Utah Wildlife Board meets tomorrow (March 10) for trail camera hearing

A

Amy

Active Member
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I realize that tomorrow's trail camera hearing is already being discussed extensively in javihammer's thread, but I wanted to post a quick reminder of the meeting details.

The Utah Wildlife Board will meet tomorrow morning at 9 a.m. at the Eccles Wildlife Education Center (1157 South Waterfowl Way in Farmington). The meeting agenda explains the purpose of the hearing and provides details about the public comment process. Board members have already received — and responded to — many emails on this topic.

We will be livestreaming the meeting for those who want to watch or listen to it.


Amy Canning
Communications Specialist
Utah Division of Wildlife Resources
 
Kudos @Amy

3 months. That is where I place the over/under as to how much longer @Amy will be be able to freely post here in her official capacity with UDWR. Wade Lemon and the other outfitter interests weighing on the board will get her shut down.

Like many of you - I only care to get game cams limited because I see how much the outfitters weigh in on the other side.
 
Thanks Amy

This is what i've been waiting for! pretty sure I will get ran threw the coals for this but it's the truth.

I run cameras 12 of them to be exact yes I enjoy them and I will admit what they do.

We have incredible technology in today's day and age that makes our lives a lot easier as hunters/outfitters. Back in the day before trail cameras existed, hunters/outfitters didn’t know what was out there until they set foot in the mountains. Trail cameras have literally changed the hunting game, and honestly most of us couldn’t live without them anymore and it shows.

So what do trail cameras really tell us? Well if you're an avid hunter or outfitter just take a minute to think about if trail cameras no longer existed. Consider how different the whole process would be and all the unknowns you would face. That will really show you how much you actually rely on them.One of the biggest things trail cameras allows us to see is what bucks or bulls or wildlife you have in a given area.

When I first started 15 years ago. I had never even heard of trail cameras. I remember going into the mountains to hunt completely blind, not having a first clue of what was out there. It was exciting being in the unknown, but could also get frustrating not knowing if you were even in the right area or in the right drainage. Running multiple cameras in multiple different areas has given me the upper hand over the last 15 years,particularly with knowing all the bucks/bulls/wildlife running in each area and what animal I want to target. It allows me to collect full inventory without having to even step foot in the field as much.This also allows me to figure out where I'm going to hunt opening morning with very little effort.

All this can be done while at work or sitting on your couch.

All the hunters/outfitters know this is 100% accurate.
 
Elkslayer2015 said:
Thanks Amy

This is what i've been waiting for! pretty sure I will get ran threw the coals for this but it's the truth.

I run cameras 12 of them to be exact yes I enjoy them and I will admit what they do.

We have incredible technology in today's day and age that makes our lives a lot easier as hunters/outfitters. Back in the day before trail cameras existed, hunters/outfitters didn’t know what was out there until they set foot in the mountains. Trail cameras have literally changed the hunting game, and honestly most of us couldn’t live without them anymore and it shows.

So what do trail cameras really tell us? Well if you're an avid hunter or outfitter just take a minute to think about if trail cameras no longer existed. Consider how different the whole process would be and all the unknowns you would face. That will really show you how much you actually rely on them.One of the biggest things trail cameras allows us to see is what bucks or bulls or wildlife you have in a given area.

When I first started 15 years ago. I had never even heard of trail cameras. I remember going into the mountains to hunt completely blind, not having a first clue of what was out there. It was exciting being in the unknown, but could also get frustrating not knowing if you were even in the right area or in the right drainage. Running multiple cameras in multiple different areas has given me the upper hand over the last 15 years,particularly with knowing all the bucks/bulls/wildlife running in each area and what animal I want to target. It allows me to collect full inventory without having to even step foot in the field as much.This also allows me to figure out where I'm going to hunt opening morning with very little effort.

All this can be done while at work or sitting on your couch.

All the hunters/outfitters know this is 100% accurate.
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A single morning of glassing an area right before a season starts, can also tell you pretty much all you need to know about an area. Cameras are only beneficial in certain circumstances. I’ve got pics of a buck in early august and killed him 7 miles away in a straight line, 2 months later. Hunt your ghosts on your cams all season, all you want, or put boots on the ground and hunt the animals. Are cams effective? Yes. Are they as important as you are implying? Certainly not. You’re inexperienced guys will be the ones who the cam ban will impact. The dudes who know what they are doing, guides definitely included, will still kill big stuff and the only “unknowns” will be the guys who haven’t prepared for the hunts prior to their start date.
 
Bux n Dux said:
A single morning of glassing an area right before a season starts, can also tell you pretty much all you need to know about an area.
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Well I guess you got nothing to worry about, hell a single morning of glassing tells you all you need to know. Cams being gone shouldn't be that big of a deal then.

My hell the more you guys try to down play them the sillier your arguments get.
 
Give them hell boys.

I'll be in a tube having my guts looked at.

I'm an old bastard, next week is hernia fixing.

I've emailed the board, several times, I hope everyone else has.

Imo, where ever you are on cams, this stunt by the outfitters, should be unanimously struck down.

I know it won't, because I've been fighting back and forth with Heaton.

Appreciate the guys who speak up, in advance
 
JakeH said:
Well I guess you got nothing to worry about, hell a single morning of glassing tells you all you need to know. Cams being gone shouldn't be that big of a deal then.

My hell the more you guys try to down play them the sillier your arguments get.
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Like a mechanic telling you he doesn't NEED air tools, or a carpenter telling you he has a hammer.

Yup, they aren't REQUIRED.

But they sure make life easier
 
Amy,
I know it's not you but why was the decision made to only have in person comments during a workday and not in the normal location?
It could be interpreted as member(s) of the board trying to influence the public input they receive
 
JakeH said:
Well I guess you got nothing to worry about, hell a single morning of glassing tells you all you need to know. Cams being gone shouldn't be that big of a deal then.

My hell the more you guys try to down play them the sillier your arguments get.
Click to expand...
trail cameras are a tool no different than a horse, atv, truck, optics, or anything else that aids in take. the question I have is where do we draw the line and why should it be ok for the group of guys that like to pack into the backcountry on mules or any other group to have more right to their hobby than I do to running cameras as a hobby. My kids enjoy checking cameras more than hunting, and I use cameras for more than hunting. I use them for general photography and trapping too. This trail cameras season takes that away from me. One day they will come for what you enjoy.
banning cameras is not going to help our deer herds, we need to limit tags if you want to kill less deer.
 
deserthnt said:
trail cameras are a tool no different than a horse, atv, truck, optics, or anything else that aids in take. the question I have is where do we draw the line and why should it be ok for the group of guys that like to pack into the backcountry on mules or any other group to have more right to their hobby than I do to running cameras as a hobby. My kids enjoy checking cameras more than hunting, and I use cameras for more than hunting. I use them for general photography and trapping too. This trail cameras season takes that away from me. One day they will come for what you enjoy.
banning cameras is not going to help our deer herds, we need to limit tags if you want to kill less deer.
Click to expand...


24/7 365. That is the difference. The difference is you actually have to be out there in person to watch the game not sitting at home eating cheetos while 10-1000 cameras does all the work. How many big bucks/bulls wouldn't even be known about if it wasn't for night time pictures of them letting the hunter know it was even in the area.

But hell, one morning of glassing before the season is all it takes to learn everything your cameras tell you so I fail to see what the big deal is.

And If it's all about "general photography, and doing it for my kids" well you have January through July to enjoy setting up cameras and spending all that quality family time.
 
JakeH said:
24/7 365. That is the difference. The difference is you actually have to be out there in person to watch the game not sitting at home eating cheetos while 10-1000 cameras does all the work. How many big bucks/bulls wouldn't even be known about if it wasn't for night time pictures of them letting the hunter know it was even in the area.

But hell, one morning of glassing before the season is all it takes to learn everything your cameras tell you so I fail to see what the big deal is.

And If it's all about "general photography, and doing it for my kids" well you have January through July to enjoy setting up cameras and spending all that quality family time.
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I would like to see you use the same logic with every other group who uses our public ground. you can only ride atvs january through july or tell someone with horses the same thing. sounds pretty selfish to me.
 
deserthnt said:
I would like to see you use the same logic with every other group who uses our public ground. you can only ride atvs january through july or tell someone with horses the same thing. sounds pretty selfish to me.
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They aren't keeping you from the land, you just can't leave a camera. And they do shut stuff down for those things. You can't take a horse into certain areas without proof it's only ate certified hay, they close roads/trails down to atv and vehicles all the time.
 
JakeH said:
They aren't keeping you from the land, you just can't leave a camera. And they do shut stuff down for those things. You can't take a horse into certain areas without proof it's only ate certified hay, they close roads/trails down to atv and vehicles all the time.
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thats alot different than saying banned on public ground isnt it, I am in favor of regulating transmitting cameras but internal storage is going to far
 
Seems to me that the process they went through has gotten brought up a lot during the "public" comment. Majority of these people that spoke have agreed with the ban and just have stood up and talked about how the process was done correctly for this trail cam ban.
 
Most people so far are still supporting the camera season. The technical problems are taking it's toll so far, trying to watch this meeting. It's currently on break until the broadcasting problems can be fixed.
 
Wait for it.

Everyone hold their breath.

Props to $fw for not trying to split the difference, or walk back their early support.

Justin and Troy expressed frustration and exasperation. I'd bet 90% of us feel the same about the end run attempted here
 
Some of the people commenting are just making a fool out of themselves.

Bears and lions are not included in the trail camera ban.

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I was inspired by Kalans speech.

This is 'Merica damn it.

FREEDOM!!!

As a red blooded, non commie, AMERICAN who demands freedom from gubment tyranny, I WILL BE HUNTING AI IN NOVEMBER, AND I WILL KILL 9 BUCKS(cue Lee Greenwood in the background), BECAUSE REGULATIONS ARE TYRANNY.

...and I proud to be an American, where at least I know I'm free.....

Everyone, sing along!!!!
 
deserthnt said:
trail cameras are a tool no different than a horse, atv, truck, optics, or anything else that aids in take. the question I have is where do we draw the line and why should it be ok for the group of guys that like to pack into the backcountry on mules or any other group to have more right to their hobby than I do to running cameras as a hobby. My kids enjoy checking cameras more than hunting, and I use cameras for more than hunting. I use them for general photography and trapping too. This trail cameras season takes that away from me. One day they will come for what you enjoy.
banning cameras is not going to help our deer herds, we need to limit tags if you want to kill less deer.
Click to expand...
Thats a terrible comparison.
You are on your horse when you see game, not on your couch.

Also....the trail cam ban isn't intended as a tool to improve our deer herds.
 
Good Heck! What a bunch of babies!! There doesn't need to be a recreation exception. If there is, they have no ban at all.
 
I admit I don't know most of these board members. Which of them have connections to special interest groups? Can anyone here tell me who's connected to what?
 
I am interested in this laser fired self defense camera? Does it have a ‘set phasers to stun’ mode?

Is there a pocket-sized EDC model that I can carry instead of a pistol? Does it take pictures and then stop the bear from biting me? Really think this Tech should be protected
 
I agree obviously with the vote.

However, it would have been a good thing to vote it unanimously.

What we saw today will be repeated on every cat reg, bear reg, trap reg, etc.

There shouldn't have been a reward of a single vote, to reward this.


I'll be interested now to see if the spirit of " in this together" (the guides) now bring their whispered lawsuit.
 
Bigwiffy said:
I liked how the public voice was heard.....oh wait that's right it wasn't.
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The problem was is that the Public did not turn up for it in the first place...... Then after the January meeting and this passes then people get all up in arms AFTER it had went through RAC's and WB.... the original public process happened and they were heard.... this was a bunch of people crying that they were not heard.... when they in fact did not participle in the original public process.

One of my favorites was the guy that said he was there on behalf of his self and family.... Then says the reason he did not participate before was he was in the hospital and sick.... well why did he not send someone on his behalf like he said he was for his family......

What I saw there was one person bringing up kids and recruitment being tied to trail cams then 75% of the guys after that followed it by saying the same thing because that was the ONLY argument against it.
 
mtnrunner260 said:
Amy,
I know it's not you but why was the decision made to only have in person comments during a workday and not in the normal location?
It could be interpreted as member(s) of the board trying to influence the public input they receive
Click to expand...
Thanks for the question, mtnrunner 260. If you look at past Wildlife Board meeting agendas (found on this page), you'll see that most of the board meetings are held on weekday mornings (usually Thursdays) at 9 a.m. Our main conference room at the DNR building in Salt Lake has been under renovation, so we've been holding meetings at the Eccles Wildlife Education Center since the Dec. 2 board meeting. Because this meeting/hearing was an appeal — and not a standard Wildlife Board meeting — the board chair had the option of deciding how to accept comments, and chose to have them be in-person only during the body of the meeting. With that said, many people reached out to the board members via email to make their thoughts and feelings known ahead of the meeting. For more information about the appeal process, you might want to revisit the first 15-20 minutes of today's meeting, if you didn't already see it. Our board coordinator, Staci Coons, provided an explanation of how that process works. Thanks again for following up!
 
The Utah boys really grabbed the bull by the horns today. it was also impressive how well the wildlife board handled the pressure. That room seemed to be majority corporate people so those Board members that voted from the gut surrounded by what at times must have felt like a mob should be applauded. Most of them mentioned they are Dads and Grandfather's so the constant drum beat of "do it for the children" probably wore a little thin to them.

I also thought Troy Justenson gave a pretty honest response when he stood up. I liked that he admitted to being an outfitter and wasn't a fan of how the appeal was handled. Not sure where he fits into Utah Wildlife politics but I wouldn't deprive him of a drink and a chair if he stumbled up to my campfire.

Congrats.

Ryan
 
javihammer said:
The Utah boys really grabbed the bull by the horns today. it was also impressive how well the wildlife board handled the pressure. That room seemed to be majority corporate people so those Board members that voted from the gut surrounded by what at times must have felt like a mob should be applauded. Most of them mentioned they are Dads and Grandfather's so the constant drum beat of "do it for the children" probably wore a little thin to them.

I also thought Troy Justenson gave a pretty honest response when he stood up. I liked that he admitted to being an outfitter and wasn't a fan of how the appeal was handled. Not sure where he fits into Utah Wildlife politics but I wouldn't deprive him of a drink and a chair if he stumbled up to my campfire.

Congrats.

Ryan
Click to expand...


$fw grand poobah.
 
Justin Oliver that followed him is $fw too.

JMO on here

Bryce Thurgood on the board used to be as well, although I believe they had a falling out.

I don't give props to $fw very often, the Don sounded like the tool he is, the rest I was impressed didn't give into what had to be big money strong arming at the expo
 
Thanks Amy.

Everybody should watch the first part of the meeting to understand the process.

If I were betting I would say that there will be a change to the appeals process.

The reason for todays meeting was because the board expanded the divisions recommendation from just transmitting cams to all cams at the January meeting.

I do feel that was a valid reason to open up another public comment period.
 
elkhunterUT said:
Pretty sure he called him "Selfless" implying that the big outfitter was pushing to overturn the ban because a ban only hurts the "average joe"
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Sorry, I could have heard wrong.
A ban would also hurt him as well as the "average joe" then. All his guys that were there with him sure didn't want the restriction.
 
SureShot said:
I still think the best comment was the guy whose trail cam saved him from getting sat on by a bear. It deserves a medal of honor and should be exempted from the trail cam season.
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Literally saved his life. Only 1 day off from him being mauled.

? when he started into that story I thought he was gonna say something about how he would have thought another hunter had tore his blind down. Man that story took a real quick turn ? ?
 
Amy said:
Thanks for the question, mtnrunner 260. If you look at past Wildlife Board meeting agendas (found on this page), you'll see that most of the board meetings are held on weekday mornings (usually Thursdays) at 9 a.m. Our main conference room at the DNR building in Salt Lake has been under renovation, so we've been holding meetings at the Eccles Wildlife Education Center since the Dec. 2 board meeting. Because this meeting/hearing was an appeal — and not a standard Wildlife Board meeting — the board chair had the option of deciding how to accept comments, and chose to have them be in-person only during the body of the meeting. With that said, many people reached out to the board members via email to make their thoughts and feelings known ahead of the meeting. For more information about the appeal process, you might want to revisit the first 15-20 minutes of today's meeting, if you didn't already see it. Our board coordinator, Staci Coons, provided an explanation of how that process works. Thanks again for following up!
Click to expand...
Thanks Amy!
 
JakeH said:
Literally saved his life. Only 1 day off from him being mauled.

? when he started into that story I thought he was gonna say something about how he would have thought another hunter had tore his blind down. Man that story took a real quick


We need some new research.

Firearm vs Bear spray vs trail cam.
Click to expand...
 
JakeH said:
Literally saved his life. Only 1 day off from him being mauled.

? when he started into that story I thought he was gonna say something about how he would have thought another hunter had tore his blind down. Man that story took a real quick turn ? ?
Click to expand...
I did laugh. I also laughed a Peays hair. With all that expo dough he should be able to afford a trip to bikini cuts no?
 
hossblur said:
14 days
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The 14 day rule is time in one location, then you must vacate for at least 10 days. The unattended campsite limit is 24 hours. And the site must be occupied the first night.

Screenshot_20220310-204507_Samsung Internet.jpg


If somebody else found your vehicle inconvenient (maybe they wanted to camp there?) it would be a violation as well.

Screenshot_20220310-204733_Samsung Internet.jpg
 
It was great to see Don Peay use his 90 seconds to address the true brass tax of the ban. His major talking points were…
- We are to good at killing stuff
- we practice what we preach
-we dump are massive state resourced unaccounted $fw slush funds from the utard knuckleheads into our Canadian Outfitter/ land interests
-We don’t shoot Dall Sheep out of Helicopters
- I’ve got a couple buddies with a net worth of 13 Billion
-Afore mentioned billionaire has a GulfStream G-650er

Way stay on topic and thanks for your selfless leadership. Can’t wait for the WHCE next year.

5723B8C4-3AC3-4667-AFDC-22FF082473DE.png
 
smokepolejohnson said:
It was great to see Don Peay use his 90 seconds to address the true brass tax of the ban. His major talking points were…
- We are to good at killing stuff
- we practice what we preach
-we dump are massive state resourced unaccounted $fw slush funds from the utard knuckleheads into our Canadian Outfitter/ land interests
-We don’t shoot Dall Sheep out of Helicopters
- I’ve got a couple buddies with a net worth of 13 Billion
-Afore mentioned billionaire has a GulfStream G-650er

Way stay on topic and thanks for your selfless leadership. Can’t wait for the WHCE next year.

View attachment 70874
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The only thing I take from this is the close caption guy and Biden’s teleprompter guy are the same person
 
JakeH said:
Well I guess you got nothing to worry about, hell a single morning of glassing tells you all you need to know. Cams being gone shouldn't be that big of a deal then.

My hell the more you guys try to down play them the sillier your arguments get.
Click to expand...
It’s not a big deal to me. I’ll round mine up first of June, never to be put out again. I don’t care either way. I’ll use them if legal, I won’t if it I cant. Either way, I’ll still fill my tags. As will many others
 
treedagain said:
The loser in my opinion is bear hunters?
I felt it was a good tool to see what is hitting your bait(s). That way you could target boars.
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How many fall bait hunts are there? I don't think there is any in my area. I'm not super informed on the bear hunting elsewhere in the state.

Edit: decided to look it up, I didn't realize there was this many. Bet those hunts get a lot easier to draw.

Screenshot_20220313-164141_Drive.jpg


That said, this would be an easy fix to carve out an exception, you already have to register your bait and post a paper at the bait, this could allow you to place a camera within say 60 feet of the tree the permit is affixed too.

Seems like a easy fix to me. ?‍♂️
 
Last edited:
Bux n Dux said:
It’s not a big deal to me. I’ll round mine up first of June, never to be put out again. I don’t care either way. I’ll use them if legal, I won’t if it I cant. Either way, I'll still fill my tags. As will many others
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In other words, this rule will make no difference in the outcome!
I believe it! As I've mentioned before on this forum, "When you change the rules of the game, you change the way it is played". That goes for everything in life, including hunting.

Politicians are notorious for changing rules based on what is happening NOW. But they don't think about what changes the people will make to compensate for the changes in the rules and laws. Raise the minimum wages all you want, but the owners will just pass that increased expense on to the customers and the price of living goes up to meet the minimum wage and we're back where we started

Ban cameras during the hunting seasons and those hunters will take more people with them or scout more often or stay on the mountain longer or switch weapons or start using decoys or blinds or treestands or get better at calling or using scents or shooting further or buy better equipment or ????????? to compensate for the loss of current pictures from the cameras. It may take a couple of seasons to make the behavior changes, but we'll get back to the same success rate we had before the camera seasonal ban. Then we'll do the cycle again with some other hunting rule designed to reduce success rates.
 
Really if you think about it, and it has already been said..... when outfitters abuse the system and make it abundantly clear they are not scared to take stuff to the extreme to make a ??
Truck loads of apples
200 to 2,000 trail cams
Open bidding on the internet, like a buffet/golden corral style
Cash payment/finders fee
Crap load of spotters sitting on a deer/elk for months.
Next should be a better stronger look at blocking roads and hunter harassment.
 
When are we going to limit the real elephant in the woods? Long range weaponry, and laser rangefinders! I think I'll get a petition running to get Casey and the board going on a bill. You'll all be on board right? In the name of conservation and putting the hunt back in hunting we can make a difference!
 
Fixed power scopes on rifles no higher than 6x

No laser rangefinders

No scoped muzzys

Let's get it on the agenda. @slamdunk if you will help get the MDF onboard. @hossblur please make a call to your buddy Troy Justensen to get SFW on board. With Sneider on our side and the board genuinely concerned about making changes to improve herd health this should receive 0 pushback. Let's make it happen!
 
Bigwiffy said:
Fixed power scopes on rifles no higher than 6x

No laser rangefinders

No scoped muzzys

Let's get it on the agenda. @slamdunk if you will help get the MDF onboard. @hossblur please make a call to your buddy Troy Justensen to get SFW on board. With Sneider on our side and the board genuinely concerned about making changes to improve herd health this should receive 0 pushback. Let's make it happen!
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The best way for this to happen is have the guides and outfitters start bragging about it. Seems like everytime they open their mouth lately it gets shut for them.
CWMU'S should be next.
 

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