

Grizzly
I can respect your argument, I can respect the argument that the SFW stole the contract from RMEF.
But this argument SFW should not have any conservation tags just because they are the SFW, that argument is crap.
If conservation tags are bad for one they are bad for all.
I personally believe conservation tags are needed they are the only way we are going to fund most of these needed projects and studies.

I don't think I mentioned the Expo contract or the necessity of Conservation Permits

 

[Tristate]

So how much should a third party annual audit cost?

 

[notdonhunting]

Grizz
How you liking the superbowl?
I brought up the contract using it as example as a legit argument.

 

[grizzly]

Grizz
How you liking the game?
I brought up the contract using it as example as a legit argument.

Gotcha ??

Game is okay. I don't really like either team but it's still good to have football for one more night before they shut it down until August.

 

[slamdunk]

Without even attempting to argue a lot of misconceptions about Conservation dollars, here are just a portion of the end results.

Utah's Watershed Restoration Initiative

Water Restoration Initiative run by DNR

wri.utah.gov

 

[JakeH]

You're either being deliberately misleading or don't understand what you just read. SFW received the initial wolf funds but can't be a lobbyist organization as a 501(c)(3) so they directed the funds to their sister organization, BGF.

The audit found the majority of funds were paid to SFW's former attorney's consulting business, that funds were comingled (which could lead to State funds being used to lobby the state legislature, which is unlawful), that proper reports and accounting weren't kept, and that payments should only be paid for performance and not up-front.

View attachment 68162
View attachment 68163View attachment 68164View attachment 68165View attachment 68166View attachment 68167View attachment 68168

I'm not going to pretend to know a thing about professional audits or how that stuff is ran. But what I read showed that sfw got out of the wolf lobby crap, and the lawyer left sfw and started his own group BGF. So sfw got out of it. All the stuff you just posted was for BGF not SFW.

Is all I am asking is for someone to show proof that they are "crooked" hoss and many others have been saying it for years. But nobody ever shows the evidence. Show us where they are miss managing the money and what are they spending it on.

At this point this many years later I doubt there is anything, or someone would have something to show by now, after all they are a horrible crooked organization.

As far as the expo tag contract goes, I've said since it happened that it was BS they gave it to SFW and not RMEF but at the same time that is a state issue not an SFW issue. Of course they did everything they could to keep the tags they would be stupid not too. It's the state that F'ed that deal up.

I've seen a lot of habitat projects that have been funded in large part by conservation tags, seen alot of good come from those dollars, have yet to see anything shady being funded with that money.

 

[hunt30]

SFW is a bunch of crooks and the Don and his mafia are ruining all wildlife in UT. I am sorry but the commercialization of wildlife to the wealthy is wrong. IT is pathetic to think that anyone is happy with such a system. Yes 9% is an insane amount. It adds up to millions. It is even more sickening to think that this Expo was stole from a truly effective group like the RMEF.

Sorry but anyone that ignores the corruption around the EXPO and the RMEF is a fool. That process alone was enough to expose just how horrible the corruption is between the state and SFW.

I think Utah will be just fine. The ignorance of your post is comical.

 

[grizzly]

I'm not going to pretend to know a thing about professional audits or how that stuff is ran. But what I read showed that sfw got out of the wolf lobby crap, and the lawyer left sfw and started his own group BGF. So sfw got out of it. All the stuff you just posted was for BGF not SFW.

Is all I am asking is for someone to show proof that they are "crooked" hoss and many others have been saying it for years. But nobody ever shows the evidence. Show us where they are miss managing the money and what are they spending it on.

At this point this many years later I doubt there is anything, or someone would have something to show by now, after all they are a horrible crooked organization.

As far as the expo tag contract goes, I've said since it happened that it was BS they gave it to SFW and not RMEF but at the same time that is a state issue not an SFW issue. Of course they did everything they could to keep the tags they would be stupid not too. It's the state that F'ed that deal up.

I've seen a lot of habitat projects that have been funded in large part by conservation tags, seen alot of good come from those dollars, have yet to see anything shady being funded with that money.

The first year the funds were paid directly to SFW. Beyond that, they were paid to BGF. There is a great article by Writers on the Range (or something like that) that explores the relationship between the two organizations. It's worth reading if you're so inclined.

I noticed you didn't accuse me of saying anybody is crooked; thank you, because I've never accused anybody of anything. I'm certainly entitled to my opinions, and feel they're well-justified and that I've supported them with facts. But I don't accuse people of anything.

As to your "show me the evidence" idea... I like where you're going with that, but when a group takes public funds it's not the duty of the public to prove where the money did or didn't go. It's the duty of the person taking the taxpayer money to prove where the money did or didn't go.

One final thing... Done properly, I support the Conservation Permit program.

 

[hossblur]

Sorry I did not know I had to have your permission to point out that the RMEF contributions to the help of mule deer recovery.

Some of them conservationists buy them tags and then give them to someone less fortunate than them.


RMEF was getting conservation tags before the SFW and MDF was even established.
A conservation tag for a chapter banquet is no different than a conservation tag intended for the Western Hunting Expo.

As for jake, he is a big boy not my conversation.

SFW raffles off plenty of riffles and other items, so I supposed the salaries are not your buisness.

Isn't it more constructive to the conversation when you can answer to the points being made by someone making assumptions than constantly trying to circumnavigate around the points some one else is making!

They aren't. Rifles, mules, sxs.They are free to raffle off Troy's daughters cat.

Not my buisness

 

[hossblur]

Grizzly
I can respect your argument, I can respect the argument that the SFW stole the contract from RMEF.
But this argument SFW should not have any conservation tags just because they are the SFW, that argument is crap.
If conservation tags are bad for one they are bad for all.
I personally believe conservation tags are needed they are the only way we are going to fund most of these needed projects and studies.

No one should have 200 tags.

Not $fw, RMEF,MDF, TU, DU, TRCP, NWTF, BHA.

NO ONE

 

[hossblur]

I'm not going to pretend to know a thing about professional audits or how that stuff is ran. But what I read showed that sfw got out of the wolf lobby crap, and the lawyer left sfw and started his own group BGF. So sfw got out of it. All the stuff you just posted was for BGF not SFW.

Is all I am asking is for someone to show proof that they are "crooked" hoss and many others have been saying it for years. But nobody ever shows the evidence. Show us where they are miss managing the money and what are they spending it on.

At this point this many years later I doubt there is anything, or someone would have something to show by now, after all they are a horrible crooked organization.

As far as the expo tag contract goes, I've said since it happened that it was BS they gave it to SFW and not RMEF but at the same time that is a state issue not an SFW issue. Of course they did everything they could to keep the tags they would be stupid not too. It's the state that F'ed that deal up.

I've seen a lot of habitat projects that have been funded in large part by conservation tags, seen alot of good come from those dollars, have yet to see anything shady being funded with that money.

Who pays THE Don for "consulting?

 

[smokepolejohnson]

Once again it was great expo. I really enjoyed Marcus Luttrell’s speech. I honestly thought Kris Stewart speech Saturday came across as desperate, at first thought it sounded like Mitt Romney’s insecure Teen age granddaughter, clueless, entitled, yet no shortage of words and trying to be relevant…
But A big WHCE Thanks has to go to Sportmans for habitat (SFH) Hunter Nation (HN) Big Game forever (BGf) Peay Consulting (Pcon) Artic Red River Outfitters,(ARRO) and SFW and all the other Peay founded non profits….
And yeah of course can’t forget to mention MDF, they might not be SFW but they might of helped put down a few chairs at some point and refilled some hand sanitizer.

 

[hossblur]

Honestly, I don't understand how more isn't done with the amount of money raised each year.

4'x8' checks to "give the state" are expensive

 

[notdonhunting]

They aren't. Rifles, mules, sxs.They are free to raffle off Troy's daughters cat.

Not my buisness

They aren't.
And what does that mean?
Troy's daughters cat?

No one should have 200 tags.

Not $fw, RMEF,MDF, TU, DU, TRCP, NWTF, BHA.

NO ONE

You giving up 40 work weeks? Because if they don't pay someone to do all this conservation work it is not going to get done.
Again what are you doing to help the deer herd?

 

[JakeH]

The first year the funds were paid directly to SFW. Beyond that, they were paid to BGF. There is a great article by Writers on the Range (or something like that) that explores the relationship between the two organizations. It's worth reading if you're so inclined.

I noticed you didn't accuse me of saying anybody is crooked; thank you, because I've never accused anybody of anything. I'm certainly entitled to my opinions, and feel they're well-justified and that I've supported them with facts. But I don't accuse people of anything.

As to your "show me the evidence" idea... I like where you're going with that, but when a group takes public funds it's not the duty of the public to prove where the money did or didn't go. It's the duty of the person taking the taxpayer money to prove where the money did or didn't go.

One final thing... Done properly, I support the Conservation Permit program.

Yep the first year they did, and it looks to me that once they realized they was treading in hazardous water they cut ties with it and passed it off. The lawyer then created his own organization and continued on, I do remember there being a lot of buzz surrounding that guy and BGF in the later years. But as far as SFW was concerned they cut ties with it all because it wasn't something they was allowed to be a part of. Looks to me like they did everything they was supposed to do.

I've never been a die hard SFW guy, I haven't alway agreed with all of the stuff they have done or sponsored. But I have seen a lot of "accusations" levied at them over the years. I always tried to keep an open mind with all of it and call balls and strikes how I seen them when it came to them. I just feel that at this point with as many people that dislike the organization and call them crooked and the like if it was true there would be stuff that had come out by now. If they was paying outrageous salaries to people or if money was disappearing and being shelled out to phony causes to pad peoples pockets I feel like a brighter light would be shined on that kind of thing.

Most people have found one or two legal things they do that they personaly do not like (expo tags, conservation tags, catering to the weathy to name a few of the big ones) and denounce the whole organization as bad and corrupt without any real evidence of them doing anything wrong.

As for your last point, I agree they should be forthcoming with that information.
Are they not?
Do you or anyone have evidence of them hiding stuff?
Like I said I've always been open to seeing where they are going wrong, but I do want to see it. They was dug into pretty heavily when the expo contract debacle happened, I find it hard to believe they would have been able to keep things hidden if they was doing shady stuff.

Who pays THE Don for "consulting?

I have no idea, does SFW still pay him for consulting? If so how much? What does he do for them? If your gonna throw stones you probably should know the answer to those questions? If you don't your just gossiping and spreading rumors.

 

[SS!]

Once again it was great expo. I really enjoyed Marcus Luttrell’s speech. I honestly thought Kris Stewart speech Saturday came across as desperate, at first thought it sounded like Mitt Romney’s insecure Teen age granddaughter, clueless, entitled, yet no shortage of words and trying to be relevant…
But A big WHCE Thanks has to go to Sportmans for habitat (SFH) Hunter Nation (HN) Big Game forever (BGf) Peay Consulting (Pcon) Artic Red River Outfitters,(ARRO) and SFW and all the other Peay founded non profits….
And yeah of course can’t forget to mention MDF, they might not be SFW but they might of helped put down a few chairs at some point and refilled some hand sanitizer.

That’s the first I’ve heard of the MDF helping out. About time they got off their ass!

 

[hossblur]

They aren't.
And what does that mean?
Troy's daughters cat?


You giving up 40 work weeks? Because if they don't pay someone to do all this conservation work it is not going to get done.
Again what are you doing to help the deer herd?

This is typical of the circle you get into with the cool aid drinkers.

Yeah, but, yeah, but, yeah but.


I will notice you didn't answer, so I'll ask again.

The DWR is saying 285, 000 deer this winter.

What did we get for a tens of millions?

Not sure what you do FOR A LIVING, and yes, as you point out they get paid to do "conservation", but if you failed for decades, DO YOU STILL HAVE A JOB.


See, I'm old enough to remember the start of $fw. And yes, they funded themselves via raffles.

$fw started to "give the average hunter a voice", and to "save the mule deer". It wasn't ever to create 4 off shoot buisnesses for THE DON, or stack the WB, or even plant pheasants.

So when anyone points this out, it becomes the disprove a negative.

Or, "if we hadn't done........it would be worse".

Now I can point to every other western state, including Arizona and Colorado and Idaho, who are seeing similar losses of habitat and increases in population, and say "looks like those states are seeing similar deer issues as us", AND they don't pimp out 200 tags, plus however many others they get.

And round and round we go with "yeah but, yeah but".



"The expo is the best show out there". "The expo is better than SCI", "The expo is the best show out there", "they really but on a great show"


How's Utah's deer herd?

"Well, it down another 10% last year"


Well hell, with raging success like that, we should double up, give them 400 tags., How about 600. Imagine 600 tags, why they could rival the world's fair.

And the deer herd, well it could shed another 50%.

BUT, they do plant pheasants, so there's that

"Why experts say the West's deer population is at 'inflection point' after another drop in 2021 | KSL.com" https://www.ksl.com/article/5034678...t-inflection-point-after-another-drop-in-2021

 

[hossblur]

Yep the first year they did, and it looks to me that once they realized they was treading in hazardous water they cut ties with it and passed it off. The lawyer then created his own organization and continued on, I do remember there being a lot of buzz surrounding that guy and BGF in the later years. But as far as SFW was concerned they cut ties with it all because it wasn't something they was allowed to be a part of. Looks to me like they did everything they was supposed to do.

I've never been a die hard SFW guy, I haven't alway agreed with all of the stuff they have done or sponsored. But I have seen a lot of "accusations" levied at them over the years. I always tried to keep an open mind with all of it and call balls and strikes how I seen them when it came to them. I just feel that at this point with as many people that dislike the organization and call them crooked and the like if it was true there would be stuff that had come out by now. If they was paying outrageous salaries to people or if money was disappearing and being shelled out to phony causes to pad peoples pockets I feel like a brighter light would be shined on that kind of thing.

Most people have found one or two legal things they do that they personaly do not like (expo tags, conservation tags, catering to the weathy to name a few of the big ones) and denounce the whole organization as bad and corrupt without any real evidence of them doing anything wrong.

As for your last point, I agree they should be forthcoming with that information.
Are they not?
Do you or anyone have evidence of them hiding stuff?
Like I said I've always been open to seeing where they are going wrong, but I do want to see it. They was dug into pretty heavily when the expo contract debacle happened, I find it hard to believe they would have been able to keep things hidden if they was doing shady stuff.



I have no idea, does SFW still pay him for consulting? If so how much? What does he do for them? If your gonna throw stones you probably should know the answer to those questions? If you don't your just gossiping and spreading rumors.

I'd like to know the answer. Can you show me where $fw puts that? Financial reports? Oh, that's right, $fw doesn't like transparency.

Who dug into them? The State? Same State that broke their own rules? Well, that's reassuring.

Jake.

Watch this.

Slam, show me where MDF puts the money they get from the expo, including paid salaries.


Now watch Jake. If SLAM sees this, it will take him 5 min.

$fw still working on it, be a few more years.

BTW

Since your an honest caller of balls and strikes, how's this for $fw success in "saving the deer herd"

"Why experts say the West's deer population is at 'inflection point' after another drop in 2021 | KSL.com" https://www.ksl.com/article/5034678...t-inflection-point-after-another-drop-in-2021

 

[hossblur]

They aren't.
And what does that mean?
Troy's daughters cat?


You giving up 40 work weeks? Because if they don't pay someone to do all this conservation work it is not going to get done.
Again what are you doing to help the deer herd?

I took this from Newberg on his forum. He is a CPA, I'm not.



"Additionally, in awarding the UT Expo contract the organizations submitting for the contract must demonstrate how much business their Expo plans will generate for the SLC economy. That is to be part of the scoring when awarding the contract. I think most question what purpose wildlife allocation serves in funding metropolitan economic activity. They are diametrically opposite activities, or at least I thought they were.

Lastly, if not for these auction and raffle tags in Utah, the financial health, possibly the solvency, of two groups would be dramatically different. Are public assets meant to keep conservation organizations afloat? If one thinks that is a useful purpose, then those organizations at a minimum should submit to a public audit of what they are doing with those proceeds, something that, to my knowledge, has never happened for the two groups sponsoring the Utah Expo.

The fact that people are questioning these auction-type events should serve as a warning to the groups sponsoring them that the public wants to know where the money is being used. It is a Public Trust asset, tags and hunting opportunity, that is being sold. It is reasonable, I'd say necessary, for the public to ask if the Trustees are getting a good return for the Beneficiaries when these public trust assets are being sold to the highest bidder. That requires transparency and accountability.

As a CPA whose main work was trust taxation and administration, I nerd out on this Public Trust stuff. I think these comments and concerns are helpful in determining if the Trustees are getting the public Beneficiaries a good deal in how these trust assets are being doled out."

 

[Tristate]

Randy Newberg is a known liar on this subject.

Just like you, Hossblur.


Get Slamdunk to post a copy of his 1099 from MDF on here. Do it. Do it.

 

[slamdunk]

I'd like to know the answer. Can you show me where $fw puts that? Financial reports? Oh, that's right, $fw doesn't like transparency.

Who dug into them? The State? Same State that broke their own rules? Well, that's reassuring.

Jake.

Watch this.

Slam, show me where MDF puts the money they get from the expo, including paid salaries.


Now watch Jake. If SLAM sees this, it will take him 5 min.

$fw still working on it, be a few more years.

BTW

Since your an honest caller of balls and strikes, how's this for $fw success in "saving the deer herd"

"Why experts say the West's deer population is at 'inflection point' after another drop in 2021 | KSL.com" https://www.ksl.com/article/5034678...t-inflection-point-after-another-drop-in-2021

Its all on their website......

 

[hossblur]

Its all on their website......

Hey Jake, did you catch that?

Now go to $fw website.

There's a real pretty pie chart.

Thanks Slam

 

[slamdunk]

Randy Newberg is a known liar on this subject.

Just like you, Hossblur.


Get Slamdunk to post a copy of his 1099 from MDF on here. Do it. Do it.

Um....I am a "Volunteer" for the MDF, I do not receive a penny from them.

 

[hossblur]

Um....I am a "Volunteer" for the MDF, I do not receive a penny from them.

Ouch, that hurt?????????

 

[Tristate]

Um....I am a "Volunteer" for the MDF, I do not receive a penny from them.

I want proof. MDF isn't transparent unless they can prove they aren't paying you.

See how this stupid spit works now slamdunk. Yall let this non hunting jackass spout any crazy crap he wants on here every February for a decade.

It's no different than what I just did with MDF and you.

Newberg is a proven liar right here on these forums. Hossblur is a nonhunting liar. You get the right kind of crazy on here and they'll dress you and MDF up as a corrupt conspiracy with no transparency because you can't prove a negative.

 

[hawkbill]

I have been going to the Expo since it started, I go now for one day to run into old hunting buddies and mainly shoot the $hit. I put in for a few hunts and did not buy much ( headlamp and a book Utah’s Biggest Bucks.) The Expo is like the half time show at the Super Bowl, it truly is over the top. I understand the conservation Dollars it brings in, it also brings in every gadget that is introduced into Utah’s back country. Idaho wanted to do this, the people shut them down on giving away tags., For the young hunter to draw a good tag now days, they have to win a drawing or sweepstakes or be in some kind of Celebrity contest. I still have a lot of points scattered around and will draw some good hunts, thank God. It shocks me how expensive not only Hunts are getting but everything else you need to have to go with hunting.

 

[bucks]

158 Auction tags alone,
200 $5.00 tags.
358 tags that should belong only to Utah residents!(my opinion)
I realize that all utah residents can bid on these tags,I have been out priced from day one!
Idaho is not buying into this crap,THEY ARE KEEPING THERE WILDLIFE FOR THEMSELFS

 

[slamdunk]

To try and clear up yet another misconception about myself and my involvement with the MDF......I am a volunteer.
I am part of what is called the "High Desert Leadership Team".
We are a group set apart from regular volunteers who devote extra time and resources by doing extra work in many banquets, Expo and habitat. projects.

As for now, I am going back to my regular job in which I collect a W2 for and I am going to enjoy the glory of finally winning a rifle through MDF in a drawing for purchasing my lifetime membership.

All the conspiracies can can be cleared up by looking at the MDF website where they list their Financials.

And if you'd like to see, learn and feel more, I suggest joining and put a shovel in your hand with us planting habitat on any of our hundreds of projects.

Enjoy your banter ?

 

[Tristate]

To try and clear up yet another misconception about myself and my involvement with the MDF......I am a volunteer.
I am part of what is called the "High Desert Leadership Team".
We are a group set apart from regular volunteers who devote extra time and resources by doing extra work in many banquets, Expo and habitat. projects.

As for now, I am going back to my regular job in which I collect a W2 for and I am going to enjoy the glory of finally winning a rifle through MDF in a drawing for purchasing my lifetime membership.

All the conspiracies can can be cleared up by looking at the MDF website where they list their Financials.

And if you'd like to see, learn and feel more, I suggest joining and put a shovel in your hand with us planting habitat on any of our hundreds of projects.

Enjoy your banter ?

Why are you defending yourself Slamdunk?

 

[Blank]

Don't include the 158 auction tags in your whining, or wanting them for residents only. Utah only contributed 48 tags (30%) to the auctions, and the surrounding states and Canadian provinces, and other countries outfitters contributed 110 (70%).

 

[Iowan]

There are many third party companies that monitor and rank non-profits. There are two (many others too) wildlife conservation organizations that consistently rank among the best of all non-profits not just wildlife conservation based - RMEF and Pheasants Forever.

Charity Navigator

Charity Navigator is the largest and most-utilized evaluator of charities in the United States providing data on 1.8 million nonprofits and ratings for close to 10,000 charities.

www.charitynavigator.org

There are others that get failing grades - SFW. Not 1 star or two stars - failing.

Charity Navigator

Charity Navigator is the largest and most-utilized evaluator of charities in the United States providing data on 1.8 million nonprofits and ratings for close to 10,000 charities.

www.charitynavigator.org

I can see both sides of the idea behind selling these special hunts to the super wealthy. The BS that happened when RMEF's superior proposal to oversee and manage the process clearly showed this current system is rife with self dealing and politics.

Anyone that tries to argue that SFW and RMEF are even comparable organizations is simply blinded by something I do not understand.

Also who was the dipshit that they let talk before the auction that said "I am not going to talk politics" and then spent his entire time talking politics and pandering to the audience?

 

[smokepolejohnson]

There are many third party companies that monitor and rank non-profits. There are two (many others too) wildlife conservation organizations that consistently rank among the best of all non-profits not just wildlife conservation based - RMEF and Pheasants Forever.

Charity Navigator

Charity Navigator is the largest and most-utilized evaluator of charities in the United States providing data on 1.8 million nonprofits and ratings for close to 10,000 charities.

www.charitynavigator.org

There are others that get failing grades - SFW. Not 1 star or two stars - failing.

Charity Navigator

Charity Navigator is the largest and most-utilized evaluator of charities in the United States providing data on 1.8 million nonprofits and ratings for close to 10,000 charities.

www.charitynavigator.org

I can see both sides of the idea behind selling these special hunts to the super wealthy. The BS that happened when RMEF's superior proposal to oversee and manage the process clearly showed this current system is rife with self dealing and politics.

Anyone that tries to argue that SFW and RMEF are even comparable organizations is simply blinded by something I do not understand.

Also who was the dipshit that they let talk before the auction that said "I am not going to talk politics" and then spent his entire time talking politics and pandering to the audience?

Great post and info,
Lol.. It was congressman kRis Stewart..

 

[slamdunk]

I want proof. MDF isn't transparent unless they can prove they aren't paying you.

See how this stupid spit works now slamdunk. Yall let this non hunting jackass spout any crazy crap he wants on here every February for a decade.

It's no different than what I just did with MDF and you.

Newberg is a proven liar right here on these forums. Hossblur is a nonhunting liar. You get the right kind of crazy on here and they'll dress you and MDF up as a corrupt conspiracy with no transparency because you can't prove a negative.

Lol...well I can't show a 1099, but I can post a picture of my "Volunteer shirts and hats!?

 

[Tristate]

Lol...well I can't show a 1099, but I can post a picture of my "Volunteer shirts and hats!?

They didn't send you a 1099 for the apparel???? See! This is what happens when these organizations aren't totally transparent. ???

 

[slamdunk]

They didn't send you a 1099 for the apparel???? See! This is what happens when these organizations aren't totally transparent. ???

I even had to purchase my own lifetime membership ?‍

And I will admit I like having additional opportunities at drawing tags that I wouldn't have otherwise, especially with points creep killing top end point holders.
I'll take an extra shot at drawing my bison tag even though it's a very long shot.
And hey, maybe I'll draw another LE deer tag even though I drew in 2016 and have zero points.
Or hey, I've got 6 LE elk points, maybe an Expo tag can shave off a few years for me that I wouldn't have without the extra opportunity.
But even if I don't draw, my $5 will buy one of the thousands of bitter brush plants i will personally put in the ground this spring ?‍

 

[JakeH]

I'd like to know the answer. Can you show me where $fw puts that? Financial reports? Oh, that's right, $fw doesn't like transparency.

Who dug into them? The State? Same State that broke their own rules? Well, that's reassuring.

Jake.

Watch this.

Slam, show me where MDF puts the money they get from the expo, including paid salaries.


Now watch Jake. If SLAM sees this, it will take him 5 min.

$fw still working on it, be a few more years.

BTW

Since your an honest caller of balls and strikes, how's this for $fw success in "saving the deer herd"

"Why experts say the West's deer population is at 'inflection point' after another drop in 2021 | KSL.com" https://www.ksl.com/article/5034678...t-inflection-point-after-another-drop-in-2021

Here you go, the top salaries. Looks like they pay 3 people, and none of them are named Don.

That's off the charity tracker link Iowan posted, looks like the only thing they need to do to get a passing grade is an audit. I agree that should be done. Everything else on the report passed with flying colors and doesn't give off the least bit of shadyness.

And here is the salaries of RMEF

That one dude makes more then then the 3 sfw guys. But it is an apples to oranges comparison as they are a much bigger organization.

MDF didn't come up in the search feature on the website so I couldn't get that info for them.

As far as the recovery of the muledeer can you show me how they have hurt the herds??? There is a lot more going into the decline of muledeer then I think anyone knows. I've personally seen thousands of acres of habitat improvement and water projects that have been paid for by all 3 of those organizations. Are you saying that is a bad thing? I've never said they was perfect, but they do alot with the money raised, I've seen it with my own eyes.

 

[JakeH]

Since your an honest caller of balls and strikes, how's this for $fw success in "saving the deer herd"

"Why experts say the West's deer population is at 'inflection point' after another drop in 2021 | KSL.com" https://www.ksl.com/article/5034678...t-inflection-point-after-another-drop-in-2021

Just read the article..... sooo you think sfw should be able to control the weather...... pretty clearly states the drought the last 3+ years has been the driving factor for deer decline since 2018 when numbers had been steadily rising too that point. It also states they believe next year will see an increase due to favorable fall and early winter storms. I tend to agree with that, as good fall conditions should lead to healthy deer going into winter and a rather mild winter will have them coming out in good shape.

 

[grizzly]

Here you go, the top salaries. Looks like they pay 3 people, and none of them are named Don.
View attachment 68205
That's off the charity tracker link Iowan posted, looks like the only thing they need to do to get a passing grade is an audit. I agree that should be done. Everything else on the report passed with flying colors and doesn't give off the least bit of shadyness.

And here is the salaries of RMEF
View attachment 68206
That one dude makes more then then the 3 sfw guys. But it is an apples to oranges comparison as they are a much bigger organization.

MDF didn't come up in the search feature on the website so I couldn't get that info for them.

As far as the recovery of the muledeer can you show me how they have hurt the herds??? There is a lot more going into the decline of muledeer then I think anyone knows. I've personally seen thousands of acres of habitat improvement and water projects that have been paid for by all 3 of those organizations. Are you saying that is a bad thing? I've never said they was perfect, but they do alot with the money raised, I've seen it with my own eyes.

You're missing a key piece on information. You're just looking in the wrong place.

 

[heartshot]

I am not at all a fan of pimping out tags. I wish it didn't happen.
That said,
My Understanding is that the auction tags have decent accountability on money being put back to wildlife.
Money from the expo draw tags is where the crap hits the fan and is a whole different story for accountability or lack thereof.

 

[smokepolejohnson]

Curious if anyone knows an actual current legit number on SFW memberships numbers??? I haven’t renewed my membership since President Clinton’s second term, just wondering where there membership stands at and what the trajectory and growth is looking like.

 

[JakeH]

You're missing a key piece on information. You're just looking in the wrong place.

I'm not the one looking for anything, show me! I'm just a stupid oilfield worker, I don't know how to dig into that stuff. So far everything posted hasn't shown sh!t. Other then there hasn't been an independent audit done. Which I agree should be done.

 

[hossblur]

Just read the article..... sooo you think sfw should be able to control the weather...... pretty clearly states the drought the last 3+ years has been the driving factor for deer decline since 2018 when numbers had been steadily rising too that point. It also states they believe next year will see an increase due to favorable fall and early winter storms. I tend to agree with that, as good fall conditions should lead to healthy deer going into winter and a rather mild winter will have them coming out in good shape.

I'm trying to find it, but I can't get it, maybe slam can.

What was the population number in the late 90's when $fw started saving mule deer

 

[hossblur]

Curious if anyone knows an actual current legit number on SFW memberships numbers??? I haven’t renewed my membership since President Clinton’s second term, just wondering where there membership stands at and what the trajectory and growth is looking like.

Their website says 8k

 

[hossblur]

I'm not the one looking for anything, show me! I'm just a stupid oilfield worker, I don't know how to dig into that stuff. So far everything posted hasn't shown sh!t. Other then there hasn't been an independent audit done. Which I agree should be done.

Jake.

I'm not hating on you, you've been here a long time, and we agree 95%of the time.

But good lord. That "independent audit" point, started in 2007.

15 yrs ago

My oldest was 1, now he's driving.

Is there ever a point where you say, them not doing audits, is a major problem and just perhaps their is a reason?

15 damn years man.

 

[smokepolejohnson]

Probably need a 3rd party audit on that number as well. Lol. Regardless still 225,000 +\- off of rmef

 

[Tristate]

Nobody answered this before but I'll try again.

How much money is acceptable to spend on a 3rd party audit?

 

[elkassassin]

Hey PUNK!

You'd Best Stick With Your Current High Salary with the MDF!

If You Made 5 Cents somebody Here On MM Would Hang You until You Proved You Spent 6 to earn the 5!

Lol...well I can't show a 1099, but I can post a picture of my "Volunteer shirts and hats!?

 

[slamdunk]

Hey PUNK!

You'd Best Stick With Your Current High Salary with the MDF!

If You Made 5 Cents somebody Here On MM Would Hang You until You Proved You Spent 6 to earn the 5!

Lol....you may be exactly right!?

 

[notdonhunting]

This is typical of the circle you get into with the cool aid drinkers.

Yeah, but, yeah, but, yeah but.


I will notice you didn't answer, so I'll ask again.

The DWR is saying 285, 000 deer this winter.

What did we get for a tens of millions?

Not sure what you do FOR A LIVING, and yes, as you point out they get paid to do "conservation", but if you failed for decades, DO YOU STILL HAVE A JOB.


See, I'm old enough to remember the start of $fw. And yes, they funded themselves via raffles.

$fw started to "give the average hunter a voice", and to "save the mule deer". It wasn't ever to create 4 off shoot buisnesses for THE DON, or stack the WB, or even plant pheasants.

So when anyone points this out, it becomes the disprove a negative.

Or, "if we hadn't done........it would be worse".

Now I can point to every other western state, including Arizona and Colorado and Idaho, who are seeing similar losses of habitat and increases in population, and say "looks like those states are seeing similar deer issues as us", AND they don't pimp out 200 tags, plus however many others they get.

And round and round we go with "yeah but, yeah but".



"The expo is the best show out there". "The expo is better than SCI", "The expo is the best show out there", "they really but on a great show"


How's Utah's deer herd?

"Well, it down another 10% last year"


Well hell, with raging success like that, we should double up, give them 400 tags., How about 600. Imagine 600 tags, why they could rival the world's fair.

And the deer herd, well it could shed another 50%.

BUT, they do plant pheasants, so there's that

"Why experts say the West's deer population is at 'inflection point' after another drop in 2021 | KSL.com" https://www.ksl.com/article/5034678...t-inflection-point-after-another-drop-in-2021

I have answered (post #13) your question what has SFW did to help the Utah deer herd.
But i will try and do it again
What has the SFW did to help the deer herd?
SFW was an instrumental part of a recent SITLA purchase.
That's not pheasants.
Paying along with other conservation organizations for deer studies on 7 different units throughout the state.
That's not pheasants.
Purchasing items for revitalizing deer habitat.
That's not pheasants.
Help paying for Fencing along critical stretches of Highway that deer frequently get hit by vehicles.
That's not pheasants.
Has what SFW and other conservation organizations helped the deer herd?
I would say yes on certain units and I do belive it will be greatly beneficial whenever Utah starts to pull out of this drought.

Again I will ask you hossblur.
What have you did to help out the deer herd lately?

 

[Tristate]

Hossblur helps deer by not being a hunter.

 

[slamdunk]

You guys need to catch up and go to the post "land conservation and groups"?

 

[hawkbill]

Slam I looked for you at the show to say high, but could not find you

 

[slamdunk]

Slam I looked for you at the show to say high, but could not find you

They kept me busy with all the activities every day, sorry I missed you.

 

[JakeH]

They kept me busy with all the activities every day, sorry I missed you.

I looked for you too,
I seen you at one point on Saturday but you was on the move and looked like you had somewhere to be so I didn't stop ya.

 

[slamdunk]

I looked for you too,
I seen you at one point on Saturday but you was on the move and looked like you had somewhere to be so I didn't stop ya.

Probably running to the restroom!!?

 

[hornkiller]

Look what the con show has done to all you people!

 

[hossblur]

I have answered (post #13) your question what has SFW did to help the Utah deer herd.
But i will try and do it again
What has the SFW did to help the deer herd?
SFW was an instrumental part of a recent SITLA purchase.
That's not pheasants.
Paying along with other conservation organizations for deer studies on 7 different units throughout the state.
That's not pheasants.
Purchasing items for revitalizing deer habitat.
That's not pheasants.
Help paying for Fencing along critical stretches of Highway that deer frequently get hit by vehicles.
That's not pheasants.
Has what SFW and other conservation organizations helped the deer herd?
I would say yes on certain units and I do belive it will be greatly beneficial whenever Utah starts to pull out of this drought.

Again I will ask you hossblur.
What have you did to help out the deer herd lately?

Care to mention who else helped, but didn't get 200 tags? (Hint it rhymes with RMEF)

BTW, feel free to do a search on buying that piece of ground, include my name, you might see I was the OP thanking them.


"The drought". Have we been a 30 year drought? Cuz $fw has been saving mule deer that long

 

[lostinOregon]

You guys should just pause your argument until the expo tags winners are released. Then you can go back at it again. Tristate, would you call people a liar to their face?

Rich

 

[notdonhunting]

Hossblur I thought the SFW only plants pheasants.
Your quote (BUT, they do plant pheasants, so there's that)

Yes hossblur i did remember you said thanks to the SFW abour the land purchase. I did not remember you was the OP.

Yes we have been in a continual drought for over 30 years. Since 1985 Utah has only had 8 years that was above average moisture for the year.

 

[LivingTheDream]

Nobody answered this before but I'll try again.

How much money is acceptable to spend on a 3rd party audit?

For what it is worth, I am currently the president of a non profit. We don't do an official audit (too small) but we have a certified CPA firm do a review of all our financials every year and it is reported to the state in order for us to maintain our non-profit status.

They review all financials, money in and money out and additionally due diligence (review meeting minutes, leases, purchases, etc). It costs 9k a year.

We are no where near the size of SFW, but I am guessing between 30 and 50k, would be an official audit for an organization their size.

 

[Vanilla]

Ya’ll are missing a huge point, and should pay attention to heartshot’s post #71. This 9% (if, in fact you believe it’s 9%) you are quibbling about is just a fraction of what the state hands SFW through this government welfare entitlement program.

Look at how many applications go into the expo tags. Multiply that by $3.50. And then realize it was only the last several years that wasn’t the full $5.00. And then also remember that RMEF proposed to give 100% of that to the state.

And now you see welfare entitlement programs at their finest!

 

[Tristate]

The entire tag system is welfare in wildlife at its finest.

 

[hossblur]

Hossblur I thought the SFW only plants pheasants.
Your quote (BUT, they do plant pheasants, so there's that)

Yes hossblur i did remember you said thanks to the SFW abour the land purchase. I did not remember you was the OP.

Yes we have been in a continual drought for over 30 years. Since 1985 Utah has only had 8 years that was above average moisture for the year.
[

Yo be fair, the pheasants I saw get planted this year were done in a silver f250 with lights on it, driven by a dude with a badge.

So we are handing out all those tags to a group that was formed to save the mule deer in the 90's(during that 30 yr drought), who haven't haven't saved the mule deer, because according to you, they can't control weather, and it's a drought.

Or, no matter what the cult does, it's not the cult, it's outside the cult, and therefore we must protect the cult.

Or, as Ratt sang , Round and round....."

 

[hossblur]

Ya’ll are missing a huge point, and should pay attention to heartshot’s post #71. This 9% (if, in fact you believe it’s 9%) you are quibbling about is just a fraction of what the state hands SFW through this government welfare entitlement program.

Look at how many applications go into the expo tags. Multiply that by $3.50. And then realize it was only the last several years that wasn’t the full $5.00. And then also remember that RMEF proposed to give 100% of that to the state.

And now you see welfare entitlement programs at their finest!

$3.75 with no output last year.

 

[Cam@strawberry]

You gents do realize that both of these statements can be correct.

1. The current system including conservation permits is not corrupt and serves its intended function well.

2. The current system does not serve wildlife or the average hunter well.

Hossy, just my observation, but you harping on mysterious back door deals, Peayday’s, and money really does your position a disservice. It moves peoples focus from the root issues to an argumentative place where they get lost in maze of he said she said, speculation, and assumption.

The root is this, the LE pay to play system Utah currently promotes may not be in the best interests of either the wildlife, or the hunters seeking to conserve it. Most of us could not care less about how SFW, MDF, or any other acronyms spend money on wildlife. We couldn’t care one bit less about who puts on the expo, or the names of the people who are successful in the draw.

What we do care about is the stark reality of a management system that limits hunting opportunities on a significant scale in the name of ‘quality’. We care about the math that bars the gate of our children having ready access to hunting in our home state in the coming years.

That group of people is horribly underrepresented, doesn’t have time, money, or the awareness to consistently attend the myriad of meetings from RAC’s to the WLB and be heard. Frankly speaking that group of people gets thwarted by apathy and out spent, intentionally so, every time someone attempts to create an entity that represents them. That’s not corruption, that’s just the application of available funds.

I didn’t intend to write a novel on the subject, but here we are. Keep beating down the door on corruption that doesn’t exist, by all means, and I’ll check back in another 10 years and be shocked that nothing has changed the same as it hasn’t in the last 10.

 

[Vanilla]

$3.75 with no output last year.

$1.50 goes to the fund that the DWR has to give permission to used internet approved projects. $3.50 goes to SFW for administrative costs.

 

[Vanilla]

That group of people is horribly underrepresented, doesn’t have time, money, or the awareness to consistently attend the myriad of meetings from RAC’s to the WLB and be heard. Frankly speaking that group of people gets thwarted by apathy and out spent, intentionally so, every time someone attempts to create an entity that represents them. That’s not corruption, that’s just the application of available funds.

I didn’t intend to write a novel on the subject, but here we are. Keep beating down the door on corruption that doesn’t exist, by all means, and I’ll check back in another 10 years and be shocked that nothing has changed the same as it hasn’t in the last 10.

I just want to focus on this last part to illustrate why I disagree. When the DWR is the on rigging the system so this lobby for “quality” continues to remain powerful and stamp out any effort to opposition is corruption. It’s the very definition of corruption.

You take from those you are saying are under-represented and underfunded and give the money to those on the other side, in a way that violated their own rules to boot, and that is corruption.

In fact, I’d be interested to see if what SFW does in its lobbying efforts for wildlife regulations are a violation of the Hatch Act. That’s an interesting rabbit hole someone should go down…

So berrysblaster, I get what you’re saying in trying to focus on fixing the issue, but if we’re starting from the position that what SFW and the DWR have done here is above board and not corruption, then you’ve lost me.

 

[Tristate]

You gents do realize that both of these statements can be correct.

1. The current system including conservation permits is not corrupt and serves its intended function well.

2. The current system does not serve wildlife or the average hunter well.

Hossy, just my observation, but you harping on mysterious back door deals, Peayday’s, and money really does your position a disservice. It moves peoples focus from the root issues to an argumentative place where they get lost in maze of he said she said, speculation, and assumption.

The root is this, the LE pay to play system Utah currently promotes may not be in the best interests of either the wildlife, or the hunters seeking to conserve it. Most of us could not care less about how SFW, MDF, or any other acronyms spend money on wildlife. We couldn’t care one bit less about who puts on the expo, or the names of the people who are successful in the draw.

What we do care about is the stark reality of a management system that limits hunting opportunities on a significant scale in the name of ‘quality’. We care about the math that bars the gate of our children having ready access to hunting in our home state in the coming years.

That group of people is horribly underrepresented, doesn’t have time, money, or the awareness to consistently attend the myriad of meetings from RAC’s to the WLB and be heard. Frankly speaking that group of people gets thwarted by apathy and out spent, intentionally so, every time someone attempts to create an entity that represents them. That’s not corruption, that’s just the application of available funds.

I didn’t intend to write a novel on the subject, but here we are. Keep beating down the door on corruption that doesn’t exist, by all means, and I’ll check back in another 10 years and be shocked that nothing has changed the same as it hasn’t in the last 10.

Hey guys yall may want to listen to Berryblaster. He's actually starting to realize real problems and how yall are being distracted. I don't agree with everything he is saying but I can tell he is actually thinking.